Grant Trade?

[GEE]

I've been a fan of, at least considering Rui as our PFOTF for some time now. I've been a fan of his since his' Gonzaga days. I think it would be difficult to find a better fit personally. If a good deal is available in the REAL world, I think Cronin should seriously it. I think it just depends on if Cronin thinks Rui could be the guy (like I strongly believe he could).

We all also have no real idea of what is actually being offered by the Lakers (could be a crap basket), or what other teams could potentially be in play, but I do recall recently reading that the BKN F.O. may have recently had a new interest in DLO Russell. If this is/or could become true (since I do also have an interest in Sharpe), I've proposed this before but nobody really liked it:

LAL trades: Russell / Rui / FRP
BRK trades: Shape / Schroeder
PDX trades: Grant

If we got Rui / Sharpe / FRP for Grant... I'd be quite happy with that.

RIP CITY!!!

[Sinobas]

I'd be surprised if we get a pick in addition to Rui and expirings for Grant. I just don't think Grant helps the Lakers enough to justify even a protected pick. Hence my Trade Board inquiry about how to give the Lakers enough of a bump to merit a pick coming back (while also dumping another vet).

If they are happy with Rui they would just keep Rui and not bother with Grant. Most of the skuttlebut says they are offering Rui+some other player, and expiring and a pick, but Cronin wants two picks.

[GEE]

I'd hope Cronin doesn't feel the need to get greedy. If Rui is a guy that Cronin sees as a possible long-term solution at PF, with TL and Reath, and Ayton, and Cling-On... as I Do... then Cronin should "Just Do It" already. But if Cronin doesn't agree, and he doesn't see Rui as a possible long-term solution at PF.... Then there really is no deal to be had with the Lakers. Stick with Grant, hope TL can resurrect and be the man, and/or until "THE GUY" that Cronin feels IS the long-term answer at PF is gettable.

[Wizenheimer]

We traded two 1sts for Robert Covington. And that netted Houston Isaiah Stewart and Usman Garuba (ie not much).

it's not very instructive to look at just the players selected with the picks. You need to gauge by opportunity cost. Using that gauge the Blazers could have had one of:

Isaiah Stewart
Josh Green
Saddiq Bey
Tyrese Maxey
Immanuel Quickley
Jaden McDaniels
Desmond Bane
Nick Richards
Isaiah Joe

and also one of:

Quentin Grimes
Cam Thomas
Day'Ron Sharpe
Herbert Jones

[Wizenheimer]

people keep ignoring a harsh reality for the Lakers: that being that they are only 600K below the 2nd apron and that's without accounting for Bronny James (who they haven't officially signed yet because they could not aggregate salaries if they do...2nd apron restriction)

so that means that if the Lakers want to stay under the 2nd apron after signing Bronny, they'd need to send out at least 1M more salary than they take back. Meaning: Grant's salary is 29.8M so the Lakers would need to send out at east 31M in salary

Rui + Vincent = 28M...won't work
Rui + Vanderbilt = 27.8M...won't work

the only 2 for 1 trade that works is Russell + Rui (35.7M) and frankly that's too much talent and production to give up for Grant if they are also adding a draft pick, even if it's protected. Last season Russell + Rui combined for 32 points, 7 rebounds, and 8 assists and they did so while shooting 42% from three point range

last season Russell posted numbers that were arguably better than Simons, and Rui has always been a solid, but injury prone, player

And the Lakers can't really afford to give up that kind of veteran depth in a 2 for 1 trade, plus add a 1st

[Tim Lehrbach]

people keep ignoring a harsh reality for the Lakers: that being that they are only 600K below the 2nd apron and that's without accounting for Bronny James (who they haven't officially signed yet because they could not aggregate salaries if they do...2nd apron restriction)

so that means that if the Lakers want to stay under the 2nd apron after signing Bronny, they'd need to send out at least 1M more salary than they take back. Meaning: Grant's salary is 29.8M so the Lakers would need to send out at east 31M in salary

Rui + Vincent = 28M...won't work
Rui + Vanderbilt = 27.8M...won't work

the only 2 for 1 trade that works is Russell + Rui (35.7M) and frankly that's too much talent and production to give up for Grant if they are also adding a draft pick, even if it's protected. Last season Russell + Rui combined for 32 points, 7 rebounds, and 8 assists and they did so while shooting 42% from three point range

last season Russell posted numbers that were arguably better than Simons, and Rui has always been a solid, but injury prone, player

And the Lakers can't really afford to give up that kind of veteran depth in a 2 for 1 trade, plus add a 1st

This is a much more detailed breakdown than I gave at the T&T Board, but the gist of my inquiry there is based on the same conclusion. Grant to LA doesn't work unless they are getting something else to compensate for the production/minutes lost by matching his salary. And they're definitely not giving up a first round pick for the privilege.

Only a huge trade where the Lakers like multiple Portland (or third-team) pieces and send out more salary than they receive is going to get done. It's a tough needle to thread.

[Sinobas]

We traded two 1sts for Robert Covington. And that netted Houston Isaiah Stewart and Usman Garuba (ie not much).

it's not very instructive to look at just the players selected with the picks. You need to gauge by opportunity cost. Using that gauge the Blazers could have had one of:

Isaiah Stewart
Josh Green
Saddiq Bey
Tyrese Maxey
Immanuel Quickley
Jaden McDaniels
Desmond Bane
Nick Richards
Isaiah Joe

and also one of:

Quentin Grimes
Cam Thomas
Day'Ron Sharpe
Herbert Jones

That's like basing the value of a lottery ticket on the amount you'll receive if you win. Most of the time, you're not going to draft a good player outside of the lottery. So seeing who was actually taken is a good way to simulate a likely outcome. Two firsts round picks sounds like more value than they'll likely end up returning.

[Pattycakes]

I've been a fan of, at least considering Rui as our PFOTF for some time now. I've been a fan of his since his' Gonzaga days. I think it would be difficult to find a better fit personally. If a good deal is available in the REAL world, I think Cronin should seriously it. I think it just depends on if Cronin thinks Rui could be the guy (like I strongly believe he could).

We all also have no real idea of what is actually being offered by the Lakers (could be a crap basket), or what other teams could potentially be in play, but I do recall recently reading that the BKN F.O. may have recently had a new interest in DLO Russell. If this is/or could become true (since I do also have an interest in Sharpe), I've proposed this before but nobody really liked it:

LAL trades: Russell / Rui / FRP
BRK trades: Shape / Schroeder
PDX trades: Grant

If we got Rui / Sharpe / FRP for Grant... I'd be quite happy with that.

RIP CITY!!!

Certainly would also be happy with Rui plus a pick, but I would def treat it as a 2-3 year stopgap.

While I like Rui - his ceiling still leaves much to be desired if a better starting option comes along.

But, down to get the trade done and then see what we have w him.

Between Rui, Jabari, Toumani, Deni, DA we probably have the 4 spot locked down

[Wizenheimer]

We traded two 1sts for Robert Covington. And that netted Houston Isaiah Stewart and Usman Garuba (ie not much).

it's not very instructive to look at just the players selected with the picks. You need to gauge by opportunity cost. Using that gauge the Blazers could have had one of:

Isaiah Stewart
Josh Green
Saddiq Bey
Tyrese Maxey
Immanuel Quickley
Jaden McDaniels
Desmond Bane
Nick Richards
Isaiah Joe

and also one of:

Quentin Grimes
Cam Thomas
Day'Ron Sharpe
Herbert Jones

That's like basing the value of a lottery ticket on the amount you'll receive if you win. Most of the time, you're not going to draft a good player outside of the lottery. So seeing who was actually taken is a good way to simulate a likely outcome. Two firsts round picks sounds like more value than they'll likely end up returning.

again though, I think teams gauge future picks by opportunity cost/gain; and that's the case for a team trading for the pick, and trading away the pick

in this case, talking about a Grant trade to the Lakers, their first available 1st round pick is 2029. That's 5 years from now when Lebron would be 45, AD would be 36, and Reaves would be 31. The Lakers could suck, big time, and be a bottom feeder; meaning their 2029 first could be top-10 or even top-5 in the lottery...maybe #1

and if it's true that Cronin was demanding two 1st's from the Lakers for Grant, then 2029 would have to be unprotected because the Lakers only have 2029, 2030, & 2031 to trade, and the Stepian rule eliminates 2030. And since 2031 is 7 drafts away, it would have to be unprotected as well

that's why Cronin's rumored demand, if accurate, is idiotic because no team would trade one unprotected pick, 5 years from now, for Grant, let alone two unprotected picks

[Sinobas]

it's not very instructive to look at just the players selected with the picks. You need to gauge by opportunity cost. Using that gauge the Blazers could have had one of:

Isaiah Stewart
Josh Green
Saddiq Bey
Tyrese Maxey
Immanuel Quickley
Jaden McDaniels
Desmond Bane
Nick Richards
Isaiah Joe

and also one of:

Quentin Grimes
Cam Thomas
Day'Ron Sharpe
Herbert Jones

That's like basing the value of a lottery ticket on the amount you'll receive if you win. Most of the time, you're not going to draft a good player outside of the lottery. So seeing who was actually taken is a good way to simulate a likely outcome. Two firsts round picks sounds like more value than they'll likely end up returning.

again though, I think teams gauge future picks by opportunity cost/gain; and that's the case for a team trading for the pick, and trading away the pick

in this case, talking about a Grant trade to the Lakers, their first available 1st round pick is 2029. That's 5 years from now when Lebron would be 45, AD would be 36, and Reaves would be 31. The Lakers could suck, big time, and be a bottom feeder; meaning their 2029 first could be top-10 or even top-5 in the lottery...maybe #1

and if it's true that Cronin was demanding two 1st's from the Lakers for Grant, then 2029 would have to be unprotected because the Lakers only have 2029, 2030, & 2031 to trade, and the Stepian rule eliminates 2030. And since 2031 is 7 drafts away, it would have to be unprotected as well

that's why Cronin's rumored demand, if accurate, is idiotic because no team would trade one unprotected pick, 5 years from now, for Grant, let alone two unprotected picks

I think Cronin is banking on the Lakers being in "win now" mode with the icon of the NBA breathing down the GMs neck to make a deal.

[Butter]

it's not very instructive to look at just the players selected with the picks. You need to gauge by opportunity cost. Using that gauge the Blazers could have had one of:

Isaiah Stewart
Josh Green
Saddiq Bey
Tyrese Maxey
Immanuel Quickley
Jaden McDaniels
Desmond Bane
Nick Richards
Isaiah Joe

and also one of:

Quentin Grimes
Cam Thomas
Day'Ron Sharpe
Herbert Jones

That's like basing the value of a lottery ticket on the amount you'll receive if you win. Most of the time, you're not going to draft a good player outside of the lottery. So seeing who was actually taken is a good way to simulate a likely outcome. Two firsts round picks sounds like more value than they'll likely end up returning.

again though, I think teams gauge future picks by opportunity cost/gain; and that's the case for a team trading for the pick, and trading away the pick

in this case, talking about a Grant trade to the Lakers, their first available 1st round pick is 2029. That's 5 years from now when Lebron would be 45, AD would be 36, and Reaves would be 31. The Lakers could suck, big time, and be a bottom feeder; meaning their 2029 first could be top-10 or even top-5 in the lottery...maybe #1

and if it's true that Cronin was demanding two 1st's from the Lakers for Grant, then 2029 would have to be unprotected because the Lakers only have 2029, 2030, & 2031 to trade, and the Stepian rule eliminates 2030. And since 2031 is 7 drafts away, it would have to be unprotected as well

that's why Cronin's rumored demand, if accurate, is idiotic because no team would trade one unprotected pick, 5 years from now, for Grant, let alone two unprotected picks

I'd offer the Lakers 1FRP and a pick swap

[Wizenheimer]

I think Cronin is banking on the Lakers being in "win now" mode with the icon of the NBA breathing down the GMs neck to make a deal.

ok then...we're not going to agree on this. I think you're significantly overrating the leverage Cronin has over the Lakers when he's dangling Grant.

[Walton1one]

Not a lot of options out there for LAL. Besides POR, you have WAS (w\Kuzma) and BRK (w\DFS and Cam Johnson). All 3 of these teams are asking for 1st round picks for their players. I think if POR packaged Williams w\Grant for a 1st with a pick swap or (2) they might have the most attractive offer of all 3 teams.

DFS was horrible LY, I can't see LAL giving up a 1st for him

For Cam I could see something like DLo, Wood & (1) of: Hayes, Reddish
for Cam & a 1st.

I don't think Cam Johnson is a better player than Grant is, but he is 2yrs younger, has one less year left on his contract, which is substantially per year lower than Grant

Cam (3yrs) remaining: $23.6 - $21.5 - $23.6
Grant (4yrs) remaining: $29.7 - $32 - $34.2 - $36.4
yikes, let those numbers sink in....

I think the most appealing deal POR could offer to LAL would be something like:

Grant\Williams\Banton (or Walker)
for
Rui\Vincent\Dlo a 30’ 1st (top 3/5 protection) and preferably (2) pick swaps (29’ & 31’), top 3\5 protected

Another option, instead of Williams could be: DLo, Vincent, Rui + picks\swaps for Grant, Thybulle & Reath

If I did my math right, the 1st trade option could get LAL another $2.3m (or $4.3m if they cut Banton) under the 2nd apron, letting them sign Bronny JR and use part of their MLE on a FA, although the pickings are getting slim: Hayward, Kennard, THT, Shamet, Morris, Fultz Crowder, Bertans, Gallinari

Pick swaps are iffy, but the benefit to LAL is that they could still trade those 1st's in a future deal if needed, and chances are that one (or both) might never come to fruition, or (more likely) offer little benefit to POR (ie. a move up of only a few spots).

For POR, besides getting a 1st for Grant, you are dangling Williams as an enticement to LAL & to get a little more value out of this deal (ie. (2) pick swaps).

[Tim Lehrbach]

I think the most appealing deal POR could offer to LAL would be something like:

Grant\Williams\Banton (or Walker)
for
Rui\Vincent\Dlo a 30’ 1st (top 3/5 protection) and preferably (2) pick swaps (29’ & 31’), top 3\5 protected

Another option, instead of Williams could be: DLo, Vincent, Rui + picks\swaps for Grant, Thybulle & Reath

These are interesting options, but why does LAL give up so much? One protected pick, no swaps, seems like enough. Rui and Russell are rotation players themselves -- they may not have value to Portland, but they do to LAL. You're asking them to accept modest upgrades at a high cost.

[Sinobas]

I think Cronin is banking on the Lakers being in "win now" mode with the icon of the NBA breathing down the GMs neck to make a deal.

ok then...we're not going to agree on this. I think you're significantly overrating the leverage Cronin has over the Lakers when he's dangling Grant.

You psychically know how much the Lakers value Grant? Danny Marang said LA initially agreed to 2 FRP then pulled out. So if that's true it's not as cut and dry as you say. Circumstance changes a lot. The Blazers dealt two 1sts for Robert Covington, who wasn't the level of player Grant is.

[GEE]

I've been a fan of, at least considering Rui as our PFOTF for some time now. I've been a fan of his since his' Gonzaga days. I think it would be difficult to find a better fit personally. If a good deal is available in the REAL world, I think Cronin should seriously it. I think it just depends on if Cronin thinks Rui could be the guy (like I strongly believe he could).

We all also have no real idea of what is actually being offered by the Lakers (could be a crap basket), or what other teams could potentially be in play, but I do recall recently reading that the BKN F.O. may have recently had a new interest in DLO Russell. If this is/or could become true (since I do also have an interest in Sharpe), I've proposed this before but nobody really liked it:

LAL trades: Russell / Rui / FRP
BRK trades: Shape / Schroeder
PDX trades: Grant

If we got Rui / Sharpe / FRP for Grant... I'd be quite happy with that.

RIP CITY!!!

Certainly would also be happy with Rui plus a pick, but I would def treat it as a 2-3 year stopgap.

While I like Rui - his ceiling still leaves much to be desired if a better starting option comes along.

But, down to get the trade done and then see what we have w him.

Between Rui, Jabari, Toumani, Deni, DA we probably have the 4 spot locked down

Just to note... Rui was drafted in the lottery several years ago by the Wiztards, which I think we all can safely agree, isn't the best place to go if one craves any kind of NBA success. He went to the Lakers for little to no money, and played well enough that the Lakers saw enough in him to sign him to a "decent" contract, and allowed him to get noticed with significant playing time on a playoff team.

My thought is... Washington must have been Suck-Ville and LA is LA, but what if he was mixed into this young core of PORTLAND players? How would he look with the players you mention, plus... the ones you failed to mention? When you look what we would end up with players 1-15, I love the new look, and think he'd be an absolute BEAST for us.

I also strongly believe that if Cronin, for whatever reason, feels that Rui has no chance of being the "Buck Williams" that I believe he can be (or Kersey if you'd rather), then there really is NO DEAL TO BE HAD. We'll just keep what we got, thank you very much.

[Walton1one]

Yeah Grant is not a modest upgrade from Rui, much better player, but older, not a great contract, but for a team with playoff\championship aspirations & a short window, he is a much better player/fit

Is Dlo better than Brogdon? Because I doubt LAL can get a 1st round pick for Dlo, so he may be a decent player, like Brogdan is, but ends up as necessary salary filler, it is what it is. The only thing that keeps his value neutral is that his contract is expiring.

Williams is a good\valuable player that can’t stay healthy, therefore a risk. Every team knows this & yet BOS was hesitant to include him in a trade. He is a gamble, but for a playoff team, one likely worth taking. The risk/reward is can he stay healthy vs. his acquisition cost via the trade deadline because when healthy, he is a difference maker & for playoff teams that has added value.

You left out Banton and his partially guaranteed deal, potentially $2mil in savings, plus the value of LAL gaining cap space in this trade, which for a team right up against the 2nd apron has value

Grant is worth Rui + lightly protected 1st

Williams, on the cheap, is worth a lightly protected swap, possibly more

Banton + $2m cap space is worth a lightly protected swap or 1/2 that and Williams low value worth the other half.

It Is more than a fair deal IMO, now maybe BRK can surpass this with something like DFS\Cam for similar package, but all indications are they want a 1st+ for both, maybe they readjust like POR should.

The wildcard in this deal IMO is Williams, if healthy he definitely brings significant value to this deal, but his health is a risk, for a team with aging players and championship aspirations, more often than not it is worth it.

[GEE]

I think the most appealing deal POR could offer to LAL would be something like:

Grant\Williams\Banton (or Walker)
for
Rui\Vincent\Dlo a 30’ 1st (top 3/5 protection) and preferably (2) pick swaps (29’ & 31’), top 3\5 protected

Another option, instead of Williams could be: DLo, Vincent, Rui + picks\swaps for Grant, Thybulle & Reath

These are interesting options, but why does LAL give up so much? One protected pick, no swaps, seems like enough. Rui and Russell are rotation players themselves -- they may not have value to Portland, but they do to LAL. You're asking them to accept modest upgrades at a high cost.

Question for ya'll... with this trade idea, who plays PG for the Lakers next year... 48 minutes for Banton?

Also, why would we also just thow in one of the league's best defenders in Thybulle, along with Reath, the guy who was just an absolute gift to us from the NBA Gods? WHY? Trade Simons.... WHY?

I can't freakin' wait for the season to start. We are not tanking and we will far eclipse the win #s that people are projecting... (someone please plug me the Barkley vid) I GUARANTEE!

RIP CITY!!!

[Wizenheimer]

You psychically know how much the Lakers value Grant? Danny Marang said LA initially agreed to 2 FRP then pulled out. .

lol...marang

[zzaj]

The real question here should be how do the Blazers get Castleton from the Lakers if Grant ends up in yellow and purple…