Ayton, Grant, and Simons for anything?

[Walton1one]

MIL has started to turn the ship around. Middleton finally came back, played 4g (not well) and now is out again.

Middleton is cooked IMO. He is done. I cannot believe MIL, who is so limited on options, would not look to upgrade from him, to a player who could be more useful.

Jerami Grant could be that player

Middleton
for
Grant + 31' 1st

Works, straight up. Maybe a follow-up trade after of:

AJ Johnson
for
(1) of Reath\Walker\Banton

This achieves several things:
1) Meets a realistic price for Grant ((1) 1st + prospect)
2) Gives MIL (2) players who could at least be CONSISTENT rotational pieces over (2) players who are not. Johnson has been in 5g this year, (2.2min\avg) - Middleton has missed the majority of the season, and then finally comes back, plays 4g so far (out tonight) averaging a stellar 7pts on 25.9% FG%
3) Grant is 3yrs YOUNGER, has no injury history to speak of (Middleton's is growing longer by the year)
4) Grant's contract is 2yrs longer than Middleton's but at least he is ON the court playing\producing, whereas Middleton over the last THREE seasons has averaged playing less than 40% of MIL games. Are they playing for a chip or not?
5)Grant actually makes LESS than Middleton, which is unbelievable
6) MIL has stated they don't want to trade Giannis\Dame, but the rest of their roster has limited trade appeal, at least trade appeal that could result in them UPGRADING their roster. With this deal, they upgrade their roster and keep their rotational roster intact
7) Being a 2nd apron team, MIL choices are really limited. Trading for Grant is at least a realistic one that is actually possible.

How this deal has not been done already is beyond me...

[Walton1one]

Another potential trade partner for POR. recently read that ATL are looking like they will be BUYERS at the trade deadline (goodbye 2nd round pick).

What are their needs?
- A backup big man
- A backup guard, preferably one that can play PG

What are their expendable assets they could trade away?
- Capela is for sure one
- Bogdanovic could be another
- They own LAL\SAC 25' 1st's, NO 27 1st and all of their own 1st (26' & 28'+)
- They own (6) future 2nd rounders

They have a nice starting rotation of: Young - Daniels - Hunter - Johnson - Okongwu, PLUS Risacher, Nance Jr, Bogdanovic off the bench

I think (2) POR players could work here: Simons and\or RW3

Simons could come off the bench, play alongside Daniels (or Bogdanovic)

Williams could come of the bench for Okongwu, in lieu of Capela, and he has another year (Capela is FA) at a reasonable price

TRADE #1
RW3\Thybulle
for
Capela + 25' 1st (they have (2) both LAL and SAC (1-14 protect), give POR worst of)

TRADE #2
Simons
for
Capela & Roddy (or Bufkin if they wanted to clear themselves from obligation to him and gain 1yr of $$) + 25' 1st (same restrictions as above)

[BlazersBroncos]

I think the days of a FRP for Jerami are over. He is playing very poorly, his contract is almost uniquely long for his caliber of player and his salary is very big for a 4th option given the current CBA.

I tend to think we as a fanbase, as with all fanbases, did not take the CBA adjustment into account enough when gauging player trade value. The apron is crushing teams. Its changed the whole landscape of making a trade, and it has plummeted the value of good-not-great-making-big-money type guys (IE Simons, Grant, Ayton - guys that were already overpaid even before the CBA adjustments).

I dont think we move any of the big 3 money guys. I simply dont think there is a market for that level of talent, at that salary cost.

And I wouldnt be surprised if we ended up settling for 3-4 SRP for RWIII (IE slightly more than BRK got for Dennis).

FWIW - if Cronin didnt give Jerami a contract length that should basically be reserved for prime age Top-3 guys on a contender and instead expired after 3 years I do think we could get a team to bite for a highly protected FRP. But Grant with another 3 years after this at 30M AV is INSANE given this NBA landscape.

[Blazinaway]

I think the days of a FRP for Jerami are over. He is playing very poorly, his contract is almost uniquely long for his caliber of player and his salary is very big for a 4th option given the current CBA.

I tend to think we as a fanbase, as with all fanbases, did not take the CBA adjustment into account enough when gauging player trade value. The apron is crushing teams. Its changed the whole landscape of making a trade, and it has plummeted the value of good-not-great-making-big-money type guys (IE Simons, Grant, Ayton - guys that were already overpaid even before the CBA adjustments).

I dont think we move any of the big 3 money guys. I simply dont think there is a market for that level of talent, at that salary cost.

And I wouldnt be surprised if we ended up settling for 3-4 SRP for RWIII (IE slightly more than BRK got for Dennis).

FWIW - if Cronin didnt give Jerami a contract length that should basically be reserved for prime age Top-3 guys on a contender and instead expired after 3 years I do think we could get a team to bite for a highly protected FRP. But Grant with another 3 years after this at 30M AV is INSANE given this NBA landscape.

[Blazinaway]

I think the days of a FRP for Jerami are over. He is playing very poorly, his contract is almost uniquely long for his caliber of player and his salary is very big for a 4th option given the current CBA.

I tend to think we as a fanbase, as with all fanbases, did not take the CBA adjustment into account enough when gauging player trade value. The apron is crushing teams. Its changed the whole landscape of making a trade, and it has plummeted the value of good-not-great-making-big-money type guys (IE Simons, Grant, Ayton - guys that were already overpaid even before the CBA adjustments).

I dont think we move any of the big 3 money guys. I simply dont think there is a market for that level of talent, at that salary cost.

And I wouldnt be surprised if we ended up settling for 3-4 SRP for RWIII (IE slightly more than BRK got for Dennis).

FWIW - if Cronin didnt give Jerami a contract length that should basically be reserved for prime age Top-3 guys on a contender and instead expired after 3 years I do think we could get a team to bite for a highly protected FRP. But Grant with another 3 years after this at 30M AV is INSANE given this NBA landscape.

Well said, it's also why I am worried about Cronin giving Shaedon a max extension, he simply does not deserve being even close to one at his current level of play and consistency, I hope he improves but lets wait and see and hopefully he realizes/learns from past mistakes

[Tim Lehrbach]

I think the days of a FRP for Jerami are over. [...]

I dont think we move any of the big 3 money guys. I simply dont think there is a market for that level of talent, at that salary cost.

Yup. I don't like it, but that's where I think we are. Hence my asking just how desperate fans are to shed these guys and whether we can accept them playing out their contracts if the alternative is using assets to dump them.

[BlazersBroncos]

I think the days of a FRP for Jerami are over. [...]

I dont think we move any of the big 3 money guys. I simply dont think there is a market for that level of talent, at that salary cost.

Yup. I don't like it, but that's where I think we are. Hence my asking just how desperate fans are to shed these guys and whether we can accept them playing out their contracts if the alternative is using assets to dump them.

I think salary dumping is in the picture. Take Middleton for example. He expires after 25/26. That is 2 years earlier than Grant. I would argue that pure salary dumping Grant for Middleton is not outrageous in any way.

We can cut 2 years of Grant's deal - and the cherry on top would be rehabbing Middleton and flipping him for something over the summer.

Additionally, maybe Simons can get THJ and 2 SRP from DET.

Finally, and this would be my optimist take after the above 2 pessimistic takes, maybe after the emphatic loss to MIL the FO in OKC re-evaluates their lack of size and ponies up a 2025 Top-20 protected FRP and Kenrich for RWIII.

Grant for Middleton
Simons for THJ + 2 SRP
RWIII for Kenrich + 2025 Top-20 Protected FRP (Reverts to 3-4 SRP if not conveyed)

Those are the types of deals I think we are looking at. And I would do every one of them at this point.

[Tim Lehrbach]

I concur and would do all of those too.

[dckingsfan]

Agreed. If you aren't bought into Grant (as Cronin irrationally seems to be) then you do a Middleton straight up for Grant in a heartbeat (a SRP would be great).

You rehab Middleton for the rest of the year and hope that he performs next year (contract year) and flip him for SRPs.

[Wizenheimer]

I think the days of a FRP for Jerami are over. [...]

I dont think we move any of the big 3 money guys. I simply dont think there is a market for that level of talent, at that salary cost.

Yup. I don't like it, but that's where I think we are. Hence my asking just how desperate fans are to shed these guys and whether we can accept them playing out their contracts if the alternative is using assets to dump them.

depends on the assets added. A 2nd round pick to dump one of the contracts for an expiring? sure

anything more than that, probably not. But maybe yes for one simple reason: my biggest issue with Simons and Ayton is I worry that Cronin will re-sign them

[DaVoiceMaster]

If the Blazers do nothing but trade Grant for an expiring or 1-year contract and simply let Ayton, Simons, Thybulle, and RWIII walk, the Blazers will have just $42M in contracts for Scoot, Deni, Camara, Clingan, and Murray plus whoever they draft the next two summers. Sharpe will get his extension and it will likely be about the same amount as the others combined. (YUCK!!!) We'll see what happens with Rupert and Walker. That leaves roughly $100M to sign players with.

[Butter]

If the Blazers do nothing but trade Grant for an expiring or 1-year contract and simply let Ayton, Simons, Thybulle, and RWIII walk, the Blazers will have just $42M in contracts for Scoot, Deni, Camara, Clingan, and Murray plus whoever they draft the next two summers. Sharpe will get his extension and it will likely be about the same amount as the others combined. (YUCK!!!) We'll see what happens with Rupert and Walker. That leaves roughly $100M to sign players with.

If that was to happen, the Blazers most likely move would be to take on talent from 2nd apron teams.

[DaVoiceMaster]

If the Blazers do nothing but trade Grant for an expiring or 1-year contract and simply let Ayton, Simons, Thybulle, and RWIII walk, the Blazers will have just $42M in contracts for Scoot, Deni, Camara, Clingan, and Murray plus whoever they draft the next two summers. Sharpe will get his extension and it will likely be about the same amount as the others combined. (YUCK!!!) We'll see what happens with Rupert and Walker. That leaves roughly $100M to sign players with.

If that was to happen, the Blazers most likely move would be to take on talent from 2nd apron teams.

Plan A - Sign 2-3 quality players.
Plan B - Trade cap space for piss-pioor players & draft picks. Gotta make it worth while though.

[shrink]

Wandering MIN fan with an offer, but at the back of your roster

POR GETS: Terrence Shannon Jr
MIN GETS: Duop Reath, 2027 MIN 2nd returned

Shannon was the #27 pick this summer, and it looked like Tim Connelly might have found another late draft NBA player. The 6-6, fifth year senior SG from Illinois immediately scored 25 and 19 in his first two Summer League games, and his physical ability to get to the rim and score through defenders looked like a smart pick up to eventually back up Ant at SG. Unfortunately for Shannon, the addition of DiVincenzo, and NAW becoming too indispensable for MIN to lose in free agency has probably set up road blocks for his career if he stays in Minnesota. These days he only gets garbage time minutes in blowouts, and his game is too experienced for the G League to help much. He’s an older rookie (turned 24 in November), 6-6 SG with athleticism.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrence-shannonjr-1.html

Reath’s chance for minutes have also been taken away by roster imbalance, so both players could get opportunities on each others’ roster.

[cucad8]

Wandering MIN fan with an offer, but at the back of your roster

POR GETS: Terrence Shannon Jr
MIN GETS: Dup Reath, 2027 MIN 2nd returned

Shannon was the #27 pick this summer, and it looked like Tim Connelly might have found another late draft NBA player. The 6-6, fifth year senior SG from Illinois immediately scored 25 and 19 in his first two Summer League games, and his physical ability to get to the rim and score through defenders looked like a smart pick up to eventually back up Ant at SG. Unfortunately for Shannon, the addition of DiVincenzo, and NAW becoming too indispensable for MIN to lose in free agency has probably set up road blocks for his career if he stays in Minnesota. These days he only gets garbage time minutes in blowouts, and his game is too experienced for the G League to help much. He’s an older rookie (turned 24 in November), 6-6 SG with athleticism.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrence-shannonjr-1.html

Reath’s chance for minutes have also been taken away by roster imbalance, so both players could get opportunities on each others’ roster.

Yes from this fan. Shannon seems worth taking a flyer on for sure. Seems like a win-win.

[BlazersBroncos]

Ya I would do that trade for sure.

[dckingsfan]

Wandering MIN fan with an offer, but at the back of your roster

POR GETS: Terrence Shannon Jr
MIN GETS: Dup Reath, 2027 MIN 2nd returned

Shannon was the #27 pick this summer, and it looked like Tim Connelly might have found another late draft NBA player. The 6-6, fifth year senior SG from Illinois immediately scored 25 and 19 in his first two Summer League games, and his physical ability to get to the rim and score through defenders looked like a smart pick up to eventually back up Ant at SG. Unfortunately for Shannon, the addition of DiVincenzo, and NAW becoming too indispensable for MIN to lose in free agency has probably set up road blocks for his career if he stays in Minnesota. These days he only gets garbage time minutes in blowouts, and his game is too experienced for the G League to help much. He’s an older rookie (turned 24 in November), 6-6 SG with athleticism.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrence-shannonjr-1.html

Reath’s chance for minutes have also been taken away by roster imbalance, so both players could get opportunities on each others’ roster.

Yes from this fan. Shannon seems worth taking a flyer on for sure. Seems like a win-win.

Shannon is 24. I like the think of a trade asset but wouldn't there be another younger player to take a flyer on?

It also depends on what they do with Williams. If they move him, Reath gets to move back into the rotation (given the history of Ayton).

[cucad8]

Wandering MIN fan with an offer, but at the back of your roster

POR GETS: Terrence Shannon Jr
MIN GETS: Dup Reath, 2027 MIN 2nd returned

Shannon was the #27 pick this summer, and it looked like Tim Connelly might have found another late draft NBA player. The 6-6, fifth year senior SG from Illinois immediately scored 25 and 19 in his first two Summer League games, and his physical ability to get to the rim and score through defenders looked like a smart pick up to eventually back up Ant at SG. Unfortunately for Shannon, the addition of DiVincenzo, and NAW becoming too indispensable for MIN to lose in free agency has probably set up road blocks for his career if he stays in Minnesota. These days he only gets garbage time minutes in blowouts, and his game is too experienced for the G League to help much. He’s an older rookie (turned 24 in November), 6-6 SG with athleticism.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/terrence-shannonjr-1.html

Reath’s chance for minutes have also been taken away by roster imbalance, so both players could get opportunities on each others’ roster.

Yes from this fan. Shannon seems worth taking a flyer on for sure. Seems like a win-win.

Shannon is 24. I like the think of a trade asset but wouldn't there be another younger player to take a flyer on?

It also depends on what they do with Williams. If they move him, Reath gets to move back into the rotation (given the history of Ayton).

I'm not opposed to another younger prospect, but am also reasonable about who Reath is and what should be expected in return. Shannon has talent. If it turns out he sucks, what did we lose? An older C we don't need? Even if we trade away Williams, Reath isn't in the rotation. Everyone was out a few games ago and we started Jabari Walker at C over him.

[dckingsfan]

Yes from this fan. Shannon seems worth taking a flyer on for sure. Seems like a win-win.

Shannon is 24. I like the think of a trade asset but wouldn't there be another younger player to take a flyer on?

It also depends on what they do with Williams. If they move him, Reath gets to move back into the rotation (given the history of Ayton).

I'm not opposed to another younger prospect, but am also reasonable about who Reath is and what should be expected in return. Shannon has talent. If it turns out he sucks, what did we lose? An older C we don't need? Even if we trade away Williams, Reath isn't in the rotation. Everyone was out a few games ago and we started Jabari Walker at C over him.

Solid logic. The alternate take is that he also isn't going to get a chance to play (given the roster). So, I would rather get a 20- or 21-year-old.

But your point is solid. And it would be doing a solid for Reath.

[Wizenheimer]

if the Blazers can get a 2nd round pick for Reath they should do it

I'm wondering, IIRC Reath is on a minimum deal and it prior CBA's a team trading for a minimum contract didn't have to send a player back. That may have changed in the new CBA