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Portland - 2016 Offseason

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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#941 » by Oneluckbox » Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:50 am

Masterfully wrote:Assuming Portland blows its wad on a center, are we all good starting Harkless and Aminu at forwards?

With a Whiteside or Biyombo I actually think Meyers Leonard pairs well.

Does Plumlee stay? If not, what kind of return can you get in a trade?


I REALLY like Harkless so hopefully a team doesn't come in with a ludicrous offer making him unreasonable to sign. As for Plumlee, I say he gets traded for sure If they get Whiteside. Could the Blazers get a 1st Round pick in the 10-20 region for him? I'm not sure. But the 2017 draft looks pretty mint so getting into the 1st round would be ideal. So the Blazers traded the 23rd pick for him in 2015. Am I being too unreasonable thinking that they can trade him for a pick higher than that?
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#942 » by Oneluckbox » Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:51 am

Forget Meyers as well. Get that garbage out of here :lol:
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#943 » by DusterBuster » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:15 am

Oden2 wrote:
GreenRiddler wrote:
Oden2 wrote:


Minnesota's roster would be a whole different ball game imo. That team is LOADED.
Yeah but I'll take a team that has been proven to win over hope. Wiggins and Leaving have been a bit disappointing and while KATs is great, so is AD and he has been on some bad teams lately.

I ll believe it when I see it in minny, a team that is in one hell of a playoff drought.


I'll have to agree to disagree here, I'd trade rosters with Minnesota any day of the week. That team has a shot at being a contender in 5 years whereas Portland needs to make a massive miracle signing/ trade/ draft pick to make that happen.


This is pretty classic "grass is always greener" thinking. Think back to 2006. I can almost guarantee there were a handful of teams fans going "Man, I'd trade our roster in a heartbeat for what Portland has with Roy, Aldridge and Oden."

I'm high on that Minny roster too, they have the makings of something amazing, but they could also crap the bed. Towns looks like he's going to make Anthony Davis' reign as the NBA's best young big short-lived, Wiggins has the potential to be next level great and then the got Dunn who was pretty highly rated. That said, Towns could end up with a line of injuries similar to Davis, Wiggins could end up having already plateaued as just a good player, and Dunn could be a total bust. Love the potential there, but potential is just that until it's realized.

For my money, I'll take a proven commodity over "potential" every day of the week and twice on Sundays.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#944 » by PDXKnight » Tue Jun 28, 2016 2:03 pm

DusterBuster wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
GreenRiddler wrote:
Minnesota's roster would be a whole different ball game imo. That team is LOADED.


I'll have to agree to disagree here, I'd trade rosters with Minnesota any day of the week. That team has a shot at being a contender in 5 years whereas Portland needs to make a massive miracle signing/ trade/ draft pick to make that happen.


This is pretty classic "grass is always greener" thinking. Think back to 2006. I can almost guarantee there were a handful of teams fans going "Man, I'd trade our roster in a heartbeat for what Portland has with Roy, Aldridge and Oden."

I'm high on that Minny roster too, they have the makings of something amazing, but they could also crap the bed. Towns looks like he's going to make Anthony Davis' reign as the NBA's best young big short-lived, Wiggins has the potential to be next level great and then the got Dunn who was pretty highly rated. That said, Towns could end up with a line of injuries similar to Davis, Wiggins could end up having already plateaued as just a good player, and Dunn could be a total bust. Love the potential there, but potential is just that until it's realized.

For my money, I'll take a proven commodity over "potential" every day of the week and twice on Sundays.


potential is certainly a roll of the dice but it's not like those guys haven't produced already. Yeah they're not superstars yet but most players don't make that kind of impact till their 4th year at least
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#945 » by Wizenheimer » Tue Jun 28, 2016 3:13 pm

DusterBuster wrote:People said the Blazers "needed" to get their way into the lottery this year as well. Gimme what Portland has had the past 3 years over what the Sixers have had the past 3 years to get a lottery pick. Simmons may be awesome, he also may flame out. No one knows right now.


I'm not sure how it is that the choice is either what Portland has done or what Philly has done. There are more templates then that, and the template Philly has used is an extreme example, almost past the point of absurdity.

For most franchises, the draft still remains the best way to infuse top-level talent. There isn't a close second either. OKC has Durant, Westbrook, and Adams, all added with top-5 draft picks. And yes, I know Adams was an 11th pick but they got him from trading a former 3rd pick in Harden. The Warriors have Curry, Klay, and Barnes, all added with lottery picks. They have struck generational paydirt in the 2nd round though, first with Monta Ellis (who was essentially 'traded' for Bogut and Ezeli), then Draymond Green, who is both a generational talent and a generational jackass. Cleveland has Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love, both secured with top draft picks. And of course that home-town fella

and you said Portland over the last 3 years. This year is a lot different then last year, but in the first 2 of those three years, Portland had Aldridge and Lillard; former #2 and #6 picks

again, high draft picks are still the best way for most teams to add top-talent

and those people, at the beginning of this year, wanting Portland to get a good lottery pick, were not advocating that Portland be Philly. That's false equivalency. There were only 15 wins separating the Blazers from a top-5 pick this year. Davis, Plumlee, and Aminu, according to win shares, added 17. Now, they are all nice role players, but does anybody really think they are core players? What would be better now, having Plumlee or Rondae Hollis-Jefferson? Portland could have filled those slots with 1 year contract players, added a top-5 pick, and have 17 million more in cap-space on July 1; and in RHJ could have potentially a dominant perimeter defender who happens to have led all NBA wings in rebounding rate. I'm not saying that would necessarily be a better position then they are in right now. But it certainly is a viable and justifiable 'plan' compared to the current one

Yes, it was fun watching the team overachieve this season and make it to the 2nd round, even though we all know the playoff success likely wouldn't have happened without injuries to Paul and Griffin.

Billy, in another thread, essentially asked how long the Blazers were going to have to settle for plan B. In reality, I think Olshey off-seasons have been a lot more plan C then B. But, by the moves Portland made last summer, they have seemingly committed to a specific plan; and that plan is to use cap-space this summer to add a high level talent. The mutual interest between the Blazers and Whiteside seem to confirm that. Maybe this summer, after all the free agency failures, the Blazers will finally find free agency success

But what if they don't? When you compared the current Portland 'template' to the Philly one, you seemed to assume the Portland plan was already a success. But if the Blazers strike out in free agency, and simply resign their 3 RFA's, probably to bloated deals, they are capped out for quite a few years, with almost no way to add talented players thru either the draft or free agency. They very well may be in a cul-de-sac. treadmill. Waiting for some big trade opportunity and hoping that their inability to attach high draft picks to a trade package doesn't leave them in 2nd place in trade bidding, time and again

in other words, whatever path they embarked on last summer could lead to frustration. We all knew last summer was a huge pivot point for Portland. Aldridge's decision forced the Blazers to pivot away from the core they had. But because of the path they chose, that leaves this summer as critical, IMO. I'm hoping they can parlay the feel-good-momentum the season ended with into something better then a status quo roster, otherwise, pivoting away from a lottery pick last summer may have been the wrong choice
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#946 » by DaVoiceMaster » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:12 pm

To take Wiz's comments a step futher ... how will Blazers fans react if they do not overachieve next season?
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#947 » by Epicurus » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:48 pm

The assumption of overachieving last season is somewhat overblown Using Wins Produced from the previous season and giving the new guys the minutes of those replaced, the expected wins were over 40. Of course, that assumes that they would play as well individually and together as they did with their previous team. They did, maybe due to team climate.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#948 » by zzaj » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:06 pm

DaVoiceMaster wrote:To take Wiz's comments a step futher ... how will Blazers fans react if they do not overachieve next season?


I wouldn't be surprised if the Blazers didn't make the Playoffs next season. In fact if they don't land a big name FA, I'd welcome it. By all accounts next year's draft is supposed to have a lot of top-end talent. I still think that if Lillard or CJ go down for any 15-30 game stretch it could be doors closed to the playoffs. Same thing if they lose a couple of role players. The West is just incredibly competitive.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#949 » by DemonLizard » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:35 pm

zzaj wrote:
DaVoiceMaster wrote:To take Wiz's comments a step futher ... how will Blazers fans react if they do not overachieve next season?


I wouldn't be surprised if the Blazers didn't make the Playoffs next season. In fact if they don't land a big name FA, I'd welcome it. By all accounts next year's draft is supposed to have a lot of top-end talent. I still think that if Lillard or CJ go down for any 15-30 game stretch it could be doors closed to the playoffs. Same thing if they lose a couple of role players. The West is just incredibly competitive.



All of your comments seem so negative, lol. Anyways, I think portland unless they bring in a big name free agent are a 1st-2nd round exit.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#950 » by zzaj » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:46 pm

DemonLizard wrote:
zzaj wrote:
DaVoiceMaster wrote:To take Wiz's comments a step futher ... how will Blazers fans react if they do not overachieve next season?


I wouldn't be surprised if the Blazers didn't make the Playoffs next season. In fact if they don't land a big name FA, I'd welcome it. By all accounts next year's draft is supposed to have a lot of top-end talent. I still think that if Lillard or CJ go down for any 15-30 game stretch it could be doors closed to the playoffs. Same thing if they lose a couple of role players. The West is just incredibly competitive.



All of your comments seem so negative, lol. Anyways, I think portland unless they bring in a big name free agent are a 1st-2nd round exit.


Too jaded (or realistic) I guess, lol. Believe me, I have been rooting and will continue to root for the Blazers to win a Championship my whole life. This franchise has had some pretty incredible setbacks in the last 15 years. Thus the jaded realism. Last year was probably my favorite Blazer year in a decade...
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#951 » by Wizenheimer » Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:52 pm

DemonLizard wrote:
zzaj wrote:
DaVoiceMaster wrote:To take Wiz's comments a step futher ... how will Blazers fans react if they do not overachieve next season?


I wouldn't be surprised if the Blazers didn't make the Playoffs next season. In fact if they don't land a big name FA, I'd welcome it. By all accounts next year's draft is supposed to have a lot of top-end talent. I still think that if Lillard or CJ go down for any 15-30 game stretch it could be doors closed to the playoffs. Same thing if they lose a couple of role players. The West is just incredibly competitive.



All of your comments seem so negative, lol. Anyways, I think portland unless they bring in a big name free agent are a 1st-2nd round exit.


I don't think those comments were negative.

Portland had incredible injury luck this season. 5 of 8 primary rotation players appeared in at least 80 games; 7 of 8 played at least 78 games, and IIRC, the two that 'only' played 78 games had DNP-CD's as the reason (Vonleh & Harkless). And all that doesn't count Lillard who missed 7 games, but did so during an easy part of the schedule

very similar to the 2013-14 Blazers when 4 of 5 starters played in all 54 games. The next season, the luck ran out, and the same thing could happen next season. Odds seem to imply it will
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#952 » by GreenRiddler » Tue Jun 28, 2016 9:25 pm

Talking about injuries occurring is damn depressing. Hope they all stay healthy. Positive vibes positive outcome.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#953 » by Tim Lehrbach » Tue Jun 28, 2016 9:30 pm

How many times have the Blazers made the second round? I'll take this past season over a lottery pick, for sure. But maybe they'll suck this year and delight all the big dreamers with a high lottery pick.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#954 » by Wizenheimer » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:07 pm

Tim Lehrbach wrote:How many times have the Blazers made the second round? I'll take this past season over a lottery pick, for sure.


I'm curious, would you take a 4-1 second round exit in 2012 over adding Damian Lillard?
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#955 » by DusterBuster » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:21 pm

Why is sports radio in Portland talking about Portland and Harrison Barnes so much?.....
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#956 » by Fitz303 » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:22 pm

Wizenheimer wrote:
Tim Lehrbach wrote:How many times have the Blazers made the second round? I'll take this past season over a lottery pick, for sure.


I'm curious, would you take a 4-1 second round exit in 2012 over adding Damian Lillard?


Thanks to Gerald Wallace, we coulda had both
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#957 » by DusterBuster » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:32 pm

Fitz303 wrote:
Wizenheimer wrote:
Tim Lehrbach wrote:How many times have the Blazers made the second round? I'll take this past season over a lottery pick, for sure.


I'm curious, would you take a 4-1 second round exit in 2012 over adding Damian Lillard?


Thanks to Gerald Wallace, we coulda had both


Or thanks to Billy King more accurately.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#958 » by Waynearchetype » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:34 pm

DusterBuster wrote:Why is sports radio in Portland talking about Portland and Harrison Barnes so much?.....

Sports radio was a thing people could look to for guidance before the internet was used much. Now, it is just another fans opinion, and its not always the smartest one.
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#959 » by Wizenheimer » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:41 pm

Fitz303 wrote:
Wizenheimer wrote:
Tim Lehrbach wrote:How many times have the Blazers made the second round? I'll take this past season over a lottery pick, for sure.


I'm curious, would you take a 4-1 second round exit in 2012 over adding Damian Lillard?


Thanks to Gerald Wallace, we coulda had both


yeah, that was the specific circumstance that summer

but Lillard was a lottery pick. It's a lot easier to dismiss the value of a pick when it's unspecified. It's a different matter to dismiss the value when you substitute a player instead of a pick. Yeah, the pick just as easily could have been Dion Waiters (or Meyers Leonard); two things about that though: one is that many here are extolling the virtues of Olshey's drafting resume; the other is that the 2nd round exit we just saw could be the apex for this current Blazer team.

I enjoyed this Blazer season as much as anybody else. I just reject the assertion of earlier in this thread that those people who were imagining the Blazers getting a high pick early in the season were wanting Portland to adopt the Philly template
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Re: Portland - 2016 Offseason 

Post#960 » by DusterBuster » Tue Jun 28, 2016 11:07 pm

Waynearchetype wrote:
DusterBuster wrote:Why is sports radio in Portland talking about Portland and Harrison Barnes so much?.....

Sports radio was a thing people could look to for guidance before the internet was used much. Now, it is just another fans opinion, and its not always the smartest one.


Yeah, I listen to it more now for entertainment than actual news. I'm assuming if I didn't know about it before they're talking about it, then it's probably just something they're mentioning to try and get/hold listeners when it's the slow sports season like right now.
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