Thoughts......

[Blazers20]

Kanter not part of NY future?
Porzingas doesn’t really want to be in NY?
Hayward not producing in Boston?
Phoenix needs a point guard.

NYK: McCollum-Collins-2019 1st (POR)
BOS: Kanter-Aminu-2019 & 2020 2nd (POR)
PHO: Ntilinkina-Swanigan
POR: Porzingas-Hayward-Bender-Jackson

What does Portland need to add to make this work?

[cdubbz]

A miracle. Hayward can net more than aminu so Boston says no. No way Knicks let porzingis go for McCollum.

[Roy The Natural]

Kanter not part of NY future?
Porzingas doesn’t really want to be in NY?
Hayward not producing in Boston?
Phoenix needs a point guard.

NYK: McCollum-Collins-2019 1st (POR)
BOS: Kanter-Aminu-2019 & 2020 2nd (POR)
PHO: Ntilinkina-Swanigan
POR: Porzingas-Hayward-Bender-Jackson

What does Portland need to add to make this work?

That's light for a lot of the teams. Ntilikina probably isn't the answer for Phoenix... I wouldn't move Jackson for him. Porzingas is worth more than that. Boston would be the one getting Porzingas as they likely would throw in true assets to get him. Too many teams involved. You'd have to think of a way to get Porzingas involving just Portland and the Knicks. I'm not sure there is one.

Kanter though, he could be had... and probably for relatively cheap. He could probably do some stuff for Portland if the price is cheap. He'd definitely provide a bit of scoring... but he doesn't really shoot the ball... and wouldn't be playable alongside Nurk.

I don't believe any team outside of Portland (and maybe Boston) even comes close to entertaining their part in this deal. Phoenix is certainly not happy with this deal, and the Knicks are getting straight up robbed.

[Roy The Natural]

A miracle. Hayward can net more than aminu so Boston says no. No way Knicks let porzingis go for McCollum.

I agree that the deal would need a Lillard sized addition to get the return Portland gets in this. But I will say that Boston would probably entertain the thought of moving Hayward for expirings. It's basically a get out of jail free card trade for them. They get out of Hayward's contract without taking any salary back beyond this year... and get 2 negligible 2nd rounders back.

They may be able to get "more" from someone else, but they certainily will have to take on that "more" for a more committed amount of time. I haven't looked into Boston's cap-room enough to see if that matters... but if it provides them the cap flexibility to get in range of reoffering a max contract, they may have a shot at someone like Durant in the offseason. I could see them being in on the parts moving on their end. But I can't see them helping to facilitate a trade with big pieces moving like this one, without getting one of the big pieces in the end.

Phoenix and New York are pretty much getting hosed though... which make this trade DOA.

[Blazers20]

Paul George was traded for Sabonis and Oladipo.

Kawhi was traded for DeRozan and Poetl.

Butler was traded Covington and Saric.

Does NY want to commit max to a player who has shown a displeasure with the organization and does the organization want to commit max to a guy who is coming back from a torn ACL.

Who is going to want the $30M plus contract from Hayward? Kanter and Aminu are both expiring and could possibly be important pieces of the bench and Ainge collects another pick.

Jackson and Bender both underachieving and there’s a glut at the 3 in Phoenix (Oubre-Warren-Bridges).

[monopoman]

Yeah at this point Hayward looks like a garbage contract, sure if he can get back to his old self pre-injury the contract might look decent or even pretty good. Right now Hayward is a huge negative though to any team, absorbing tons of salary and not even producing anywhere near his contract.

The trade still might be imbalanced but I think any team taking on Hayward would likely want more assets to offset him. 4 team trades are pipe dreams almost though, I mean it's so hard to find a trade that all 4 teams will agree upon.

[Village Idiot]

Trading everyone for KP is a gutsy move but it's one I would support. This four way trade is too big though. Too many moving parts. New York - Portland straight up would be more viable. If they move KP they will want to dump THJ with him and not an ending contract like Kanter or a young guy like Ntilkina. For the Knicks you have to consider their direction and viability as a free-agent destination. Right now they're in a draft and develop mode which is unusual for them. They could be a free-agent destination already this summer if they can move THJ and/or Lee before extending KP. Under your proposal they don't accomplish that

[Blazers20]

I see CJ being like a Oladipo which he blows up in the east as he becomes the number one option for the Knicks as he becomes an all star for the Knicks. I’m not sure if KP wants to be part of a rebuild? Kanter wants out. Knicks get Collins (young player with huge potential and can be teamed up with Knox and Mitchell).

Could the Blazers send a 1st rounder to both NY and Boston?

Boston gets a redo with Hayward’s contract.

[Blazers20]

Blazers can do a straight up deal with the Knicks.

NYK: CJ-Collins-2019 1st
POR: KP-Kanter-Frank

Blazers can always try and move Kanter and Aminu to Boston at the deadline and Frank to Phoenix.

[BlazersBroncos]

Even with his injury, KP is just too valuable to deal. His potential is sky high still. And a deal with them taking back CJ and moving Kanter destroys their cap space, so they cant sign a MAX FA.

Keep KP, clear a bit of cap space and sign a MAX FA or trade him for CJ, kill your cap space and think that CJ+Hardaway is a foundational base moving forward? Its an easy decision for NYK.

[Blazers20]

https://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/ny-sports-kristaps-porzingis-knicks-free-agency-20190102-story.html?outputType=amp

[BlazersBroncos]

Even if KP did want out, they would deal him for a younger guy on a cheap contract to retain cap space, or a legit superstar worth burning their cap space for, or in a deal that at least increases their cap space in 2019 rather than reduces it.

CJ doesnt check any of those boxes. Maybe if THJ was coming back instead of Kanter they would get on the phone, but even then I would doubt it.

[Wizenheimer]

Yeah at this point Hayward looks like a garbage contract, sure if he can get back to his old self pre-injury the contract might look decent or even pretty good. Right now Hayward is a huge negative though to any team, absorbing tons of salary and not even producing anywhere near his contract.

not that I disagree with you, but:

PER: CJ 16.4....Hayward 15.1
TS%: CJ .542....Hayward .540
FT Rate: CJ .170....Hayward .246
Reb/36: CJ 3.9....Hayward 6.5
assist/36: CJ 2.7....Hayward 4.7
turnover/36: CJ 1.7....Hayward 1.8
usage: CJ 26.2....Hayward 18.8
winshare/48: CJ .093....Hayward .127
box +/-: CJ -0.6....Hayward +1.0
value over replacement: CJ 0.5....Hayward 0.7
ORPM: CJ 1.90....Hayward 0.73
DRPM: CJ -1.86....Hayward -0.31
RPM: CJ 0.04....Hayward 0.42

now, there's a little mitigation to all that because CJ has a much higher usage; he's carrying more offense. But even with that factored, Hayward is arguably contributing as much, if not more, to his team as CJ is to his. Hayward had an injury about as severe as Paul George; and PG had more time to recover yet he struggled when he first started playing.

the point being in a trade that has CJ and Hayward as the two main pieces moving, it's not like Portland is sending out some gem of asset value

on the other hand, CJ is making 27M a year over the next 3 years while Hayward will be making 32M. That's a notable difference. And while CJ has flaws, he has at least established and settled into his production/cost level. Teams would know how much they be overpaying CJ, salary wise. That's not established yet with Hayward. Will he come all the way back to what he was? How long will it take. If he does than Hayward at 32M is better value than CJ at 27M; but if he doesn't he then represents a pretty big albatross contract.

[Wizenheimer]

I see CJ being like a Oladipo which he blows up in the east as he becomes the number one option for the Knicks as he becomes an all star for the Knicks.

CJ an all-star??

Kyle Lowry, Khris Middleton, Victor Oladipo, Ben Simmons, Jimmy Butler, Kyrie Irving, Jayson Tatum, Kemba Walker, Bradley Beal, John Wall

5 guards in all-star game and there's 10 on that list, all arguably better than CJ, most by quite a bit. You can try and slide Butler and/or Tatum and Middleton to SF....but Giannis and Kawhi are already taking 2 of those slots

CJ would NOT be anything close to an automatic all-star in the east.

[Blazers20]

How many guys on that list average more points than CJ? The guys that do are they the #1 option on their team? Is the east a tougher conference than the west?

[zzaj]

1) Kanter doesn't work in Portland. He wants to be a starter and he wouldn't be that here...end of story.

2) Porzingis won't be had for CJ+, unless that "+" includes Lillard...which obviously isn't happening.

3) Even if Hayward was able to be had for CJ, I doubt the Blazers would do it because of salary implications. I however, would do that trade in a heartbeat.

Anybody see Hayward's line last night? 35 points on 14-18 shooting and 4-7 from downtown to go along with 5 assists...in time Hayward is going to be just fine.

[Shem]

Anybody see Hayward's line last night? 35 points on 14-18 shooting and 4-7 from downtown to go along with 5 assists...in time Hayward is going to be just fine.

Did you see the stat line before his 35 point game? ZERO points in 22 minutes of play.

[Blazers20]

Kanter would be used as trade bait (expiring contract) so there isn’t really a need to be to concerned about him. Boston could use a Kanter as Horford is aging and could use Kanter 20-25 minutes as a starter or backup. Boston would get Kanter and Aminu and make a run at another free agent (maybe KD or Klay?).

If NY were to trade KP what do you think they would get back?

[monopoman]

Anybody see Hayward's line last night? 35 points on 14-18 shooting and 4-7 from downtown to go along with 5 assists...in time Hayward is going to be just fine.

Did you see the stat line before his 35 point game? ZERO points in 22 minutes of play.

Nah man it's like Nurkics huge 24 point 23 rebound 7 assist 5 steals 5 blocks game the guy is clearly the greatest center ever. The old one game sample size evaluation what a great way to evaluate a player.

Anyways my point with Hayward is he is extremely inconsistent right now and he has a long way to go before he is "back to his old self". Even then when one of these injuries come along I think teams start to fear a 2nd or 3rd similar injury (or a injury like it in the other leg), in a lot of cases this type of injury can lead to more down the line.

There are a crap ton of questions around Hayward until he can produce consistently and shows he is mostly injury free for a while.

[Blazers20]

Blazers should try and put a package of expiring contracts for Hayward now before he does turn it around. I just don’t think he fits in well with their youth movement and part of me thinks Kyrie and Hayward are holding the Tatums and Browns back. Hayward would fit well with this Blazers team and trying to win now.