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Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW

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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#21 » by Oden2 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:06 am

I think the nba should play the game as planned. Regardless of politics if I have a political opinion and don’t show up to work I don’t get paid!
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#22 » by DeBlazerRiddem » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:17 am

NBA players have a chance to send a message without hurting anyone. I don't know how selfish you have to be to think they should rather be playing so you can have entertainment on this particular evening.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#23 » by The Sebastian Express » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:17 am

Oden2 wrote:I think the nba should play the game as planned. Regardless of politics if I have a political opinion and don’t show up to work I don’t get paid!


They're humans. Stop asking them act otherworldly while people who look like them are getting murdered.

It's their choice. This is much more beyond sports now.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#24 » by Oden2 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:24 am

The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:I think the nba should play the game as planned. Regardless of politics if I have a political opinion and don’t show up to work I don’t get paid!


They're humans. Stop asking them act otherworldly while people who look like them are getting murdered.

It's their choice. This is much more beyond sports now.


Meh I’ll agree to disagree. They’re getting paid a fortune and I’ve seen the city of Portland get destroyed in the last 2 months via vandalism and more acts of violence than the 2 highly publicized cases

It’s their choice to protest, but the league going with it is why it’s becoming increasingly hard for me to say I’m an nba fan with any sense of pride. Fact is if you or I protested and didn’t work we wouldn’t get paid whether our views were important or not. The fact that nba players make more that we see in a lifetime is why I’m not buying the nba movement
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#25 » by The Sebastian Express » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:27 am

Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:I think the nba should play the game as planned. Regardless of politics if I have a political opinion and don’t show up to work I don’t get paid!


They're humans. Stop asking them act otherworldly while people who look like them are getting murdered.

It's their choice. This is much more beyond sports now.


Meh I’ll agree to disagree. They’re getting paid a fortune and I’ve seen the city of Portland get destroyed in the last 2 months and I’m sick of it


What does their pay have to do with it?

Them being paid a lot doesn't mean we've bought them or erased their humanity.

How much would you cost to ignore being sick of the city being destroyed?

They see people like them getting murdered for existing or murdered for the most minor of incidents.

I cannot imagine how much that must weigh on someone or wear them down.

Their pay does not mean we get to tell them to ignore their humanity and their suffering.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#26 » by Oden2 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:32 am

The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
They're humans. Stop asking them act otherworldly while people who look like them are getting murdered.

It's their choice. This is much more beyond sports now.


Meh I’ll agree to disagree. They’re getting paid a fortune and I’ve seen the city of Portland get destroyed in the last 2 months and I’m sick of it


What does their pay have to do with it?

Them being paid a lot doesn't mean we've bought them or erased their humanity.

How much would you cost to ignore being sick of the city being destroyed?

They see people like them getting murdered for existing or murdered for the most minor of incidents.

I cannot imagine how much that must weigh on someone or wear them down.

Their pay does not mean we get to tell them to ignore their humanity and their suffering.


Actually the antifa terrorists are mostly white people from what I can tell. And I do think every life matters but I have zero qualms about saying we shouldn’t allow acts of vandalism merely because it’s “for a good thing.” Now I do support the right to protest whether I agree with it or not. Just like equally I think Trump rallies should be allowed without instantly being labeled “racist” or Biden rallies without being labeled “socialist”
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#27 » by soobias » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:32 am

as a 54 year old black man who's been a victim of police brutality i love and fully support this move and any other that can bring a end to senseless killings and brutality .
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#28 » by The Sebastian Express » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:34 am

Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
Meh I’ll agree to disagree. They’re getting paid a fortune and I’ve seen the city of Portland get destroyed in the last 2 months and I’m sick of it


What does their pay have to do with it?

Them being paid a lot doesn't mean we've bought them or erased their humanity.

How much would you cost to ignore being sick of the city being destroyed?

They see people like them getting murdered for existing or murdered for the most minor of incidents.

I cannot imagine how much that must weigh on someone or wear them down.

Their pay does not mean we get to tell them to ignore their humanity and their suffering.


Actually the antifa terrorists are mostly white people from what I can tell. And I do think every life matters but I have zero qualms about saying we shouldn’t allow acts of vandalism merely because it’s “for a good thing”


That's not what I asked you.

You said that they should play the games and keep politics out of it.

You responded to drb and myself by saying they're getting paid a fortune.

So I am asking you, Oden2 - how much would it cost to get you to not care about the destruction and vandalism?

Because you seem to think what someone is paid makes it so that worker shouldn't speak out against something or take action against something.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#29 » by Oden2 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:39 am

The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
What does their pay have to do with it?

Them being paid a lot doesn't mean we've bought them or erased their humanity.

How much would you cost to ignore being sick of the city being destroyed?

They see people like them getting murdered for existing or murdered for the most minor of incidents.

I cannot imagine how much that must weigh on someone or wear them down.

Their pay does not mean we get to tell them to ignore their humanity and their suffering.


Actually the antifa terrorists are mostly white people from what I can tell. And I do think every life matters but I have zero qualms about saying we shouldn’t allow acts of vandalism merely because it’s “for a good thing”


That's not what I asked you.

You said that they should play the games and keep politics out of it.

You responded to drb and myself by saying they're getting paid a fortune.

So I am asking you, Oden2 - how much would it cost to get you to not care about the destruction and vandalism?

Because you seem to think what someone is paid makes it so that worker shouldn't speak out against something or take action against something.


Tse if you paid me even a minimum nba contract I’d shut my mouth about anything and I think anyone who said they wouldn’t is a terrible liar :lol:

I didn’t respond to dbr as far as I know?
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#30 » by The Sebastian Express » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:46 am

Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
Actually the antifa terrorists are mostly white people from what I can tell. And I do think every life matters but I have zero qualms about saying we shouldn’t allow acts of vandalism merely because it’s “for a good thing”


That's not what I asked you.

You said that they should play the games and keep politics out of it.

You responded to drb and myself by saying they're getting paid a fortune.

So I am asking you, Oden2 - how much would it cost to get you to not care about the destruction and vandalism?

Because you seem to think what someone is paid makes it so that worker shouldn't speak out against something or take action against something.


Tse if you paid me even a minimum nba contract I’d shut my mouth about anything and I think anyone who said they wouldn’t is a terrible liar

I didn’t respond to dbr as far as I know?


Except those players in the NBA have minimum and maximum contracts and they aren't shutting their mouth - so no, people who say they wouldn't aren't terrible liars. They're happening now, in real life, in real time.

A majority of those men did not grow up with great wealth. Average wealth.

The players have silently protested. They've spoken out using their platforms. They've organized in their communities. They've contributed to their communities. They've gone on television.

Whether they do this during their off time, whether they're doing this in games, whether they do it silently or they do it vocally - they're all told to stick to sports. Stick to sports and nothing else.

And now they're striking.

Every step of the way people tell them not do what they're doing, that change'll come, they should stick to sports and let other people do the work.

Except change doesn't come.

You do not have to watch.

But their pay, you buying their time, their merchandise, you being a fan of the team, rooting for the team, living vicariously through these players does not make them any less human or give them any less rights to speak up, out and against what is happening to other men and women who look like them.

They don't owe us anything in terms of entertainment. Nothing at all. We do owe it to them to treat them like human beings, though.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#31 » by Oden2 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:55 am

The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
That's not what I asked you.

You said that they should play the games and keep politics out of it.

You responded to drb and myself by saying they're getting paid a fortune.

So I am asking you, Oden2 - how much would it cost to get you to not care about the destruction and vandalism?

Because you seem to think what someone is paid makes it so that worker shouldn't speak out against something or take action against something.


Tse if you paid me even a minimum nba contract I’d shut my mouth about anything and I think anyone who said they wouldn’t is a terrible liar

I didn’t respond to dbr as far as I know?


Except those players in the NBA have minimum and maximum contracts and they aren't shutting their mouth - so no, people who say they wouldn't aren't terrible liars. They're happening now, in real life, in real time.

A majority of those men did not grow up with great wealth. Average wealth.

The players have silently protested. They've spoken out using their platforms. They've organized in their communities. They've contributed to their communities. They've gone on television.

Whether they do this during their off time, whether they're doing this in games, whether they do it silently or they do it vocally - they're all told to stick to sports. Stick to sports and nothing else.

And now they're striking.

Every step of the way people tell them not do what they're doing, that change'll come, they should stick to sports and let other people do the work.

Except change doesn't come.

You do not have to watch.

But their pay, you buying their time, their merchandise, you being a fan of the team, rooting for the team, living vicariously through these players does not make them any less human or give them any less rights to speak up, out and against what is happening to other men and women who look like them.

They don't owe us anything in terms of entertainment. Nothing at all. We do owe it to them to treat them like human beings, though.


Quote me where I said they weren’t human beings?
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#32 » by Epicurus » Thu Aug 27, 2020 3:17 am

Want our professional sporting events as usual, then have police not abuse and kill people due to the color of their skin. Of course, it is not all police persons who do the abuse and killing, but the protection of the abusers by the "good" law enforcement officers sure makes this brutal racist behavior seem systemic. Its been since 1868 that this nation constitutionally became a multiracial representative democracy. Isn't it well past time that the institution of law enforcement lives up to the 14th Amendment? I am proud of these players and other team personnel for taking a dramatic action in support of nonwhite citizen rights.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#33 » by Sinobas » Thu Aug 27, 2020 3:24 am

So, new story is that the Lakers and Clips voted to boycott the whole playoffs but no other team did.

I guess that means we win!! =)
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#34 » by Sinobas » Thu Aug 27, 2020 3:30 am

Epicurus wrote:Want our professional sporting events as usual, then have police not abuse and kill people due to the color of their skin. Of course, it is not all police persons who do the abuse and killing, but the protection of the abusers by the "good" law enforcement officers sure makes this brutal racist behavior seem systemic. Its been since 1868 that this nation constitutionally became a multiracial representative democracy. Isn't it well past time that the institution of law enforcement lives up to the 14th Amendment? I am proud of these players and other team personnel for taking a dramatic action in support of nonwhite citizen rights.


More whites are shot by cops than blacks. Yet you're so sure you can chalk it up to "racism"? The context of these events are also mostly ignored. The officers had George Floyd in the police car for example, then he kept demanding to be held on the ground. The guy that got shot in Wisconsin was armed and resisting arrest.

Police shoot white person, barely makes a blip on the radar, same event happens with a black person, national riots. It's all how people have been brainwashed to respond due to how the media frames things.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#35 » by The Sebastian Express » Thu Aug 27, 2020 3:35 am

Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
Tse if you paid me even a minimum nba contract I’d shut my mouth about anything and I think anyone who said they wouldn’t is a terrible liar

I didn’t respond to dbr as far as I know?


Except those players in the NBA have minimum and maximum contracts and they aren't shutting their mouth - so no, people who say they wouldn't aren't terrible liars. They're happening now, in real life, in real time.

A majority of those men did not grow up with great wealth. Average wealth.

The players have silently protested. They've spoken out using their platforms. They've organized in their communities. They've contributed to their communities. They've gone on television.

Whether they do this during their off time, whether they're doing this in games, whether they do it silently or they do it vocally - they're all told to stick to sports. Stick to sports and nothing else.

And now they're striking.

Every step of the way people tell them not do what they're doing, that change'll come, they should stick to sports and let other people do the work.

Except change doesn't come.

You do not have to watch.

But their pay, you buying their time, their merchandise, you being a fan of the team, rooting for the team, living vicariously through these players does not make them any less human or give them any less rights to speak up, out and against what is happening to other men and women who look like them.

They don't owe us anything in terms of entertainment. Nothing at all. We do owe it to them to treat them like human beings, though.


Quote me where I said they weren’t human beings?


When you are demanding that people play games and stop being political because of how much they are paid or because it's a job, you are demanding that they are less than human.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#36 » by Matt800 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 3:54 am

Sinobas wrote:
Epicurus wrote:Want our professional sporting events as usual, then have police not abuse and kill people due to the color of their skin. Of course, it is not all police persons who do the abuse and killing, but the protection of the abusers by the "good" law enforcement officers sure makes this brutal racist behavior seem systemic. Its been since 1868 that this nation constitutionally became a multiracial representative democracy. Isn't it well past time that the institution of law enforcement lives up to the 14th Amendment? I am proud of these players and other team personnel for taking a dramatic action in support of nonwhite citizen rights.


More whites are shot by cops than blacks. Yet you're so sure you can chalk it up to "racism"? The context of these events are also mostly ignored. The officers had George Floyd in the police car for example, then he kept demanding to be held on the ground. The guy that got shot in Wisconsin was armed and resisting arrest.

Police shoot white person, barely makes a blip on the radar, same event happens with a black person, national riots. It's all how people have been brainwashed to respond due to how the media frames things.


yes it is awkward because in part the issue is racism, and in part the issue is echoes of systemic racial inequality established a long time ago, and in part the issue is general corruption and exploitation of people, especially lower income people. It is important that we are talking about the racism part and the systemic racial inequality part. But also not so good that some of the other problems are forgotten or confused to be about racism. Just in the sense that it is better if we know what's what so real solutions can be found and implemented. It is also challenging to separate anger and emotions so that real solutions can be found. But it's very important to find real solutions, because reactionary actions that are not helpful could make the situation worse.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#37 » by Oden2 » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:00 am

The Sebastian Express wrote:
Oden2 wrote:
The Sebastian Express wrote:
Except those players in the NBA have minimum and maximum contracts and they aren't shutting their mouth - so no, people who say they wouldn't aren't terrible liars. They're happening now, in real life, in real time.

A majority of those men did not grow up with great wealth. Average wealth.

The players have silently protested. They've spoken out using their platforms. They've organized in their communities. They've contributed to their communities. They've gone on television.

Whether they do this during their off time, whether they're doing this in games, whether they do it silently or they do it vocally - they're all told to stick to sports. Stick to sports and nothing else.

And now they're striking.

Every step of the way people tell them not do what they're doing, that change'll come, they should stick to sports and let other people do the work.

Except change doesn't come.

You do not have to watch.

But their pay, you buying their time, their merchandise, you being a fan of the team, rooting for the team, living vicariously through these players does not make them any less human or give them any less rights to speak up, out and against what is happening to other men and women who look like them.

They don't owe us anything in terms of entertainment. Nothing at all. We do owe it to them to treat them like human beings, though.


Quote me where I said they weren’t human beings?


When you are demanding that people play games and stop being political because of how much they are paid or because it's a job, you are demanding that they are less than human.


I didn’t demand they play games, I merely think the nba should continue the games as planned. And if the players opt to not play that’s up to them

Anyhow I was in no way shape or form saying they are not human that was not my intent
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#38 » by Epicurus » Thu Aug 27, 2020 5:21 am

Sinobas wrote:
Epicurus wrote:Want our professional sporting events as usual, then have police not abuse and kill people due to the color of their skin. Of course, it is not all police persons who do the abuse and killing, but the protection of the abusers by the "good" law enforcement officers sure makes this brutal racist behavior seem systemic. Its been since 1868 that this nation constitutionally became a multiracial representative democracy. Isn't it well past time that the institution of law enforcement lives up to the 14th Amendment? I am proud of these players and other team personnel for taking a dramatic action in support of nonwhite citizen rights.


More whites are shot by cops than blacks. Yet you're so sure you can chalk it up to "racism"? The context of these events are also mostly ignored. The officers had George Floyd in the police car for example, then he kept demanding to be held on the ground. The guy that got shot in Wisconsin was armed and resisting arrest.

Police shoot white person, barely makes a blip on the radar, same event happens with a black person, national riots. It's all how people have been brainwashed to respond due to how the media frames things.
History includes continuity and not just change. Police brutality is part of the continuity history. It can't be wihed out of existence. It is on display. Yes, brainwashing exist regarding racism. Brainwashing and white racism has skipped together since the 14th amendment was passed.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#39 » by zzaj » Thu Aug 27, 2020 5:25 am

Sinobas wrote:
Epicurus wrote:Want our professional sporting events as usual, then have police not abuse and kill people due to the color of their skin. Of course, it is not all police persons who do the abuse and killing, but the protection of the abusers by the "good" law enforcement officers sure makes this brutal racist behavior seem systemic. Its been since 1868 that this nation constitutionally became a multiracial representative democracy. Isn't it well past time that the institution of law enforcement lives up to the 14th Amendment? I am proud of these players and other team personnel for taking a dramatic action in support of nonwhite citizen rights.


More whites are shot by cops than blacks. Yet you're so sure you can chalk it up to "racism"? The context of these events are also mostly ignored. The officers had George Floyd in the police car for example, then he kept demanding to be held on the ground. The guy that got shot in Wisconsin was armed and resisting arrest.

Police shoot white person, barely makes a blip on the radar, same event happens with a black person, national riots. It's all how people have been brainwashed to respond due to how the media frames things.


That's simply not true. If you look at the rate of shootings with underlying factors it's not even that close.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2246987-us-police-kill-up-to-6-times-more-black-people-than-white-people/

I think it's ridiculous of you to say that people are "brainwashed" because they think the difference between what happened with Jacob Blake and Kyle Rittenhouse (as one example) is because of how media "frames things".

Anyway, this has gotten pretty far off topic. Mods, perhaps we should open a thread specific to the "protest" event?

While I do take what NBA players say with a grain of salt--many of them have been in a sports bubble most of their young lives and have a limited picture of what an average life is like--I fully support someone striking at work for whatever reason they so choose.
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Re: Playoff game 5 rd 1Portland vs LA Lakers 6:00pm TNT/SNW 

Post#40 » by Sinobas » Thu Aug 27, 2020 1:41 pm

zzaj wrote:
Sinobas wrote:
Epicurus wrote:Want our professional sporting events as usual, then have police not abuse and kill people due to the color of their skin. Of course, it is not all police persons who do the abuse and killing, but the protection of the abusers by the "good" law enforcement officers sure makes this brutal racist behavior seem systemic. Its been since 1868 that this nation constitutionally became a multiracial representative democracy. Isn't it well past time that the institution of law enforcement lives up to the 14th Amendment? I am proud of these players and other team personnel for taking a dramatic action in support of nonwhite citizen rights.


More whites are shot by cops than blacks. Yet you're so sure you can chalk it up to "racism"? The context of these events are also mostly ignored. The officers had George Floyd in the police car for example, then he kept demanding to be held on the ground. The guy that got shot in Wisconsin was armed and resisting arrest.

Police shoot white person, barely makes a blip on the radar, same event happens with a black person, national riots. It's all how people have been brainwashed to respond due to how the media frames things.


That's simply not true. If you look at the rate of shootings with underlying factors it's not even that close.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2246987-us-police-kill-up-to-6-times-more-black-people-than-white-people/

I think it's ridiculous of you to say that people are "brainwashed" because they think the difference between what happened with Jacob Blake and Kyle Rittenhouse (as one example) is because of how media "frames things".

Anyway, this has gotten pretty far off topic. Mods, perhaps we should open a thread specific to the "protest" event?

While I do take what NBA players say with a grain of salt--many of them have been in a sports bubble most of their young lives and have a limited picture of what an average life is like--I fully support someone striking at work for whatever reason they so choose.


I said more whites were shot, which is true, I didn't say they were shot at a higher rate. But when you factor in the higher rate at which black people commit violent crime, that easily accounts for the racial disparity. This has actually been studied pretty thoroughly.




Out of all the terrible events and killings that occur, only one scenario, which is relatively rare, causes this kind of national eruption. Not even kids getting shot. To me that's brainwashing...people have been trained how to react.

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