Amick: Harden expands his list of preferred destinations to include Blazers

[JasonStern]

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Man has my vote.

[Matt800]

Harden looks like a much better player, but I wonder how much of an upgrade he would actually be? Especially when factoring in his style of play, he's 31, and causing issues with his current team.

Also it looks like to make the contracts work would involve something undesirable. CJ is at 29m and Harden 41m. So it seems like it would take CJ + Nurkic, or Covington, or both Kanter and Collins. The rest of the guys have 2m or less contracts. Unless somehow Hood could be traded. Maybe it can be offset with picks? I don't know much about that.

[BNM]

Harden looks like a much better player, but I wonder how much of an upgrade he would actually be? Especially when factoring in his style of play, he's 31, and causing issues with his current team.

Also it looks like to make the contracts work would involve something undesirable. CJ is at 29m and Harden 41m. So it seems like it would take CJ + Nurkic, or Covington, or both Kanter and Collins. The rest of the guys have 2m or less contracts. Unless somehow Hood could be traded. Maybe it can be offset with picks? I don't know much about that.

According to the ESPN Trade Machine, C.J. + Zach for Harden works, salary wise. Of course, HOU will want more than that. POR could also include Trent and Ant, salary wise, plus picks and pick swaps.

Hood can't be traded until March. But, no need to trade him (or Nurk or Kanter). I want those guys around for the playoffs.

[DusterBuster]

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Man has my vote.

#YangGang

[MarxyLebronist]

Have seen enough Twitter noise and threads for various teams mulling Harden now to almost be willing to accept that HOU is asking for a C in deals. But that just doesn't make any sense, and neither SAC nor PDX, for example, have Cs that move the needle on Harden value. Collins, however, would appear to have more possible trade value over any Kings bigs given age and upside. I guess the Bagley hype is not just noise, and his contract would help SAC get a few different deals done. But really, the Olshey story is one of the better personal angle ones I've seen suddenly disclosed amidst the Harden saga (Morey's in PHI! D'Antoni's in BKN! Etc.). I'll buy it. And like many say: PDX has to make the next step or they're done walking at this point. Lillard and Harden is better than anything they already have and better than most NBA top star pairs. Certainly not playing defense in PDX as currently constructed, anyway.

It's a no brainer, if it's actually plausible at all.

[EDIT] Quick addition: meant to note the RoCo presence. And, frankly, if the Rockets were open to Nurkic, Collins, McCollum for Harden and Tucker, I would be concerned about folks resisting that. I loved Nurkic pre-injury and wouldn't want to miss out on potential return to excellence, but Tucker is a tough guy I really like as well and I am a big fan of Giles and Kanter for any C offense desired and 12 fouls on Jokic lol.

[GEE]

Collins is a side dish in any potential Harden deal, with CJ as the main course. Houston would need to really like the idea of Wall/CJ for any deal to get done. I also hope to have Kanter as the main filler, as I think he's pretty replaceable, has some value, is on a short deal for HOU, and very movable again at the trade DL.

Wall
CJ / Gordon
Tucker
Wood
Cousins / Kanter

Not terrible.

Furthermore, looking at the above and if the GM for the Rockets is smart, Collins with CJ likely is the best offer of the 6 teams on the list. It sounds like the asking price has been too high for GMs to consider, with players like Brown, MPJ and Simons being a price too steep. CJ and Collins is in that ballpark IMO, and also a price not worth paying. I also care about Harden about the same as I care for Melo; Only willing to gamble so much with certain guys, knowing Hardens recent history.

I think Olshey may very well be an active player in this as I type, but I do hope he sticks to his guns. Know that Houston really wants to be done with him asap, so make a fair offer CJ/Kanter/GTJ(and/or)Little/FRP in 202? Take it or leave it, but let Houston's GM know they can get this done and be over Harden as early as tomorrow... if they wish. Your move Houston.

[MarxyLebronist]

Collins is a side dish in any potential Harden deal, with CJ as the main course. Houston would need to really like the idea of Wall/CJ for any deal to get done. I also hope to have Kanter as the main filler, as I think he's pretty replaceable, has some value, is on a short deal for HOU, and very movable again at the trade DL.

Wall
CJ / Gordon
Tucker
Wood
Cousins / Kanter

Not terrible.

That makes sense, and money that goes away right away makes good sense for HOU. Assuming some sort of draft picks could also be thrown in for HOU, the one team I could see being very interested in McCollum- especially for the duration of his contract relative to their success at drawing excellent free agents- is Indiana. This is just pure speculation, but McCollum (and Ohio guy I believe) to Indy, Oladipo and McDermott's expiring deals (and very good play) to HOU along with Kanter's expiring and the Collins potential, for Harden works technically at least. Perhaps Tucker will become a buy out candidate or something down the line, or perhaps Nurkic and Giles are enough for the shortened run-first season around all the high quality wings still in PDX with two premier scorers and passers in Lillard and Harden. I think they'd be a serious wrecking crew, and I say that really liking CJ's game a lot.

[BNM]

Collins is a side dish in any potential Harden deal, with CJ as the main course. Houston would need to really like the idea of Wall/CJ for any deal to get done. I also hope to have Kanter as the main filler, as I think he's pretty replaceable, has some value, is on a short deal for HOU, and very movable again at the trade DL.

Wall
CJ / Gordon
Tucker
Wood
Cousins / Kanter

Not terrible.

Furthermore, looking at the above and if the GM for the Rockets is smart, Collins with CJ likely is the best offer of the 6 teams on the list. It sounds like the asking price has been too high for GMs to consider, with players like Brown, MPJ and Simons being a price too steep. CJ and Collins is in that ballpark IMO, and also a price not worth paying. I also care about Harden about the same as I care for Melo; Only willing to gamble so much with certain guys, knowing Hardens recent history.

I think Olshey may very well be an active player in this as I type, but I do hope he sticks to his guns. Know that Houston really wants to be done with him asap, so make a fair offer CJ/Kanter/GTJ(and/or)Little/FRP in 202? Take it or leave it, but let Houston's GM know they can get this done and be over Harden as early as tomorrow... if they wish. Your move Houston.

Why do you want to move Kanter, and why would HOU want him???? Have you forgotten how valuable Kanter was to POR's run to the WCF just a year and a half ago? He was great against OKC and played very well against DEN in spite of playing with one arm. There aren't a lot of slow, lumbering centers left, but two of those are in the Western Conference and likely to be in the playoffs this year - the same two Kanter did battle with in the 2019 playoffs: Adams and Jokic. If Nurk is injured or in foul trouble, do you really want Harry Giles or Zach Collins doing battle with Nikola Jokic for 40 minutes in a playoff game?

Hopefully, this time around, Kanter will be backing up Nurk. Imagine what an asset it would be to have 48 minutes of Nurk/Kanter to bang with and physically wear down Jokic. Against other teams, because of his truly elite offensive rebounding and offensive efficiency around the basket, Kanter is an asset against other teams' 2nd units (which are less capable of exploiting his defensive weaknesses).

HOU has FIVE non-guaranteed contracts they can waive at any time to save money. Plus, financially, I think they'd rather have our $5.6 million available cash than paying Kanter $5 million while waiting for him to expire. If HOU wants to save money, they have better options that acquiring Enes Kanter. If they trade Harden, any "filler" they want will be in the form of young players and draft picks, not a veteran back up like Kanter.

Conversely, if POR goes after Harden, it clearly signals they want to win now/soon, so vets like Kanter, Hood, Covington and even Melo are more valuable than young guys like Collins, Little and Ant. In short, if this trade were to happen, Kanter holds more value to POR and Collins holds more value for HOU. Giving them Kanter instead of Collins makes no sense for either team.

[Norm2953]

If you go over to the trade board, Portland likely doesn't have the necessary pieces to get Harden, especially
if Philly ends up willing to include Ben Simmons in a Harden deal. Likely the Rockets will have to make a
decision at some point in January to take the deal that makes the most sense for them which likely will be
young, cost controlled players, draft picks/swaps and ideally a large expiring contract for salary cap. Portland
likely will be the most motivated team but its not likely they would want CJ's contract unless they could make
another deal to send him elsewhere.

[PDXKnight]

If you go over to the trade board, Portland likely doesn't have the necessary pieces to get Harden, especially
if Philly ends up willing to include Ben Simmons in a Harden deal. Likely the Rockets will have to make a
decision at some point in January to take the deal that makes the most sense for them which likely will be
young, cost controlled players, draft picks/swaps and ideally a large expiring contract for salary cap. Portland
likely will be the most motivated team but its not likely they would want CJ's contract unless they could make
another deal to send him elsewhere.

Real gm value vs real life value are quite different. I have a feeling cj is worth more than real gm assumes, and I’d say his contract isn’t as bad as it once seemed and while it may not be a bargain it may well represent “fair value” given the amount of money shelled out this off season.

[GEE]

The two main points I'm trying to make are first, CJ is the main piece and the Rockets would have to really like the idea of a Wall/CJ pairing for any deal to get done.

The second is that I don't believe other GMs (in real life) are quite as eager to offer what fans on here would. It's been rumored that Houston's asking price may be too high, which leads me to think guys at the level of Simons, Brown or MPJ aren't on the table. CJ+Collins rivals those single players IMO, and would get the deal done, but only, again, if the Rockets like Wall/CJ. Furthermore, offering CJ + good assets (but not Collins) is possibly as good of offer that IS available to Houston... If they like CJ.

And I love Kanter, but find him much easier to replace, vs a 7 ft. prototypical stretch 4.

[DusterBuster]

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Olshey is speaking with Houston’s GM here... could be nothing but interesting given the rumors...

[MarxyLebronist]

Yikes what a show down. You get the sense talks are real, players know they're on the table, and now it would be a bloodbath to make the move lol.

[acidfrehley]

I don't know why the heck we're even considering this nonsense.

This trade would be bad for every part involved. I hope he gets traded to Philly asap so we can end this bs.

[HoopsFanAZ]

I don't know why the heck we're even considering this nonsense.

This trade would be bad for every part involved. I hope he gets traded to Philly asap so we can end this bs.

Harden is that good. He has gravity that opens spacing for others ... and not just the spread the court and everyone else stands around to shoot threes nonsense. I just hope it wouldn’t cost Nurkic, too.

[DaVoiceMaster]

You could throw in a pick swap option for Houston in 2024 too.

Yep, I would be fine with that.

One thing that I believe is understated is the emotional maturity of Dame which, in conjunction with his tremendous will to win, makes him a great fit to pair with Harden IMO. He will do what is necessary to win, and if Harden is playing in a selfish or immature way is the type to speak with him man-to-man and teammate-to-teammate rather than start a understated locker room insurrection as CP3 seemed to do. Or just up his selfishness to combat Harden as Westy seemed to do.

Playing it safe is for skydiving, not basketball. Go big or go out in round 2.

The real question is... would Harden listen and abide by the team culture. I kind of have my doubts.

[DaVoiceMaster]

Financially, McCollum, Simons, and Little is enough to trade for Harden. Include two future picks and reduce the protection on next years pick and you've got a deal. IF Houston wants to trade Harden bad enough, that offer may just be enough. Look at the list of teams Harden is "willing" to go to:

Milwaukee - Reportedly, Giannis has no interest in Harden.
Miami - Reportedly is not interested and is holding out until next offseason to do anything.
Boston - I can't imagine they would move Brown or Tatum so who do they have left to offer... Walker? Maybe???
Philadelphia - I would think if Philly were willing to trade Simmons, a deal would have been made during the offseason. Who's left... Harris?
Brooklyn - They've got the players to acquire Harden and another player ... LeVert, Dinwiddie, Harris, and Allen
Portland - McCollum may potentially be the best overall player Houston could acquire in a trade for Harden. Add in some young prospects in Simons, Little, Trent Jr, or Collins, but that still does not equal what Brooklynn "could" do if they chose to do so.

Does Brooklyn have any interest in CJ? What about CJ to Brooklyn and Dinwiddle & LeVert to Houston from Brooklyn with Simons & Little and 2 picks from Portland, and Harden to Portland. Houston gets younger guys, Brooklyn gets a talented guard to pair with Durant/Irving, and Portland gets the best player.

[Sinobas]

You could throw in a pick swap option for Houston in 2024 too.

Yep, I would be fine with that.

One thing that I believe is understated is the emotional maturity of Dame which, in conjunction with his tremendous will to win, makes him a great fit to pair with Harden IMO. He will do what is necessary to win, and if Harden is playing in a selfish or immature way is the type to speak with him man-to-man and teammate-to-teammate rather than start a understated locker room insurrection as CP3 seemed to do. Or just up his selfishness to combat Harden as Westy seemed to do.

Playing it safe is for skydiving, not basketball. Go big or go out in round 2.

The real question is... would Harden listen and abide by the team culture. I kind of have my doubts.

What team culture? Our team culture is take as many shots as you want. Harden is actually a better passer than Lillard, and no comparison between him and CJ.

[DusterBuster]

Yep, I would be fine with that.

One thing that I believe is understated is the emotional maturity of Dame which, in conjunction with his tremendous will to win, makes him a great fit to pair with Harden IMO. He will do what is necessary to win, and if Harden is playing in a selfish or immature way is the type to speak with him man-to-man and teammate-to-teammate rather than start a understated locker room insurrection as CP3 seemed to do. Or just up his selfishness to combat Harden as Westy seemed to do.

Playing it safe is for skydiving, not basketball. Go big or go out in round 2.

The real question is... would Harden listen and abide by the team culture. I kind of have my doubts.

What team culture? Our team culture is take as many shots as you want. Harden is actually a better passer than Lillard, and no comparison between him and CJ.

You’re confusing culture with system. Culture is locker room camaraderie, shot selection in an offensive system is not the same thing.

[DaVoiceMaster]

The real question is... would Harden listen and abide by the team culture. I kind of have my doubts.

What team culture? Our team culture is take as many shots as you want. Harden is actually a better passer than Lillard, and no comparison between him and CJ.

You’re confusing culture with system. Culture is locker room camaraderie, shot selection in an offensive system is not the same thing.

Yeah, what he said!