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Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers

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Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#1 » by wco81 » Mon Dec 6, 2021 8:03 pm

In the latest Bill Simmons podcast, about 80 minutes in, after he talks bout NFL mostly.

KOC mentions a blow it up move, targeting someone like Victor Wembayama in the next draft or the one after it.

They also discuss various trades like which teams might want CJ.

Talk also about the expiring Nurkic and Covington contracts, suggests they might have to trade one of them to take a longer contract.

Some other trade ideas, including Dame trade ideas.

I think they're just throwing things, see what might stick.

But you'd think the organization would be having similar discussions internally.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#2 » by DusterBuster » Mon Dec 6, 2021 8:42 pm

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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#3 » by DusterBuster » Mon Dec 6, 2021 8:50 pm

wco81 wrote:In the latest Bill Simmons podcast, about 80 minutes in, after he talks bout NFL mostly.

KOC mentions a blow it up move, targeting someone like Victor Wembayama in the next draft or the one after it.

They also discuss various trades like which teams might want CJ.

Talk also about the expiring Nurkic and Covington contracts, suggests they might have to trade one of them to take a longer contract.

Some other trade ideas, including Dame trade ideas.

I think they're just throwing things, see what might stick.

But you'd think the organization would be having similar discussions internally.


The segment is called Best Fake NBA trades, so they're clearly just throwing things out with no truth to them.

That said, I don't think they said anything unreasonable. Portland is really at a crossroads and blowing it up for a fast rebuild isn't a terrible thought at this moment with strong drafts coming up.

I'm actually in interested a Porzingis for CJ trade. They kinda didn't give that deal much thought, but I think that could be a good fit.

Dame
Powell
Covington
KP
Nurk
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#4 » by Pattycakes » Mon Dec 6, 2021 8:57 pm

Bill Simmons and opinions about the Blazers... for these reasons, I’m out
Oct. 18, 2015 The Prophecy...

Pattycakes wrote:I think people are really gonna be caught sleeping on our depth this year. The big guy rotation is more than impressive, and our guard play looks to be a strength as well. Don't overlook the young guys just yet.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#5 » by DusterBuster » Mon Dec 6, 2021 9:22 pm

Pattycakes wrote:Bill Simmons and opinions about the Blazers... for these reasons, I’m out


Nothing more than a podcast version of the Trade Board. Nothing to get bent outta shape over, just a couple of guys shooting the ish. No controversial takes or anything.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#6 » by wco81 » Mon Dec 6, 2021 9:32 pm

DusterBuster wrote:
Pattycakes wrote:Bill Simmons and opinions about the Blazers... for these reasons, I’m out


Nothing more than a podcast version of the Trade Board. Nothing to get bent outta shape over, just a couple of guys shooting the ish. No controversial takes or anything.


Like I said, you would think the Blazers were having these discussions internally.

Or at least when they get a new GM put in place.

Some people have mentioned that NO was too tied to CJ when it might have made sense to try to trade him a couple of seasons ago.

So maybe with a new GM or person in charge of personnel or basketball operations, the team might consider things that NO was unwilling to consider.


Another trigger for big moves might be if they were building a new arena. Look at the fire agent contracts that the Texas Rangers gave out a coupe of weeks ago? Or the Rams did in the past couple of seasons before their new stadium opened.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#7 » by DusterBuster » Mon Dec 6, 2021 9:36 pm

wco81 wrote:
DusterBuster wrote:
Pattycakes wrote:Bill Simmons and opinions about the Blazers... for these reasons, I’m out


Nothing more than a podcast version of the Trade Board. Nothing to get bent outta shape over, just a couple of guys shooting the ish. No controversial takes or anything.


Like I said, you would think the Blazers were having these discussions internally.

Or at least when they get a new GM put in place.

Some people have mentioned that NO was too tied to CJ when it might have made sense to try to trade him a couple of seasons ago.

So maybe with a new GM or person in charge of personnel or basketball operations, the team might consider things that NO was unwilling to consider.


Another trigger for big moves might be if they were building a new arena. Look at the fire agent contracts that the Texas Rangers gave out a coupe of weeks ago? Or the Rams did in the past couple of seasons before their new stadium opened.


Portland has no plans for a new arena, so that's definitely nothing in the works.

Yeah, everyone is hoping the interm GM will be a little more willing to make moves... I also hope the team hurries on trying to get Neil's full-time replacement. They don't have a ton of time to waste, so I hope the move on this fast.

But they definitely need to do something. Blazer fans are over the current product being trotted out. Tickets are going for rock bottom / lottery-level team prices and the arena hasn't sold out once I don't believe this season. So fans are showing what they think of this roster with their attendance. Something has to change and soon.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#8 » by wco81 » Tue Dec 7, 2021 6:46 pm

Zach Lowe and Kevin Pelton with some more trade ideas for the Blazers.

Zach thinks CJ may have become untraceable once his big extension kicked in (or will kick in?). But they both run down teams which might be willing to take on CJ.

One thing that probably won't work is Philly, since they have undersized guards scoring on good efficiency already.

http://www.espn.com/espnradio/podcast/archive/_/id/10528553

Philly won't talk unless Dame's name is in the mix.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#9 » by DusterBuster » Tue Dec 7, 2021 7:47 pm

wco81 wrote:Zach Lowe and Kevin Pelton with some more trade ideas for the Blazers.

Zach thinks CJ may have become untraceable once his big extension kicked in (or will kick in?). But they both run down teams which might be willing to take on CJ.

One thing that probably won't work is Philly, since they have undersized guards scoring on good efficiency already.

http://www.espn.com/espnradio/podcast/archive/_/id/10528553

Philly won't talk unless Dame's name is in the mix.


Yeah, the more I've thought and discussed this scenario, I don't think there's any realm where a Simmons to Blazers trade ever happens. The Blazers poor start and chaos will have just emboldened Morey's belief that Dame will shake free sooner or later and they aren't in a rush to move Simmons since they are just fining him into oblivion. So they have the leverage to a certain extent to just hold off.

Meanwhile, the Blazers aren't going to move Dame until he asks/demands it. All indications directly from Dame are nothing has really changed, regardless of what some media articles say. Dame is pretty directly shooting down those articles assertions of him being unhappy with the Blazers.

Then, even if Dame were to ask out, Simmons has indicated he doesn't want to play for the Blazers unless Lillard is still on the team. So that right there kind of kills a Dame for Simmons swap. It should also make the Blazers somewhat leery of Simmons altogether. If they could get Simmons without giving up Dame, but then Dame asks out say next season, Simmons would likely just do this holdout game again to get traded once again - doubt the Blazers want that headache at the start of a full rebuild.

So yeah, finding it hard to see where the Sixers and Blazers can find middle-ground on a deal.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#10 » by GEE » Tue Dec 7, 2021 8:39 pm

In trade scenarios involving Philly, I feel totally different depending on if it's Dame or CJ involved. In short, I like the idea of Simmons for several reasons, but the most important thing to consider is, Simmons is only effective as a primary ball handler, like a true PG. To this, I don't like trades with CJ as much, unless Dame is willing to play the 2 primarily (but not exclusively). Could work, but a huge ask of Dame. He would need to let Simmons run the O, and along with Powell and Ant, just score the rock... Simmons and Nurkic will find you for the 3.

Unfortunately, I really don't think Philly will bite unless it's for Dame, unless we include extra asset with CJ, that we really can't afford to give up. CJ / +++(3 FRPs) is what Morey asked for (too much IMO), so I think CJ / ++, or CJ / Simons(or)Little and 1FRP & 1Swap, or even better... CJ / 2FRPs & 2Swaps seems our best offer.

Again, pretty sure Philly's not interested in any of that, so if it's CJ going out, considering the Seth Curry factor, I think ultimately, it would be to a different team and not the Sixers.

Finally, I ultimately feel a CJ for Simmons trade has a much greater chance of failure, while the right one involving Dame, selling high, could potentially get us right back into a top seed (#4) this Year. If we don't and it fails miserably (which it won't), we could just go to the full "Blow up" this off season starting with CJ.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#11 » by wco81 » Wed Dec 8, 2021 2:41 am

I don't know how long CJ is going to be out. Will he have recovered and played some games before the trade deadline?

May make it tough to trade him until the offseason.

With Dame also missing games, Portland may have its decision made for them as far as a path.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#12 » by Norm2953 » Wed Dec 8, 2021 3:07 am

Indeed, the best path forward for Portland is to tank. Sit Dame down as long as its needed to get him healthy
and earn themselves a lottery pick. Stay as far away from Simmons this season
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#13 » by DusterBuster » Wed Dec 8, 2021 3:39 am

wco81 wrote:I don't know how long CJ is going to be out. Will he have recovered and played some games before the trade deadline?

May make it tough to trade him until the offseason.

With Dame also missing games, Portland may have its decision made for them as far as a path.


Yeah, you can comfortably take CJs name out of any trades for the foreseeable future until we know more. Sounds like this is a manageable and maybe even short term injury, but still…. Just hoping it’s not more serious.

Portland’s best path forward is full tank imo. Let everyone rest, find your new GM, maybe cash out on Nurk and RoCo if you can and go from there.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#14 » by Blazinaway » Wed Dec 8, 2021 10:20 pm

Norm2953 wrote:Indeed, the best path forward for Portland is to tank. Sit Dame down as long as its needed to get him healthy
and earn themselves a lottery pick. Stay as far away from Simmons this season


apparently Dame got a cortisone shot last week and could be available Sunday, not a smart move IMO as cortisone can mask pain and further inhury could occur
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#15 » by wco81 » Wed Dec 8, 2021 10:35 pm

Listening to The Ringer NBA podcast. They also go into the Blazers.

They say Dame is not only asking them to make trades, but not himself yet, but also trying to get another big extension which would take him out to age 36.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#16 » by Wizenheimer » Thu Dec 9, 2021 4:54 pm

wco81 wrote:Listening to The Ringer NBA podcast. They also go into the Blazers.

They say Dame is not only asking them to make trades, but not himself yet, but also trying to get another big extension which would take him out to age 36.


since he isn't even eligible for that extension till next July how could he even 'try' to get it...?

all the talk about his extension came from one source: Woj. And it's really obvious that the source Woj had for that was Olshey. You have to retain a lot of skepticism now when Woj talks about the Blazers. Everything we know about Olshey strongly suggests on top of everything else, he'll be vindictive. And, he just got fired at the same time it appears the Blazers are refusing to pay the balance of his contract for 'cause', which could be as much as 12M out of Olshey's pocket. It's just about guaranteed he's going to fire torpedoes at the Blazers whenever he can. This "Dame wants a big extension" chatter looks like one of those torpedoes. It can cause problems for the Blazers in their GM search and it kind of tarnishes the brand of the player on the roster many suspect had issues with Olshey

that's not to say that Dame wold not like to eventually sign an extension that puts another guaranteed 100 million in his future. No player would turn that down.

I don't think it's a coincidence that many of the NBA talking heads at ESPN are advocating for Dame to be traded...to NY for instance (Steven A)...and Woj works for ESPN and has been a noted Olshey mouthpiece. Notice how the 'rumor' has morphed into Dame wants that extension in a S&T.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#17 » by Jsun947 » Thu Dec 9, 2021 8:10 pm

Of course Dame wants the extension in July if he’s still on the roster. Why wouldn’t he? That’s just a giant duh.

CJ, Nurkic, and Covington are all very difficult to find trade partners for where we could get anywhere near equal value in production back, in particular when those talents have to fit with Dame.

You almost have to be willing to shove all in for roster upgrades around the edges but boy oh boy that’s risky
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#18 » by wco81 » Thu Dec 9, 2021 11:22 pm

Definitely big markets and the giant media complex have always circled like vultures over small market teams.

But Portland got off to a strong start last season, before CJ got injured -- CJ had started out hot.

They ended up #6, tied to #5 and #7, 42-30.

Currently they're on a 35-win pace. It's not too late to turn it around but with key injuries right now, would it be worth it if they could get in only to the 7-10 position?

They appear to have a top 14 protected pick which they'd lose if they got a high enough seed.

OTOH, unless they can get at least into the top 5 of the draft lottery, maybe it's not worth giving up on the season. If both CJ and Lillard come back fully healthy, with more than half the season left -- Blazers have played 26 games -- they can still get into the top #6.

But you have to see how they play against other playoffs teams, because if it's another first-round exit, it's a tough place to be.

The timing is tough, if the two leading scorers aren't back and showing that they're as good as ever before the trade deadline.


Unfortunately, the Blazers are going to be in the spotlight while this uncertainty about Dame's status remains. It started last year, when some people had high expectations because of the acquisition of Covington and other moves. Then Dame had that epic game vs. Denver, yet the Blazers still lost the series. It continued through the Olympics and then the start of this season.

Is there any scenario where he's content if the team doesn't make any big moves, just the status quo, which would be to try to get a playoff seed and see if they have a different result with largely the same roster?

He's getting paid big money but it seems to be other people pushing the narrative that it's a shame he can't have a better supporting cast in his prime. Would he be happy to collect super max money for the rest of his career leading a lower or mid seed playoffs team but never breaking past the WCF?
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#19 » by Case2012 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 12:41 am

I think Dame is committed and probably realizes they're not going to actually compete this year, so I could see Cronin selling off everyone he can to clear space and acquire assets to trade for another star in the off-season. So they can start over with a new team built around Dame next season. At least, that seems like the best plan to me.

Cronin's job would then be to essentially make moves to lure in his replacement. The GM job looks a lot more attractive with loads of cap space, picks, young prospects, and a superstar to build around right? I liked everything I heard from Cronin during his introduction so we'll see if he doesn't just keep the job too.
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Re: Bill Simmons and Kevin O'Connor on the Blazers 

Post#20 » by MagicBagley18 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 4:20 am

Outsider here coming in peace.....I think dame truly wants to stay and win in Portland- he’s always been transparent ab that and I don’t think it’s changed. I think what’s changed is that this is potential the first time ever the organization may decide down the road they’d be better off in a different direction.

There will be no trade in season and personally no dame trade at all unless the organization explains to him they would like to move on as well and then there will be a mutual decision to seek a trade. I think nothing happens until July but I think all parties involved have to think about what’s best for them no wouldn’t be shocked if in the offseason he’s moved.

I think personally it’s time to move on for the blazers but I am not as emotionally invested in the team as blazers fans and get why they don’t want to.

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