Kings @ Hornets

[SacKingZZZ]

He's one of the butthurt Martin fanboys.

no need to take shot at others without enough knowledge..

i am not Martin fan.. i was one of many fans who wanted to get him traded..

however looking at current shooting struggles, in hindsight I would have rather not traded him even he has horrible defense.. or may be for got another intelligent pass-first PG or a high efficiency SG..

getting landry at that time was not total blunder since we were struggling in front court.. however Petrie was reportedly targetting Dalembert or Murphy entire last season.. if he had plans to get one of them.. he should have rather got PG/SG.. also it was clear that kings were not in playoff contention last year.. they were a lottery bound team.. and this year's draft had more front court players.. 8/15 selected in first 15..

WHO? It takes two to tango. Petrie very well may have been looking at guards but nobody was willing to give up anyone for a guy who plays no D for $10 million. Hindsight is 20/20 buddy.

Anyway when the team is taking steps backwards with an upgrade in talent, the blame 100% goes on the coach. We're not a playoff team, but we shouldn't be at the very bottom either. It's bullcrap.

I don't even care if we are at the bottom, although I do agree with you, but we should at the very least be having a season like last year where there were some positives to speak of coming out of games. The waters are too muddied at this point, time to move on if for nothing more than change and the sound of a new voice or some new ideas. Most of all somebody that understands the situation and the goals moving forward. Winning will come with that recognition. It's like Westphal is as bad at thinking ahead in terms of development as he is at thinking of alternate routes to attack an opposing team.

Two steps need to happen now. Petrie needs to consolidate some talent and limit the pieces Westphal has to work with which would be for his own good. And preferably after that first step a change is made up top if Westphal completely reverts into overthinking without purpose like he has for most of the season. He really seemed to have turned the corner before this road trip. Kind of gave in and we saw growth in terms of our personnel. Well, it took him a matter of a few games to crap all over that and bam! back to square one.

Before this team can grow as a team and get better, there needs to be INDIVIDUAL growth. Letting guys experiment a little with their own games is a part of that. Basing a system around the foundation of that team is another part of it. In fact, the MAIN part of it. As they grow, the team will grow. This team will only go as far as it's brightest talents will take it. Sure maybe Carl Landry and Luther Head give us a better chance of going "farther" now, but c'mon now. Coaches can make a difference but they can also (Please Use More Appropriate Word) any positive growth factor.

[dozencousins]

are you aware that we have a moron GM, who can't get a single trade good for kings.. and maloofs are cheap ass owners.. who don't wanna spend..

Jeoff Petrie? Moron GM?? What??? .....

so you think Petrie has nothing to do with team's struggles in last decade (except glory days)??

let's see petrie's transcript

DRAFT
Hedo Turkoglu : 2000 draft, Good Selection.
Gerald Wallace : 2001 draft, Good Selection.
Dan Dickau : 2002 draft, missed Carlos Boozer, Luis Scola. Bad Selection.
Kevin Martin : 2004 draft, Good Selection.
Francisco Garcia : 2005 draft, missed David Lee, Monta Ellis. Bad Selection.
Quincy Douby : 2006 draft, missed Rajon Rondo, Kyle Lowry, Paul Millsap, Bad Selection.
Spencer Hawes : 2007 draft, missed Rodney Stuckey, Wilson Chandler, Aaron Brooks, Carl Landry, Marc Gasol, Bad Selection
Jason Thompson : 2008 draft, Good Selection.
Tyreke Evans, Omri Casspi : 2009 draft, Good Selection.
DeMarcus Cousins : 2010 draft, Good Selection.
Total : 6 Good Drafts, 4 Bad



Coach
Adelman : He was a great coach. Agreed Kings were steadily declining post 2002-03 season. But the talent he had to work with was also declining. Can't blame him for the decline. He is doing a good job with Rockets. He would have been a perfect coach for the rebuilding team and we might have been a good team by now.
Adelman -> Mussleman : Bad move.
Reggie Theus : Bad move.
Kenny Natt : Bad move. Agreed he was interim coach, but could have got a better coach right away.
Paul Westphal : Bad move.
Picking up Westphal's third year : Bad move. He met expectations last season, but there was no need to rush and pick third year on his contract. Westphal was not going anywhere this season. Petrie should have waited this season. Now kings are stuck with Westphal for one more season, or if they fire him and hire someone else, they still have to pay westphal. The total coach salary will be comparable to that of a good coach.
Overall Coach Selection/Moves : Bad



Trades
1) Leaving Gerald Wallace open in expansion draft. Could have left Songalia instead. Bad.
2) Trading Webber for garbage. Agreed Webber had blown knees and had a bloated contract. But Kenny Thomas also had a horrible contract. I guess in the end kings saved 5-10million over 4-5 yrs. Atleast they could have Webber's 05-06 season. When traded he could have been still impact player on a contender. May be get an expiring or 2yr left contracts. Bad.
3) Peja -> Artest : Good.
4) Mikki Moore : 3yr contract, 18m : Bad.
5) Beno Udrih : 5yr contract, 32m : Bad.
6) Francisco Garcia : 5yr contract, 30m : Bad.
7) Trading Bibby for garbage. The positive was none was big contracts. Financially good move. But might have got a better player by trading Bibby to contender. OK
8) Martin -> Landry. Martin was not gelling well with Tyreke, who was future of franchise. Martin had to be traded. But could have given a little more time and waited the season to see if they can play together. Specially with this season's offense woes. Getting Landry was good at that time since kings needed front court help. But Petrie had been targeting Dalembert and Murphy. Eventually he ended up with Dalembert. This year's draft had 8/15 front court players. Thompson was developing well. Could have either waited for Martin or traded him for a PG/SG as Beno and Garcia as bench players at best.
9) Did nothing with Kenny Thomas expiring. Bad
Overall trade rating : Bad

Overall Petrie's performance is below average. And if you remove draft selections (which is only a brighter spot compared to coach&trades, but still average compared to league), then his performance is bad. He should only be leading draft scouting department.

1st In reguards to your trade area #1 it wasnt putting wallace on that list for songaila at the time they put wallace on the list instead of funderburke that was the decision at the time Songaila was not on the roster at the time ! In PETRIE'S defense at the time Funderburke was a key role player & WALLACE was not as key of a role player as funderburke was keep in mind we were contenders for the championship at the time. PETRIE had io feel we had a real shot to win the title so I find it hard to say PETRIE really made a bad move at the time that was a really tough decision at the time.
2nd at the time he gave GARCIA his contract he had just dealt ARTEST & Garcia was our only real SMALL FORWARD WITH EXPERIENCE yes WE RECIEVED D.GREEN in the deal but he was unproven & still is & also recieved a future 1st round draft pick wich later turned out to be CASSPI so in all fairness it is hard to fault PETRIE for that as well !
It is unfortuante that the last several years the MALOOFS have financially prevented petrie FROM ADDING TEAM SALARY BECAUSE SOME OF THE MOVES HE MADE WOULD HAVE TURNED OUT MUCH BETTER .
SO YOU CAN KEEP ON BLAMMING PETRIE ALL YOU WANT BUT IN REALITY YOU SHOULD BE BLAMMING THE MALOOFS .

[stock01234]

SO YOU CAN KEEP ON BLAMMING PETRIE ALL YOU WANT BUT IN REALITY YOU SHOULD BE BLAMMING THE MALOOFS .

i said in my other posts tons of time, that Petrie is not the ONLY one responsible.. ofcourse maloofs are influencing petrie's decisions.. but imho i don't think so that for each and every move/draft/coach maloofs would be interfering and preventing him from making good decision..

[dozencousins]

SO YOU CAN KEEP ON BLAMMING PETRIE ALL YOU WANT BUT IN REALITY YOU SHOULD BE BLAMMING THE MALOOFS .

i said in my other posts tons of time, that Petrie is not the ONLY one responsible.. ofcourse maloofs are influencing petrie's decisions.. but imho i don't think so that for each and every move/draft/coach maloofs would be interfering and preventing him from making good decision..

1st though you never mentioned it I was having computer issues & could not remove caps lock so i want to be clear i was not yelling !

You right not all movies are the MALOOFS fault but more are than not .
You should keep in mind that the MALOOFS are responsible for more of what Petrie cant do than what he can . (Example ) When we were championship contenders the year I believe we were screwed & lost to the LAKERS in the WESTERN CONFERENCE finals we had JIMMY JACKSON he was a very key role player for us . Had the MALOOFS allowed PETRIE to pay him just a little more money we would have been able to resign him & had a much better shot at making another title run the next year but the MALOOFS cut corners they would not allow PETRIE to spend the money thus we lost him & did not do nearly as well .
The year of expansion we added Wallace to the list instaed of FUNDY in hinsight because we did not win the title you can complain but at that time our team was very deep almost every bech player was very key to us FUNDY had been with the team for quit some time were as WALLACE had not Petrie likely felt a sense of wich one give us a better shot now to win the title + a sense of loyalty to FUNDY for having been a key role player on the team for years as at the time so was BARRY , B.JACKSON ,POLLARD etc.
The last few years in trades we have been going with the youth movement so trading guys like BIBBY etc. made some sense not just from the youth movement but from financial had we kept BIBBY & his salary we would have been way over the cap & considering the KINGS / MALOOFS have been losing alot of money over the past 3-4 years now they have been dumping salary because of financial reasons as well as youth movement.
For this reason as well nobody should be shocked if we dumped GARCIA & or BENO this season & not get very much for them in return these ghuys have 3-4 more years in contract & I assure you the KINGS will do everything in their power to rid themselves of these 2 contracts for financial reasons as well as youth movement . I am 100% sure this is the last season we see these type of salary dump type deals. Next season we will have more money by far to spend & better assetts for trades so our position as a franchis will get alot better . We have guys like LANDRY who can & will likely be packaged with either CISCO or BENO IN DEALS .

Finally the only draft pick I feel PETRIE was responsible for & got a scrub was the DOUBY draft again when we passed on D.lee ETC. we drafted more so based on team needs.

PETRIE is easily a top 5 GM in this leauge & we are lucky to have him .

[Nicky Nix Nook]

Glad I missed it

[ADoaN17]

Westphal can't control that these players are selfish and lazy.

This experiment has gone on long enough GP, make a damn move.

[SacKingZZZ]

Ok, for an entire half at a time usually this team is "unselfish" then as the other team changes their defensive scheme all of a sudden the players become "selfish"? What!? No, that's not how it works, at least not entirely and not game after game after game. This is a broken record that Westphal doesn't look like he can even get to spin anymore. I really hope he just digs in and goes back to his coaching style from the last couple of home games when he just kind of stayed out of the way and let the young guys learn but I'm pretty much all out of faith. He showed some strides and then crapped all over it within the blink of an eye. It's like an addict getting sober for a month and then going right back on crack.

It's still early but Westphal's butt better be hitting the fire by now if it wasn't before. The Maloofs made a mistake picking up that extra year on his contract but they better be willing to pay for it if that's what ends up happening. I can't see them shuddering at 2 million when they signed and cut a player like Antoine Wright at just about half that. Time to move on and the sooner the better so we can hopefully salvage some positivity before seasons end. Heck, maybe the Rockets will pay for his exit.

[YC42Balla]

Petire is a GREAT GM. Period. End of discussion.

[darkadun]

Petire is a GREAT GM. Period. End of discussion.

Totally agree. Here's the deal. Being a nba gm is not easy, it's very easy to go back in time and say, "hey, that was a bad move." At any given time, you don't know exactly how things will play out. What player will develop into a good/great player? No one can guarantee anything, you can only make a reasonably good decision at that point in time.

Secondly, people seem to forget that Petrie built the great kings team of the early 2000's, that barring a C-Webb injury could very well have gone to the nba finals and perhaps won a title. Who knows? But Petrie built that team, and then had to tear it down when Webb got hurt. Not the easiest task, especially now that alot of the nba teams are struggling financially.

[RoyalCourtJestr]

Lawl. I agree Petire has made some dumb moves, but

A. pointing out every time he missed someone in the draft means you should also be blaming the other 29 GMs for missing the guy too,

B. you're gnoring the fact that the Maloofs, post Aldeman, have kept tight pursestrings on coach paying,

C. We haven't been able to use our excess cap for two seasons now, dispite having to trade much to get it.

He's made mistakes, signed people who shouldn't have gotten the contract they did, and trades have been a weaker aspect of his career. But he's one of the best GMs in the league, and I'll blame everyone and their MOM before I make him carry the complete failure of this team.

[RIPskaterdude]

Secondly, people seem to forget that Petrie built the great kings team of the early 2000's, that barring a C-Webb injury could very well have gone to the nba finals and perhaps won a title. Who knows? But Petrie built that team, and then had to tear it down when Webb got hurt. Not the easiest task, especially now that alot of the nba teams are struggling financially.

Playing Devil's advocate here, let's pretend that Petrie was fired at the same time that Adelman was, and then we hired someone else. Judging his track record from post Adelman, how would you grade his job as a GM since?

[RoyalCourtJestr]

Got us a decent core for the future in Tyreke/JT/Cousins (not now, of course, but for the future) - the Beno signing is the one "oh snap, horrid call", but I'd still blame the Maloofs for being so cheap with their wallets and coaches.

[SacKingZZZ]

I don't know about Beno being too horrid of a move. I think he's played up to a MLE level contract. Probably rather have the open spot and space with the team looking like this but still.

Petrie isn't perfect, I wouldn't say he's been great. Whoever delayed the rebuild this long deserves some type of blame and punishment. Went it comes to drafting, he knows talent. I'm just glad he made the moves he did the last two drafts, don't forget we could have Udoh or Monroe right now! hahaha. Both will be good players but Demarcus is going to be SPECIAL.

[cman55]

I dont understand everyones hatred for beno...yes hes not a great defensive player but he compliments tyreke very well...everyone that describes the point guard they want are describing a perfect player or a top 6 pg in the league right now lets be real...i think what we really need is a coach who can run an offense correctly and i'll bet beno and tyreke would look great