No Trades

[kevin44]

We all know this organization has made a lot of mistakes & will continue making them. Jimmer was a reach & I don't see him as part of the future. He is a defensive liability, not a great passer & so far an inconsistent shooter. Will 30 minutes a game help him? This draft is going to be so important to this team b/c I don't see any quality free agents coming. Bad teams like ours have to build through the draft. If Petrie doesn't hit a home run I would cut him loose. Were stuck with The Maloofs, unless they go broke & have to sell the team.

[perezident]

So who's going to start the Geoff Petrie should be fired thread???

It really would be terrible if they fired him. You start making changes like that while you've just started laying the groundwork of a rebuild and you might end up back at the bottom having just wasted 3-4 years.

The time has come where Petrie has to either find the right coach for his vision, or make moves that fit the vision of his coach. Those are two issues that have been at odds for too long now. Somewhat understandable considering you never know what the draft will yield but it's time for Petrie to either coach these guys himself, or to tell his coach how to use them. He put this squad together, it's his task of enlightening those in charge to his ideas on how they should play (which we all know what way that is BTW).

Wait, if we make changes like that we might end up back at the bottom? Where exactly are we in the standings, again? And who's to say that the last 3-4 years haven't been a complete waste? What exactly have we got? Cousins? Maybe Evans? That's what the last 4+ years of being terrible was good for?

This! Clearly explains where I was going with that statement. So some of you guys are saying by this rate, the next 4 years would give us solid players at the PG SF PF and 6man spots through the draft? Because it's clear Geoff's only plausible plan is to rebuild through the draft!

I don't care for the excuse of "oh, players (star caliber players) don't want to come to Sacramento." If that's Petrie's excuse then he shouldn't be in the chair! For far to long we've been making "financial moves" and have shown nothing for it! Because it obvious we're only making those sorts of moves to strengthen the pockets of Salmons, Outlaw and Hayes with those god awful atrocious contracts. The reality is this, no one wants to come to Sacramento because 1) The roster is trash, 2) We get rid of coaches faster than Lebron hairline recedes, 3) Our owners are too cheap

What needs to happen here now is we need to have Whiteside and Honeycutt getting some serious minutes. Sit Salmons, Cisco, Hayes and Outlaw and give Donte and Jimmer along with the above mentioned the minutes.

[SacKingZZZ]

Outlaw isn't in the picture much anyway, but he is for better or worse here long term. Salmons I can agree with but I'm almost questioning whether Petrie will amnesty him. He's been playing a lot better off the bench, but that extra money might be worth more. I think they should try and play Outlaw, see what he can do, maybe even find a role for him or build his value.

Guys that I can agree to not playing: Donte Greene (he's gone, not coming back, not in the long term picture), John Salmons (possibly the same), JJ Hickson (same, and if he starts playing semi-well might end up re-signing him when he's not a great fit unless he's getting major minutes). Another thing they should do is bench JT for the rest of the year, let teams forget about him and re-sign him cheap. hehehe.

Every time Outlaw comes to the floor, he immediately jacks up a shot. Same with Hickson. These type of player feel like they are entitled to do so. It's so annoying. They are hurting the Kings on offense and defense. Moreso, they are inefficient chuckers and should be receiving as little minutes as possible.

Why do you think Greene is out of the "long term picture"? I haven't heard anything that he's gone. I know, Greene is pretty bad on offense (erratic shooter) but he can be useful on selected matchups when we need his defense.

Outlaw and Hickson are production players, any team that would want them would want them for their production, here, their production isn't needed more than their ability to compliment the players that are already here. It's that catch 22 where they get slammed for a lack of production then get slammed for trying to produce. When you try and force tons of production into tiny minutes players like that will look terrible. Too late to put Hickson in a position to produce because he's essentially not part of any trade scenario for the Kings now unless in a sign and trade, which aren't usually that great anyway. No real point in playing him either, if I were Hickson's agent I would be on the phone to Petrie right now discussing buyout options because the role he has had here is going to cost him millions this summer, already apparently killed his trade value.

Read a few things around the net about the Kings shopping Greene. Not a shocker, he doesn't fit here either. Guess you could always re-sign him to fill out the roster but would he want that? I would imagine there might be a team interested in him come summer time that might actually play him. Maybe not.

[SacKingZZZ]

We all know this organization has made a lot of mistakes & will continue making them. Jimmer was a reach & I don't see him as part of the future. He is a defensive liability, not a great passer & so far an inconsistent shooter. Will 30 minutes a game help him? This draft is going to be so important to this team b/c I don't see any quality free agents coming. Bad teams like ours have to build through the draft. If Petrie doesn't hit a home run I would cut him loose. Were stuck with The Maloofs, unless they go broke & have to sell the team.

If it equates to more shot attempts and opportunity to get into rhythm is goes without saying. You can't go from college where you are known as a scorer putting up 20 shots a game to half that in the pros, where you hardly play some nights, and expect a volume scorer/shooter to keep that rhythm. That's why Westphal and Smarts rotations are infuriating sometimes.

[KF10]

Outlaw and Hickson are production players, any team that would want them would want them for their production, here, their production isn't needed more than their ability to compliment the players that are already here. It's that catch 22 where they get slammed for a lack of production then get slammed for trying to produce. When you try and force tons of production into tiny minutes players like that will look terrible. Too late to put Hickson in a position to produce because he's essentially not part of any trade scenario for the Kings now unless in a sign and trade, which aren't usually that great anyway. No real point in playing him either, if I were Hickson's agent I would be on the phone to Petrie right now discussing buyout options because the role he has had here is going to cost him millions this summer, already apparently killed his trade value.

Read a few things around the net about the Kings shopping Greene. Not a shocker, he doesn't fit here either. Guess you could always re-sign him to fill out the roster but would he want that? I would imagine there might be a team interested in him come summer time that might actually play him. Maybe not.

So, what's the point of signing Outlaw if we already know he is not going to get minutes? The fact of the matter is, Petrie dropped the ball and outbid himself for Outlaw. This guy stopped being good when he decided to shoot Js instead of attacking the basket. And it's well documented that Petrie eyed Outlaw from afar and believed he can replicate some of his production in Portland. Ugh, no! This guy was coming off one of the worst seasons as a NBA player with NJ last year. It was an awful move then and an awful move now.

Hickson wasn't all that even his last season with the Cavs. He was scoring at an inefficient pace and his defense blows. Why trade for him when we got multiple guys in position?

Greene does suck but he still has a couple of redeeming values i.e. defense, athleticism, hype man. If he returns to his 09-10 form where he shot the long ball at 37.7% He has a role on this team going forward.

[SacKingZZZ]

This! Clearly explains where I was going with that statement. So some of you guys are saying by this rate, the next 4 years would give us solid players at the PG SF PF and 6man spots through the draft? Because it's clear Geoff's only plausible plan is to rebuild through the draft!

I don't care for the excuse of "oh, players (star caliber players) don't want to come to Sacramento." If that's Petrie's excuse then he shouldn't be in the chair! For far to long we've been making "financial moves" and have shown nothing for it! Because it obvious we're only making those sorts of moves to strengthen the pockets of Salmons, Outlaw and Hayes with those god awful atrocious contracts. The reality is this, no one wants to come to Sacramento because 1) The roster is trash, 2) We get rid of coaches faster than Lebron hairline recedes, 3) Our owners are too cheap

What needs to happen here now is we need to have Whiteside and Honeycutt getting some serious minutes. Sit Salmons, Cisco, Hayes and Outlaw and give Donte and Jimmer along with the above mentioned the minutes.

Near the end of the year that will be the way to go, if it's looking that bad. But, you still have to find a way to make it work because this team does have talent and some useful, if yet underutilized, pieces on it. The idea is that in 3-4 years Cousins, Evans, and Thornton, or whoever is filling their spot at the time, are ready to take you somewhere.

Still have to have the right system in place though, that's the issue with this team. It's not only young, but it's in the midst of a 2 year identity crisis. They've gone from a "running" team under Westphal. To a high post team running offense through Cousins (which was great by the way), to a read and react offense supposed to be running offense through Cousins and Hayes (which he never did), to a "running" team under Smart who then ditched that for the pick and roll, who then started an entirely different style bench team who runs things through Hayes in the high post (who in the last ten games is averaging 4.1+ apg to 1.4 to ratio per 36), to a small ball team putting the smallest wing combo in history together often times playing 4 guards to one lone big who at times is 6'6" Chuck Hayes.

The fact is, with this last free agency period, and potentially this next one, there just aren't that many marquee free agents, nor is it necessarily wise to add that type of player because you just add to the problem that exists now, not enough balls to go around. It will eventually become clear what "core" you should move forward with and if that means removing one of that core for a better fit, or depth, so be it. You can't expect to build a complete team through the draft when you're aiming at talent. If that talent fits together you hit the jackpot and it's downright rare.

[SacKingZZZ]

Outlaw and Hickson are production players, any team that would want them would want them for their production, here, their production isn't needed more than their ability to compliment the players that are already here. It's that catch 22 where they get slammed for a lack of production then get slammed for trying to produce. When you try and force tons of production into tiny minutes players like that will look terrible. Too late to put Hickson in a position to produce because he's essentially not part of any trade scenario for the Kings now unless in a sign and trade, which aren't usually that great anyway. No real point in playing him either, if I were Hickson's agent I would be on the phone to Petrie right now discussing buyout options because the role he has had here is going to cost him millions this summer, already apparently killed his trade value.

Read a few things around the net about the Kings shopping Greene. Not a shocker, he doesn't fit here either. Guess you could always re-sign him to fill out the roster but would he want that? I would imagine there might be a team interested in him come summer time that might actually play him. Maybe not.

So, what's the point of signing Outlaw if we already know he is not going to get minutes? The fact of the matter is, Petrie dropped the ball and outbid himself for Outlaw. This guy stopped being good when he decided to shoot Js instead of attacking the basket. And it's well documented that Petrie eyed Outlaw from afar and believed he can replicate some of his production in Portland. Ugh, no! This guy was coming off one of the worst seasons as a NBA player with NJ last year. It was an awful move then and an awful move now.

Hickson wasn't all that even his last season with the Cavs. He was scoring at an inefficient pace and his defense blows. Why trade for him when we got multiple guys in position?

Greene does suck but he still has a couple of redeeming values i.e. defense, athleticism, hype man. If he returns to his 09-10 form where he shot the long ball at 37.7% He has a role on this team going forward.

It was an awkward time, in between the Chuck Hayes issues if you recall. And that's just it, right now you never know who's going to get time! One game a guy will play 30+ minutes and then disappear for 3 games. I don't know if it's better or worse than Westphal just playing everybody 15 mpg and platooning left and right. I don't think it's as bad though.

Hickson was a stab in the dark. Honestly, I don't know what Petrie had envisioned because anyone can see there is no way to play all those guys unless you bring in Fratello as coach, which Westphal did a pretty good impression of at times keeping all the minutes pretty equal unless you were Tyreke Evans and John Salmons. As we all saw, doing that pisses everyone off, better to just have 3-4 pissed of guys because they don't play then 12-13 pissed off guys because they don't play enough. That and everyones production looks like shat. Remember the start of the year when every single players production looked like garbage?

The time to move Hickson was right after they signed Hayes, or rather a few weeks after the season started. It's Petries job to clear the clutter, and I still think it's his job to let his coach in on how to play HIS group. And if this is it? ****! I think he likes to give his coach freedom but he needs to step in at some point, and I'm positive he did with Westphal to start the year, problem was he had a coach that had no idea to deal with personalities which negated everything. Now he has one that has no idea how to use his squad to it's full potential.

If it were me I'd stick Outlaw, since he's here for the long term, in at starting SF for 5-6 games. See how it goes, see if he gets in rhythm. Play him 30+ mpg. See if playing as a legit sized NBA team can work. That would also have to come with the ditching of his coaching style though. He also still needs to ditch the idea of using Hayes as a backup C, that's not why Petrie brought him here, and for craps sake, Petrie needs to tell him. I think because Hayes whooped on his midget W's so bad last year he got the wrong impression of who he is and how he's best used. Needs to play with Cousins PERIOD.

[KF10]

Starting Outlaw will look like we are legitimately tanking! haha

If I was Smart, this is my starting lineup:

IT
Reke
Garcia
Hayes
Cousins

Bench: Thornton, Thompson, Jimmer, Whiteside

You move Reke from SF to SG. Bench Thornton and make him a super sub like Manu/Harden. Start Hayes. Jimmer & Whiteside gets valuable minutes.

This lineup has a nice balance both offensively & defensively imo.

[SacKingZZZ]

Well, that's the lineup I've wanted to see the entire year outside of benching Thornton, but I'm talking about building some trade value! That and maybe getting his confidence up a little, let him work out the kinks.

I think Evans, Thornton, Cisco, Hayes, and Cousins can work well. Thornton is getting good at playing off of Hayes as well. That's two targets and a whole different set of offense you can run that will help you maintain control of the game and not just go up and down without point.

[KF10]

Well, that's the lineup I've wanted to see the entire year outside of benching Thornton, but I'm talking about building some trade value! That and maybe getting his confidence up a little, let him work out the kinks.

I think Evans, Thornton, Cisco, Hayes, and Cousins can work well. Thornton is getting good at playing off of Hayes as well. That's two targets and a whole different set of offense you can run that will help you maintain control of the game and not just go up and down without point.

Meh, I think Outlaw's trade value is beyond repair at this point. He's horrible in the last two years. He's already 27 going 28. Which is unfortunate because he seems like a decent dude off the court. Maybe at best, he can provide some defensive hounding and 3s. That's probably the reason why Petrie brought him in with us.

But no, I still have Outlaw in the doghouse. I rather opt to with a more productive player in Garcia. Salmons can get his before Outlaw if we are not going to amnesty him. He's a much better player than Outlaw.

[deadenddude]

The problem is, half of the roster are players that literally no one else wants. The only guys with any trade value are Cousins, Tyreke, Jimmer, and to a lesser degree, maybe Thomas, Thompson, and Thornton. The former three are all players I think the Kings want to develop still and the latter three wouldn't bring much of any value back, so might a swell keep them.

[FINGER]

Haha, you can count the number of legit "NBA-level" defensive PG's in the NBA on one hand. And half of them can't shoot.

Name me one PG that has been worse on defense than Jimmer this year.

A several: the injured.
No coach, no pg, no leader, no plan...
On the floor of the truck, just see this team as a contender in 3/4 years.

[deNIEd]

The problem is, half of the roster are players that literally no one else wants. The only guys with any trade value are Cousins, Tyreke, Jimmer, and to a lesser degree, maybe Thomas, Thompson, and Thornton. The former three are all players I think the Kings want to develop still and the latter three wouldn't bring much of any value back, so might a swell keep them.

Tyreke & Jimmer's value drop as every day passes

[SacKingZZZ]

Well, I wouldn't really consider Jimmer as a real "value" guy anyway. Tyreke on the other hand, well, if the idea is to move him, better do it THIS summer. 3rd year is when the glitz wears off and reality of what you are begins to set in and yes, that will have a major effect on "value". Like Jason Thompson. Around year 3 it became clear he was going to be closer to Udonis Haslem than Chris Bosh. If GS offered Monta for him it shows he still has some pretty decent value. Wonder how hard Smart pushed for that one, hahaha.

[SadKingsFan]

Not sure what Trades you all wanted. There would have been complaints either
way