OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:And it’s weird that Keegan was the hold up in Beal talks, reportedly
I wouldn’t have included him, but we couldn’t beat the Suns offer without including him (not that I especially craved him on this team)?
Beal picked the Suns. That was the end of the conversation. Miami beat out their offer too apparently. It had nothing to do with who was willing to give what.
OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:On Kingsherald the Raptors beat writer is saying basically what I said initially. OG is a league heralded player that will cost. We are bidding league wide and for the raptors not to want to keep him. The Kings maybe a contender with OG, that’s the possible frame of the picks. IMO it’s Keegan or several drafts.
There is a lot of hometown thinking IMO in our media.
If OG is committed, extended and contract isn’t at issue I would probably give Keegan, but it’s hard to see how the contract situation gets there
I don't think it's even the contract situation. Yes it's important. But the contribution Keegan made/is going to make vs OG isn't as large as people think. That's what Monte would be thinking about, building the team and improving it, not switching one out for another. He has his building blocks, now is the time to put the pieces around them and you don't do that by trading a key player who you believe will be a major piece coming off their rookie season for another player that would be a key piece for what essentially could be a minor upgrade, as quick as next season.
Particularly when the salary slot is extremely in favor of Keegan along with durability, youth, and offensive upside.
OG would no doubt be a huge addition to the defense, and it's not like he is a slouch on offense (nor will Keegan on D), but you absolutely need to add him to Keegan, not swap them.
There is talk that the FO/coaching staff views Keegan as a future multi time AS and will be part of a big 3 here that will lead the Kings to championship contention. Not saying that's what he is, or will be, but that's how high the FO/coaching staff views him. They see him every day, they know his work ethic, how coachable he is etc.
If that's the case Keegan isn't just off the table for OG, the Raptors, from the Kings' POV, would need to add to him.
Keegan isn't getting traded unless it's a star/superstar coming back, that much should be known by now (knock on wood cough Hali). And even though OG is really, really good, he isn't that. Having said that, maybe Monte views him as a star/superstar, who knows? I doubt he does, he wants to replace Barnes with OG, not Keegan with OG.
If that means the Kings miss out on him, so be it. They can wait it out and make a play for him next off season.
Outside of all this, a question for you. I asked myself this after listening to the Kings Pulse pod.
Could OG be a 2nd option?
IMO he absolutely can't be a 2nd option. Would seem Samson Folk of Raptors Republic agrees with that as well.
Does OG want a larger role on offense?
Yes, he does. last 3 seasons OG has averaged 13.2 attempts per game. That's more than anyone else on this roster except for Fox. That's essentially 2nd option-type stuff already on this squad and are the Sacramento Kings championship caliber with OG Anunoby as a 2nd option and taking away Keegan and essentially Barnes?
I don't think so.
If the Kings don't give him a 2nd option role, will OG stay and sign an extension?
No, he absolutely won't. He will go to the highest bidder that will give him that role. And if that happens the Kings just traded Keegan for the right to let OG try himself as a 2nd option, and most likely fail because of his shortcomings on the offensive end.
I don't see a deal of OG to Sacramento at all now. It needs to be a picks package and the Raptors seem like they wouldn't do that, which you have to question Masai here. From all reports they set the bar last deadline at 3 x 1sts. Now he is expiring and it would seem some teams are coming in with offers and they are balking. Time to walk away when someone isn't negotiating in good faith.
BoogieTime wrote:
OG is a good all around role player that impacts the game on many levels. That’s better than Keegan might ever be. It’s more of a bird in the hand than Keegan’s potential and we are competing. And OG can possibly grow into a 20 pt player
BoogieTime wrote:OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:On Kingsherald the Raptors beat writer is saying basically what I said initially. OG is a league heralded player that will cost. We are bidding league wide and for the raptors not to want to keep him. The Kings maybe a contender with OG, that’s the possible frame of the picks. IMO it’s Keegan or several drafts.
There is a lot of hometown thinking IMO in our media.
If OG is committed, extended and contract isn’t at issue I would probably give Keegan, but it’s hard to see how the contract situation gets there
I don't think it's even the contract situation. Yes it's important. But the contribution Keegan made/is going to make vs OG isn't as large as people think. That's what Monte would be thinking about, building the team and improving it, not switching one out for another. He has his building blocks, now is the time to put the pieces around them and you don't do that by trading a key player who you believe will be a major piece coming off their rookie season for another player that would be a key piece for what essentially could be a minor upgrade, as quick as next season.
Particularly when the salary slot is extremely in favor of Keegan along with durability, youth, and offensive upside.
OG would no doubt be a huge addition to the defense, and it's not like he is a slouch on offense (nor will Keegan on D), but you absolutely need to add him to Keegan, not swap them.
There is talk that the FO/coaching staff views Keegan as a future multi time AS and will be part of a big 3 here that will lead the Kings to championship contention. Not saying that's what he is, or will be, but that's how high the FO/coaching staff views him. They see him every day, they know his work ethic, how coachable he is etc.
If that's the case Keegan isn't just off the table for OG, the Raptors, from the Kings' POV, would need to add to him.
Keegan isn't getting traded unless it's a star/superstar coming back, that much should be known by now (knock on wood cough Hali). And even though OG is really, really good, he isn't that. Having said that, maybe Monte views him as a star/superstar, who knows? I doubt he does, he wants to replace Barnes with OG, not Keegan with OG.
If that means the Kings miss out on him, so be it. They can wait it out and make a play for him next off season.
Outside of all this, a question for you. I asked myself this after listening to the Kings Pulse pod.
Could OG be a 2nd option?
IMO he absolutely can't be a 2nd option. Would seem Samson Folk of Raptors Republic agrees with that as well.
Does OG want a larger role on offense?
Yes, he does. last 3 seasons OG has averaged 13.2 attempts per game. That's more than anyone else on this roster except for Fox. That's essentially 2nd option-type stuff already on this squad and are the Sacramento Kings championship caliber with OG Anunoby as a 2nd option and taking away Keegan and essentially Barnes?
I don't think so.
If the Kings don't give him a 2nd option role, will OG stay and sign an extension?
No, he absolutely won't. He will go to the highest bidder that will give him that role. And if that happens the Kings just traded Keegan for the right to let OG try himself as a 2nd option, and most likely fail because of his shortcomings on the offensive end.
I don't see a deal of OG to Sacramento at all now. It needs to be a picks package and the Raptors seem like they wouldn't do that, which you have to question Masai here. From all reports they set the bar last deadline at 3 x 1sts. Now he is expiring and it would seem some teams are coming in with offers and they are balking. Time to walk away when someone isn't negotiating in good faith.
It’s not about what you want (adding OG to Keegan), it’s what Toronto will accept. That’s Keegan or some uncomfortable pick package, not the teams expendable players like the fans hope most likely
Keegan was a rather one dimensional rookie, hitting open assisted threes. The rest of his game wasn’t much to write home about. That’s not alike Hali putting up 20/10 as a starter here.
OG is a good all around role player that impacts the game on many levels. That’s better than Keegan might ever be. It’s more of a bird in the hand than Keegan’s potential and we are competing. And OG can possibly grow into a 20 pt player
City of Trees wrote:For the record I'm not onboard trading Keegan for OG. I see untapped shot creation potential that will win over Boogie.
blind prophet wrote:Looks like the Pacers may be interested in Barnes.
https://hoopshype.com/2023/06/19/pacers-interested-in-harrison-barnes/
OGSactownballer wrote:I think the games per season average is the most underrated factor here.
OG not averages playing only three quarters of the regular season - and the first four were as a Non starter - but also has missed significant playoff time (not factored into the other number). By contrast in just his first season, Keegan okayed 80 plus seven playoff games and likely would have played through the other two but the team made him sit.
Also OG is at his prime. You are seeing what you get. And thinking somehow that he is going to come here and score 20+ is a foolish exaggeration. He won’t and he will not suddenly turn into a number two option here. There are too many other better offensive mouths to feed and that’s not his game.
So making a deal that would be for an all star/number two option guy is ludicrous.
That type of thing for Siakam (still no Keegan because he is our SF starter going into the future) with multiple picks and cap involved makes sense because you form a big three with Fox and Domas with a bonfires third All Star/All NBA caliber player who can alternate that 1a/1b or 2 role EVERY NIGHT.
BoogieTime wrote:So, it’s 4 (!) pick swaps for Beal, 6 (?) second rounders…
Yeah, that report by Aldridge that our refusal to give up Keegan killed the Beal trade may have been accurate
I wouldn’t have given up Keegan plus solid role players like Huerter at all. Wizards got value for Beal
OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:So, it’s 4 (!) pick swaps for Beal, 6 (?) second rounders…
Yeah, that report by Aldridge that our refusal to give up Keegan killed the Beal trade may have been accurate
I wouldn’t have given up Keegan plus solid role players like Huerter at all. Wizards got value for Beal
How many times does it need to be said. Keegan is off the table. Now, put a superstar on the table then Monte would listen.
BoogieTime wrote:OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:So, it’s 4 (!) pick swaps for Beal, 6 (?) second rounders…
Yeah, that report by Aldridge that our refusal to give up Keegan killed the Beal trade may have been accurate
I wouldn’t have given up Keegan plus solid role players like Huerter at all. Wizards got value for Beal
How many times does it need to be said. Keegan is off the table. Now, put a superstar on the table then Monte would listen.
Not for you to say
And Aldridge has been a respected, and a Washington, reporter. He may have knowledge on the sticking points of our deal with Beal
City of Trees wrote:
Haynes getting the inside scoop. Does it mean anything he didn't say the same about OG?
OxAndFox wrote:blind prophet wrote:Looks like the Pacers may be interested in Barnes.
https://hoopshype.com/2023/06/19/pacers-interested-in-harrison-barnes/
I might be in the minority that wants HB back as I think its a big hole to fill. Keegan obviously will pick up some slack but this team is still talent poor and can't afford to lose players that do have value for nothing.
OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:OxAndFox wrote:
How many times does it need to be said. Keegan is off the table. Now, put a superstar on the table then Monte would listen.
Not for you to say
And Aldridge has been a respected, and a Washington, reporter. He may have knowledge on the sticking points of our deal with Beal
That's right. I'm not the one saying it though, I'm just basing my thoughts on what has been reported. It's been reported many times by Ham and others that Keegan is off the table for any of these deals, yet you continue to not believe it.
When someone like that reports it, you chalk it up to, what was it, hometown reporting or something? When someone reports Keegan for Beal, as absurd as it is, you believe it. That's ok too.
David Aldridge might come up with, sky is blue for his next report.
And, there's a difference in what the Wizards received. They got CP3 who was literally going to be waived, Shamet who has no value other than expiring money, pick swaps that might convey once and 6 seconds.
That's closer to Bey territory than Keegan, or Heurter, or even Davion.
BoogieTime wrote:OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:
Not for you to say
And Aldridge has been a respected, and a Washington, reporter. He may have knowledge on the sticking points of our deal with Beal
That's right. I'm not the one saying it though, I'm just basing my thoughts on what has been reported. It's been reported many times by Ham and others that Keegan is off the table for any of these deals, yet you continue to not believe it.
When someone like that reports it, you chalk it up to, what was it, hometown reporting or something? When someone reports Keegan for Beal, as absurd as it is, you believe it. That's ok too.
David Aldridge might come up with, sky is blue for his next report.
And, there's a differDude, ence in what the Wizards received. They got CP3 who was literally going to be waived, Shamet who has no value other than expiring money, pick swaps that might convey once and 6 seconds.
That's closer to Bey territory than Keegan, or Heurter, or even Davion.
Ham isn’t reporting anything, he’s just speculating (unless you have an article instead of off the cuff podcast talk you can share)
Aldridge a respected national reporter, and yes, it could have come down to Keegan being off the table as to why Beal isn’t here
OxAndFox wrote:BoogieTime wrote:OxAndFox wrote:
That's right. I'm not the one saying it though, I'm just basing my thoughts on what has been reported. It's been reported many times by Ham and others that Keegan is off the table for any of these deals, yet you continue to not believe it.
When someone like that reports it, you chalk it up to, what was it, hometown reporting or something? When someone reports Keegan for Beal, as absurd as it is, you believe it. That's ok too.
David Aldridge might come up with, sky is blue for his next report.
And, there's a differDude, ence in what the Wizards received. They got CP3 who was literally going to be waived, Shamet who has no value other than expiring money, pick swaps that might convey once and 6 seconds.
That's closer to Bey territory than Keegan, or Heurter, or even Davion.
Ham isn’t reporting anything, he’s just speculating (unless you have an article instead of off the cuff podcast talk you can share)
Aldridge a respected national reporter, and yes, it could have come down to Keegan being off the table as to why Beal isn’t here
Dude, it's not just an off the cuff comment on a podcast. Multiple Sacramento reporters have said it. What did these guys do to you?
Beal to Kings
"The Kings made inquiries, but were unwilling to include Keegan Murray, their first-round pick from last year, whom the Wizards had tried to move up to select in the 2022 draft, in a potential trade," David Aldridge reported.
Anyone that isn't a superstar
"The Kings made inquiries, but were unwilling to include Keegan Murray, their first-round pick from last year, whom the XXX had tried to move up to select in the 2022 draft, in a potential trade," Stated the most obvious reporter ever.