Cousins demanded a trade(Other fans: Stop proposing trades)

[FINGER]

Westphal is weak, but actually DMC is a cancer. Solution: send the two guys to the moon! Survive without it.

[VeeJay24]

You can try to go with that, but listen around. The vibe we're getting from everyone (and in some cases, it's just directly saying it) is that this is about Cousins, not Westphal.

I understand wanting to defend Cousins at all costs guys, but we can't ignore reality. JT was basically diplomatically saying that Demarcus was a cancer, and mnWI, who would know of the situation is saying that everybody seems to agree that this is Demarcus' fault.

Yes, and I actually kind of like what Westphal did. Now, if the intention was to take the onus off of his own failures, well, that's sad but this could end up bringing this team together and save Westphals career. Time will tell and as I said that quote from Petrie didn't sound like a glowing endorsement of his coach.

It does not change the fact that Cousins isn't the only, or first problem player in this league. Great article here and worth a read if you haven't already:

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/1/2/2676173/demarcus-cousins-sacramento-kings-paul-westphal-hook

Sometimes personalities just do not work together, and Westphal is clearly the continuing factor here in regards to these types of situations. You can pick Cousins or Westphal when the time comes, I think I know who should win. There was a reason Sonics fans came out with some pretty specific warnings when he was hired.

Also, I have to hear what question JT was asked. I'm going to go out on a limb and guarantee the word "cancer" was posed in the question itself. I saw an interview with JT the other night and if you didn't hear the actual question and only his reply, you would be convinced he was pissed and complaining about playing time.

Cousins has to grow up, ballsy move by the Kings here, maybe it'll work. If not, oh well, move on and if Cousins feels like the organization turned their back on him they have another two years to get some type of value for him. It will go one way or the other, but once Westphal is gone, and he's on that real thin line even worse than last season because he's lame duck now, you have to think of the best option to move forward with.

Thanks, for that article which is saying what I have been thinking as I watched the shameful performances against Portland (half the game), the Bulls and the Knicks.

Listen people stop talking about how immature Cousins' is or his behavior and attitude because it is just an excuse. The Kings knew exactly what they were getting and so did everyone here but most of us didn't care. They need to stop announcing in public how he has to grow up; you knew what you were getting into and the rest of the league knew as well.

It's all in the article in plain text: Westphal has to go, all he is doing is trying to save face by making Cousins the scapegoat. As the article states Reke went public with his displeasure and I am willing to bet substantial money that many players on this team aren't happy with Westphal. Let's start with Garcia and Greene who can't get minutes and I can't really understand why. How many damn open shots does Outlaw has to miss before you give another player a chance? Greene is just as good a defender and probably a better shooter? Why is Isaiah Thomas getting more minutes than Garcia? Thompson also should be playing more. What is going on with the offense? This is a train wreck being driven by Westphal and I think it will end soon thus the statement attributed to just Westphal and not the KIngs organization. I think Westphal is the Kings coach for 1 reason and 1 reason only the Maloofs' money issues but they need to move on before he damages a good core of young talent.

[VeeJay24]

And just to add something and I don't know but it is my observation:

Cousins to me has issues with losing. He doesn't seem to be able to deal with losing especially the way the Kings are losing. I think this is a good thing what isn't a good thing is how he deals with it. And listening to the insiders and reporters who cover the team it seems that he takes those frustrations out on the team.

But watching his facial expressions and body language on the court when things aren't going well for the team I get this vibe from him.

As far as his play and I read a post from someone talking about how he is not that talented and he isn't shooting well for a big man. If you have watched any of the Kings games then you would know that the shots he is missing will fall eventually and that he is as skilled a big man that there is in the game. I'd even say he is more skilled offensively that Howard; furthermore, you would know that no one is giving more effort than he is: he is rebounding better than any other big man especially on the offensive boards, playing hard defense and has taken many charges so get out of here with that type of garbage. As far as fouls; it takes time to (1) learn how to play in the NBA and not foul and (2) get the respect of the refs or learn how certain refs call a game.

The Kings and specifically the Maloofs keep blasting publicly that Cousins is the cornerstone and they will build around him which isn't a bad thing but if that is the case they need to do whatever it takes or costs to put that cornerstone in a position to succeed. Surround him with people that will progress his career. Get a true big man coach in here to work with him. I believe Kareem was available; Mchale was available reach out to other names like Mychal Thompson. Get a coach that has experience dealing with temperamental players; not one with a record of not being able to deal with those types of players.

[rpa]

Lost in all of this, of course, is how Cousins has changed his game so much from year 1 to year 2. He's playing MUCH smarter this year and it's rather disappointing to see his shots not falling (and this situation, of course). That said, some numbers:

Last year 61% of Cousins' attempts were jump shots--where he shot a mere 33%. The remaining 39% of his shots were "inside" (dunks, tips, 'close') where he shot 58%. Put those 2 together and you get his season ending average of about 43%.

This year he's only taking 42% of his shots as jumpers (that sounds high but it isn't--it's right alongside what guys like Dwight Howard & Al Jefferson take) and shooting an even worse 27%. Yeah, that sucks. But that he's only taking 42% of his shots at jumpers means 58% of his shots are inside. Problem is, he's shooting a ridiculously low 36% on them. Though, to be fair, his first 4 games have come against: Tyson Chandler, Joakim Noah (and the Bulls defense), Marcus Camby (and the Portland defense), and Pau Gasol. It's not like he's screwing the pooch against scrubs.

Anyways, now the real question: assuming Cousins' shot selection stays constant (which it should, as it's the kind of shot selection he's had pretty much his entire basketball playing career EXCEPT last year) but his shooting percentages revert to last years (which is safer to use since it's a large sample size of games) what would his numbers look like?

It would put his FG% at 48%. Which is good, not great (you'd hope it would be about 5 points higher). However, this assumes:
a) No improvement from his rookie percentages
b) He doesn't continue to look inside more

It's been amusing to read other boards and see people trashing Cousins not only for his attitude but for being a crappy jump shooter with a horrible offensive game. Just goes to show how few people pay attention to games and just look at raw numbers instead.

EDIT: one other thing also needs to be mentioned. I've harped before on why I think that +/- is an overrated stat (particularly because it disfavors certain players--starters on bad teams--and people rarely, if ever, take +/- with any context--they just use the number as the beginning and end of the argument). That said, Cousins' +/- is actually a bit amazing. Keep in mind that he played in a close win over the Lakers followed by 3 blowout losses (to the Bulls, Blazers, & Knicks). Unlike the rest of the team, he didn't get to take advantage of the NO blowout. However, despite being involved in 4 games where the Kings were outscored by a combined 45 points, Cousins himself owns a +/- of +4.0.

[PaKwAn]

as good as cousins is i dont want a cancer being in this team.... people say we have more talent than the twolves, but that team just got a good coach, an unselfish star player and a group of guys filled to play as a team (except beas) .... i want this team to play as a team and have fun out there and stop thinking about there individual games.... cousins is a knucklehead and will always be a knucklehead, he will eventually explode once again and still have this type of problem!

[pillwenney]

You can try to go with that, but listen around. The vibe we're getting from everyone (and in some cases, it's just directly saying it) is that this is about Cousins, not Westphal.

I understand wanting to defend Cousins at all costs guys, but we can't ignore reality. JT was basically diplomatically saying that Demarcus was a cancer, and mnWI, who would know of the situation is saying that everybody seems to agree that this is Demarcus' fault.

Yes, and I actually kind of like what Westphal did. Now, if the intention was to take the onus off of his own failures, well, that's sad but this could end up bringing this team together and save Westphals career. Time will tell and as I said that quote from Petrie didn't sound like a glowing endorsement of his coach.

It does not change the fact that Cousins isn't the only, or first problem player in this league. Great article here and worth a read if you haven't already:

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/1/2/2676173/demarcus-cousins-sacramento-kings-paul-westphal-hook

Sometimes personalities just do not work together, and Westphal is clearly the continuing factor here in regards to these types of situations. You can pick Cousins or Westphal when the time comes, I think I know who should win. There was a reason Sonics fans came out with some pretty specific warnings when he was hired.

Also, I have to hear what question JT was asked. I'm going to go out on a limb and guarantee the word "cancer" was posed in the question itself. I saw an interview with JT the other night and if you didn't hear the actual question and only his reply, you would be convinced he was pissed and complaining about playing time.

Cousins has to grow up, ballsy move by the Kings here, maybe it'll work. If not, oh well, move on and if Cousins feels like the organization turned their back on him they have another two years to get some type of value for him. It will go one way or the other, but once Westphal is gone, and he's on that real thin line even worse than last season because he's lame duck now, you have to think of the best option to move forward with.

Thanks, for that article which is saying what I have been thinking as I watched the shameful performances against Portland (half the game), the Bulls and the Knicks.

Listen people stop talking about how immature Cousins' is or his behavior and attitude because it is just an excuse. The Kings knew exactly what they were getting and so did everyone here but most of us didn't care. They need to stop announcing in public how he has to grow up; you knew what you were getting into and the rest of the league knew as well.

It's all in the article in plain text: Westphal has to go, all he is doing is trying to save face by making Cousins the scapegoat. As the article states Reke went public with his displeasure and I am willing to bet substantial money that many players on this team aren't happy with Westphal. Let's start with Garcia and Greene who can't get minutes and I can't really understand why. How many damn open shots does Outlaw has to miss before you give another player a chance? Greene is just as good a defender and probably a better shooter? Why is Isaiah Thomas getting more minutes than Garcia? Thompson also should be playing more. What is going on with the offense? This is a train wreck being driven by Westphal and I think it will end soon thus the statement attributed to just Westphal and not the KIngs organization. I think Westphal is the Kings coach for 1 reason and 1 reason only the Maloofs' money issues but they need to move on before he damages a good core of young talent.

I'm not going to argue the stuff about Westphal, but that doesn't justify Demarcus being a problem over and over again. Absolving him of responsibility because"we knew what we were getting into" is pretty ridiculous. Not only that, but you're basically implicitly saying there that Cousins is being a problem, but somehow still blaming Westphal for it.

I'd like to think this is about losing and it probably is to a large extent. I have no doubt that Cousins' objections with the team are about problems with the teams.

But the issue isn't mere objections. It's the fact that he flips out and creates constant problems in the locker room.

[YC42Balla]

as good as cousins is i dont want a cancer being in this team.... people say we have more talent than the twolves, but that team just got a good coach, an unselfish star player and a group of guys filled to play as a team (except beas) .... i want this team to play as a team and have fun out there and stop thinking about there individual games.... cousins is a knucklehead and will always be a knucklehead, he will eventually explode once again and still have this type of problem!

Unfortunately, your statement is probably true. Cousins will always have these egocentric related problems through-out his career, but, he doesn't have to be a cancer; If we can win with him, and he is committed to staying in Sacramento, it may be easier to look past his "issues."

[VeeJay24]

Yes, and I actually kind of like what Westphal did. Now, if the intention was to take the onus off of his own failures, well, that's sad but this could end up bringing this team together and save Westphals career. Time will tell and as I said that quote from Petrie didn't sound like a glowing endorsement of his coach.

It does not change the fact that Cousins isn't the only, or first problem player in this league. Great article here and worth a read if you haven't already:

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2012/1/2/2676173/demarcus-cousins-sacramento-kings-paul-westphal-hook

Sometimes personalities just do not work together, and Westphal is clearly the continuing factor here in regards to these types of situations. You can pick Cousins or Westphal when the time comes, I think I know who should win. There was a reason Sonics fans came out with some pretty specific warnings when he was hired.

Also, I have to hear what question JT was asked. I'm going to go out on a limb and guarantee the word "cancer" was posed in the question itself. I saw an interview with JT the other night and if you didn't hear the actual question and only his reply, you would be convinced he was pissed and complaining about playing time.

Cousins has to grow up, ballsy move by the Kings here, maybe it'll work. If not, oh well, move on and if Cousins feels like the organization turned their back on him they have another two years to get some type of value for him. It will go one way or the other, but once Westphal is gone, and he's on that real thin line even worse than last season because he's lame duck now, you have to think of the best option to move forward with.

Thanks, for that article which is saying what I have been thinking as I watched the shameful performances against Portland (half the game), the Bulls and the Knicks.

Listen people stop talking about how immature Cousins' is or his behavior and attitude because it is just an excuse. The Kings knew exactly what they were getting and so did everyone here but most of us didn't care. They need to stop announcing in public how he has to grow up; you knew what you were getting into and the rest of the league knew as well.

It's all in the article in plain text: Westphal has to go, all he is doing is trying to save face by making Cousins the scapegoat. As the article states Reke went public with his displeasure and I am willing to bet substantial money that many players on this team aren't happy with Westphal. Let's start with Garcia and Greene who can't get minutes and I can't really understand why. How many damn open shots does Outlaw has to miss before you give another player a chance? Greene is just as good a defender and probably a better shooter? Why is Isaiah Thomas getting more minutes than Garcia? Thompson also should be playing more. What is going on with the offense? This is a train wreck being driven by Westphal and I think it will end soon thus the statement attributed to just Westphal and not the KIngs organization. I think Westphal is the Kings coach for 1 reason and 1 reason only the Maloofs' money issues but they need to move on before he damages a good core of young talent.

I'm not going to argue the stuff about Westphal, but that doesn't justify Demarcus being a problem over and over again. Absolving him of responsibility because"we knew what we were getting into" is pretty ridiculous. Not only that, but you're basically implicitly saying there that Cousins is being a problem, but somehow still blaming Westphal for it.

I'd like to think this is about losing and it probably is to a large extent. I have no doubt that Cousins' objections with the team are about problems with the teams.

But the issue isn't mere objections. It's the fact that he flips out and creates constant problems in the locker room.

I am not absolving Cousins' of anything; I am simply saying when you go against the grain and draft a guy with a history like Cousins you are obviously taking a risk; a multi-million dollar risk. You must protect your investment and put him in a comfort zone to succeed. I don't think the Kings have done that and a big reason is Paul Westphal. I mean what is the use or the benefit of saying over and over that Cousins' has an attitude problem or that he needs to grow up? No one cares! Not the press, fans or other teams because we all knew this when he entered the league. What they are doing is showing their ineptness because they weren't prepared to deal with Cousins and his issues. Instead of trying to cover your ass which you're not going to be able to do anyway; get behind close doors with this guy and determine what he really needs to succeed and if that means firing the coach then by all means do it. You made a decision to draft this guy despite his issues so stand by it and stop airing laundry out in public and do all that is necessary to make it work. Stop acting as if you are ready to bail after only 1 year.

As the article implies, Westphal blew this thing way over board because Cousins was crazy enough to question his coaching. I am not blaming Westphal for Cousins being a problem; I am blaming Cousins being a problem on losing. I am blaming Westphal for the losing so if that is blaming Westphal for Cousins' problems then so be it.

[OGSactownballer]

I think that you are all being a pack of stooge fools at this point.

We all know and knew what we have in DeMarcus from the months before draft day last year and we accepted that as the risk and price to pay for lucking into a truly dominant talent as a big. It makes me as nauseous as the BS "Jimmer mania" that all these pathetic white bread clowns in this POS overgrown small town are going ape shift about.

It's all pathetic.

Let's try and recognize a real problem when we see it. Wesphal's time - if it ever was - is long past. He is running an offense structured and designed for Charles Barkley and four of the most talented perimeter shooters of all time. We don't have that here. We MIGHT, some day, if he were to actually do the job he was hired to DO, and properly develop the talent that has been handed to him. But he hasn't because he is incapable of doing so. And what's worse, he is using a popular media theme about his own franchise caliber player to try to shift the blame from himself. It's pathetic and childish, and it's pretty obvious that the team is letting him set himself up for his own fall - and as far as I am concerned that can't happen soon enough to try to salvage this season.

[floppymoose]

But that he's only taking 42% of his shots at jumpers means 58% of his shots are inside. Problem is, he's shooting a ridiculously low 36% on them. Though, to be fair, his first 4 games have come against: Tyson Chandler, Joakim Noah (and the Bulls defense), Marcus Camby (and the Portland defense), and Pau Gasol. It's not like he's screwing the pooch against scrubs.

He was horrid in the preseason game against the scrubby GSW bigs, too.

[sacking123]

I don't know if this has been asked and/or answered but have the Kings tried to get CWebb to work with Cousins?
I just think with CWebb's immaturity of sorts early in his career he could definitely help him out.
If the Kings haven't asked CWebb to do something, why the hell haven't they?
Hell I would even like them to see if Shaq can teach him some things, even though Shaq himself is still a little immature.

[pillwenney]

I am not absolving Cousins' of anything; I am simply saying when you go against the grain and draft a guy with a history like Cousins you are obviously taking a risk; a multi-million dollar risk. You must protect your investment and put him in a comfort zone to succeed. I don't think the Kings have done that and a big reason is Paul Westphal. I mean what is the use or the benefit of saying over and over that Cousins' has an attitude problem or that he needs to grow up? No one cares! Not the press, fans or other teams because we all knew this when he entered the league. What they are doing is showing their ineptness because they weren't prepared to deal with Cousins and his issues. Instead of trying to cover your ass which you're not going to be able to do anyway; get behind close doors with this guy and determine what he really needs to succeed and if that means firing the coach then by all means do it. You made a decision to draft this guy despite his issues so stand by it and stop airing laundry out in public and do all that is necessary to make it work. Stop acting as if you are ready to bail after only 1 year.

As the article implies, Westphal blew this thing way over board because Cousins was crazy enough to question his coaching. I am not blaming Westphal for Cousins being a problem; I am blaming Cousins being a problem on losing. I am blaming Westphal for the losing so if that is blaming Westphal for Cousins' problems then so be it.

I agree that they're showing that they weren't ready to deal with him. I'd argue that almost nobody would be ready though. And I do agree that the situation was just not handled well.

Losing definitely makes things worse, but you're always going to lose sometimes, which is always going to create some tension. No locker room or ever will be like the 02 Kings again. There are going to be objections and disagreements. What's wrong here is that Demarcus doesn't say "You know coach, I'm not sure I agree with that assessment." He flies off the f******** handle in a way that's a distraction and that's really detrimental to the team.

I don't know if this has been asked and/or answered but have the Kings tried to get CWebb to work with Cousins?
I just think with CWebb's immaturity of sorts early in his career he could definitely help him out.
If the Kings haven't asked CWebb to do something, why the hell haven't they?
Hell I would even like them to see if Shaq can teach him some things, even though Shaq himself is still a little immature.

If we did and he declined, we probably wouldn't hear about it. And he probably would decline, since he's got a pretty cushy studio job. Maybe not though.

[SacKingZZZ]

I don't know what the deal is with CWebb. He came out and said he wanted to work with Cousins, but then we never heard anything.