The TRADE Thread 2021

[dozencousins]

As I updated a bit ago just today . Looks very promising a Simmons trade will get done . Though as of now a package would include Fox . We are talking other paths with no Fox or Hali . So Yes that is very possible as well .

[LightTheBeam]

I can say this Monte is not posturing . Weather or not Morey is who know's ? If he is there will be no deal now or later . I know that Monte is ready to move on if the deal is not agreed to really soon now !

Its not posturing that he wants Simmons. That has been made very very clear.

Morey is posturing.

Monte is calling his bluff.

[dozencousins]

I can say this Monte is not posturing . Weather or not Morey is who know's ? If he is there will be no deal now or later . I know that Monte is ready to move on if the deal is not agreed to really soon now !

Its not posturing that he wants Simmons. That has been made very very clear.

Morey is posturing.

Monte is calling his bluff.

Agreed ! Monte is ready to move on as He knows Morey is playing games .

[BoogieTime]

I thought Fox had to be a part of a Simmons trade, just because I can't really see them in the same starting unit with any type of traditional lineup (certainly with a non stretching center like Holmes), if Fox doesn't drastically up his shooting from what we've seen.

Still, Simmons has actually been better with his usage in the last couple of years, but its just a weird fit with him and Hali/Fox IMO

[LightTheBeam]

So i'm operating under the assumption that Vivek is hell bent on Monte making a trade for the sake of making a trade.

I don't want to give up picks or young players.. With that said,

Knicks and Randle are really struggling. They have Toppin waiting in the wing, they have IQ, Grimes, Barrett, Reddish, Robinson - A nice core under 23.

What is the consensus of taking on Randle for little to nothing? Imagine if Knicks wanted to do a soft re-tool and being in a big market they can actually use the cap space. Tristan + Bagley + Harkless + 2nds for Randle?

It gets us a legit interior scorer to pair with the young guys. Id rather go the opposite way, but we know that won't happen.

[eyeatoma]

I can say this Monte is not posturing . Weather or not Morey is who know's ? If he is there will be no deal now or later . I know that Monte is ready to move on if the deal is not agreed to really soon now !

Its not posturing that he wants Simmons. That has been made very very clear.

Morey is posturing.

Monte is calling his bluff.

Agreed ! Monte is ready to move on as He knows Morey is playing games .

Hi, any updates on this? I'm a sixers fan, but it looks like you're in the know and an insider. You mentioned the deal would get done in the next day or two. That is today right? So are you saying if there is no deal today, there might not be any deal at all?

[sacking123]

Let's get some optimism around here leading up to the deadline.

Everyone that continue to harp on Fox's down year need to look at January. Despite the Kings going 3-7 so far De'Aaron is a + on the floor, only he and Bagley are doing so out of major minutes.
His shooting is still not there, but all the trends are upwards.

As mentioned, Marvin is the other + player this month and since he has been playing, he's putting up 11/8 in 23 minutes. Similar to Fox, shooting still isn't there, but his impact in rebounding has been noticeable.

The Rookie gets a lot of flack for his sub par campaign, but Davion is shooting the three at 36% over the past 2 months. Add in his excellent D and it's been a great bounce back. I still contend, Davion has been on the end of some of the most horrendous calls this season, plus he has shown he could lead his own team right now.

All three of these guys might not be on the team shortly, but they're coming good at the right time for Monte to have something to work with.

[PhillyNj]

As I updated a bit ago just today . Looks very promising a Simmons trade will get done . Though as of now a package would include Fox . We are talking other paths with no Fox or Hali . So Yes that is very possible as well .

I don’t believe there is any chance of a deal getting done without one of Fox or Haliburton in the trade.

[rpa]

Sometime last week on the T&T board someone (HartfordWhalers I believe) called out a comment I made about the impact Embiid has had on Simmons--namely how much better/worse Simmons is without Embiid. At the time I hadn't looked deeply into the difference. I did today. The results:

Season Averages vs. Without Embiid
Points/Rebounds/Assists: 14/7/7 vs 16/8/7
FG%: 56% vs 50%
ORTG/DRTG: 114/116 vs 100/107
BPM: +2.9 vs +0.2
Record: 49-23 (.681) vs 7-9 (.438)
Opponents TS%: ? vs .565*

* BBRef doesn't appear to track Opponents TS% for the season. However, the league media is about .570 and considering the Sixers were a top defensive team (3rd in eFG%, 2nd in PP100) I'd imagine their season average was a good deal lower than the median team's was .

One caveat is that their games without Embiid were tougher on average (12 of 16 were on the road and 10 of 16 were against opponents with a +.500 record).

That all being said: I think the numbers show that Simmons took a pretty huge step down without Embiid on the floor. His offensive efficiency cratered (ORTG of 114 => 100, FG% dropped 6 points) and his on-court impact also dropped significantly (BPM of +2.9=>0.2).

Point here being: I wouldn't want to be the team who gave up a ton of assets for a guy who appears to have ridden Embiid's nuts like a Harley. If McNair refused to give up either Fox or Haliburton I hope he sticks to that. Simmons on court value without Embiid minus all of his other issues clearly show he's not worth a massive haul of value.

[BoogieTime]

Kings without Fox and Haliburton putting up 20/10+ every time the team has been without him.

He's not going anywhere, obviously

[76ciology]

If you look at the draft there’s 4 guards that are slotted at the 3-6 range with Ivey, Sharpe, Matthurin and Johnny Davis.

Not to mention, Chet could slide and I think he will. Chet and Ben can be playable at 3-4 positions or 4-5 positions depending on the match-ups while Kings can then utilize a Davion-Hali backcourt.

While Jabari-Ben at 3-4 is also a really good wing duo.

This also explains why Kings looks to be going hard for a PF in both Ben and Sabonis.

[rpa]

This also explains why Kings looks to be going hard for a PF in both Ben and Sabonis.

More than likely it's just about who's available.

The Kings lack talent and that statement applies to at least 3 positions--and possibly 4 since Fox/Haliburton appear to be a questionable pairing at this point. Getting more talent is goal #1. What position that talent plays is a distant #2.

[76ciology]

Hali and Ben are the type of players who can hide young cornerstone players specially the unique ones like Chet.

Fox is a very good player and I prefer him to land with the Sixers. But you’re team will just not go anywhere with him as an alpha and may even me a detriment for a young cornerstone’s development like John Wall or maybe how Ricky Davis was to LeBron (taking the extreme example).

[HopelessKnick]

So i'm operating under the assumption that Vivek is hell bent on Monte making a trade for the sake of making a trade.

I don't want to give up picks or young players.. With that said,

Knicks and Randle are really struggling. They have Toppin waiting in the wing, they have IQ, Grimes, Barrett, Reddish, Robinson - A nice core under 23.

What is the consensus of taking on Randle for little to nothing? Imagine if Knicks wanted to do a soft re-tool and being in a big market they can actually use the cap space. Tristan + Bagley + Harkless + 2nds for Randle?

It gets us a legit interior scorer to pair with the young guys. Id rather go the opposite way, but we know that won't happen.

Leading up to the deadline I could see such a deal having some possibility of happening. I read somewhere that the Kings have some level of interest in Randle. Despite his struggles this season with his shooting he has been a 48% career shooter that is usually adequate from midrange as well and passes and rebounds well.

One necessary ingredient for the Knicks to become sellers and trade Randle is them losing as many games as possible during the upcoming stretch---if they go like 1-9 or 2-8 I could see them giving up on the season and with the things that have been going between Randle and the fans I believe they'd consider trading him and trying to re-tool through the draft and free agency (they are said to be highly interested in Brunson who is gonna be a UFA).


However I do believe that the Kings and 76ers will get something done between them and Simmons is likely going to end up in some type of 3-way trade where Fox is headed to a third team (Indiana?). Good luck guys, remembering 20 years ago the Kings with Bibby, Christie, Peja, Webber and Kukoc and the Arco Arena going crazy ---you guys desevered the title that year and to this day I believe you got robbed by the referees in that series vs. the Lakers. You were the better team. Good luck with the upcoming deadline.

[Lost in LA]

Kukoc played for the Kings? Thanks otherwise...I think you mean Turkoglu?

[76ciology]

Sometime last week on the T&T board someone (HartfordWhalers I believe) called out a comment I made about the impact Embiid has had on Simmons--namely how much better/worse Simmons is without Embiid. At the time I hadn't looked deeply into the difference. I did today. The results:

Season Averages vs. Without Embiid
Points/Rebounds/Assists: 14/7/7 vs 16/8/7
FG%: 56% vs 50%
ORTG/DRTG: 114/116 vs 100/107
BPM: +2.9 vs +0.2
Record: 49-23 (.681) vs 7-9 (.438)
Opponents TS%: ? vs .565*

* BBRef doesn't appear to track Opponents TS% for the season. However, the league media is about .570 and considering the Sixers were a top defensive team (3rd in eFG%, 2nd in PP100) I'd imagine their season average was a good deal lower than the median team's was .

One caveat is that their games without Embiid were tougher on average (12 of 16 were on the road and 10 of 16 were against opponents with a +.500 record).

That all being said: I think the numbers show that Simmons took a pretty huge step down without Embiid on the floor. His offensive efficiency cratered (ORTG of 114 => 100, FG% dropped 6 points) and his on-court impact also dropped significantly (BPM of +2.9=>0.2).

Point here being: I wouldn't want to be the team who gave up a ton of assets for a guy who appears to have ridden Embiid's nuts like a Harley. If McNair refused to give up either Fox or Haliburton I hope he sticks to that. Simmons on court value without Embiid minus all of his other issues clearly show he's not worth a massive haul of value.

Get a big who can just spot up the floor then let Ben do this if the opponent’s big decides to defend him.

Watch on YouTube

Ben is like Siakam or Giannis, he needs to play with a center who will just camp at the 3pt line and space the floor.

[Eyeamok]

Kings fans I come in peace.

what is the plan going forward if no trade is made for Ben Simmons by the deadline?

Another high lottery draft pick ? If so do you think that will help you make the playoffs in the 2022-2023 season?
A trade for someone else? If so which player(s) are you willing to give up that have potential?

Thank you.

[BoogieTime]

Kings fans I come in peace.

what is the plan going forward if no trade is made for Ben Simmons by the deadline?

Another high lottery draft pick ? If so do you think that will help you make the playoffs in the 2022-2023 season?
A trade for someone else? If so which player(s) are you willing to give up that have potential?

Thank you.

Our remaining schedule is brutal, and we are already a lot of games out

Anyone with sense would wait til the offseason to start to make trades as this point and let our pick this year accumulate in value

We may not be guided with sense, so dont know

[dozencousins]

Its not posturing that he wants Simmons. That has been made very very clear.

Morey is posturing.

Monte is calling his bluff.

Agreed ! Monte is ready to move on as He knows Morey is playing games .

Hi, any updates on this? I'm a sixers fan, but it looks like you're in the know and an insider. You mentioned the deal would get done in the next day or two. That is today right? So are you saying if there is no deal today, there might not be any deal at all?

I don't see one happening . I said earlier in this thread of deals that Kings could or would do and what Morey was claiming to be okay with and a lot of that was based on Morey wanting to free cap to go after Harden . Monte knows this and I have known about this for quit a long time . If we are talking right now a deal i s Dead ! Simply because Morey is playing games . Morey better hope that he ends up getting Harden now or in the off season because if he does not he is wasting Joel's years and 76ers timeline of championships and if he fails 76ers nation will call for his head !

IMO Morey is being stupid because he is risking the 76ers chances at a title run , Players like Joel's timeline amd this can bit him in the @ss .

I can say this as of now Monte has moved on .He is great friends will Morey and out of frienship he will listen and take calls but Monte at this point is not and will not initiate any call between the two .

Monte is tired of Morey's games and if Monte gets another great deal done then Morey will have missed the boat .

[OGSactownballer]

I have been thinking this through and a three team deal that centers around Fox and Barnes going to Brooklyn, Harden and parts going to Philly and Simmons and Harris coming to Sac actually makes a lot of sense and creates roster balance for both the other teams and transforms Saf to a defensive monster.

There are a lot of other ancillary parts that have to come into play including at least two picks (ideally ‘23 and ‘25) coming from Sac with one going to each team. I’m not thinking that Buddy needs to go and actually it may be better to have his shooting stay here. Keep in mind that we have TT and Marvin to include and they represent about 23 million in expiring money. So with Fox and Barnes and those two the money is there to cover both incoming salaries.

In Brooklyn they would slide Kyrie to the two as the primary scoring guard which should work fine as he has the size to handle that. That backcourt is virtually unguardable and you run Barnes next to Durant.

In Philly you have your pairing of Joel and Harden and whatever Brooklyn includes to make things balance money wise.

In Sac you have a starting lineup of Mitchell/Halliburton/Simmons/Harris/Holmes. You instant transform into a nightmare defensive team and most importantly in the modern NBA where teams live and die by the three, a lockdown perimeter defensive team. Secondary moves can be made to fill in needs but there is already existing shooting with Buddy and Davis to flex in situationally. We haven’t given up any of the young bigs (Queta/Jones/Metu) and that also makes Holmes a value piece that can be safely moved and increase the size/interior defensive presence to balance the perimeter.

I don’t know if this is the kind of thing g that is being discussed but it sure does make BASKETBALL sense for everyone involved.

And thinking about it while the picks could be added as sweetener/get it done incentive, realistically with the balance of the rosters they aren’t a necessity.

Quick edit I just realized the pieces to go to Oholly would have to be Marvin and TT to make the money work and fill their PF spot. Sorry that was a miss by me.