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Draft Watch 2018

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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2621 » by sacking123 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:15 am

ICMTM wrote:
simonbampfield wrote:Sorry all I will add is how did Vlade, who thinks Bogdan is going to be an all star, thought Papa G could become an all star and then passes on the absolute best Euro prospect ever? Doesn’t quite add up, that means Bagley is going to be a superstar in his eyes, and will need to be.


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Media spin.

I feel if the org does a good job in development of these players we can be something. When I say something I mean a Portland, Utah, NOLA, and I'm great with that.

If we become something more than that...gravy!

I agree. I’m super high on Bagley, I had him 2nd and I think he will be a lot better than a lot think.
Now that we have Bagley I’m just hoping that with this group of bigs plus guys like Embid, Towns, Davis, Boogie etc the big man will make a comeback. It won’t if you can’t shoot though and that is what Bagley will need to improve on, he has good form, just needs to work on it, as every player in this draft needs to.


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Re: RE: Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2622 » by nolimit0820 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:19 am

City of Trees wrote:
nolimit0820 wrote:Bogdan provides much of what Doncic does. Smart move drafting Bagley.
Time will tell if it was smart but I agree rebounding was a bigger team need than passing.

However the Kings arent in a position to comfortably draft by need.
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Yeah only time will tell. I could not ever disagree with the statement, "you can't have too many playmakers." Although with our team, I felt we have two legitimate playmakers in Fox and BB. I would even throw Buddy in that conversation because I see him as more than a "spot up and shoot" type of guy. So we really have three perimeter players who can be effective with the ball in their hands.

Adding Bagley met a huge need..a bonafide scorer and an elite rebounder. I'm already tired of the Bagley can't play D argument from fans and "experts." That's for a whole other thread, but I will say...as a former college player and coaching the past 8 years at the college level...I've always preached and every coach I have ever met would argue that REBOUNDING is DEFENSE...lol even my 6th grade AAU team's defensive slogan was "one and done." We all know it, but I think it is often forgotten about when we're talking about a player's defensive potential.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2623 » by kingjawn100 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:23 am

The hope is that the Bagley addition really lights a fire under Willie's ass. He's being spoken of as an afterthought who has no future with the team. in some ways the team drafted his replacement 2 years in a row. It's both on him and also the coaching staff to get defensive/rim protecting production out of him. Strange that no one's been able to get through to him being that he has the tools. The pitch this year really should be, "'we don't care what you do on offense - if you're not playing D we aren't gonna play you" - that would hurt him in the poket book come next summer.

Also...with all the hype surrounding Harry i still maintain he will probably be on some minutes restrictions this year and may not play in back-to-backs. i also think it's possible that Harry starts the year playing in Stockton to both give him confidence playing in live action and to also help solve the big man glut. At least until the all-star break when Willie/others get moved. Not what fans want to hear but i think it's an option.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2624 » by nolimit0820 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:52 am

kingjawn100 wrote:The hope is that the Bagley addition really lights a fire under Willie's ass. He's being spoken of as an afterthought who has no future with the team. in some ways the team drafted his replacement 2 years in a row. It's both on him and also the coaching staff to get defensive/rim protecting production out of him. Strange that no one's been able to get through to him being that he has the tools. The pitch this year really should be, "'we don't care what you do on offense - if you're not playing D we aren't gonna play you" - that would hurt him in the poket book come next summer.

Also...with all the hype surrounding Harry i still maintain he will probably be on some minutes restrictions this year and may not play in back-to-backs. i also think it's possible that Harry starts the year playing in Stockton to both give him confidence playing in live action and to also help solve the big man glut. At least until the all-star break when Willie/others get moved. Not what fans want to hear but i think it's an option.


Agreed on Willie. Well said.

Totally hope you're wrong about Giles LOL but a reasonable prediction.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2625 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:00 am

kingjawn100 wrote:The hope is that the Bagley addition really lights a fire under Willie's ass. He's being spoken of as an afterthought who has no future with the team. in some ways the team drafted his replacement 2 years in a row. It's both on him and also the coaching staff to get defensive/rim protecting production out of him. Strange that no one's been able to get through to him being that he has the tools. The pitch this year really should be, "'we don't care what you do on offense - if you're not playing D we aren't gonna play you" - that would hurt him in the poket book come next summer.

Also...with all the hype surrounding Harry i still maintain he will probably be on some minutes restrictions this year and may not play in back-to-backs. i also think it's possible that Harry starts the year playing in Stockton to both give him confidence playing in live action and to also help solve the big man glut. At least until the all-star break when Willie/others get moved. Not what fans want to hear but i think it's an option.


IMO WCS lacks motor, which is innate and won’t change with the flick of a few words. Even if he moderately improved for a payday, who would be comfortable with that. The way Joerger was speaking with Carmichael Dave, I inferred that WCS is not in their plans, and IMO he shouldn’t be
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2626 » by City of Trees » Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:08 am

Want to see the moment a Kings fan reached his limit? Watch.

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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2627 » by nolimit0820 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:33 am

Lol. I have a feeling that's one of our outspoken posters. Show yourself!
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2628 » by sacking123 » Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:59 am

kingjawn100 wrote:The hope is that the Bagley addition really lights a fire under Willie's ass. He's being spoken of as an afterthought who has no future with the team. in some ways the team drafted his replacement 2 years in a row. It's both on him and also the coaching staff to get defensive/rim protecting production out of him. Strange that no one's been able to get through to him being that he has the tools. The pitch this year really should be, "'we don't care what you do on offense - if you're not playing D we aren't gonna play you" - that would hurt him in the poket book come next summer.

Also...with all the hype surrounding Harry i still maintain he will probably be on some minutes restrictions this year and may not play in back-to-backs. i also think it's possible that Harry starts the year playing in Stockton to both give him confidence playing in live action and to also help solve the big man glut. At least until the all-star break when Willie/others get moved. Not what fans want to hear but i think it's an option.

Yeah I would agree with all of that. Having said that I just don’t see WCS on the roster to start the season.


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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2629 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 23, 2018 6:16 am

Glad we’re in the phase of falling in love with our player after all the uncertainty
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2630 » by Shy Gorgeous-Al » Sat Jun 23, 2018 10:55 am

Doncic would have changed the Kings culture and put them in the right path to winning.

I don't understand the idea behind picking Bagley tbh. Did the FO know that Doncic si a guy that can play all 4 positions? there wasn;t a reason to skip on Doncic because they had Fox.

Other than that, if you wanted to get Bagley, at least be smart enough to trade down and gain additional assets. He was coveted by every team in the top 8 other than Atlanta. It makes zero sense.

Bagley will be a good player, but just not as impactful. I don't believe it will be that close. 1 way front court players without noticeable playmaking skills just can not come close to multi positional elite playmakers like Doncic.

Sad...
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2631 » by Eisenheart » Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:34 pm

Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:Doncic would have changed the Kings culture and put them in the right path to winning.

I don't understand the idea behind picking Bagley tbh. Did the FO know that Doncic si a guy that can play all 4 positions? there wasn;t a reason to skip on Doncic because they had Fox.

Other than that, if you wanted to get Bagley, at least be smart enough to trade down and gain additional assets. He was coveted by every team in the top 8 other than Atlanta. It makes zero sense.

Bagley will be a good player, but just not as impactful. I don't believe it will be that close. 1 way front court players without noticeable playmaking skills just can not come close to multi positional elite playmakers like Doncic.

Sad...



I'm disappointed as well but let's wait. maybe Bagley becomes the best player and Doncic is the next Rubio/ Ball etc. Bagley has big weaknesses but there is nothing that can not improve
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2632 » by Shy Gorgeous-Al » Sat Jun 23, 2018 1:04 pm

Eisenheart wrote:
Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:Doncic would have changed the Kings culture and put them in the right path to winning.

I don't understand the idea behind picking Bagley tbh. Did the FO know that Doncic si a guy that can play all 4 positions? there wasn;t a reason to skip on Doncic because they had Fox.

Other than that, if you wanted to get Bagley, at least be smart enough to trade down and gain additional assets. He was coveted by every team in the top 8 other than Atlanta. It makes zero sense.

Bagley will be a good player, but just not as impactful. I don't believe it will be that close. 1 way front court players without noticeable playmaking skills just can not come close to multi positional elite playmakers like Doncic.

Sad...



I'm disappointed as well but let's wait. maybe Bagley becomes the best player and Doncic is the next Rubio/ Ball etc. Bagley has big weaknesses but there is nothing that can not improve


I understand. You always want to get behind the selection and it's human nature. I do it all the damn time man.

It's just that you just don't see players like Doncic come all that often at all. He is legit 6'9 PG looks like with a big frame, has such an all-around game that does what he does and is currently at his athletic floor. Imagine the things he is going to do with good nutrition, good training program and some PEDs? there is a reason skilled players usually excel in the NBA.

I think Bagley will be a good player. But he is more of that rich man's Julius Randle/John Collins/Amare(Amare needed a Nash to excel) type don't you think? He has the best second jump I have ever seen and will be very very tough to stop on the block and especially against switches, but you see his types around the NBA and in NBA history...Did you ever see a player like Doncic? When was the last time a player like Bagley was a superstar? The players that dominate the league right now are big wings/SFs that are elite playmakers...and one Steph curry. I just don't see his type in the superstar/perennial all-star nba landscape.

I think he has a chance to reach perennial All-Star for sure...just don't see how franchise/culture changing his game really is...is he going to elevate his teammates games? or is he going to get his? I think that's an important difference for rebuilding teams especially.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2633 » by Archx » Sat Jun 23, 2018 1:24 pm

Eisenheart wrote:
Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:Doncic would have changed the Kings culture and put them in the right path to winning.

I don't understand the idea behind picking Bagley tbh. Did the FO know that Doncic si a guy that can play all 4 positions? there wasn;t a reason to skip on Doncic because they had Fox.

Other than that, if you wanted to get Bagley, at least be smart enough to trade down and gain additional assets. He was coveted by every team in the top 8 other than Atlanta. It makes zero sense.

Bagley will be a good player, but just not as impactful. I don't believe it will be that close. 1 way front court players without noticeable playmaking skills just can not come close to multi positional elite playmakers like Doncic.

Sad...



I'm disappointed as well but let's wait. maybe Bagley becomes the best player and Doncic is the next Rubio/ Ball etc. Bagley has big weaknesses but there is nothing that can not improve


If Doncic is 6'8 220 Rubio with a proper jumpshot or even Lonzo, then DAL 100% won this draft :D .... Imagine how much damage would those 2 do if they had a proper jumpshot and were that big.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2634 » by Eisenheart » Sat Jun 23, 2018 2:00 pm

i'm with you guys, i think we made a huge mistake, Doncic will become in my opinion the best player of this draft class and i'm not high on Bagley. i think, he is a player you can get in almost every draft class and Doncic is special, a player you can get 1 time in 20 years. but now it is how it is, and in the end 3 teams passed on Luka, maybe they see something. i don't know, i'm really disappointed but we'll see how it'll work out.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2635 » by bleeds_purple » Sat Jun 23, 2018 2:12 pm

BoogieTime wrote:
kingjawn100 wrote:The hope is that the Bagley addition really lights a fire under Willie's ass. He's being spoken of as an afterthought who has no future with the team. in some ways the team drafted his replacement 2 years in a row. It's both on him and also the coaching staff to get defensive/rim protecting production out of him. Strange that no one's been able to get through to him being that he has the tools. The pitch this year really should be, "'we don't care what you do on offense - if you're not playing D we aren't gonna play you" - that would hurt him in the poket book come next summer.

Also...with all the hype surrounding Harry i still maintain he will probably be on some minutes restrictions this year and may not play in back-to-backs. i also think it's possible that Harry starts the year playing in Stockton to both give him confidence playing in live action and to also help solve the big man glut. At least until the all-star break when Willie/others get moved. Not what fans want to hear but i think it's an option.


IMO WCS lacks motor, which is innate and won’t change with the flick of a few words. Even if he moderately improved for a payday, who would be comfortable with that. The way Joerger was speaking with Carmichael Dave, I inferred that WCS is not in their plans, and IMO he shouldn’t be


Honestly, it all comes down to his mentality. There were two instances last year that really stood out to me. First, was that game where Porzingis destroyed him. He does a media spot after the game and basically hypes himself up saying he's a multi-faceted player who can score and be a go to guy.

WCS wrote:"I think I just gotta get more selfish,” said Cauley-Stein, who hit 2-of-6 shots, and is averaging 8.9 points this season. “Offensively, I gotta get to the point that I’m just going at dudes like him. Guarding him, and then watching his game, you take away, oh, this is what he’s doing. I have the same body size, the same skill-level, just transfer it over to a game now. But being behind in the race, he’s been doing it for a while.”


Second, we had a game coming up against Minnesota. Again, he starts talking and comparing himself to KAT. Then he plays what I consider the worst game of his career wherein he seems to take the KAT matchup personally and as a moment to prove he is just as good. He played completely outside of himself trying to go one-on-one and turned it over and took so many bad shots that I couldn't even count them.

--Couldn't dig up the quote I was looking for here but once again he was talking about his matchup with KAT as if he is anywhere on that level--

News flash to him - you are not that good. Know your role and stick to it. King Jawn hit the nail on the head. The message to WCS next year needs to be pretty simple: your value to the team is to anchor our defense, run end to end, and score off setting screens. The optimist in me still believes WCS could break out and be a good two-way player in an uptempo offense. He could even be decent next to Bagley who should hopefully make up for Willie's poor rebounding. But I'm not holding my breath.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2636 » by BoogieTime » Sat Jun 23, 2018 3:21 pm

Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:
Eisenheart wrote:
Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:Doncic would have changed the Kings culture and put them in the right path to winning.

I don't understand the idea behind picking Bagley tbh. Did the FO know that Doncic si a guy that can play all 4 positions? there wasn;t a reason to skip on Doncic because they had Fox.

Other than that, if you wanted to get Bagley, at least be smart enough to trade down and gain additional assets. He was coveted by every team in the top 8 other than Atlanta. It makes zero sense.

Bagley will be a good player, but just not as impactful. I don't believe it will be that close. 1 way front court players without noticeable playmaking skills just can not come close to multi positional elite playmakers like Doncic.

Sad...



I'm disappointed as well but let's wait. maybe Bagley becomes the best player and Doncic is the next Rubio/ Ball etc. Bagley has big weaknesses but there is nothing that can not improve


I understand. You always want to get behind the selection and it's human nature. I do it all the damn time man.

It's just that you just don't see players like Doncic come all that often at all. He is legit 6'9 PG looks like with a big frame, has such an all-around game that does what he does and is currently at his athletic floor. Imagine the things he is going to do with good nutrition, good training program and some PEDs? there is a reason skilled players usually excel in the NBA.

I think Bagley will be a good player. But he is more of that rich man's Julius Randle/John Collins/Amare(Amare needed a Nash to excel) type don't you think? He has the best second jump I have ever seen and will be very very tough to stop on the block and especially against switches, but you see his types around the NBA and in NBA history...Did you ever see a player like Doncic? When was the last time a player like Bagley was a superstar? The players that dominate the league right now are big wings/SFs that are elite playmakers...and one Steph curry. I just don't see his type in the superstar/perennial all-star nba landscape.

I think he has a chance to reach perennial All-Star for sure...just don't see how franchise/culture changing his game really is...is he going to elevate his teammates games? or is he going to get his? I think that's an important difference for rebuilding teams especially.


Why is being a 6’9 PG a good thing? Team already has a PG. Luka is also a bit of a tweener, in that I don’t know if he’s athletic enough to guard wings
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2637 » by J_T » Sat Jun 23, 2018 3:37 pm

You guys need to get over it (and I think most of you are). Sure, I think that Divac did a mistake by not drafting Doncic, but it's not like he drafted some weird Serbian player who was projected to go around 59th place. Keep your fingers crossed. In the end Bagley might had been the best player that really REALLY wanted to play for Sacramento. These guys are all prospects and in the end you can never be sure. It's definitely a better pick than Trae Young in my opinion.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2638 » by Shy Gorgeous-Al » Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:29 pm

BoogieTime wrote:
Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:
Eisenheart wrote:

I'm disappointed as well but let's wait. maybe Bagley becomes the best player and Doncic is the next Rubio/ Ball etc. Bagley has big weaknesses but there is nothing that can not improve


I understand. You always want to get behind the selection and it's human nature. I do it all the damn time man.

It's just that you just don't see players like Doncic come all that often at all. He is legit 6'9 PG looks like with a big frame, has such an all-around game that does what he does and is currently at his athletic floor. Imagine the things he is going to do with good nutrition, good training program and some PEDs? there is a reason skilled players usually excel in the NBA.

I think Bagley will be a good player. But he is more of that rich man's Julius Randle/John Collins/Amare(Amare needed a Nash to excel) type don't you think? He has the best second jump I have ever seen and will be very very tough to stop on the block and especially against switches, but you see his types around the NBA and in NBA history...Did you ever see a player like Doncic? When was the last time a player like Bagley was a superstar? The players that dominate the league right now are big wings/SFs that are elite playmakers...and one Steph curry. I just don't see his type in the superstar/perennial all-star nba landscape.

I think he has a chance to reach perennial All-Star for sure...just don't see how franchise/culture changing his game really is...is he going to elevate his teammates games? or is he going to get his? I think that's an important difference for rebuilding teams especially.


Why is being a 6’9 PG a good thing? Team already has a PG. Luka is also a bit of a tweener, in that I don’t know if he’s athletic enough to guard wings


Then play him as a 4 if it proves to be problematic.

A PF with his playmaking skills that can shoot 3's? He is longer than Kevin Love.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2639 » by bleeds_purple » Sat Jun 23, 2018 5:12 pm

Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:
I understand. You always want to get behind the selection and it's human nature. I do it all the damn time man.

It's just that you just don't see players like Doncic come all that often at all. He is legit 6'9 PG looks like with a big frame, has such an all-around game that does what he does and is currently at his athletic floor. Imagine the things he is going to do with good nutrition, good training program and some PEDs? there is a reason skilled players usually excel in the NBA.

I think Bagley will be a good player. But he is more of that rich man's Julius Randle/John Collins/Amare(Amare needed a Nash to excel) type don't you think? He has the best second jump I have ever seen and will be very very tough to stop on the block and especially against switches, but you see his types around the NBA and in NBA history...Did you ever see a player like Doncic? When was the last time a player like Bagley was a superstar? The players that dominate the league right now are big wings/SFs that are elite playmakers...and one Steph curry. I just don't see his type in the superstar/perennial all-star nba landscape.

I think he has a chance to reach perennial All-Star for sure...just don't see how franchise/culture changing his game really is...is he going to elevate his teammates games? or is he going to get his? I think that's an important difference for rebuilding teams especially.


Why is being a 6’9 PG a good thing? Team already has a PG. Luka is also a bit of a tweener, in that I don’t know if he’s athletic enough to guard wings


Then play him as a 4 if it proves to be problematic.

A PF with his playmaking skills that can shoot 3's? He is longer than Kevin Love.


If he really ends up being a PF then his stock only goes up in my eyes. Then suddenly in addition to being a playmaker on the ball he can become a screen setter off the ball. If you have a PG who is an off the dribble three point shooting threat then you suddenly force the defense to make the type of decisions a Curry/Green pick and roll presents.
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Re: Draft Watch 2018 

Post#2640 » by Shy Gorgeous-Al » Sat Jun 23, 2018 5:46 pm

bleeds_purple wrote:
Shy Gorgeous-Al wrote:
BoogieTime wrote:
Why is being a 6’9 PG a good thing? Team already has a PG. Luka is also a bit of a tweener, in that I don’t know if he’s athletic enough to guard wings


Then play him as a 4 if it proves to be problematic.

A PF with his playmaking skills that can shoot 3's? He is longer than Kevin Love.


If he really ends up being a PF then his stock only goes up in my eyes. Then suddenly in addition to being a playmaker on the ball he can become a screen setter off the ball. If you have a PG who is an off the dribble three point shooting threat then you suddenly force the defense to make the type of decisions a Curry/Green pick and roll presents.


That's why his ceiling is so ridiculous. Just how impactful are just straight stetch 4's are in the nba today...and Luka can do a whole lot of other things to boot. His ability to shoot off the dribble as a 4, rebound and run the break nd playmake in transition and in the half court is unprecedented.

The fact that he is so versatile is important. could play the 1 or the 4... if he plays the 1 he will be able to punish smaller PGs in the post in time, and as a 4 he will be an almost impossible cover.

I just can't see how Bagley is a better pick...it makes no sense to me. Definitely not without acquiring additional assets. Divac went with fit because of Fox instead of BPA.

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