Kings General Discussion 2018-2019

[LightTheBeam]

What do you guys think about repalcing WCS by Skal as a starting center? He has nearly the same size, his D just can't get any worse, while offensively he can shoot and spread the floor for Fox.

We have no reason to believe Skal replacing Willie wouldn't be a big downgrade.

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Our offense would take a HUGE hit. And I don't think our defense would get that much better. WCS has done enough to keep his job unless a clear upgrade is signed or traded for.

[becorz]

Ok guys here is my trade idea: WCS for Tristan Thompson.

TT is on a reasonable deal (2 yrs , $17m per yr). He provides rebounding and rim protection while being agile enough to run. 27 years old.

I posted this on the TT board a couple weeks ago. WCS + Skal for TT + Cedi. Asking for Cedi too might be a little much because of how well Thompson is playing but I'd be all for a deal like that. Thompson can play with the uptempo pace and would be night and day as a rebounder for us.

Cedi is probably too much. Im good with Nwaba.

WCS / Skal / Koufos /2nds for TT / Nwaba

Not only do the Kings get consistency at the Center spot but it forces Joerger's hand to move on from Koufos.

OK, codydaze has convinced me that Thompson could work on this team. But that contract is pretty dang big.

I just don't get the love for Nwaba on this board. He is a SG (he can't play SF, dude is small) who plays OK defense and is not a good 3 point shooter. How does he help us?

If we were to trade for Thompson, I think we would have to get Osman back too. I would be willing to give an asset or two in that scenario. Something like Thompson/Osman for WCS/Jackson/Randolph seems fair. But I just don't see the Cavs dumping a good young player just to get rid of salary. But if they believe in WCS, this would be the way to get him.

[PetrieUnderstudy]

Recent Tweet that John Wall considering season ending heel surgery. That said, Jason Anderson from Bee suggests Wizards could be more likely to trade Otto Porter Jr. Wizards could go into tank mode in hopes of landing Zion.

My proposal:

Kings trade- Willie Cauley-Stein, Kosta Koufos, Skal Labissiere, Ben McLemore, Zach Randolph & 2 2nd round picks
Kings receive- Otto Porter Jr & Nikola Vucevic

Wizards trade- Otto Porter Jr
Wizards receive- Willie Cauley-Stein, Ben McLemore & Zach Randolph

Magic trade- Nikola Vucevic
Magic receive- Kosta Koufos, Skal Labissiere & 2 2nd round picks

Rationale- Kings use cap space and expirings to consolidate talent. Fill small forward hole and replace "Big Money" Willie with a better scorer, rebounder, and defender in Vucevic. Wizards save $ dumping Porter getting under cap, tank for Zion, and take a flier on Willie. Magic have Bamba as their future center and Vucevic is a free agent.

This opens up roster spots for Kings to sign Troy Williams, I'd like to see them resign ex-Kings JaKarr Sampson and Jack Cooley. I like the idea of JaKarr situationally matching up with the Tobias Harris/Kyle Kuzma types. Remember the Cavs game last year? Talk about a likable team and energy with Williams, Sampson, and Cooley! Back fill Williams 2-way contract with Cameron Oliver.

Roster to finish out 2018-19
PG De'Aaron Fox/Yogi Ferrell/Frank Mason
SG Buddy Hield/Bogdan Bogdanovic/Justin Jackson
SF Otto Porter Jr/Iman Shumpert/Troy Williams
PF Marvin Bagley/Nemanja Bjelica/JaKarr Sampson
C Nikola Vucevic/Harry Giles/Jack Cooley

2-way Wenyen Gabriel and Cameron Oliver

Playoffs here we come!

[kalenclayton]

What do you guys think about repalcing WCS by Skal as a starting center? He has nearly the same size, his D just can't get any worse, while offensively he can shoot and spread the floor for Fox.

We have no reason to believe Skal replacing Willie wouldn't be a big downgrade.

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Our offense would take a HUGE hit. And I don't think our defense would get that much better. WCS has done enough to keep his job unless a clear upgrade is signed or traded for.

Not only would our offense take a hit, but our defense would sputter even more. The perception that Willie isn’t a good defender is wrong. There are certain aspects of his defense that are bad, but he isn’t a bad defender. For a big, he’s great at switching onto smaller players. He moves his feet well and that allows him to stay on the quicker guys. He actually has good post defense mechanics as well. He just struggles with holding bigger players away from the basket.

The biggest defensive issues with Willie are (in short terms) defensive IQ, reluctance, rebounding, and effort. The crazy thing is that if he fixes one of these things, the others should follow or fall hand in hand.

He is reluctant to make quick decisions because he is scared of making the wrong decision. That is fine and will get better with time, but he needs to really sit down and study tape on (1) when/how hard to show while sticking to his man in help defense, (2) overall help defense, and (3) BOXING OUT! If he can show more effort and energy, then Everton should get better. He will get better at making decisions on the fly because he will see himself making more mistakes. Making mistakes is the best way to identify issues and correct them.

Back to the point... Skal would be a huge downgrade to Willie. Skal is slow footed, has low IQ, and is as inconsistent as they get. On top of that, he’s a black hole who’s confidence gets shot quite quickly. He has a lot of issues and just isn’t ready yet. That being said, I can still see him becoming a role player. He just isn’t and won’t be on Willie’s level.

[kalenclayton]

Recent Tweet that John Wall considering season ending heel surgery. That said, Jason Anderson from Bee suggests Wizards could be more likely to trade Otto Porter Jr. Wizards could go into tank mode in hopes of landing Zion.

My proposal:

Kings trade- Willie Cauley-Stein, Kosta Koufos, Skal Labissiere, Ben McLemore, Zach Randolph & 2 2nd round picks
Kings receive- Otto Porter Jr & Nikola Vucevic

Wizards trade- Otto Porter Jr
Wizards receive- Willie Cauley-Stein, Ben McLemore & Zach Randolph

Magic trade- Nikola Vucevic
Magic receive- Kosta Koufos, Skal Labissiere & 2 2nd round picks

Rationale- Kings use cap space and expirings to consolidate talent. Fill small forward hole and replace "Big Money" Willie with a better scorer, rebounder, and defender in Vucevic. Wizards save $ dumping Porter getting under cap, tank for Zion, and take a flier on Willie. Magic have Bamba as their future center and Vucevic is a free agent.

This opens up roster spots for Kings to sign Troy Williams, I'd like to see them resign ex-Kings JaKarr Sampson and Jack Cooley. I like the idea of JaKarr situationally matching up with the Tobias Harris/Kyle Kuzma types. Remember the Cavs game last year? Talk about a likable team and energy with Williams, Sampson, and Cooley! Back fill Williams 2-way contract with Cameron Oliver.

Roster to finish out 2018-19
PG De'Aaron Fox/Yogi Ferrell/Frank Mason
SG Buddy Hield/Bogdan Bogdanovic/Justin Jackson
SF Otto Porter Jr/Iman Shumpert/Troy Williams
PF Marvin Bagley/Nemanja Bjelica/JaKarr Sampson
C Nikola Vucevic/Harry Giles/Jack Cooley

2-way Wenyen Gabriel and Cameron Oliver

Playoffs here we come!

If this trade goes up on the trade board, prepare for Magic fans to shoot it down immediately. As a Kings fan, I even see that it wouldn’t happen. Vuc is playing very well and is worth more than Skal and Koufos. We would need to send them Willie at the very least.

[PetrieUnderstudy]

I understand it isn't an enticing trade for the Magic. The Kings can just wait until after the season and offer him a big contract as a free agent. Vucevic won't be on the Magic next season. I think he'd be a great center for us and let WCS walk.

[kalenclayton]

I understand it isn't an enticing trade for the Magic. The Kings can just wait until after the season and offer him a big contract as a free agent. Vucevic won't be on the Magic next season. I think he'd be a great center for us and let WCS walk.

Certainly. We could totally wait for the offseason. Vuc totally seems like a Vlade target. I have two issues with Vuc though. One is that we don’t know if he can run with Fox and the squad. We need to be pairing athleticism with Fox, not slower players. The second thing is that I am not sure Vuc is a good defender, but I’m pretty certain he isn’t as good of a defender as Willie. For all the crap Willie gets, he’s actually a decent-to-good defender. He is very capable of being a great defender, but it seems his effort is spotty. Something that is consistent with him is his speed, quickness, and footwork. He has sound footwork on defense and moves his feet better than most, if not all of the league’s centers. One thing that he doesn’t have is Vuc’s strength and scoring prowess. It’s hard to pinpoint who would be the better fit, but I would reluctantly side with Willie unless Vuc came at a discount.


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[PetrieUnderstudy]

I understand it isn't an enticing trade for the Magic. The Kings can just wait until after the season and offer him a big contract as a free agent. Vucevic won't be on the Magic next season. I think he'd be a great center for us and let WCS walk.

Certainly. We could totally wait for the offseason. Vuc totally seems like a Vlade target. I have two issues with Vuc though. One is that we don’t know if he can run with Fox and the squad. We need to be pairing athleticism with Fox, not slower players. The second thing is that I am not sure Vuc is a good defender, but I’m pretty certain he isn’t as good of a defender as Willie. For all the crap Willie gets, he’s actually a decent-to-good defender. He is very capable of being a great defender, but it seems his effort is spotty. Something that is consistent with him is his speed, quickness, and footwork. He has sound footwork on defense and moves his feet better than most, if not all of the league’s centers. One thing that he doesn’t have is Vuc’s strength and scoring prowess. It’s hard to pinpoint who would be the better fit, but I would reluctantly side with Willie unless Vuc came at a discount.


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I watched the highlights of Vucevic's 30 pt/20 reb/8 ast game the other night and he can run decently. No where like Willie however I think Vucevic would be nice trailing the break with an occasional 3. He can shoot and rebound significantly better than Willie. The Kings would be able to run more with Vucevic's cleaning the defensive glass and he'd be another option for Fox to kick out to. I also like the ability to throw it to him in the post to get a bucket when needed. Watch some film on him. He's good. 20.5 ppg, 12.1 rpg and 3.7 apg while shooting 52.8/38.6/81.3 is no joke and he recently turned 28.

I also don't get why we didn't keep JaKarr Sampson. I loved his energy. He has the athleticism and size to make it difficult on Kuzma/Harris types. His defense on LeBron last year in Cleveland sticks out.

[dckingsfan]

Feeling like we need to go close to 28 & 18 to make the playoffs now - unless some team above us goes on a losing streak...

[nolimit0820]

6 game homestand!!!

[dckingsfan]

One more thing - for those that are thinking Porter could really help - I agree. Having Bogdan, Buddy and Iman playing substantial minutes at SF means our defense rebounding suffers. And Porter would arguably become the best defender on the team (but damn if Fox isn't a good defender).

If Porter doesn't happen - then for a free agent that could really help - I would target Tobais Harris. Also a good defender and good defensive rebounder. And can spread the floor like Porter.

My two cents.

[dckingsfan]

6 game homestand!!!

And the strength of schedule might help?
http://www.tankathon.com/remaining_schedule_strength

[Sactowndog]

I understand it isn't an enticing trade for the Magic. The Kings can just wait until after the season and offer him a big contract as a free agent. Vucevic won't be on the Magic next season. I think he'd be a great center for us and let WCS walk.

Certainly. We could totally wait for the offseason. Vuc totally seems like a Vlade target. I have two issues with Vuc though. One is that we don’t know if he can run with Fox and the squad. We need to be pairing athleticism with Fox, not slower players. The second thing is that I am not sure Vuc is a good defender, but I’m pretty certain he isn’t as good of a defender as Willie. For all the crap Willie gets, he’s actually a decent-to-good defender. He is very capable of being a great defender, but it seems his effort is spotty. Something that is consistent with him is his speed, quickness, and footwork. He has sound footwork on defense and moves his feet better than most, if not all of the league’s centers. One thing that he doesn’t have is Vuc’s strength and scoring prowess. It’s hard to pinpoint who would be the better fit, but I would reluctantly side with Willie unless Vuc came at a discount.


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I watched the highlights of Vucevic's 30 pt/20 reb/8 ast game the other night and he can run decently. No where like Willie however I think Vucevic would be nice trailing the break with an occasional 3. He can shoot and rebound significantly better than Willie. The Kings would be able to run more with Vucevic's cleaning the defensive glass and he'd be another option for Fox to kick out to. I also like the ability to throw it to him in the post to get a bucket when needed. Watch some film on him. He's good. 20.5 ppg, 12.1 rpg and 3.7 apg while shooting 52.8/38.6/81.3 is no joke and he recently turned 28.

I also don't get why we didn't keep JaKarr Sampson. I loved his energy. He has the athleticism and size to make it difficult on Kuzma/Harris types. His defense on LeBron last year in Cleveland sticks out.

We didn’t keep Jakar because we have enough low IQ players on the roster. We have our bigs of the future in Giles and Bagley. Bagley has to get healthy and Joeger needs to pull his head out and play Giles as the Clipper game and last night showed.

[Sactowndog]

One more thing - for those that are thinking Porter could really help - I agree. Having Bogdan, Buddy and Iman playing substantial minutes at SF means our defense rebounding suffers. And Porter would arguably become the best defender on the team (but damn if Fox isn't a good defender).

If Porter doesn't happen - then for a free agent that could really help - I would target Tobais Harris. Also a good defender and good defensive rebounder. And can spread the floor like Porter.

My two cents.

I agree but hard to find a trade for Porter that works.

[dckingsfan]

One more thing - for those that are thinking Porter could really help - I agree. Having Bogdan, Buddy and Iman playing substantial minutes at SF means our defense rebounding suffers. And Porter would arguably become the best defender on the team (but damn if Fox isn't a good defender).

If Porter doesn't happen - then for a free agent that could really help - I would target Tobais Harris. Also a good defender and good defensive rebounder. And can spread the floor like Porter.

My two cents.

I agree but hard to find a trade for Porter that works.

And to add to that - both sides become sellers as they move out of the playoff picture.

[dckingsfan]

We have our bigs of the future in Giles and Bagley. Bagley has to get healthy and Joeger needs to pull his head out and play Giles as the Clipper game and last night showed.

This - although to be honest - I don't think Giles was ready to play at the beginning of the season and it cost a few games.

But this should eliminate the need to max WCS, right? Next season the rotation can be Bagley/Bjelica/Giles.

[dckingsfan]

Two trades with the Wizards that I thought of would be:

Porter for Ferrell, Jackson and Randolph.

Or

Porter and Mahimni for Ferrell, Jackson and Randolph, Koufos and McLemore.

But I don't think you do either of those trades unless you think you aren't making the playoffs.

[Sactowndog]

Two trades with the Wizards that I thought of would be:

Porter for Ferrell, Jackson and Randolph.

Or

Porter and Mahimni for Ferrell, Jackson and Randolph, Koufos and McLemore.

But I don't think you do either of those trades unless you think you aren't making the playoffs.

If Washington would do the first why would we do the second?

[Sactowndog]

6 game homestand!!!

And the strength of schedule might help?
http://www.tankathon.com/remaining_schedule_strength

Wait until after our next two games. The strength of schedule gets much easier. But be prepared to lose two more.

[dckingsfan]

Two trades with the Wizards that I thought of would be:

Porter for Ferrell, Jackson and Randolph.

Or

Porter and Mahimni for Ferrell, Jackson and Randolph, Koufos and McLemore.

But I don't think you do either of those trades unless you think you aren't making the playoffs.

If Washington would do the first why would we do the second?

Yep, #1 would be better for Sac. #2 would probably get it done... just thinking, I don't really have a good read (like you) on how to move it forward.