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Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment

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Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment  

Post#1 » by RipPizzaGuy » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:50 am

Well boys, seasons all but over for us. At first I was a little mad, but none of us expected to be playing meaningful games into March to begin with. Lots of positives and this team is definitely ahead of schedule. Plus barring a meltdown we should finish ahead of the lebron led Lakers!

My biggest positive of the year- Harry Giles. I'll be honest I love the kid, but I truly had my expectations VERY low. I figured if he could ever even be a 10-20mpg role player itd be a win, but hes shown so much dog that its easy to see why he was so highly regarded pre-injury. I think this summer helps him more than any player on our entire team.

I'd say fox or buddy, but I've been a big believer in both of them from day 1 so it wasnt a surprise for me.

My biggest disappointment has to be Bogdan. Something happened this season, seems like it happened post game winner against the Lakers. He went through a huge slump and has really regressed this year IMO. He over dribbles, hes a ball hog at times, and his shot also took a big step back. I have a feeling he thinks hes too big for the team which pains me. Either way hes not a long term starter to me. Bagley needs a spot next year, barnes as well, and I think Bogdan is best served as that backup lead ball handler role.

Either way I'm excited as hell to see what the future holds for our guys. I've got a feeling Fox, Bagley and Buddy can lead the way for us to be the next young thunder.

Fox = our Westbrook
Buddy = our harden
Bagley = our Durant
Giles = our Ibaka

We definitely need to learn to hold leads, and get over the hump of finishing off the good teams. With just that, an offseason of our young guys meshing together and improving, we can increase our wins to close to 50 imo!

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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#2 » by Sacramento_King » Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:02 pm

Biggest positive to me was the growth of Fox and Buddy. Both at times looked like all star type players so seeing them meet expectations was really fun. Also, Bagley being way better than expected. I thought Luka was better pick but his defense has been better than originally thought and his energy has been perfect. Just a little more passing and he’ll be great.
Three nice young core pieces.

Not really a disappointment, because we all kind of thought it, but Willies play is unacceptable. He can’t be an all star one night and G League the next. Still fails to do the little things like box out. With Giles play and his expected contract demands, I expect a stop gap center like a Robin Lopez to sign and start year initially before Giles takes over. His entire King’s existence has been disappointing.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#3 » by dckingsfan » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:04 pm

Front court
Pluses
Bagley and Giles are the real deal. I think they are both PFs but both can stretch the floor and that is only going to get better. Both are already decent defensive rebounders and that is going to get much better. I was surprised at how good a passer Giles is - if he takes a couple of steps outside the arc and makes those passes and hits 3 pointer, Katy bar the door. And Bagley is a much better rim protector than what I expected.

Bjelica also turned out to be a nice stretch 4.

Neutral
Koufos was Koufos - he was what he is.

Negatives
WCS really didn't make the step I hoped he would take as a rim protector and defensive rebounder. He also clogged the middle on offense. He would be best suited as a backup C - but I doubt that this is where his mind is at...

Outcome
I think we really need to be in the market for someone that is a stretch C that can rebound. I like Nikola Vucevic as our target.

Point Guards
Pluses
Fox is the real deal - if he advances next year again he has all-star written all over him. Someone pointed it out earlier but I just think he needs to hit the mid-range and 3 better and he is there. Ferrell has been terrific as a backup PG.

Neutral
Frank Mason just didn't have a big enough sample size to really know.

Negatives
Bogdan didn't really have a good season (I look at him as the other primary ball handler and why he is in this group).

Outcome
I think we are set here. No need to change.

Shooting Guards
Pluses
Buddy Hield really took a huge jump across the board. TSS, DRB, TOV just very solid. One more jump next year? Corey Brewer has been a fine replacement off the bench (although to be honest he played a lot of SF). It would be terrific to have him back.

Neutral
Bogdan should have been playing more SG to see what he could do... I guess.

Negatives
Ben McLemore - not much to say here.

Outcome
Return Brewer as the backup or move Bogdan to backup Buddy.

Small Forward
Neutral
It should have been Harrison Barnes but he played a lot of PF as well. This has been uniformily the most problematic position on the court for the Kings this year. Barnes is around next year - just don't see him turning down that option.

Negative
Bogdan got crushed defensively at this position.

Outcome
We are probably stuck here. Hopefully Barnes gets moved back to this position exclusively and we play Giles and Bagley all the minutes at PF.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#4 » by dckingsfan » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:08 pm

RipPizzaGuy wrote:My biggest disappointment has to be Bogdan. Something happened this season, seems like it happened post game winner against the Lakers. He went through a huge slump and has really regressed this year IMO. He over dribbles, hes a ball hog at times, and his shot also took a big step back. I have a feeling he thinks hes too big for the team which pains me. Either way hes not a long term starter to me. Bagley needs a spot next year, barnes as well, and I think Bogdan is best served as that backup lead ball handler role.

I hear you... If it is Fox, Hield, Barnes, Bagley, C next year, it means Bogdan has to come off the bench. That either needs to be as a PG or SG as he gets destroyed defensively against SFs.

In hindsight, I wish we had agreed to move him with a package for Otto Porter or Vucevic.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#5 » by RipPizzaGuy » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:46 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:My biggest disappointment has to be Bogdan. Something happened this season, seems like it happened post game winner against the Lakers. He went through a huge slump and has really regressed this year IMO. He over dribbles, hes a ball hog at times, and his shot also took a big step back. I have a feeling he thinks hes too big for the team which pains me. Either way hes not a long term starter to me. Bagley needs a spot next year, barnes as well, and I think Bogdan is best served as that backup lead ball handler role.

I hear you... If it is Fox, Hield, Barnes, Bagley, C next year, it means Bogdan has to come off the bench. That either needs to be as a PG or SG as he gets destroyed defensively against SFs.

In hindsight, I wish we had agreed to move him with a package for Otto Porter or Vucevic.


Id be okay with us looking at Vucevic. He can do almost all of what we need.

Another alternative to that, if Gasol and Kawhi walk from Toronto, Id take Serge Ibaka in with cap space and even give a few 2nd round picks. Hes 23 million for next year, but hes literally the absolute perfect fit for this team to take that next step.

Ibaka/Giles
Bagley/Bjelica
Barnes/Brewer
Buddy/Bogdan
Fox/Yogi

Id kill to watch this team for an entire year. Serges 3pt shooting has taken a dive this year, but it looks to be an outlier.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#6 » by dckingsfan » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:50 pm

RipPizzaGuy wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:My biggest disappointment has to be Bogdan. Something happened this season, seems like it happened post game winner against the Lakers. He went through a huge slump and has really regressed this year IMO. He over dribbles, hes a ball hog at times, and his shot also took a big step back. I have a feeling he thinks hes too big for the team which pains me. Either way hes not a long term starter to me. Bagley needs a spot next year, barnes as well, and I think Bogdan is best served as that backup lead ball handler role.

I hear you... If it is Fox, Hield, Barnes, Bagley, C next year, it means Bogdan has to come off the bench. That either needs to be as a PG or SG as he gets destroyed defensively against SFs.

In hindsight, I wish we had agreed to move him with a package for Otto Porter or Vucevic.


Id be okay with us looking at Vucevic. He can do almost all of what we need.

Another alternative to that, if Gasol and Kawhi walk from Toronto, Id take Serge Ibaka in with cap space and even give a few 2nd round picks. Hes 23 million for next year, but hes literally the absolute perfect fit for this team to take that next step.

Ibaka/Giles
Bagley/Bjelica
Barnes/Brewer
Buddy/Bogdan
Fox/Yogi

Id kill to watch this team for an entire year. Serges 3pt shooting has taken a dive this year, but it looks to be an outlier.

I like your idea of Ibaka. You are right, he would be terrific.

Giles can't play C. It would have to be more like

Ibaka/Bagley/Bjelica
Bagley/Giles/Bjelica

But that is a nit.

Also, I think both Brewer and Bogdan are overmatched at SF defensively. That is a nit as well.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#7 » by RipPizzaGuy » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:10 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
RipPizzaGuy wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:I hear you... If it is Fox, Hield, Barnes, Bagley, C next year, it means Bogdan has to come off the bench. That either needs to be as a PG or SG as he gets destroyed defensively against SFs.

In hindsight, I wish we had agreed to move him with a package for Otto Porter or Vucevic.


Id be okay with us looking at Vucevic. He can do almost all of what we need.

Another alternative to that, if Gasol and Kawhi walk from Toronto, Id take Serge Ibaka in with cap space and even give a few 2nd round picks. Hes 23 million for next year, but hes literally the absolute perfect fit for this team to take that next step.

Ibaka/Giles
Bagley/Bjelica
Barnes/Brewer
Buddy/Bogdan
Fox/Yogi

Id kill to watch this team for an entire year. Serges 3pt shooting has taken a dive this year, but it looks to be an outlier.

I like your idea of Ibaka. You are right, he would be terrific.

Giles can't play C. It would have to be more like

Ibaka/Bagley/Bjelica
Bagley/Giles/Bjelica

But that is a nit.

Also, I think both Brewer and Bogdan are overmatched at SF defensively. That is a nit as well.


I think Giles can play the backup center role against most players. Harrell is the big exception.

Same thing for Brewer, he does a decent enough job off the bench. Just need to play Barnes at SF where he was designed to play and not play SUPER SMALL when we have no paint defender or plus rebounding center.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#8 » by KF10 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:21 am

Playoffs are unlikely at this point.

I like to see them finish the season strong, nonetheless. If they manage to reach 40 wins at the end of the 82 games, it's still a fantastic achievement for this group.

Grab a real solid piece or two in the offseason (or get lucky and lure in a star), and groom the foundation, this team would be a strong contender for the playoffs next season.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#9 » by dckingsfan » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:19 pm

KF10 wrote:Playoffs are unlikely at this point.

Monte Python skit if the Parrot is dead? :D

KF10 wrote:I like to see them finish the season strong, nonetheless. If they manage to reach 40 wins at the end of the 82 games, it's still a fantastic achievement for this group.

Cosign this - .500 or near is a huge jump. Let the young guys finish strong and with confidence for next season. And Joerger needs to figure out his rotations. So, there is still work to be done.

KF10 wrote:Grab a real solid piece or two in the offseason (or get lucky and lure in a star), and groom the foundation, this team would be a strong contender for the playoffs next season.

Cosign this too, I would think even a solid rebounder/stretch C would do it... I think we are sitting on a couple of stars in Fox and Bagley - and they almost certainly (barring injury) will improve next season.

The future looks bright.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#10 » by Javidad » Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:20 am

Biggest take away is I cannot wait to see this team without WCS. Grade of C- as center, F for Effort
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment  

Post#11 » by simonbampfield » Sat Mar 16, 2019 2:59 am

Biggest positive was coach Joerger switching up the game plan and letting the young guys fly up the court.
Biggest disappointment was Bagley not starting from day 1. It may have cost us some wins early in the season, however I think playing the long game, this season and beyond should have been the move. Who knows though, it might have actually cost us games earlier.



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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#12 » by Sacramento_King » Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:41 am

simonbampfield wrote:Biggest positive was coach Joerger switching up the game plan and letting the young guys fly up the court.

Hated his rotations. Outside of a handful of games, he seemed stuck to subbing guys at certain times. Didnt stick with hot hand and seemed to be deliberately obtuse with his rotations. I mean we went from no Yogi and to much Mason to no Mason and only Yogi in a single game it seemed. Numerous games where Buddy is on fire and then he takes spot on bench. Sticking with guys like WCS and Bogi lately when play is just lethargic or bad and not seeing if someone else can step up; cough, cough; Bagley, Giles, Yogi.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#13 » by Lost in LA » Sat Mar 16, 2019 2:30 pm

WCS has to go for me, need a stop at 5 until Bagley/Giles mature. Use of Hield has been puzzling, Get Fox and Giles in the Gym...
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#14 » by oligo » Sat Mar 16, 2019 3:43 pm

Hello Kings Fans!
I was watching Kings games with one eye only, as I'm quite neutral NBA fan and I watch a lot of teams. So maybe I overlooked something:

POSITIVES:
- Giles III: I mean that guy is just like a dog caught in a human body. That's a type of player every team needs to compete in the NBA. He brings you some energy, some dunks, some aley-oops. Just perfect.
- Fox: I love Patrick Beverly type of guys, and Fox is just a good copy of him. He was balling from the first game, went through some disappointing games, but overall grade is more than just positive. Some games he was average/underaverage player, so coach should pull him out. But instead, he got heavy-minute games and that helped him to fill his stat sheet even when he was not in a top form.
- Bjelica:The guy is worth every single penny you invested to get him. He's on a low contract and I personally didn't expect much from him, as he performed very poorly at Wolves. That's your future backup for Bagley.
HM: Coach Joeger

NEUTRALS:
- Bagley: He had about 10 great games, but the rest was somewhere average. Expectations from rookies of 2018 NBA Draft class were extremely high this season, and even though Bagley showed a lot, he was left in a kind of shadow this season (for being a #2 pick ofc.). I saw a lot positives on him, but the thing that really makes me worried is his injury record (not his fault). So young, in his first season and already so injured.
- Buddy Hield: Sometimes he was hot, sometimes he was cold, and sometimes he went ghost. There was no indication before the game what kind of performance will he have. I wouldn't say he went on a slump this season, but consistency looks to be his main obstacle.
- Harrison Barnes: From a $25M/yr. guy you expect a lot! He gave something, but not everything organization expected from him. I know, it's still a small sample size, so I would not overreact on him. I would just give him a neutral label right now with a positive forecast when he plays a whole season in Kings uniform.
HM: GM Vlade Divac

NEGATIVES:
- Bogdanovic: I'm disappointed with his performance A LOT. When the court is open and run-and-gun type of game is played, he looks great. But as soon as he's confronted by a set defense, he is clueless, looks like a ball hog, puts his team into a difficult position and then tries to solve that with some crazy something-out-of-nothing shots. Sometimes he also goes into wild dribbles with no outcome. I don't know, maybe a bit different time distribution inside his 15 minutes might help, but that's already a question for a coach.
- WCS: Do I need to explain anything?
- On third place, I wanted to put Kosta Koufos, but I'm really not going to do that. Kosta is Kosta, you already know well what you should and what you shouldn't expect from him. He was playing inside his capabilities.

I know you guys don't like to hear that, but Bogi is actually the only replaceable guy with some trade value in Kings uniform right now. I would try to trade him because he is still young enough and could perform well on some other team. IMO he needs a fresh start, and Kings might get something valuable back for him.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment  

Post#15 » by City of Trees » Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:07 am

There is no denying Bogdanovic has looked out of place for most of the season.

None of us know why but he did miss most if not all of the off-season with a knee injury, right? Came back mid december and never really got going.

If I'm Vlade I wait on entertaining moving Bogi until the trade deadline next season.

The question which is the real Bogi... Rookie Bogi or Sophmore Bogi? Must be answered.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#16 » by RipPizzaGuy » Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:43 am

City of Trees wrote:There is no denying Bogdanovic has looked out of place for most of the season.

None of us know why but he did miss most if not all of the off-season with a knee injury, right? Came back mid december and never really got going.

If I'm Vlade I wait on entertaining moving Bogi until the trade deadline next season.

The question which is the real Bogi... Rookie Bogi or Sophmore Bogi? Must be answered.


I agree we shouldnt rush to move him, but I think If the right deal comes along we need to think about it. Can we extend him this summer? If we could get him to commit to being our manu on a reasonable extension I'm good with that.

My fear is that after next season if hes still on the bench hes going to go somewhere else that he can get more opportunity. Cant help but think hed look great in San Antonio.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#17 » by simonbampfield » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:10 pm

City of Trees wrote:There is no denying Bogdanovic has looked out of place for most of the season.

None of us know why but he did miss most if not all of the off-season with a knee injury, right? Came back mid december and never really got going.

If I'm Vlade I wait on entertaining moving Bogi until the trade deadline next season.

The question which is the real Bogi... Rookie Bogi or Sophmore Bogi? Must be answered.

I agree with this.
I don't think he is happy with his role though so that is a situation Vlade will have to keep tabs on.
On our squad he is best suited in that Manu role off the bench. He is our most clutch player, yes over Buddy and Fox, and will come back strong next season I have no doubt about that.
The way I see it we have a lot of positions set.
Fox
Buddy/Bogi
Barnes
Bagley
Giles
I don't buy into this Giles not ready narrative. By next season he will be ready. The Kings just need to stay the course and keep the running game plan. If teams think they can bully Marvin and Harry down low then try and keep up with them. There isn't a team in the league that will keep up with them in transition. People are going to be really surprised what this off season will do for Fox/Bagley/Giles.
I do think we will need to sign a big on a 2 year deal to back up the 5 to play decent minutes potentially. Still I would like to see Bagley/Giles/Bjelica/Barnes as the main core at 4/5.
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#18 » by dckingsfan » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:55 pm

City of Trees wrote:The question which is the real Bogi... Rookie Bogi or Sophmore Bogi? Must be answered.

To me they look very similar. I think Bogs needs to skip Euro bball in the summer and work on the basics. He needs to make a pretty sizeable jump next season. And we have to NOT have him play SF.

Code: Select all

Season   Age   TS%   AST%   TOV%   USG%   STL%   DRB%   BLK%   WS/48   VORP
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18-'19   26   0.523   19.5   11.5   22.5   1.8   11.8   0.7    0.063   0.5
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#19 » by dckingsfan » Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:06 pm

simonbampfield wrote:The way I see it we have a lot of positions set.
Fox
Buddy/Bogi
Barnes
Bagley
Giles
I don't buy into this Giles not ready narrative. By next season he will be ready. The Kings just need to stay the course and keep the running game plan. If teams think they can bully Marvin and Harry down low then try and keep up with them. There isn't a team in the league that will keep up with them in transition. People are going to be really surprised what this off season will do for Fox/Bagley/Giles.I do think we will need to sign a big on a 2 year deal to back up the 5 to play decent minutes potentially. Still I would like to see Bagley/Giles/Bjelica/Barnes as the main core at 4/5.

With you on most of it...
Fox/Ferrell/Mason
Buddy/Bogi
Barnes/??
Bagley/Giles/Bjelica/Swanigan
??

Ferrell and Mason's contracts are too good to pass up.

I agree with you that Bogi needs be the backup SG. I think he needs run a PG too?

I didn't like the Bogi experiment at SF... I didn't think it worked very well - hopefully Vlade will work his magic.

I don't agree with you that Giles should play C. He is more of a PF that Bagley. Bagley is bigger and stronger and that will become more evident as time passes. Giles is a fine weakside rim protector but not at C and you can add to that that he isn't a good enough defensive rebounder to hold that position down (generally). I actually think Giles could play some minutes at SF he worked on his 3.

My two cents - let me know where I have it wrong :D
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Re: Biggest positive takeaway/biggest disappointment 

Post#20 » by KF10 » Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:30 pm

I really think Bogi is suffering fatigue due to all-year basketball activity. I believe that a good summer break would do wonders for the guy. I wouldn't be too keen to dump the guy so soon. Sure, listen to trade offers but he should be considered to be within our main core.

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