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Orlando (22-13) at Sacramento (12-20)

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Post#101 » by SacKingZZZ » Wed Jan 9, 2008 5:43 am

Cruel_Ruin wrote:I hate this team. We REALLY suck


I love the young guys and the way they play in everything except the 4th. We are turning the ball over a lot but I am actually seeing REAL offense out there. So much more crisp when we play motion offense. Plus all of our players fit so well in it. Think about the team we are putting on the floor right now! Then remember that we are playing at least as well if not better than we do with Bibby and Artest in there.

For 3 solid quarters I am watching a TEAM play. It's been awhile since I could say that.
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Post#102 » by RoyalCourtJestr » Wed Jan 9, 2008 5:44 am

This is one of the games I can't wait to get home to watch. >.< Unfortunetly I won't be able to see it for a month >.<
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Post#103 » by SacTown Kings » Wed Jan 9, 2008 5:48 am

KingInExile wrote:Yes...a win!!! Ugly win, but a win nonetheless. We realllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyy need to do something about the meltdowns we have in the last 5 minutes of every game. It gets so annoying.


It's like we need a 17 point lead going into the 4th or we're screwed.
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Post#104 » by Smills91 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 5:54 am

Cruel_Ruin wrote:I hate this team. We REALLY suck
We do? Our bench just kicked the crap out of one of the better Eastern Conference teams. I actually think this team is pretty good if we could get and STAY healthy for a prolonged period of time.
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Post#105 » by Cruel_Ruin » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:00 am

Smills91 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

We do? Our bench just kicked the crap out of one of the better Eastern Conference teams. I actually think this team is pretty good if we could get and STAY healthy for a prolonged period of time.


OK, maybe I overreacted :lol:

But still, we didn't kick the crap out of anyone. Our faces turned blue and we scraped one out because the Magic didn't want it enough. Besides, this bench plays better defense than our starters, and you'll see it when Bibby and Martin come back.
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Post#106 » by Ballings7 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:01 am

I saw a team playing before Artest went out, too. Remember, aside from what was/is going on offensively, there's another side of the court and Ron contributes real well there, also. We're 4-10 without Ron this season.

Now, last season? Well, that was different, and involved some other factors. Bibby being a main part of it, for the most part. Musselman, as well with a few things.

Anyway, satisfied to get this game, and a decent win at that, considering everything. The game as a whole, definitely impressed. I thought we'd come up short by like 5-7 points.

Thought Orlando would make a run in the 4th, but not quite that much, some too many, TOs, also. I agree with Reggie that some of is fatigue to an extent, as well as unfamiliarity.

Was a bit worried late there, but they managed to hold on and make enough plays. I couldn't quite see this one being choked away like with Denver.

Got nice games from several guys - especially good to see Douby step up again.

Garcia's play to the push that ball down the court was excellent, just smart. Almost immediately reminded me of Eric Snow doing it to win G5 against Detroit in 2006.
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Post#107 » by SacKingZZZ » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:01 am

Smills91 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

We do? Our bench just kicked the crap out of one of the better Eastern Conference teams. I actually think this team is pretty good if we could get and STAY healthy for a prolonged period of time.


I really think people take for granted how promising this young team looks out there. We are missing what are considered to be our 3 best players and are in just about every game! No other team in the league has the kind of talent we do deep on the bench. We got super lucky with Beno and Salmons. Well I don't know about Salmons but Beno was luck combined with a dumbass franchise somewhere in the middle of the States where the weather is very cold.

Problem though! I personally don't expect us to be adding all that much in terms of potential, as a team, when Artest/Bibby return. This team plays entirely different with them in there, especially Artest, and IMO I don't think that team has the longterm potential the one we are seeing right now has. If we add a legit big man in the draft or via trade I think some good times are heading our way sooner than later.
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Post#108 » by Ballings7 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:12 am

With just Ron, though, I think things would be fine. I think were a better team overall with him, and he adds another dimension on both ends of the court. Which has proven to fit. So much versatility that is unique.

With Bibby in there, too, there's some serious questionability on how Mike would mesh, and if he'd adjust his game. To be more balanced offensively as more of a PG than he's been, and expend more energy defensively, consistently. Mike didn't do that last season, and his thumb injury isn't too much of an excuse. I really don't know if he would do what's needed enough.
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Post#109 » by The Letter J » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:20 am

Cruel_Ruin wrote:I hate this team. We REALLY suck

:lol:

Thought I was on the Orlando board there for a second. Good game fellas.
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Post#110 » by Ballings7 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:27 am

Cruel_Ruin wrote:I hate this team. We REALLY suck


Yeah... you overreacted :P. I don't think this team has sucked much for what's been going on this season. Especially recently.
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Post#111 » by SadKingsFan » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:51 am

The Letter J wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


:lol:

Thought I was on the Orlando board there for a second. Good game fellas.
I dont know what cruel ruin is talking about but we dont suck, we continue to play well even without bibby, martin, artest and Reef.

Stan is good for you guys but THANK GOD he went to Orlando because I LOVE REGGIE!!

just got back from the game and had a great time.
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Post#112 » by SacKingZZZ » Wed Jan 9, 2008 6:57 am

Ballings7 wrote:With just Ron, though, I think things would be fine. I think were a better team overall with him, and he adds another dimension on both ends of the court. Which has proven to fit. So much versatility that is unique.

With Bibby in there, too, there's some serious questionability on how Mike would mesh, and if he'd adjust his game. To be more balanced offensively as more of a PG than he's been, and expend more energy defensively, consistently. Mike didn't do that last season, and his thumb injury isn't too much of an excuse. I really don't know if he would do what's needed enough.


But him being on the court nullifies the impact of two players in John and Cisco. We are playing a motion offense, something we don't play as well when Ron is here because the ball is in his hands instead of Brad's. Ron doesn't play off Brad or our other bigs at all really, everybody plays off of him. Mike could actually really fit the way we are playing but then we don't have Beno slashing into the lane as much.

I will give it a shot and would think Ron at the PF playing the way we play, with Ron at the high post could work, but then we don't have the length and size we do now. That and Spencer/Justin most likely get bounced from the rotation. 3 main guys are coming back, that means 3 guys that play now get cut completely, and 3 others get majorly reduced roles.
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Post#113 » by Ballings7 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 8:18 am

Indeed.

But Ron gets passes from the high post and finishes at the basket, and Ron's a consistent play-maker in more than just posting up. One of the top passers on the team. This is just what I've seen with regularity all season in effectiveness. As well as in the past for the latter aspect (and gets underrated and overlooked in general).

The team has been playing off multiple players, which includes Ron both ways. Ron not playing off the bigs much, and everybody playing off of Ron, isn't what I recall this season at all. Also, if that were the case, it would of been clear via Theus and the announcers. With adjustments by Theus, and questions/points from the announcers going against what would be going on. I don't remember any of that. The training camp and pre-season doesn't reflect it, either.

I just don't see where you're coming from on that. I can't remember that as the consensus or something of significance, on the season with Ron.

Theus will have to manage things as best he can with who's going to play. Until there are changes made.

Not really taking Bibby into account. I think he makes things a different and questionable situation, probably, because of his game up to this point. Significant adjustment needs to be made with him.
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Post#114 » by pillwenney » Wed Jan 9, 2008 8:26 am

The problem that I have noticed is that we don't have a go-to iso player at the end of games right now. Brad could do that tonight because Rashard's D on him was just awful, but when Ron willingly passes, we can run our offense through him, and when the offense is cut off, unlike Brad, Ron can actually do something with it consistently.

Also, I agree that it's not like Ron is just a polar opposite kind of bad fit for the motion offense. We just don't run plays often for him in that offense because he is so effective in isolation. We have largely had the same attitude with Salmons this year and really have only had him moving without the ball with any consistency recently. It's not like there are plays where we need Ron to cut back door and he just says "meh, no".
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Post#115 » by Ballings7 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 8:38 am

Yeah, mitch.
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Post#116 » by sackings916 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 9:17 am

I think Ron's best role on the team is when he's a playmaker. He's had a few high assist games this year which he hasn't had in the past. Theus has also talked about using him as a decoy and setting up others.

If Theus can convince Ron to be that I think we are a much better team. He should still be aggressive offensively though, just cut down on the off the dribble jumpers, go to the post more,and create plays for both yourself and others.

To elaborate I dont think Ron is at his best when he's the #1 scoring option. I like him as a 2nd or even 3rd option. Artest is probably the only player on our team that creates a 1 on 1 mismatch every night though. I see Artest at his best as an all around player - scoring,passing,rebounding,focusing on defense and playing with high energy. He shouldn't put all his energy in scoring where the other parts of his game takes a backseat.
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Post#117 » by Ballings7 » Wed Jan 9, 2008 9:23 am

I tend to agree ^. Solid post.
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Post#118 » by SacKingZZZ » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:16 am

Ballings7 wrote:Indeed.

But Ron gets passes from the high post and finishes at the basket, and Ron's a consistent play-maker in more than just posting up. One of the top passers on the team. This is just what I've seen with regularity all season in effectiveness. As well as in the past for the latter aspect (and gets underrated and overlooked in general).

The team has been playing off multiple players, which includes Ron both ways. Ron not playing off the bigs much, and everybody playing off of Ron, isn't what I recall this season at all. Also, if that were the case, it would of been clear via Theus and the announcers. With adjustments by Theus, and questions/points from the announcers going against what would be going on. I don't remember any of that. The training camp and pre-season doesn't reflect it, either.

I just don't see where you're coming from on that. I can't remember that as the consensus or something of significance, on the season with Ron.

Theus will have to manage things as best he can with who's going to play. Until there are changes made.

Not really taking Bibby into account. I think he makes things a different and questionable situation, probably, because of his game up to this point. Significant adjustment needs to be made with him.


Where am I coming from? How about this...when Ron is on the floor he is #1. Theus will tell you as much. Ron is a great passer no doubt, but when you already have so many offensive players playing well, adding another guy that is going to look for his shot just as much as he's looking to pass is going to be a problem. Let alone adding 3 of those types at basically the same time.
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Post#119 » by SacKingZZZ » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:19 am

mitchweber wrote:The problem that I have noticed is that we don't have a go-to iso player at the end of games right now. Brad could do that tonight because Rashard's D on him was just awful, but when Ron willingly passes, we can run our offense through him, and when the offense is cut off, unlike Brad, Ron can actually do something with it consistently.

Also, I agree that it's not like Ron is just a polar opposite kind of bad fit for the motion offense. We just don't run plays often for him in that offense because he is so effective in isolation. We have largely had the same attitude with Salmons this year and really have only had him moving without the ball with any consistency recently. It's not like there are plays where we need Ron to cut back door and he just says "meh, no".



Coincidentally when Ron went down. Hmmm...

Anyway I am seeing a much more balanced offense out there than I have seen all year. I see more people involved offensively than I did with Ron out there. We'll see what happens when he returns, but my guess is Brad's play, John's play, and Cisco's play goes down dramatically and not just because of the lack of playing time either. Hopefully I am wrong but I think it's very possible.
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Post#120 » by ICMTM » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:50 am

I don't think Ron held anyone down. Guys like Cisco, Douby had their own confidence issues. Ron doesn't play as uptempo as Cisco, Beno, or Salmons so when Ron's on the floor you don't see the ball move as much. HOWEVER Ron can draw a double and the defense reacts to him much differently than anyone else we have.

I think Ron has done a great job this year trying to integrate his style with other players on this team and as their play gets better I really don't see Artest coming back disruptive. IMO add all three injured guys and that's where the hiccups will come in.
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