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Now, back to where we were in the summer...

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Now, back to where we were in the summer... 

Post#1 » by OGSactownballer » Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:51 pm

Now that the top West teams are all making themselves nearly un-matchable for any lower tier playoff team, is it time to just throw in the towel for the next two seasons, clear cap, get picks and experience for the young players on the roster? I don't see being able to truly compete with the top 4-6 teams in the West now for at least 2-4 years when the current group of top players on their rosters begin to age and fall off.

Any thoughts?
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Post#2 » by Cruel_Ruin » Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:59 pm

Basically, I look at the Kings' future like this:

PG: ????/Beno
SG: Martin/Douby
SF: ????/Garcia
PF: ????/3Will
C: Hawes/????

We still have some holes to fill, but if we can fill them adequately, then I can see this team ready to compete in less than 2 years.
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Post#3 » by PaKwAn » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:04 pm

Same here, i am a bit worried because the west just keeps getting better and younger..This is one of the dilemma's the kings are in which if they choose to stay intact and try to compete or get younger through excellent trading and draft picking.

The problem with staying intact is about our salary cap,we may compete with some teams but it also hinders us from acquiring a good free agent. But then agen its up to Petrie on what route he would be taking.
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Post#4 » by sackings916 » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:10 pm

With the recent trades in the West I think the Kings should forget any plans of winning now and focus on attaining assets to rebuild. Trade our vets including Miller if you can get good value, acquire prospects and picks, and try to get in a position where we could add a big FA in the near future to go with Martin and Hawes.
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Post#5 » by Ballings7 » Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:23 pm

I expect the rebuilding to increase.
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Post#6 » by ICMTM » Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:03 pm

I don't know...Boston held onto Pierce for forever and look what happened. Building around young unproven talent is a gamble clubs like the Clippers have been making for years. The Kings were one of those clubs. I'm not saying we SHOULD NOT rebuild. I'm just saying being patient seems like the best way to go. The option of dumping salary seems to be always there.
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Post#7 » by a-rod » Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:11 pm

To rebuild In The NBA you have to sacrifice, for example hornets and raptors they Traded Carter and Davis for basically nothing, but look at them now.
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Post#8 » by Smills91 » Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:26 pm

a-rod wrote:To rebuild In The NBA you have to sacrifice, for example hornets and raptors they Traded Carter and Davis for basically nothing, but look at them now.
Sure and it took the Warriors 13 years through that method, the Clippers STILL always suck even when they're 'good', the Hawks still haven't jumped out with their complete 'rebuild' at this point(it's been almost a decade since they were last in the playoffs). You can look at a franchise here and there and say it worked but that's it, it worked for them THIS ONE TIME. It's not the rule. It's a GAMBLE. Hanging onto veterans that can win is MUCH LESS of a gamble and that's why GOOD teams like the Spurs, Suns, Mavs look to acquire VETERANS.
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Post#9 » by chriswebb86 » Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:37 pm

While, you can build a team with young players I think you have to have a combo of both young and older players. To me it seems like a lot of the individuals who want to rebuild, want to move all our older players and push for getting younger players and draft picks. To me this makes no sense. Very Very few teams have had success with this. A great example is the Bulls. So while I would have no problem moving some of our players in favor of youth/draft picks, I think we all need to be clam and allow Geoff to do his job. Hopefully at some point we can rip another team off like we have in the past.
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Post#10 » by Ballings7 » Wed Feb 6, 2008 11:13 pm

There's going to be at least 3-4 longer-term-year (years in the league) veterans on the team for stability. The majority of the roster, main players isn't going to be all youngsters. That's not putting a team together right, and will not help with development of the team and young players.

Also have to remember Kevin's going to be entering out of that young player stage, and is going to be in his 5th (4th full) season next season. Salmons is 28/will be 29 and will be in his 6th year. Beno, assuming he stays, will be 26 in his 5th year.

Cisco doesn't count, because while Garcia's going to be 27, he will just be in his 4th year. But, with his first consistent, season-long oppurtunity next season he's ever had, because Ron will probably be gone.

Two of Brad/Moore/SAR/KT will be around, also. Maybe Mike, but I sway to him being dealt by next season. My prediction last year was last summer, and at deadline by the latest. But, things are still going to be there, even moreso in the next summer for him to be dealt, if not by the deadine.

chriswebb86 wrote:Very Very few teams have had success with this. A great example is the Bulls.


But, they still had veteran players, too (04-05, 05-06, 06-07). Antonio Davis, Adrian Griffin, Othella Harrington, PJ Brown, Ben Wallace. All proven, tough, effective veteran guys for what each of them were/are. All were in the rotation, as well.
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Post#11 » by SacKingZZZ » Wed Feb 6, 2008 11:18 pm

Smills91 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Sure and it took the Warriors 13 years through that method, the Clippers STILL always suck even when they're 'good', the Hawks still haven't jumped out with their complete 'rebuild' at this point(it's been almost a decade since they were last in the playoffs). You can look at a franchise here and there and say it worked but that's it, it worked for them THIS ONE TIME. It's not the rule. It's a GAMBLE. Hanging onto veterans that can win is MUCH LESS of a gamble and that's why GOOD teams like the Spurs, Suns, Mavs look to acquire VETERANS.



Fortunately we have been very lucky to find some LEGIT young players. We don't have to go out and waste time to just get one.
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Post#12 » by dozencousins » Wed Feb 6, 2008 11:37 pm

i see no real need to panic we have veterans we will trade or dump
we have alot of young talent
we just need to be smart with our moves we have to have the philosophy now that our veterans are like the stock market we need to trae our vets while the stock is up

such as bibby , artest and yes b.miller who is having a great season reason being is we need to get solid value for these guys as the true contenders this year will want to make moves to contend in the playoffs any of these guys coould help us involve k9,shareef in a deal

i see no true solid free agents next year so we should do very little offseason spending on free agents unless we can get a top name youg talent in a deal possibly one that is unhappy in their situation with another team this type of situation could work to petrie's advantage as did for the heat dumpimg shaq old beat up a$$ for marion !

we might need to ride this out until the 09/10 season if we cant find the right deal then there will be a ton of great free agents and if we make smart moves we will have tons of money to through at the top nba talent with young draft picks to add to ou future talent ! :wink:
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Post#13 » by Smills91 » Wed Feb 6, 2008 11:58 pm

People that want a rebuild want instant gratification, which is ironic. They want a team like the Hawks/Blazers/Bobcats etc...but guess what those teams are still YEARS away from contending. It's counter-intuitive. A full-fledge rebuild only DELAYS this franchise from bouncing back. To have a rebuild like the Jazz/Spurs/Lakers etc is through TRADES and FREE AGENCY. However, dilapitating your roster from ALL veteran talent doth not accomplish this. I'm with ICMTM on this one. It's so hard to win in this league, why make it easier for someone else and harder on yourself. Of course if you get a Pau Gasol for free, a Shawn Marion for free, a Chris Webber for free you take it...but you 'rebuilders' out there want to sell our talent for .10 cents on the dollar and THAT IS STUPID. That will NOT make this team better now OR later.
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Post#14 » by ICMTM » Thu Feb 7, 2008 12:26 am

Smills91 wrote:I'm with ICMTM on this one.


Better not tell him who I voted for...
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Post#15 » by pillwenney » Thu Feb 7, 2008 1:16 am

I think what this boils down to is how to acquire a star, basically. If we're content with acquiring good solid players, than staying put is probably fine, but as of right now, we don't have the assets to acquire a star.

I think another thing is the idea of "are we okay with sucking for a few years?" I mean sure Portland won't legitimately contend for a few years, but when they do, ho-ly s**t. I would absolutely kill to be in Portland's situation.

It's one thing if the reasoning is that you honestly feel it is the better and more proven way to build a team, but if you don't want to go into full rebuilding because "I'd rather win 45 games a year than 20", then I don't agree with that.
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Post#16 » by deNIEd » Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:32 am

Smills91 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Sure and it took the Warriors 13 years through that method, the Clippers STILL always suck even when they're 'good', the Hawks still haven't jumped out with their complete 'rebuild' at this point(it's been almost a decade since they were last in the playoffs). You can look at a franchise here and there and say it worked but that's it, it worked for them THIS ONE TIME. It's not the rule. It's a GAMBLE. Hanging onto veterans that can win is MUCH LESS of a gamble and that's why GOOD teams like the Spurs, Suns, Mavs look to acquire VETERANS.


It's funny how much you praise Petrie, yet have absolutely no confidence in him doing a true complete rebuild.
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Post#17 » by deNIEd » Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:36 am

Smills91 wrote:People that want a rebuild want instant gratification, which is ironic. They want a team like the Hawks/Blazers/Bobcats etc...but guess what those teams are still YEARS away from contending. It's counter-intuitive. A full-fledge rebuild only DELAYS this franchise from bouncing back. To have a rebuild like the Jazz/Spurs/Lakers etc is through TRADES and FREE AGENCY. However, dilapitating your roster from ALL veteran talent doth not accomplish this. I'm with ICMTM on this one. It's so hard to win in this league, why make it easier for someone else and harder on yourself. Of course if you get a Pau Gasol for free, a Shawn Marion for free, a Chris Webber for free you take it...but you 'rebuilders' out there want to sell our talent for .10 cents on the dollar and THAT IS STUPID. That will NOT make this team better now OR later.


Not really, King's took roughly 6 years to rebuild last time (since drafting of Peja to 02), and 6 years rebuilding now would be good.
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Post#18 » by Smills91 » Thu Feb 7, 2008 7:05 am

ICMTM wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Better not tell him who I voted for...


Who the hell cares, with effing McCain probably win I just as soon vote for Billary or Osama. I mean at least they'll get the credit then when the country goes to hell in a handbasket when they take over.

You jsut can't keeping taxing 'the rich' and get away with it for too long. It'll stall the economy faster than a dead clutch. The 'rich' can't manage without INCOME since they have other assets. When the rich stop working that causes a loss of jobs and who suffers? The poor/middle class who can't land a good job anymore, because there is no longer any incentive for the 'rich' to EARN INCOME. Which is what our tax system is based on, INCOME. California sees this every year. They jack up taxes and the rich stop producing.

However, when you cut taxes it incentivizes people to EARN INCOME which creates more taxable money, it grows the economy and EVERYONE is better off, known as a trickle down effect.

BIG Government <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<BIG Economy.

Taxes create big government and small economy. So I don't even care who you voted for, at this point it's 1976 all over again. Reagan had to wait 4 years to rescue America, Romney will too I suppose.
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Post#19 » by SacKingZZZ » Thu Feb 7, 2008 7:23 am

Smills91 wrote:People that want a rebuild want instant gratification, which is ironic. They want a team like the Hawks/Blazers/Bobcats etc...but guess what those teams are still YEARS away from contending. It's counter-intuitive. A full-fledge rebuild only DELAYS this franchise from bouncing back. To have a rebuild like the Jazz/Spurs/Lakers etc is through TRADES and FREE AGENCY. However, dilapitating your roster from ALL veteran talent doth not accomplish this. I'm with ICMTM on this one. It's so hard to win in this league, why make it easier for someone else and harder on yourself. Of course if you get a Pau Gasol for free, a Shawn Marion for free, a Chris Webber for free you take it...but you 'rebuilders' out there want to sell our talent for .10 cents on the dollar and THAT IS STUPID. That will NOT make this team better now OR later.


Well I think the last couple of years of getting suckier and suckier has technically been "rebuilding". We don't need to blow it up completely but we need to get value for players we have NO INTENTION of building around or using long term.

It's better to be years away from contending than an ETERNITY away from contending.
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Post#20 » by ethiosew » Thu Feb 7, 2008 7:29 am

Start rebuilding NOW. like Theus said tonight we're not that good.

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