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Brad Miller to Chicago?

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Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#1 » by Toro Rojo » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:44 am

A guy who has legit Bulls info posted that the Bulls and Kings are discussing a deal that would send Brad Miller to Chicago for Andres Nocioni, a future 1st and Cedric Simmons. The Kings want to include Noah instead of Simmons, that could complicate things because Noah obviously is that much better and promising.

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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#2 » by SacKingZZZ » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:53 am

What? I don't know why either team would do that. I don't think we need Nocioni nor Simmons. Nor Noah for that matter. I mean I know Petrie wanted to draft Noah but I don't see the need now.

Nocioni is in the middle of a long term deal too. No way this is the deal, it just doesn't even remotely make sense.

I will add that it is good value for Miller however. I just can't see the Kings taking on Nocioni unless they feel he can be the starting SF for the next four years when Artest is traded.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#3 » by SactownHrtBrks8 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:11 am

I'd do it. I like it because it gives us flexability with what we wanna move Artest for and it gives Hawes / Thompson / Williams time to develop
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#4 » by Ballings7 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:15 am

Well, for whatever it's worth...

I'm definitely on board with that deal, in the case of Noah. Noah would be a tremendous addition to the front-court. He's not all defense, rebounding, and hustle, either... I watched him on a pretty regular basis... his driving, handle, and passing ability is really overlooked generally, and all are better than ordinary for a big man. Then you have his all-around defense, good rebounding, good length, very good agility, and consistent energy. He has also shown a consistent ability to get to the FT line, and has shown a hook shot at times. Will only get better offensively. He just would be a great fit on this team in general. With Noah, Thompson, Hawes, Shelden, the size and versatility on both ends of the court would be fantastic, and there would be quite a strong presence of balance and compatability, up front :). Even still without Shelden, if he might be moved or not re-signed. Though not as much on the aformentioned, because he'd fill the role of that total big body on both ends. So that would be missing, and think you should have that kind of guy up front, typically.

Nocioni is a solid veteran player that can be a future trade piece. Unless he can return to his old form from his first 3 seasons, he's more of a scorer now than the kind of mulit-dimensonal tough/team-playing guy he used to be. I think injuries and losing weight has played into that.

I definitely wouldn't mind getting Simmons, and maybe finally being able to get a fair oppurtunity as the back-up PF (when things clear in the near future). I still like the guy's situation to be a solid complementary big with nice athleticism and size.

I would not be that excited about the deal as a whole if Noah's not in it, though. If Simmons would turn out to be the kind of role-playing PF that this team lacks off the bench - I'd definitely be happy then, but that is up in the air.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#5 » by Ballings7 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:19 am

Here's the source:

Tech_N9ne wrote:Hey everyone, I wanted to let you know the Bulls and Kings are trying to work out a trade that would bring Brad Miller back to the Bulls. I finally opened up my site/blog, and I wrote all about it on there. This trade is pretty hot news so I decided to introduce the site with this information. On top of the Bulls inside info I receive, I'm going to try to keep the site updated with miscellaneous news, articles, etc.

http://www.rumorpress.net is the site...

Now as for the Miller information, the Bulls and Kings are working on a deal but the Bulls really don't want to make the trade until they resolve the Gordon and Deng contract issues. The teams are also having some minor trouble because the Bulls want to send Nocioni, a future pick and Cedric Simmons for Miller. But the Kings are hoping they can replace Simmons with Joakim Noah. I'll post more info as it comes but thats all for now. Check out the site for updates...

Talk to you guys soon


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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#6 » by SacKingZZZ » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:22 am

Artest93 wrote:I'd do it. I like it because it gives us flexability with what we wanna move Artest for and it gives Hawes / Thompson / Williams time to develop



If it's Noah then it creats quite the logjam though. No way can you develop 4 young bigs at once, no way.

Plus Nocioni? I mean Nocioni falls in line like a Tayshaun Prince as far as the kind of player that would be a great fit next to Martin, but is he the guy??? He'd certainly help on the boards, he's a very good rebounder at the SF position and can even slide over to PF for stretches. Good 3 point shooter, good attitude, solid higher end role player.

If we did get Noah, he is another guy that has the potential to fit very well with his ability to pass out of the high post and work within a motion offense. A lineup of Thompson at the 3, Noah at the 4, and Hawes at the 5 would be pretty interesting! I just don't know. I can't see the Kings being even remotely interested in Simmons.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#7 » by Ballings7 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:24 am

Nocioni isn't the kind of guy you have next to Kevin like an Artest, Prince, Howard type of player...
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#8 » by SactownHrtBrks8 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:28 am

SacKingZZZ wrote:
Artest93 wrote:I'd do it. I like it because it gives us flexability with what we wanna move Artest for and it gives Hawes / Thompson / Williams time to develop



If it's Noah then it creats quite the logjam though. No way can you develop 4 young bigs at once, no way.

Plus Nocioni? I mean Nocioni falls in line like a Tayshaun Prince as far as the kind of player that would be a great fit next to Martin, but is he the guy??? He'd certainly help on the boards, he's a very good rebounder at the SF position and can even slide over to PF for stretches. Good 3 point shooter, good attitude, solid higher end role player.

If we did get Noah, he is another guy that has the potential to fit very well with his ability to pass out of the high post and work within a motion offense. A lineup of Thompson at the 3, Noah at the 4, and Hawes at the 5 would be pretty interesting! I just don't know. I can't see the Kings being even remotely interested in Simmons.


If Noah was involved (which i doubt) then Williams probably would be irrelavant... If he doesn't crack the rotation this year and show the Kings something i doubt they pick up this option (which is like for 5 million). Noah as a backup PF/C or Thompson as a backup PF/C looks good going forward with Hawes.

I like Nocioni. He's a qaulity player and he also gives us options. He could start or backup Salmons because he is comfortable in a backup role. People can say well he's not a good fit next to Martin but you really don't know what type of chemistry they'd have playing together. Nocioni would just be another assets to later help are rebuilding process any way
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#9 » by KF10 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:40 am

Oh, I hate to lose Miller. He is one of my favorite players in the NBA. He is completely undervalue by general NBA fans. He is a good center with an unique skill list. Miller/Artest are basically the MOST important piece of our offense. Without Miller, we will see a change of our offense. But if Petrie thinks that this move is good for the team, I would say deal. I never argue with Petrie. Especially, if Noah in the deal. I really like him. I wanted him last year as well.

Wow, if Miller is traded. Thar makes Martin the longest tenure King. He was with the Kings in 2004. Whoa, how things change here.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#10 » by BMiller52 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:54 am

I'd love to see that deal happen. Hawes/Noah/Thompson is a hell of a frontcourt for the future. Even if we got Simmons and a future first instead, we need that type of player for the future. I'd be ok with dropping the future 1st if they include Noah though.

My god look at the young talent on this team:

KMart
Beno
Hawes
Thompson
Noah
Cisco
Bobby Brown
Singletary
Shelden

then pull the trigger on the Artest/Douby for Prince and you have support players like

Prince
Nocioni
Salmons
Mikki


You also have our draft picks for the next couple years, and possibly one from Chicago or maybe Detroit in an Artest deal(depending on the details of that deal). We'd have one of the best young teams in the NBA.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#11 » by SadKingsFan » Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:25 am

I think Petrie is doing this because we might not get J-max in the Artest deal, so he is trying to get another young athletic big man. Makes sense to me if Noah is in, otherwise chicago can forget it. And how long do we have to wait for this damn deng and gordon crap to be over with damn it?!?!

God we have to wait on the Josh smith situation because Detoit wants him and Artest might be their Plan B, and now this? Ugh...
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#12 » by SacKingZZZ » Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:41 am

Ballings7 wrote:Nocioni isn't the kind of guy you have next to Kevin like an Artest, Prince, Howard type of player...


If the Kings don't think that then they shouldn't be trading for him. With the type of money he makes it would be a waste of money for the Kings to use him like Chicago has. I am not so sure he is too far under the level of those guys. He never really got a chance to play a solid 35 minutes a night. If given that he is a better rebounder than all of them and is on par with Prince defensively.

If the Kings trade for Nocioni it has to be under the premise that they feel he can become much more than he is now given full time minutes.

And he also fits next to Martin quite well, and is a lot like Prince. He is a great spot up shooter that can handle the ball a little and will hustle on defense. Now I think Prince is a more ideal fit but the Kings certainly could use the edge in rebounding Nocioni brings.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#13 » by BMiller52 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:08 am

SacKingZZZ wrote:
Ballings7 wrote:Nocioni isn't the kind of guy you have next to Kevin like an Artest, Prince, Howard type of player...


If the Kings don't think that then they shouldn't be trading for him. With the type of money he makes it would be a waste of money for the Kings to use him like Chicago has. I am not so sure he is too far under the level of those guys. He never really got a chance to play a solid 35 minutes a night. If given that he is a better rebounder than all of them and is on par with Prince defensively.

If the Kings trade for Nocioni it has to be under the premise that they feel he can become much more than he is now given full time minutes.

And he also fits next to Martin quite well, and is a lot like Prince. He is a great spot up shooter that can handle the ball a little and will hustle on defense. Now I think Prince is a more ideal fit but the Kings certainly could use the edge in rebounding Nocioni brings.



You do the deal because of Joakim Noah not because of Nocioni. I actually like Nocioni but I'd do it to get Noah here regardless. I mean we can use all the young talent we can get, and the fact that he's a legit 6'11''+athletic is great. He'd be a great compliment to JT and Spencer. Considering we will be going up vs Gasol/Bynum and Aldridge/Oden, having youth+athleticism+height+rebounding+shotblocking is going to be VERY important.

Nocioni is just an added benefit.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#14 » by HINrichPolice » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:10 am

I'd love this deal for a few reasons...

Although a valuable basketball player, Nocioni's long term contract makes it difficult for us to retain our young prospects because our owernship refuses to pay the luxury tax. Miller's contract also expires in the summer of 2010 when all the big named free agents will be available.

Nocioni has a lot of positives (ability to spread the floor with perimeter shooting, rebounding, aggressiveness, effort). However, if you go to the Bulls board you'll easily hear about all his negatives (shoots a lot, plays like a chicken with his head cut off on defense). The thing that I think a lot of Bulls fans don't realize is that Nocioni just needs constant coaching. Him putting in 100% effort is almost to a fault because it causes him to try to do too much, but in reality he's all about whatever will help his team win.

BTW, no chance this deal happens if you want to replace Simmons with Noah.

So with the deal as presented, would you guys do it?

Nocioni
Simmons
future 1st rounder (probably top 3 or lottery protected)

for

Brad Miller
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#15 » by RIPskaterdude » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:15 am

As much as I would like to get rid of Miller (for cap reasons, not talent), I want no part of Noah. He was SUSPENDED by his own teammates because he was complaining so much last year when they were losing. How do you think he'll feel on a Kings team that has no chance for the playoffs this year?

On January 13, 2008 Noah was benched for the team's upcoming game at Atlanta following a confrontation with assistant coach Ron Adams. Noah's teammates delivered a unanimous vote to bench him for an additional game since they felt the one game suspension did not suffice. According to interim coach Jim Boylan, Noah has been involved in several incidents, including being late for practices and team meetings. "This is not college anymore. This is professional sports," Boylan remarked.


At 1:50 a.m. on May 25, 2008 in Gainesville, Florida, Noah was arrested for having an open container of alcohol and misdemeanor possession of marijuana. A few hours later, Noah was also cited for driving with a suspended license and not wearing a seat belt. He was sentenced to six months probation and a $200 fine for the marijuana and open container charges. Noah also must pay $206 in traffic fines.


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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#16 » by _SRV_ » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:21 am

Nocioni is a long and bad contract, he's productive, but is paid over his worth, if the Kings are willing to take on the extra 2 years of his contract, I sure hope it'll be for more the late 1st rounder.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#17 » by humboldtkingsfan » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:24 am

HINrichPolice wrote:At 1:50 a.m. on May 25, 2008 in Gainesville, Florida, Noah was arrested for having an open container of alcohol and misdemeanor possession of marijuana. A few hours later, Noah was also cited for driving with a suspended license and not wearing a seat belt. He was sentenced to six months probation and a $200 fine for the marijuana and open container charges. Noah also must pay $206 in traffic fines.


No thanks? Umm...did you forget Brad is suspended for the 1st five games of this season? Oh, and it turns out he had numerous failed tests. Noah just got caught by the PD and not the NBA.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#18 » by RIPskaterdude » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:27 am

Also, with Nocioni has a very long contract and would just add MORE to the overload at the wings. Artest/Salmons/Nocioni/Garcia/Martin/Douby? We would have to be planning on trading two of our swings ASAP, or that is going to be alot of money committed to the backcourt of the team. I would rather just let Miller expire or trade him for expirings/1st.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#19 » by sackings916 » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:29 am

SacKingZZZ wrote:
Ballings7 wrote:Nocioni isn't the kind of guy you have next to Kevin like an Artest, Prince, Howard type of player...


If the Kings don't think that then they shouldn't be trading for him. With the type of money he makes it would be a waste of money for the Kings to use him like Chicago has. I am not so sure he is too far under the level of those guys. He never really got a chance to play a solid 35 minutes a night. If given that he is a better rebounder than all of them and is on par with Prince defensively.

If the Kings trade for Nocioni it has to be under the premise that they feel he can become much more than he is now given full time minutes.

And he also fits next to Martin quite well, and is a lot like Prince. He is a great spot up shooter that can handle the ball a little and will hustle on defense. Now I think Prince is a more ideal fit but the Kings certainly could use the edge in rebounding Nocioni brings.


I think you're overrating Nocioni a bit. He hustles but as far as on ball defense he's average or below average. He doesn't have the quickness to stay with quicker SFs. He cant handle the ball that well but he has decent ball handling for a PF. At the end of the day Nocioni is a bench player and is not any more of a starter than Salmons or Garcia.
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Re: Brad Miller to Chicago? 

Post#20 » by HINrichPolice » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:29 am

Nocioni isn't necessarily overpayed for what he brings to the table. However, for the Bulls, because we have younger players with redundant skills that need playing time for development, and because can't pay the luxury tax, he's "overpaid" in our eyes.

Look at his contract. His contract decreases each year and is really just a little bit above the MLE.
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