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After finally trading Ron Artest the Kings get Bobby Jackson, Donte Greene, and a 1st round pick. This trade the Kings get rookie 6 feet 10 inch tall Donte Greene who will play the PF position. (Unless the Kings want to play small he could play Center) With this I feel that the Kings just have too many PFs. So whose the odd man out? Right now with the new trade the Kings have the following potential Pfs: Mikki Moore, Jason Thompson, Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Kenny Thomas, Shelden Williams, maybe Patrick Ewing Jr, and finally new acquired Donte Greene. Obviously the Kings will keep Moore, and Thompson. But who will not get any playing time/be released? I think Williams, Ewing, SAR, Thomas will get little to no playing time this year.

Greene is a 3/4, not a 4/5. Ewing Jr. may be included in the deal (it's been mentioned) so that somewhat cuts down the choices.

Consider that most of the Kings 3/4 players have a lot of versatility.

Garcia & Salmons can both play 1-3.
Thompson looks like he may be able to play the 3 & 4.
Greene can play the 3 & 4.
Williams can play the 4 and 5.

I don't really see much of a problem there to be honest. If all 4 front court guys pan out (the 3 young guys + Hawes) you're talking about a rotation of Thompson/Greene @ PF and Hawes/Williams @ C.

Moreover, if you look at the age of the players you can also say:
PG - No really young guys
SG - Martin @ 25
SF - Greene @ 20
PF - Thompson @ 22
C - Hawes @ 20

That's a pretty young core of guys going forward (assuming they all develop into good players).

Valid point, however what about this year?

If the trade stays the same the potential depth chart would look something like this.

Miller/Hawes
Moore/Thompson/Williams/SAR/Thomas/Greene
Salmons/Garcia/Ewing Jr
Martin/Brown
Udrih/Jackson/Douby

In this depth chart I did not put versatility. And all I'm saying is that out of the PF people who will get the most playing time? I think that SAR, Thomas, and maybe Williams(unless he wants to play the Center) will get the least amount of playing time.

At this point here is how I see our lineup:

Miller/Hawes
Moore/Thompson/Williams/Thomas
Salmons/Garcia/Greene
Martin/Jackson/Douby
Udrih/Brown

I think Moore is really a guy we should look to trade, he is taking a lot of playing time from our young guys.

Greene is a swing man kind of guy. So he will most likely end up being a back-up SF not a back-up PF. If your seriously asking who the odd man out is at PF, Kenny Thomas has to be the answer. Our lineup is young and I'm liking it. I dont expect us to do much next year, but were young and our youngins have great potential.

This is how I see the lineup:

Miller/Hawes
Moore/Thompson/Williams
Salmons/Cisco/Greene
Martin/Jackson/Douby/Salmons
Udrih/Brown/Cisco

norcal07 wrote:Valid point, however what about this year?

If the trade stays the same the potential depth chart would look something like this.

Miller/Hawes
Moore/Thompson/Williams/SAR/Thomas/Greene
Salmons/Garcia/Ewing Jr
Martin/Brown
Udrih/Jackson/Douby

In this depth chart I did not put versatility. And all I'm saying is that out of the PF people who will get the most playing time? I think that SAR, Thomas, and maybe Williams(unless he wants to play the Center) will get the least amount of playing time.

Greene's pretty raw and I don't think that Ewing Jr. makes the team. I also don't think SAR say much (if any) playing time. So I see the chart as:

Miller / Hawes
Moore / Thompson / Williams
Salmons / Garcia / Greene
Martin / Douby
Udrih / Jackson / Brown

Of course, there's a chance the Kings move Miller (e.g. in that deal with Chicago) or even Jackson (to a contender) so this could change.

rpa wrote:Greene is a 3/4, not a 4/5. Ewing Jr. may be included in the deal (it's been mentioned) so that somewhat cuts down the choices.

Consider that most of the Kings 3/4 players have a lot of versatility.

Garcia & Salmons can both play 1-3.
Thompson looks like he may be able to play the 3 & 4.
Greene can play the 3 & 4.
Williams can play the 4 and 5.

I don't really see much of a problem there to be honest. If all 4 front court guys pan out (the 3 young guys + Hawes) you're talking about a rotation of Thompson/Greene @ PF and Hawes/Williams @ C.

Moreover, if you look at the age of the players you can also say:
PG - No really young guys
SG - Martin @ 25
SF - Greene @ 20
PF - Thompson @ 22
C - Hawes @ 20

That's a pretty young core of guys going forward (assuming they all develop into good players).

Isn't Udrih only like 25 also?

Also Greene is definitely a Sf. He could be a small ball every once in a while but that won't be this position. Rahim and Thomas are irrelavent. They won't play. Rahim has a chance but i highly doubt it.

Our Rotation looks like this IMO (at the moment until Thompson can prove himself in camp)

Miller/Hawes
Moore/Williams/Thompson

If Mikki Moore gets major minutes and squashes Hawes, Greene, and Thompson out of the rotation something is wrong. He won't be here next year, just like with Ron Artest, why give minutes to someone that is not in any long term plans!? The more time for the young guys to develop the better. We have so many young guys it's going to be hard enough getting them all the opportunity they need just between themselves.

SacKingZZZ wrote:If Mikki Moore gets major minutes and squashes Hawes, Greene, and Thompson out of the rotation something is wrong. He won't be here next year, just like with Ron Artest, why give minutes to someone that is not in any long term plans!? The more time for the young guys to develop the better. We have so many young guys it's going to be hard enough getting them all the opportunity they need just between themselves.

Ya i highly doubt he gets major minutes. We were equally as good with Hawes on the floor last year. I can see Moore getting shipped out by the deadline

Moore/SAR/KT all will be gone sooner (this season) or later (2010). Moore should be dealt to a playoff team for an expiring player, as a back-up, he could really help somebody.

I think Shelden's going to show well enough to stick around, being that big wide body every team needs.

That and by developing the young players maybe their value goes up. Mikki Moore is what he is. He won't do anything on the court that will increase his value, he doesn't put up pretty numbers or anything that other teams will be really impressed by.

I say start Shelden, I think he can average 10 ppg and 10 rpg and let his value increase, then later on use that value to your advantage. Same thing with Salmons, if he gets the chance to start and plays like he did last year as a starter he could have major value by the end of the year. We may want to keep both of them long term but still it at least gives us the option to use the increased value of the other guys as leverage down the line.

Greene is definately a SF. I don't think the Kings can justify playing Garcia at the 3 over Greene by the halfway point of the season. Greene's potential, size and shooting ability are rare so he could be special. So I see Garcia being a 2/3 in very, very limited minutes. I'll admit Greene is raw but he needs the playing time.
I think the lineup is something like:
Udrih/Jackson/Brown
Martin/Douby
Salmons/Greene/Garcia
Moore/Thompson/Williams
Miller/Hawes

Here the 13th man would be Brown because Douby and Salmons could man the point in spot minutes. Garcia's and Williams' ability to play multiple positions wins out over Brown.

Artest93 wrote:Isn't Udrih only like 25 also?

Yeah, but I pray that Udrih isn't our longterm answer at PG--he just isn't that good

SacKingZZZ wrote:If Mikki Moore gets major minutes and squashes Hawes, Greene, and Thompson out of the rotation something is wrong. He won't be here next year, just like with Ron Artest, why give minutes to someone that is not in any long term plans!? The more time for the young guys to develop the better. We have so many young guys it's going to be hard enough getting them all the opportunity they need just between themselves.

Theus will put the best lineup available, Moore is going to play, at least 25 IMO, besides in the SL we saw that Thompson isn't readt (neither is Hawes for that matter).
The front court will be
Miller(~30)/Hawes(~15)
Moore(~25)/Williams(~25)

with Thompson filling injury and garbage time void.
That is true if Miller is kept, which I think he will be.

i<3basketball wrote:Greene is definately a SF. I don't think the Kings can justify playing Garcia at the 3 over Greene by the halfway point of the season. Greene's potential, size and shooting ability are rare so he could be special. So I see Garcia being a 2/3 in very, very limited minutes. I'll admit Greene is raw but he needs the playing time.
I think the lineup is something like:
Udrih/Jackson/Brown
Martin/Douby
Salmons/Greene/Garcia
Moore/Thompson/Williams
Miller/Hawes

Here the 13th man would be Brown because Douby and Salmons could man the point in spot minutes. Garcia's and Williams' ability to play multiple positions wins out over Brown.

I wouldn't expect Greene to get much playing time this season. I think it'll be similar to how Kmart was his rookie year. Greene has talent and potential but he's still very raw. I think Theus is the perfect coach for Greene though. He can really teach him the ins and outs of being a scorer and Greene's attitude hasn't been the best but I think he'll mesh with Theus.

I know almost everyone gets fired up about rookies but the truth is that the vaaast majority of them every season play limited minutes. Thompson and Greene are not highly talented. They're just good players below the 10th pick. There's a more than 50% chance that they won't ever average double digits. And yes there's a smaller chance they will be great.

Anyway.. my point is that we have now 2 nice rookies in positions that are already filled. I can't see Moore or Salmons/Cisco losing their places. I believe that Theus will find playing time for the rookies but I can't see them playing more than 25 minutes.

To be honest I would love to see Moore leaving. The only reason this player is still in the NBA is Jason Kidd who fooled us to give him the MLE. Same thing happened to the Nuggets and Kenyon Martin etc.

Let's just hope the rookies surprise us and earn a starting position.. same thing goes for Hawes.

I would assume that Moore is trade bait at the deadline since he's only partially guaranteed for next season (almost as good as an expiring). To be good bait, though, he will need to continue to see solid minutes to maintain his value.

The Kings have already demonstrated that they are willing to pay KT to not play. I doubt that changes (assuming he lasts the summer). The only question mark is SAR. If he is capable of playing, he will get time. If he's not capable of playing, the point is moot...he'll likely retire.

That's why I keep mentioning SAR, if he's fine health-wise, he'll get time.

_SRV_ wrote:

SacKingZZZ wrote:If Mikki Moore gets major minutes and squashes Hawes, Greene, and Thompson out of the rotation something is wrong. He won't be here next year, just like with Ron Artest, why give minutes to someone that is not in any long term plans!? The more time for the young guys to develop the better. We have so many young guys it's going to be hard enough getting them all the opportunity they need just between themselves.

Theus will put the best lineup available, Moore is going to play, at least 25 IMO, besides in the SL we saw that Thompson isn't readt (neither is Hawes for that matter).
The front court will be
Miller(~30)/Hawes(~15)
Moore(~25)/Williams(~25)

with Thompson filling injury and garbage time void.
That is true if Miller is kept, which I think he will be.

Which is all the same thing as wasting a year. There is no question that this team is in FULL rebuild mode now. They would only be hurting themselves by pulling another "Corliss" and gluing the young guns to the bench in favor of a guy that gives the franchise nothing of tangible value. And the way last season worked out, I doubt Shelden plays more than Hawes. If kept the same the only difference from last year is that Douby really won't play at all, and neither will Thompson/Greene.