All Things Luka Doncic

[saphan]

Doncic was supposedly just officially measured at 6-6 1/2 barefoot.....so we can finally stop with the "he is 6-9, 6-10, 6-11" posts....

Can you post a link please?

[burek3]

GMs voted Doncic best international player not in NBA. I'm not sure if this has been posted here before, apologies in advance if it has.

Link: http://www.nba.com/gmsurvey/2017#/

Who is the best international player NOT in the NBA?

1. Luka Doncic – 69%

2. Nando de Colo – 28%

3. Alexey Shved – 3%

Last year: Milos Teodosic – 54%

EDIT: Ah, I see bob8 posted a link couple of pages ago, sorry bob8. Can't hurt though, I pasted the poll results

[UcanUwill]

GMs voted Doncic best international player not in NBA. I'm not sure if this has been posted here before, apologies in advance if it has.

Link: http://www.nba.com/gmsurvey/2017#/

Who is the best international player NOT in the NBA?

1. Luka Doncic – 69%

2. Nando de Colo – 28%

3. Alexey Shved – 3%

Last year: Milos Teodosic – 54%

EDIT: Ah, I see bob8 posted a link couple of pages ago, sorry bob8. Can't hurt though, I pasted the poll results

I know a lot of Euroleague fanboys will be furious because of this, but I actually think its accurate. Have a lot of faith in Doncic this year.

[Bob8]

GMs voted Doncic best international player not in NBA. I'm not sure if this has been posted here before, apologies in advance if it has.

Link: http://www.nba.com/gmsurvey/2017#/

Who is the best international player NOT in the NBA?

1. Luka Doncic – 69%

2. Nando de Colo – 28%

3. Alexey Shved – 3%

Last year: Milos Teodosic – 54%

EDIT: Ah, I see bob8 posted a link couple of pages ago, sorry bob8. Can't hurt though, I pasted the poll results

I know a lot of Euroleague fanboys will be furious because of this, but I actually think its accurate. Have a lot of faith in Doncic this year.

And Doncic is not Euroleague player?

Shved and Nando will have around 20 ppg. Doncic will be very happy with 12+.

[Derento]

I saw Nando de Colo in EB and he looked very average.
Maybe he just didn't have a good tournament but he probably plays much better for his club team.
Shved was very good scorer for Russia and they relied on him for the scoring load.

[Saints14]

It's really not close. Doncic is by FAR more skilled than Lebron at the same age. If you can't recognize that I'd question even the most basic analysis you provide.

I could easily debate that LeBron was par with Donuc as a ball handler and passer coming out of high school but that's not even what I took issue with.

Donic being one of the "greatest prospects in NBA history" is absolutely comical.

And I could easily debate that Doncic's handle is on par with Lebron's RIGHT NOW. That's how underrated Doncic is by the consensus on this board. Lebron's handle is trash for an elite playmaker. Absolute trash. His shooting is remarkably average for an elite scorer. Lebron is highly skilled for a player of his size and athleticism. If he was 6'2 he'd be an afterthought in the the league.

Doncic's skill level as an 18 year old with his size is off the charts. If it continues to progress he will be an ELITE NBA player, period. There is some type of bias that currently exists with Doncic. Whether that's racial, xenophobic, or recency I'm not sure. I don't care to expand on that topic. Just understand that it exists. Doncic is a prospect of the rarest breed. To compare him to stiffs like Michael Porter, Jr. will look absolutely silly in a few months.

Idk about 6'2",but 6'4" LeBron just averaged a triple double and won MVP last year...

If you want to say that the biggest catalyst for LeBron's success is his size/athleticism, that's fair. But to say he isn't skilled is ridiculous. He's one of the best passers of all time, regardless of size. And he isn't crossing guys up like Kyrie and Steph, but his handle is plenty good enough for him to effectively run point and be one of the best ever at driving to the hoop.

[J_T]

LeBron's passing is in my opinion one of his best assets and it's elite. But I'm not sure that HoopsMalone actually talked about passing. I'm not even sure why is Doncic being compared to LeBron in any way at all. They are completely different type of players and I don't think that Doncic will be developing down LeBron's path. As much as it sounds crazy (or at least it was considered crazy a year ago) I do believe that Doncic will be a PG in NBA. He is going to have strengths and weaknesses playing that position but the strengths are going to prove to be too much.

[Jkam31]

Doncic was supposedly just officially measured at 6-6 1/2 barefoot.....so we can finally stop with the "he is 6-9, 6-10, 6-11" posts....

That makes him 6’8 in nba height


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

[UcanUwill]

I saw Nando de Colo in EB and he looked very average.
Maybe he just didn't have a good tournament but he probably plays much better for his club team.
Shved was very good scorer for Russia and they relied on him for the scoring load.

Yeah, Shved looked way better in Eurobasket. But DeColo has been a beast in the past years on his club. Doncic can overtake them both tho, way more versatile then either of these guys.

[Mirotic12]

I saw Nando de Colo in EB and he looked very average.
Maybe he just didn't have a good tournament but he probably plays much better for his club team.
Shved was very good scorer for Russia and they relied on him for the scoring load.

Yeah, Shved looked way better in Eurobasket. But DeColo has been a beast in the past years on his club. Doncic can overtake them both tho, way more versatile then either of these guys.

de Colo and Shved are in no way in hell the two best players in EuroLeague. The NBA GMs never know how to answer that question. They named Furkan Aldemir once, named Rubio once, named Hezonja once...

Clearly, Llull (assuming he's OK after his injury) and Spanoulis are the two best players in EuroLeague. de Colo and Shved are up among the best also, but very, very clearly not as good as Llull or Spanoulis.

[pacersGM]

de Colo and Shved are in no way in hell the two best players in EuroLeague. The NBA GMs never know how to answer that question. They named Furkan Aldemir once, named Rubio once, named Hezonja once...

Clearly, Llull (assuming he's OK after his injury) and Spanoulis are the two best players in EuroLeague. de Colo and Shved are up among the best also, but very, very clearly not as good as Llull or Spanoulis.

now you see how different of worlds and levels the euroleague @ nba are? people who you consider best in the euroleague were washed out of the nba because they are not able to play at that highest level. im talking about spanoulis.

the nba gms usualy vote for players they think could be succesfull in the nba also. becasue for them best means beeing able to play at the highest level of basketball wich is by far the nba, not who has won the most titles on high budget rich teams, then im shure they would rate sanoulis among the best in the second best league in the world / euroleague but they didnt, since we all know how that story panned out with houston

[UcanUwill]

I dont get all the Llull love, I think he is so overrated. Spanoulis, please, these days are over. I think GMs voted very good this year.

[XTraderXL]

Llull is a good scorer when he gets hot and thats all he is. He doesnt play defense, he doesnt rebound, his playmaking is avg at best and his assists mostly come after he dribbles the ball for 16s and has nothing else to do but pass the ball in the last 3s. Half of his assists come from plays like that.
I would definitely rather have Doncic running my offense than Llull. He is already more versatile and more valuable than Llull. Now, when Llull gets hot he is better than Luka but that really only happens a few times per season. He is a good player overall but there are at least 5 players in EL I would take befroe him.

And Spanoulis is just laughable, he is nowhere close to being even top 10 player right now. In the past he was but now he is done as an elite EL player.

[SportsGuy8]

I agree on both Llull and Spanoulis.

It's crazy to think about it, but Doncic might actually end up being the best player in Europe this season. And I'm not talking Mirotic or Saric type of "best player" hype, but actually the best. He's just so well-rounded. He submitted a bit too much to Campazzo during the first 3 games, but I expect that to change a bit. Doncic took a bit of a hit to the start of the season with Real by playing with Slovenia 'till the end of Eurobasket and then having to rest his ankle.

[Mirotic12]

now you see how different of worlds and levels the euroleague @ nba are? people who you consider best in the euroleague were washed out of the nba because they are not able to play at that highest level. im talking about spanoulis.

the nba gms usualy vote for players they think could be succesfull in the nba also. becasue for them best means beeing able to play at the highest level of basketball wich is by far the nba, not who has won the most titles on high budget rich teams, then im shure they would rate sanoulis among the best in the second best league in the world / euroleague but they didnt, since we all know how that story panned out with houston

Spanoulis didn't wash out of the NBA. He quit it because of how the Rockets treated him. Both the Rockets and Spurs are on record numerous times saying they asked him to stay on their teams. That's not "washing out of the NBA". Anthony Bennett is "washing out of the NBA".

For your arguments to have any merit of any kind at all, you need to use arguments that are factually correct.

In the cases of De Colo and Shved, neither one of them "washed out of the NBA" either. At least not Shved. He was like Spanoulis, he could have stayed in the NBA, if he wanted to. Not to mention that both Shved and Spanoulis (several times) turned down NBA offers, after they went back to Europe.

De Colo is a little bit closer to "washing out of the NBA", but not exactly. Because he was offered NBA contracts since he came back to Europe. And he could have stayed as a 3rd string player if he wanted, to begin with.

There are some NBA players that indeed "washed out of the NBA", and went to EuroLeague....Anthony Parker, Andrew Goudelock, Trajan Langdon, etc., etc., players like that. None of the players I mentioned "washed out of the NBA". Please keep to facts here.

When a player has numerous chances to sign in the NBA, and CHOOSES instead to play in EuroLeague, he did not "wash out of the NBA". Saying that is "washing out of the NBA" is factually untrue.

Like I said, just look at Anthony Bennett, for an example of a guy that is actually "washing out of the NBA" - completely different than Spanoulis and Shved turning down numerous NBA offers, because they prefer playing in Europe, for a various number of reasons.

Your argument is invalid, when your entire premise is based on something that is factually untrue.

One more thing you stated as incorrect...Spanoulis wasn't playing on high budget teams. Only in Panathinaikos was his team high budget. Olympiacos has been something around the 8th to 12th highest budget in EuroLeague, since he has been there, and in recent years, they are around 12th out of 16 teams in budget. Even a team like Brose Baskets has a bigger budget than Olympiacos does.

[Mirotic12]

Players that actually play in EuroLeague..........

http://www.euroleague.net/news/i/89btdoaek7prwio8/2017-18-turkish-airlines-euroleague-team-captains-survey

Shved
Printezis
De Colo
Spanoulis

tied as best player they have to play against. Seems actual players in the league definitely disagree with NBA GMs (that don't play or even watch EuroLeague), and posts here (that obviously by their comments don't watch EuroLeague).

I dont get all the Llull love, I think he is so overrated. Spanoulis, please, these days are over. I think GMs voted very good this year.

Llull is a good scorer when he gets hot and thats all he is. And Spanoulis is just laughable, he is nowhere close to being even top 10 player right now. In the past he was but now he is done as an elite EL player.

I agree on both Llull and Spanoulis.

Spanoulis in 2017 EuroLeague playoffs:

Watch on YouTube

Spanoulis in 2017 EuroLeague Final Four:

Watch on YouTube

Spanoulis in 2017 Greek League Finals:

Watch on YouTube

Spanoulis highlights during the 2016-17 season:

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

You are right, he is still the #1 best in EuroLeague, so nowhere near #10. Some of the comments made here are absolute 100% proof that the posters making them have never seen an actual EuroLeague game.

As far as Llull goes....

http://admin.euroleague.net/news/i/7tnnwxuxvbtlp9lx/madrid-s-llull-is-crowned-the-2016-17-turkish-airlines-euroleague-mvp

Madrid's Llull is crowned the 2016-17 Turkish Airlines EuroLeague MVP!

How could anyone possibly think the league's MVP is one of the best players in the league, since posters here are baffled at how anyone could even think that....

[UcanUwill]

If Spanoulis is best player in Europe, its pretty sad then. I really have more faith in Euro basketball.

[Mirotic12]

If Spanoulis is best player in Europe, its pretty sad then. I really have more faith in Euro basketball.

Spanoulis was much better than Doncic was last season. So yes, you are definitely going on "faith", and not actual facts or objective analysis.

[UcanUwill]

If Spanoulis is best player in Europe, its pretty sad then. I really have more faith in Euro basketball.

[b]Spanoulis was much better than Doncic was last season.[b] So yes, you are going on "faith", and not actual facts or objective analysis.

Debating Spanoulis with you is the same as debating science with a creationist. So I am not gonna bother.

But you got to keep in mind that NBA GM's are looking from NBA point of view. Put Doncic and Spanoulis in the NBA right now, Doncic is much better NBA player without a question. And thats what these NBA GM's care about. Just looking at Spanoulis' jumpshot, quickness, athleticism and finishing around the rim, it was always obvious that hes not gonna be a very good NBA player. He is kinda Euroleague's inferiority personified.

[Mirotic12]

Debating Spanoulis with you is the same as debating science with a creationist. So I am not gonna bother.

But you got to keep in mind that NBA GM's are looking from NBA point of view. Put Doncic and Spanoulis in the NBA right now, Doncic is much better NBA player without a question. And thats what these NBA GM's care about. Just looking at Spanoulis' jumpshot, quickness, athleticism and finishing around the rim, it was always obvious that hes not gonna be a very good NBA player. He is kinda Euroleague's inferiority personified.

You made those same claims before, and I posted video of what Spanoulis did against Team USA in 2006 and 2008, being one of the most athletic players on the court...

You then came back with, (paraphrasing) - "I guess I underestimated his athleticism and what he could do against NBA players. I guess I just always underestimate his level."

You have made up your mind that Spanoulis could not play in NBA, and that he has zero athletic ability, even though it's untrue and the opposite was actually true. Unless you think that those two games against Team USA were the only games Spanoulis ever played in his entire life, where he was athletic...I guess you don't know, but NBA considered Spanoulis a freak athlete in all his scouting reports before he was drafted.

If Spanoulis isn't athletic enough to play in NBA, then 95% of the players in the NBA are not either. Doncic, for me, is athletic enough for NBA, and will be fine with the NBA rules and reffing...Spanoulis at age 35 is way more athletic than Doncic is right now at age 18.

So your argument is, Spanoulis can't play in NBA or be one of the best players in Europe because he's not athletic, yet Doncic, who is very clearly far less athletic than Spanoulis (and barely even average for EuroLeague athletically), is good enough for NBA and best player in Europe.

Athleticism is not subjective. Athleticism is not a personal opinion. Athleticism is an actual real tangible thing, that a player either has, or does not have. Spanoulis is miles more athletic than Doncic. Doncic athletic level is more something like a bit worse than Kostas Papanikoloau.

Navarro, who you said here before is very non-athletic...Navarro at age 18 I can tell you was far more athletic than Doncic is right now. It's very easy to throw "athletic" or "not athletic" around as an excuse to just bolster whatever your opinion is. However, there are still the actual facts of what athleticism actually is.

Players being discussed here,

Spanoulis = very athletic
Shved = decent athleticism
Llull = solid athleticism
de colo = below average athleticism
Doncic = about average overall, but very poor in lateral quickness

Then anyone can just make posts like, (paraphrasing) "Spanoulis has zero athletic ability, and Doncic is much more athletic". Because anyone can say whatever personal opinion they want, even if it is untrue. I am much higher on Doncic as a player than you are, based on what you have said in these discussions. I'm one of the most positive people on him here.

But I am still going to post in facts and objectivity. Doncic is not at all athletic, and if we are now claiming he's more athletic than guys like Spanoulis, then this debate has gotten extremely far off the rails.

There is not a single point guard in EuroLeague that isn't more athletic than Doncic. Anyone saying otherwise has very obviously never viewed a EuroLeague game ever. Doncic would be more athletic than Teodosic or Diamantidis, but they are out of the league. No current EuroLeague point guard isn't more athletic than Doncic, including 35 year old Spanoulis, and every other one.

Doncic is not making his career on athleticism - that's by far and away his biggest weakness as a player.