2020 NBA Draft II

[Catchall]

Thoughts on Wiseman's ceiling being a more athletic Brook Lopez?

A more athletic Brook Lopez would be amazing, pretty much Joel Embiid on a good day.

[Catchall]

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Comp on Woodard? This video makes him look very Danny Granger esque.

Post-injury Rudy Gay.

[EMG518]

Anyone get young Kawhi vibes from Patrick Williams?

[doordoor123]

Wiseman isn't that good tbh. Not right now at least. And given how much wing ball-handling players affect winning and how little centers with no creation skills do, I'm not sure he has that much value as a top-3 pick.

Have we forgotten how much Davis, Cousins, Embiid, etc. have struggled to produce any winning?

He’s not that good, he’ll be a 19 year old rookie who has dealt with a lot of injuries. But his physical ability and size is still an outlier. His hands, ability to rebound at the apex with a super long wingspans and run the floor at his size is super impressive for anyone without skill. And there are reasons to believe he’s better than he’s shown with the ball in his hands, based on his ability in high school. It was the same with Adebayo when he went to college. He played a different game than he does now, but we all knew what he was able to do in high school. To compare him to players who can’t run, aren’t good rebounders, and doesn’t have his size is asinine. You don’t see players like this very often. SUre bigs are more likely #2 or 3 guys on a team, but IMO there aren’t any #1 options in this draft.

Davis, Cousins and Embiid can't run, rebound or don't have size??

The Adebayo comparison makes no sense. Adebayo is way more mobile, agile and shifty.

And they are not even in the same ballpark on defense.

Not making a direct Adebayo comparison. The comparison is that he played in a way that didn’t show off his entire game. He was forced to be a rim-runner in college. So was Wiseman.

People do this so much here to devalue someone’s comment. They’ll ignore the post completely and look at the player and say “those players aren’t the same” when no one is talking about their games directly, rather the situation they’re in or something beyond just the on-the-surface game. You guys are so obsessed with comparing the game of one player to another that you view every comment through that lens. Real evaluators see the game beyond direct comparisons because no one’s game is alike and there isn’t one kind of thing you have to be to be successful.

[clyde21]

Anyone get young Kawhi vibes from Patrick Williams?

people get Kawhi vibes from players every year

last year it was De'Andre Hunter for instance...it's just a hard comp to make because Kawhi's progression in the NBA is pretty unprecedented

[EMG518]

Anyone get young Kawhi vibes from Patrick Williams?

people get Kawhi vibes from players every year

last year it was De'Andre Hunter for instance...it's just a hard comp to make because Kawhi's progression in the NBA is pretty unprecedented

This is true, its the one off scenario where everything went perfect and he hit his absolute ceiling. I do get Kawhi vibes though lol. I think I would take him top 5.

[Stillwater]

Anyone get young Kawhi vibes from Patrick Williams?

people get Kawhi vibes from players every year

last year it was De'Andre Hunter for instance...it's just a hard comp to make because Kawhi's progression in the NBA is pretty unprecedented

This is true, its the one off scenario where everything went perfect and he hit his absolute ceiling. I do get Kawhi vibes though lol. I think I would take him top 5.

not me if anything the vibes are more like an OG Anunoby upside which is special in itself but Williams is nothing close to Kawhi

[stormi]

Wiseman isn't that good tbh. Not right now at least. And given how much wing ball-handling players affect winning and how little centers with no creation skills do, I'm not sure he has that much value as a top-3 pick.

Have we forgotten how much Davis, Cousins, Embiid, etc. have struggled to produce any winning?

Embiid has been a literal gamechanger when he's been on the court since he first stepped into the league off his copious injuries. His on/off numbers are tremendous and Philly is literally a championship caliber at all times he's on the floor. Respective of management doing everything they can to surround him with his least cohesive teammate options

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[MartinsIzAfraud]

Jahmi'us Ramsey

DRIBBLING

Good and competent ball-handler though not a guy you want handling the ball for an extended period of time. Has flashed some advanced stuff like cross-overs, hesitations, and even behind-the-back dribbles. Left hand is pretty solid. Could stand to tighten up his handle a bit.

PASSING

Really solid passer and willing one, too. Has flashed an array of passes on the move, showing some creativity when pressured. Not a ball-stopper -- if he doesn't see good opportunity, will swing ball quickly. Uses long arms to whip passes around the court when opportunity presents itself. Can effectively rocket passes into shooting pocket. Does a good job of finding open guy on perimeter. Has flashed ability to find his big man in paint or a baseline cutter when driving with wrap-arounds. Likes to drive into top of key, get his feet set and find his guys on the perimeter/coming off screens. Doesn't see corners very well, but could be due to mask interfering with peripheral vision.

SHOOTING

Shot selection could improve, but not bad; likes to step inside 3-pt line and take long 2s at times. Should be attacking rim more often, but sometimes settles for mid-range Js. Takes shots within the flow of the offense for the most part. Really good spot-up/C&S shooter when feet are set -- virtually textbook jumper (84th percentile on spot-up, no-dribble Js; 91st percentile on C&S). Has flashed ability to hit OTD step-back Js.

Pretty and fluid shooting form coming off screens and/or pulling up but efficiency isn't there yet, but enough to reasonably assume it will improve with reps. Better with his feet set in C&S sitches. Dips the ball down pretty far on C&S 3s (below waist line). Release point is nice and high. Could stand to speed up his release a bit, but it's not slow. Has quite a bit of gravity. Defenders are pretty much only 2-3 feet away almost always. Has shown ability to knock down shots from NBA range.

Touch around the rim isn't great as of current, but has flashed enough finishing ability to be optimistic for future improvement. Has shown he can finish through contact at times. Can play above the rim at times when he has room to load up.

MISC

Has flashed ability to euro-step as well as the willingness to attempt behind-the-back dribbles when driving. Shows willingness and instinct for cutting, reads when man is sleeping on him. Pretty awesome ISO player (84th percentile in ISO-derived offense + 88th percentile in own ISO offense) due to gravity from pull-up 3 and threat of going to rim.

DEFENSE

Somewhat raw on defensive end. Makes head-scratching decisions at times, though not very often. Shows good understanding of angles; does a good job of keeping arms up to cut off potential passes. Gets caught ball-watching at times and loses sense of where man is.

When switched on to bigs in P&Rs, does a good job fronting and discouraging entry passes. Isn't easy to push around due to strength.

Solid defensive awareness. Understands what is happening around him and when he needs to help, though is prone to over-helping on occasion. Rotates well on the perimeter and interior for the most part. Needs to work on footwork -- prone to crossing feet.

Overall decision-making is not bad, but needs to improve in order to unlock full defensive potential. Sometimes takes less-than-ideal angles, instead of backpedaling to keep BH in front. Overall, does a solid job of staying in front of guys and discouraging anything real from happening in ISO situations. Can find himself caught in ""no man's land"" at time with poor positioning off-ball at times.

Has flashed capability of stopping attacking BH in transition while backpedaling and keeping arms up. Capable of using long arms to play passing lanes; does read passes before they happen.

One of my picks for the Magic. This dude next to Fultz would be a super solid combo in a few years.

[King Ken]

Ariza in his prime was one of the best wing defenders in the NBA.
I think the young guy in the NBA right now who reminds me the most of Trevor Ariza is Mikal Bridges who looks like a VERY good draft pick at #11, in a VERY good draft.

Now, I haven't scouted Woodard, so this is an honest question, do you see Ariza in his game, or "a poor man's Trevor Ariza"?

Let me also note although Trevor has been in the NBA well over ten years, he was still an obvious defensive + playing at PF this season. Trevor is definitely a modern hyprid forward as far as his positional size. Does Woodard have that size? And do you honestly think he projects to be an elite level defender who can shoot 36+% career from 3 and be a very good transition scoring threat?

Because if you say yes, I'll scout him because that's a lottory pick. If he's a poor man's Ariza, how poor? A defensive stopper who shoots threes on a bad team or a good team? Do you honestly think his shooting will translate to 36+% career?

Mikal Bridges is miles better than Ariza as a prospect and he's miles better as a 2nd year player. Mikal Bridges is getting extremely underrated on here.

Mikal Bridges is an Al Horford level role player and he is very good at Basketball. Ariza is a Jeremi Grant level role player and he's merely average at basketball. Please stop using Mikal name like a mere system fit player. He's an impact player and one that makes anyone better. I would trade John Collins for him RIGHT NOW!

I had Mikal #5 on my board, I'm unreasonably high on him.

Trevor as a 23 year old 9/4/2/1.5
Mikal as a 23 year old 9/4/2/1.5

Mikal is a slightly better shorter, but the league as a whole is slightly better shooting.

Trevor Ariza was stealing last second oimbound passes to win confrese semifinals and conference finals games at 23. Ariza started on a championship team at the age Mikal is.

Ariza was pretty dang amazing.

And comparing Mikal to Horford is silly, but I won't address your takes on this any longer because your unreasonable here.

LOL! This is a Whiteside type post. Look at his blocks and his metrics when he's one of the worst defenders in the NBA. Please, let's watch the games.

[BlazersBroncos]

LOL! This is a Whiteside type post. Look at his blocks and his metrics when he's one of the worst defenders in the NBA. Please, let's watch the games.

Ariza was never the paper tiger that Hassan is.

Also, calling Hassan one of the worst defenders in the league is conjecture. He is overrated based on stats, but he isnt a complete waste either. He should be a 18mpg backup but his attitude wont let him.

[getrichordie]

[Stillwater]

lol his shooting is so good, it overshadows his deficiencies everywhere else .
I think he is one of the most efficient C&S deep range shooters along with SBey but neither esp Nesmith are
great off the dribble shooters & Nesmith is far from elite as an on the move shooter lacking a plethora of high % areas all over the floor.
He should get looks in the 20's not the lottery, but anything is possible if they think there is room for improvement I guess

[getrichordie]

lol his shooting is so good, it overshadows his deficiencies everywhere else .
I think he is one of the most efficient C&S deep range shooters along with SBey but neither esp Nesmith are
great off the dribble shooters & Nesmith is far from elite as an on the move shooter lacking a plethora of high % areas all over the floor.
He should get looks in the 20's not the lottery, but anything is possible if they think there is room for improvement I guess

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[Stillwater]

lol his shooting is so good, it overshadows his deficiencies everywhere else .
I think he is one of the most efficient C&S deep range shooters along with SBey but neither esp Nesmith are
great off the dribble shooters & Nesmith is far from elite as an on the move shooter lacking a plethora of high % areas all over the floor.
He should get looks in the 20's not the lottery, but anything is possible if they think there is room for improvement I guess

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nice graphic, he shoots c/s 3's at an elite level and gives nothing else of value at this point.

[getrichordie]

lol his shooting is so good, it overshadows his deficiencies everywhere else .
I think he is one of the most efficient C&S deep range shooters along with SBey but neither esp Nesmith are
great off the dribble shooters & Nesmith is far from elite as an on the move shooter lacking a plethora of high % areas all over the floor.
He should get looks in the 20's not the lottery, but anything is possible if they think there is room for improvement I guess

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nice graphic, he shoots c/s 3's at an elite level and gives nothing else of value at this point.

This wasn't just any C&S 3. Many of these were off screens or just really good off-ball movement. A lot of these were difficult shots. He does one thing and he does it well. That has value.

[Stillwater]

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nice graphic, he shoots c/s 3's at an elite level and gives nothing else of value at this point.

This wasn't just any C&S 3. Many of these were off screens or just really good off-ball movement. A lot of these were difficult shots. He does one thing and he does it well. That has value.

sure thing it has value as a catch and shoot role player like Joe Harris not a go get your shot option like Lavert ...just saying.

[Catchall]

Anyone get young Kawhi vibes from Patrick Williams?

Jimmy Butler for me.

[getrichordie]

Here's a list of how players who attempted Isolation situations more than 2x per game fared:

Note: Jared Butler and Kira Lewis Jr. rank near the bottom of the list in terms of efficiency (PPP) and Cole Anthony and Jalen Harris rank near the top.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19fiSpQUJKz1ojH0hcKZ8ez0bcb3Mz9fROGJUtAFyP_s/edit?usp=sharing

[MemphisX]

Cole Anthony has become very underrated in this draft.