Kon Knueppel

[FarBeyondDriven]

You want an old-school, total throwback comp for Kon Knueppel? How about Chris Mullin at St. Johns in he early 80s.

Chris Mullin's freshman year: 17 pts, 3.2 rebs, 3 assists, 1.4 steals, 0.2 blocks. Mullin was a 90% FT shooter by his junior year. There was no 3pt line back then. Mullin was a 6'6", 200-lb., SF/SG.

decent comp with a lot of similarities but Mullin is a HoF for a reason and was just an all around much better prospect. I don't think there's any chance Kon will make all-NBA teams or be an all-star like Mullin. I'm not even sure he'll be a starter but he's the type of smart kid you want on your 2nd unit at worse as a secondary playmaker and 3 point shooter so every team is likely considering him at a certain point.

[tmorgan]

Yeah, not buying Kon at all. I get that he’s a smart player and can really shoot. There’s a role for him in the NBA as he develops fully… but that role is bench sniper that’s a sieve on the other end. This draft isn’t deep in high quality prospects, so I’d still call him a 1st rounder, but if he goes in the lottery it’s a major mistake. Luke Kennard with a lesser handle is not a good player.

[EvanZ]

Like a less athletic Corey Kispert basically.

Kispert measured 6'6" barefoot so an inch taller.

[azcatz11]

Yeah, not buying Kon at all. I get that he’s a smart player and can really shoot. There’s a role for him in the NBA as he develops fully… but that role is bench sniper that’s a sieve on the other end. This draft isn’t deep in high quality prospects, so I’d still call him a 1st rounder, but if he goes in the lottery it’s a major mistake. Luke Kennard with a lesser handle is not a good player.

Kennard was a way better play maker in college. Not even close really. Kennard is better than his role now. I would put kennard 2 tiers above Kon

[tmorgan]

Yeah, not buying Kon at all. I get that he’s a smart player and can really shoot. There’s a role for him in the NBA as he develops fully… but that role is bench sniper that’s a sieve on the other end. This draft isn’t deep in high quality prospects, so I’d still call him a 1st rounder, but if he goes in the lottery it’s a major mistake. Luke Kennard with a lesser handle is not a good player.

Kennard was a way better play maker in college. Not even close really. Kennard is better than his role now. I would put kennard 2 tiers above Kon

Kennard is happy with his NBA role these days. He gets paid and doesn’t have to play for long stretches and his knees don’t fall off.

[JMAC3]

Obviously, Kispert was older when drafted, which I think most people will factor in their evaluations of prospects. However, I have seen people dismiss Kispert as a comp for Kon like it is a massive insult.

Kispert stats year he was drafted 18.6 ppg, 5 rpg 1.8 apg
9 Dunks
98/130 at rim 75.4%
20/58 midrange
91/207 three (90.4% assisted)

Kon stats this year 14.4 ppg, 4 rpb, 2.7 apg
2 Dunks
77/122 at rim 63%
20/49 midrange
84/207 (93% assisted)

Kon measured 6' 5 barefoot with 6'6.25 wingpspan 8' 5.5' Standing Reach and weighed 219lbs-- No Max Vert yet
Kispert measured 6' 6 barefoot with 6'7 wingspan ''8' 6 standing reach and weighted 224 lbs--37.5 Max Vert

Do you think Kon is going to match his Vert?

[Upperclass]

Kon and Kispert play nothing alike..Kispert is a big wing shooter, Kon is an onball initiator. Nor does he play like Redick or Kennard who were similar.

Kon's wingspan isnt 6.25 either.. that makes zero sense.

Read on Twitter

[2weekswithpay]

Kon has almost double the AST%, and only 25% of Kon's shots at the rim are assisted compared to 55% for Kispert. Kon got to the line more and got more steals.

In lineups without Flagg (lineup B), Kon's AST% rose to 23.7%, got to the rim a bit more, and didn't have a big drop in efficiency.

Spoiler:

Good numbers with Flagg (lineup A) and without (lineup B) against top 60 competition. His ability to get to the rim and finish didn't drop against good teams, and his AST% stayed at a respectable number.

Spoiler:

I understand the athleticism concerns, but Kon's is way ahead of Kispert as a creator.

[tester551]

Kon has almost double the AST%, and only 25% of Kon's shots at the rim are assisted compared to 55% for Kispert. Kon got to the line more and got more steals.

In lineups without Flagg (lineup B), Kon's AST% rose to 23.7%, got to the rim a bit more, and didn't have a big drop in efficiency.

Spoiler:

Good numbers with Flagg (lineup A) and without (lineup B) against top 60 competition. His ability to get to the rim and finish didn't drop against good teams, and his AST% stayed at a respectable number.

Spoiler:

I understand the athleticism concerns, but Kon's is way ahead of Kispert as a creator.

What software are you using there?
I have not come across that one before....

[2weekswithpay]

Kon has almost double the AST%, and only 25% of Kon's shots at the rim are assisted compared to 55% for Kispert. Kon got to the line more and got more steals.

In lineups without Flagg (lineup B), Kon's AST% rose to 23.7%, got to the rim a bit more, and didn't have a big drop in efficiency.

Spoiler:

Good numbers with Flagg (lineup A) and without (lineup B) against top 60 competition. His ability to get to the rim and finish didn't drop against good teams, and his AST% stayed at a respectable number.

Spoiler:

I understand the athleticism concerns, but Kon's is way ahead of Kispert as a creator.

What software are you using there?
I have not come across that one before....

Hoop-explorer.com I found it last year, and the site is amazing once you get used to it.

[JMAC3]

Kon and Kispert play nothing alike..Kispert is a big wing shooter, Kon is an onball initiator. Nor does he play like Redick or Kennard who were similar.

Kon's wingspan isnt 6.25 either.. that makes zero sense.

Read on Twitter

You think the combine is lying about his wingspan lol... that is a new one.

[JMAC3]

Kon has almost double the AST%, and only 25% of Kon's shots at the rim are assisted compared to 55% for Kispert. Kon got to the line more and got more steals.

In lineups without Flagg (lineup B), Kon's AST% rose to 23.7%, got to the rim a bit more, and didn't have a big drop in efficiency.

Spoiler:

Good numbers with Flagg (lineup A) and without (lineup B) against top 60 competition. His ability to get to the rim and finish didn't drop against good teams, and his AST% stayed at a respectable number.

Spoiler:

I understand the athleticism concerns, but Kon's is way ahead of Kispert as a creator.

I haven't seen any other prospect draft profile needing to get built around when the teams best player sat on the bench. Maybe I am wrong but I haven't seen anyone's stats get pushed this hard off splits. Should we look at Khamans rebound% when Flagg is on the bench too? Should we see what Condon splits are when Clayton didn't play too? That is weird that for a guy that is supposedly a top 5 talent we are having to cherry pick stats to make him look better. That is a redflag to me.

I would agree Kon has shown more as a passer, but overall 15.7% assist rate for a guard is pretty meaningless. That is lower than Tre Johnson and VJ Edgecombe, again I don't see people trying to prop them up as elite playmakers the way the Kon community is attempting to. Maybe I am wrong, maybe there is someone in the draft community pushing VJ assist rates when Wright and Roach were on the bench lol

I do think Kispert is bigger and a better athlete and still a terrible defender in the NBA. The Kon defense narrative is also really poor, terrible athleticism, terrible length, terrible steal and block rates- all that would mean he profiles as a terrible defender in the NBA, but for some reason people are just clinging to the hope he is going to be some outlier because again nothing about him says he will be even an average defender other than he played for an awesome Duke team and people think that means he is great.

[Upperclass]

Who has even talked about his defense in this thread? Who projects him as a good defender? Even raising that as a topic of discussion is illogical.

[FarBeyondDriven]

Kon and Kispert play nothing alike..Kispert is a big wing shooter, Kon is an onball initiator. Nor does he play like Redick or Kennard who were similar.

Kon's wingspan isnt 6.25 either.. that makes zero sense.

Read on Twitter

You think the combine is lying about his wingspan lol... that is a new one.

there was a '6' omitted in the 6'6.25" wingspan which I imagine is the confusion

[2weekswithpay]

Kon has almost double the AST%, and only 25% of Kon's shots at the rim are assisted compared to 55% for Kispert. Kon got to the line more and got more steals.

In lineups without Flagg (lineup B), Kon's AST% rose to 23.7%, got to the rim a bit more, and didn't have a big drop in efficiency.

Spoiler:

Good numbers with Flagg (lineup A) and without (lineup B) against top 60 competition. His ability to get to the rim and finish didn't drop against good teams, and his AST% stayed at a respectable number.

Spoiler:

I understand the athleticism concerns, but Kon's is way ahead of Kispert as a creator.

I haven't seen any other prospect draft profile needing to get built around when the teams best player sat on the bench. Maybe I am wrong but I haven't seen anyone's stats get pushed this hard off splits. Should we look at Khamans rebound% when Flagg is on the bench too? Should we see what Condon splits are when Clayton didn't play too? That is weird that for a guy that is supposedly a top 5 talent we are having to cherry pick stats to make him look better. That is a redflag to me.

I would agree Kon has shown more as a passer, but overall 15.7% assist rate for a guard is pretty meaningless. That is lower than Tre Johnson and VJ Edgecombe, again I don't see people trying to prop them up as elite playmakers the way the Kon community is attempting to. Maybe I am wrong, maybe there is someone in the draft community pushing VJ assist rates when Wright and Roach were on the bench lol

I do think Kispert is bigger and a better athlete and still a terrible defender in the NBA. The Kon defense narrative is also really poor, terrible athleticism, terrible length, terrible steal and block rates- all that would mean he profiles as a terrible defender in the NBA, but for some reason people are just clinging to the hope he is going to be some outlier because again nothing about him says he will be even an average defender other than he played for an awesome Duke team and people think that means he is great.

How is this cherry picking? Kon's stats look good regardless of circumstances, good teams, bad teams, conference play, etc. I brought up lineups without Flagg because when Flagg sat or didn't play, Kon was the primary on offense for Duke, and Kon was effective in that role. Kon's scoring profile still looks great, and Duke's offense remained highly effective. This was also true against good teams as well. I don't consider this to be cherry picked stats. How someone looks against good teams and as the main guy on offense is important information, right?

I'm not propping Kon up as an elite playmaker, but I don't see the Kispert comparisons. Kon is a better creator than Kispert ever was, while being 2 years younger. Kon's AST% is fine considering his usage. Tre's usage is like 6 points higher.

Any concerns about Kon's defense and athleticism are legitimate

[JMAC3]

Kon has almost double the AST%, and only 25% of Kon's shots at the rim are assisted compared to 55% for Kispert. Kon got to the line more and got more steals.

In lineups without Flagg (lineup B), Kon's AST% rose to 23.7%, got to the rim a bit more, and didn't have a big drop in efficiency.

Spoiler:

Good numbers with Flagg (lineup A) and without (lineup B) against top 60 competition. His ability to get to the rim and finish didn't drop against good teams, and his AST% stayed at a respectable number.

Spoiler:

I understand the athleticism concerns, but Kon's is way ahead of Kispert as a creator.

I haven't seen any other prospect draft profile needing to get built around when the teams best player sat on the bench. Maybe I am wrong but I haven't seen anyone's stats get pushed this hard off splits. Should we look at Khamans rebound% when Flagg is on the bench too? Should we see what Condon splits are when Clayton didn't play too? That is weird that for a guy that is supposedly a top 5 talent we are having to cherry pick stats to make him look better. That is a redflag to me.

I would agree Kon has shown more as a passer, but overall 15.7% assist rate for a guard is pretty meaningless. That is lower than Tre Johnson and VJ Edgecombe, again I don't see people trying to prop them up as elite playmakers the way the Kon community is attempting to. Maybe I am wrong, maybe there is someone in the draft community pushing VJ assist rates when Wright and Roach were on the bench lol

I do think Kispert is bigger and a better athlete and still a terrible defender in the NBA. The Kon defense narrative is also really poor, terrible athleticism, terrible length, terrible steal and block rates- all that would mean he profiles as a terrible defender in the NBA, but for some reason people are just clinging to the hope he is going to be some outlier because again nothing about him says he will be even an average defender other than he played for an awesome Duke team and people think that means he is great.

How is this cherry picking? Kon's stats look good regardless of circumstances, good teams, bad teams, conference play, etc. I brought up lineups without Flagg because when Flagg sat or didn't play, Kon was the primary on offense for Duke, and Kon was effective in that role. Kon's scoring profile still looks great, and Duke's offense remained highly effective. This was also true against good teams as well. I don't consider this to be cherry picked stats. How someone looks against good teams and as the main guy on offense is important information, right?

I'm not propping Kon up as an elite playmaker, but I don't see the Kispert comparisons. Kon is a better creator than Kispert ever was, while being 2 years younger. Kon's AST% is fine considering his usage. Tre's usage is like 6 points higher.

Any concerns about Kon's defense and athleticism are legitimate

I ask again, which other prospect this draft cycle is getting splits without player X on the court to prove they are good? I have yet to see that be the case anywhere else but if you think this is a normal prospect thing please point me to the other prospects where this is a talking point.

[Chuck Everett]

Kon can play for sure and has a place in the league, but he might be exposed on a bad team, if he was expected to do too much. On a good team in a very specific role he could be really effective.

He's an outstanding free throw shooter and he is good with movement. I think he'd look really good in Atlanta playing off of Trae, Risacher and Dyson.

[2weekswithpay]

I haven't seen any other prospect draft profile needing to get built around when the teams best player sat on the bench. Maybe I am wrong but I haven't seen anyone's stats get pushed this hard off splits. Should we look at Khamans rebound% when Flagg is on the bench too? Should we see what Condon splits are when Clayton didn't play too? That is weird that for a guy that is supposedly a top 5 talent we are having to cherry pick stats to make him look better. That is a redflag to me.

I would agree Kon has shown more as a passer, but overall 15.7% assist rate for a guard is pretty meaningless. That is lower than Tre Johnson and VJ Edgecombe, again I don't see people trying to prop them up as elite playmakers the way the Kon community is attempting to. Maybe I am wrong, maybe there is someone in the draft community pushing VJ assist rates when Wright and Roach were on the bench lol

I do think Kispert is bigger and a better athlete and still a terrible defender in the NBA. The Kon defense narrative is also really poor, terrible athleticism, terrible length, terrible steal and block rates- all that would mean he profiles as a terrible defender in the NBA, but for some reason people are just clinging to the hope he is going to be some outlier because again nothing about him says he will be even an average defender other than he played for an awesome Duke team and people think that means he is great.

How is this cherry picking? Kon's stats look good regardless of circumstances, good teams, bad teams, conference play, etc. I brought up lineups without Flagg because when Flagg sat or didn't play, Kon was the primary on offense for Duke, and Kon was effective in that role. Kon's scoring profile still looks great, and Duke's offense remained highly effective. This was also true against good teams as well. I don't consider this to be cherry picked stats. How someone looks against good teams and as the main guy on offense is important information, right?

I'm not propping Kon up as an elite playmaker, but I don't see the Kispert comparisons. Kon is a better creator than Kispert ever was, while being 2 years younger. Kon's AST% is fine considering his usage. Tre's usage is like 6 points higher.

Any concerns about Kon's defense and athleticism are legitimate

I ask again, which other prospect this draft cycle is getting splits without player X on the court to prove they are good? I have yet to see that be the case anywhere else but if you think this is a normal prospect thing please point me to the other prospects where this is a talking point.

What exactly is wrong with looking at splits against good teams and without their best player? Does nobody ever bring up how a prospect performed against good teams or in conference play? I don't participate in draft discussions here, but conference play/tougher opponents is brought up all the time. Fears' struggles in conference play were mentioned quite often.

Likewise, I don't see the issue with bringing up splits without Flagg. It's fair to knock Kon down for playing with the best player in the country, and it's fair to bring up how he played without said player.

[JMAC3]

How is this cherry picking? Kon's stats look good regardless of circumstances, good teams, bad teams, conference play, etc. I brought up lineups without Flagg because when Flagg sat or didn't play, Kon was the primary on offense for Duke, and Kon was effective in that role. Kon's scoring profile still looks great, and Duke's offense remained highly effective. This was also true against good teams as well. I don't consider this to be cherry picked stats. How someone looks against good teams and as the main guy on offense is important information, right?

I'm not propping Kon up as an elite playmaker, but I don't see the Kispert comparisons. Kon is a better creator than Kispert ever was, while being 2 years younger. Kon's AST% is fine considering his usage. Tre's usage is like 6 points higher.

Any concerns about Kon's defense and athleticism are legitimate

I ask again, which other prospect this draft cycle is getting splits without player X on the court to prove they are good? I have yet to see that be the case anywhere else but if you think this is a normal prospect thing please point me to the other prospects where this is a talking point.

What exactly is wrong with looking at splits against good teams and without their best player? Does nobody ever bring up how a prospect performed against good teams or in conference play? I don't participate in draft discussions here, but conference play/tougher opponents is brought up all the time. Fears' struggles in conference play were mentioned quite often.

Likewise, I don't see the issue with bringing up splits without Flagg. It's fair to knock Kon down for playing with the best player in the country, and it's fair to bring up how he played without said player.

My point is nobody else is doing that, we are doing it because the goal is to say Kon is actually a better passer than his numbers appear. Right? That is the goal of pulling the data without Flagg?

Nobody is pulling up Dylan Harper numbers to show he scored more points per 100 possession with Bailey on the bench right? You know why? Because Harper was awesome scoring all the time and there is no need to try to oversell it. He is just good at scoring.

The fact that we are trying to sell ourselves on Kon being this hidden playmaker because he had a good game vs Georgia Tech, a team that went .500 in the worst power 5 conference, is us trying to oversell him. If he was an awesome playmaker he probably isn't behind Sion James in assists per game.

It is whatever, it is just an opinion. But the draft coverage I am consuming on Kon seems to be overselling him as a playmaker and defender. Vecenie pushing Kon as some awesome 2 way player in the NBA when there is nothing about his defensive profile that says he will be good on defense.

I will take Jeremiah Fears as a playmaker over Kon because he consistently can get down hill as a #1 option surrounded by mediocre talent and has actually showcased elite wiggle, good vision, elite traits with 9 dunks for a player his size. Vs Kon who has 2 dunks, zero wiggle in terms of crossovers or dribble moves, his highlight tape has the most basic finishing package available surrounded by 5+ other future NBA players...

Imagine Fears surrounded by the shooting of Proctor, James, Evans and then having Cooper Flagg and Khaman Maluach to pass to around the rim. Do we think Fears struggles to get to the rim and finish in that system or is he massively helped by having 4 other guys that are getting drafted around him?

[King Ken]

Kon can play for sure and has a place in the league, but he might be exposed on a bad team, if he was expected to do too much. On a good team in a very specific role he could be really effective.

He's an outstanding free throw shooter and he is good with movement. I think he'd look really good in Atlanta playing off of Trae, Risacher and Dyson.

Atlanta needs more two way players with either length or size. Kon would be a nice add but Coward is significantly a better fit for what we need at the 2. I like Kon in Portland. Different style of SG compared to Sharpe but they need more shooting and playmaking