2020 NBA Draft

[Roddy B for 3]

i get why people want to go the Wiseman route, heck I'm kinda/sorta leaning that way for the Warriors only because I have 0 faith in Myers being able to maneuver the top 5 so getting Wiseman wouldn't be the worst thing because he's relatively safe, at the very least it's a + asset we can always flip if we need to

but again theoretically speaking where does Wiseman fit on this list? really this list of C types that I feel do deserve to be picked this high if they develop into this archetype:

- the defensive anchor - Gobert type defensive anchor in the middle
- the elite offensive player - KAT type multi-level elite offensive scorer
- the elite playmaker - Jokic type that can run offense
- the all around C - Embiid type that can be a defensive and offensive force

and then you have the Drummond/Ayton category...this is probably where I think Wiseman lands tbh...which is obviously fine but if I'm picking this high I'd rather aim higher.

Nah, stay strong in your opinion.

Picking Wiseman is a mistake. He looks like he'll be somewhere around Hassan Whiteside, JaVale McGee, Nerlens Noel, Clint Capela.

Capela is not yet in his prime and has been the 3rd-best player on a 50+ win team the last 3 years. He's a top 5 player from his draft class. If you get a Clint Capela, an above-average starter on a good team, anywhere in this draft that's a good outcome.

Wiseman being a 7'1" Clint Capella with a 7'4" wingspan, that'd be a #1 in most drafts.

[Roddy B for 3]

Nah, stay strong in your opinion.

Picking Wiseman is a mistake. He looks like he'll be somewhere around Hassan Whiteside, JaVale McGee, Nerlens Noel, Clint Capela.

Capela is not yet in his prime and has been the 3rd-best player on a 50+ win team the last 3 years. He's a top 5 player from his draft class. If you get a Clint Capela, an above-average starter on a good team, anywhere in this draft that's a good outcome.

you're using hindsight, that's not how it works, in a redraft Brogdon goes top 5 doesn't mean he should've went top 5.

If Brogdan ends up being the #5 player from his draft then obviously he should've been taken in that range.

"Ends up" means it's not yet determined if he will or won't be. He was injury flagged or he would've probably been drafted much closer to where he should've been.

[zimpy27]

Nah, stay strong in your opinion.

Picking Wiseman is a mistake. He looks like he'll be somewhere around Hassan Whiteside, JaVale McGee, Nerlens Noel, Clint Capela.

Capela is not yet in his prime and has been the 3rd-best player on a 50+ win team the last 3 years. He's a top 5 player from his draft class. If you get a Clint Capela, an above-average starter on a good team, anywhere in this draft that's a good outcome.

Wiseman being a 7'1" Clint Capella with a 7'4" wingspan, that'd be a #1 in most drafts.

No, not a bigger Capela. A player with the same output as Capela who peaked as the 3rd best player on a team with the two top RPM scores of the season.

[clyde21]

Capela is not yet in his prime and has been the 3rd-best player on a 50+ win team the last 3 years. He's a top 5 player from his draft class. If you get a Clint Capela, an above-average starter on a good team, anywhere in this draft that's a good outcome.

you're using hindsight, that's not how it works, in a redraft Brogdon goes top 5 doesn't mean he should've went top 5.

No I'm just using my brain and actually examining how this 'archetype' of player actually does in the modern NBA rather than reflexively going 'durr if he doesn't shoot threes or pass like Jokic he's worthless.' Even players like Drummond and Whiteside outperformed their draft slot.

The Brogdon point is very weak and simplistic (par for the course) since about half the players selected in his draft are still younger than he was before he had ever played a single NBA minute; even someone like Zubac is currently having a better season than Brogdon's rookie year while being 22 as opposed to 24. Additionally, whatever 'archetype' you want to place Brogdon in (combo guards, 4-year college players) I would guarantee has a higher bust rate than the pool of guys who have some athleticism and coordination to go with being taller/longer than 95+ percent of NBA players.

Clyde, keep up the name-calling, and there'll be no pony for Christmas. - Ruz

[Roddy B for 3]

Capela is not yet in his prime and has been the 3rd-best player on a 50+ win team the last 3 years. He's a top 5 player from his draft class. If you get a Clint Capela, an above-average starter on a good team, anywhere in this draft that's a good outcome.

Wiseman being a 7'1" Clint Capella with a 7'4" wingspan, that'd be a #1 in most drafts.

No, not a bigger Capela. A player with the same output as Capela who peaked as the 3rd best player on a team with the two top RPM scores of the season.

We judge Wiseman differently.

I have him as a guy who peaks as a somewhere between occasional all-star and perinial all-star.

AD, Ayton, Gobert, Jokic, Towns, Zion, Giannis, Siakim, Embiid, and Bam are the only bigs I'd rather build around than Wiseman moving forward.

Sabonis, Lauri, KP, Harrell, Green, Bagley, Adams, LMA, Capella, JJJ, Drummond, Turner, Sabonis, Love, WCJ, Collins, Robinson, Allen are the tier below Wiseman imo.

I see Wiseman as a 17-24ppg/8-12rpg/2-3apg/2blk/.5stl 55/0/75 guy while being a top 3-10 defender at the Center position. (Lower end stats mean the team is probably more stacked, while higher end stats are him as the featured offensive piece).

I see a better version of Tyson Chandler, with potential to expand his offensive game. Fwiw Chandler went #2 in his draft, and if not for injuries probably would be looked back as worthy of that spot.

[MemphisX]

There is no way I would take Wiseman over Jaren Jackson.

[Roddy B for 3]

There is no way I would take Wiseman over Jaren Jackson.

Alot of people would probably agree with you, probably most on Realgm. JJJ over Wiseman is the risk adverse take and normally I'm on that side.

JJJ has more offensive tools, and that's a floor raiser, but Wiseman looks to be more dynamic as a rim roller lob threat, thus more efficient offensively (tho more limited) and I project Wiseman to be better defensively.

How tall is JJJ? I've seen 6'11" before the draft but I read Memphis measured him at 6'9" this preseason?

If your big spreads the floor then who scores inside? Guards or wings. Well if it's guards, most guards who make a living attacking the basket get injured. If it's wings, well most traditional championship teams have an elite defender at the 5 and to me JJJ looks like a classic 4 with more shooting range than previous eras. Generally bugs are more efficient inside than wings/guards and wings/guards are more efficient on the perimeter. It's traditionally easier to have elite defenses built around star rim protectors (which both JJJ and Wiseman project to be) who play the 5 as opposed to the 4.

JJJ should be hoping to be Chris Bosh while Wiseman should be hoping to be a better on offensive fslastbreak version of Rudy Gobert.

If Wiseman scores inside that leaves guards and wings to do their more natural thing of being perimeter players. That just allows GM's to have a wider variety of players who fit more naturally.

Also Wiseman looks to be a top 10 rpg type while JJJ might be a 7-9rpg guy.

I don't mean to down talk JJJ to someone with the name "Memphisx". So, I'll compliment Memphis to end this long post.

If Ja's health holds (it's honestly difficult for me to think of freakish athlete PG's who don't get hurt, even some bounce back fine).

I think JJJ clearly projects as a potential allstar and Clarke looks like a Lamar Odom level player (read 6th man of the year type) in the right context, which next to Ja and JJJ that's the perfect fit for Clarke.

Memphis to me has 2/3 of what could be a championship caliber big man trio 3 years from now. Obviously Ja projects to be a championship caliber starting PG in the next few years. Guys like Crowder, Brooks, Melton probably are currently in or will be good enough to be top 10 guys on a championship caliber team. Valancuinas I have doubts about as anything more than a (highly effective) 15-25mpg 5 on a true title contender, during deep postseason runs (including garbage time).
Y'all's PG rotation looks set if everyone keeps developing and no one leaves. JJJ and Clarke should obviously be good enough to at least be #2 and #3 bugs on a title team in their prime. If Memphis can get a 5 (like Wiseman) who can stay on the floor in crunch time, leave JJJ at the 4 and have Clarke as a suber sub, that'd do wonders. Okobo + Brooks + Crowder + Jones + a foul eating big (Alex Len type) + 1 more dynamic wing and Ja being MVP caliber (he might already be top 15 in that regard for me) and Memphis could be a real title threat.
Playoff rotation:
???/JJJ/Clarke/foul eater
JJJ/Clarke/small ball stretch 4
???/small ball stretch 4
Brooks/Okobo
Morant/Okobo/Jones

Crowder might age out if being that small ball stretch 4. IDK who Memphis could get to be a game changer I the wing or as that 5 next to JJJ.

[Stillwater]

limited film lends itself to higher risk...but does not take away from obvious tools a player has,no matter who they have faced or ltd the action comparisons existed, just whether or not those tools will transfer has to account for who they faced esp if the following is not all there:
a prospect has elite athletic control of their skills and their skills are elite or project to be, and on top of that they have an above proto level combo of anthro and IQ
I think Wiseman is almost a lock to go top 3 even if certain teams value more proof from a full 1 and done. maybe somebody else will become more deserving by June, but his value aint going down for lack of playing

[clyde21]

There is no way I would take Wiseman over Jaren Jackson.

JJJ is quite clearly the more valuable type of big to me

[Duke4life831]

Say Jalen Johnson skips Duke and enters the 2020 draft. Where would you guys take him?

[Marcus]

Say Jalen Johnson skips Duke and enters the 2020 draft. Where would you guys take him?

is this a thing?

[Duke4life831]

Say Jalen Johnson skips Duke and enters the 2020 draft. Where would you guys take him?

is this a thing?

Age eligible and skipping out on his last year of high school. Will be eligible if he wants to be.

I don't think he goes straight to the NBA, I think he goes over seas, I don't expect to see him in a Duke jersey, just curious where people would have him if he did join this draft.

[Marcus]

Say Jalen Johnson skips Duke and enters the 2020 draft. Where would you guys take him?

is this a thing?

Age eligible and skipping out on his last year of high school. Will be eligible if he wants to be.

I don't think he goes straight to the NBA, I think he goes over seas, I don't expect to see him in a Duke jersey, just curious where people would have him if he did join this draft.

would like to see him play in a more intense setting before i just take the flyer on him. skill wise i think he's a top 5. would definitely take him over any other forward in the class RN (haven't really seen enough Avdija).

[Duke4life831]

is this a thing?

Age eligible and skipping out on his last year of high school. Will be eligible if he wants to be.

I don't think he goes straight to the NBA, I think he goes over seas, I don't expect to see him in a Duke jersey, just curious where people would have him if he did join this draft.

would like to see him play in a more intense setting before i just take the flyer on him. skill wise i think he's a top 5. would definitely take him over any other forward in the class RN (haven't really seen enough Avdija).

Ya I would love to see how his athleticism looks again higher quality competition. That is his big knock is the questionable athleticism. Is it bad enough where he struggles to get any kind of separation, or with his size and skill it doesn't really matter.

[Marcus]

Age eligible and skipping out on his last year of high school. Will be eligible if he wants to be.

I don't think he goes straight to the NBA, I think he goes over seas, I don't expect to see him in a Duke jersey, just curious where people would have him if he did join this draft.

would like to see him play in a more intense setting before i just take the flyer on him. skill wise i think he's a top 5. would definitely take him over any other forward in the class RN (haven't really seen enough Avdija).

Ya I would love to see how his athleticism looks again higher quality competition. That is his big knock is the questionable athleticism. Is it bad enough where he struggles to get any kind of separation, or with his size and skill it doesn't really matter.

yeah that's the part for me and his tendency to not play up to his talent. once that gets answered then i'm good. off measurerables and skillset kid could get paid today though.

any idea where he's looking to play overseas?

[clyde21]

he'd be in T1 for me for sure

[LSandersBong]

JJJ has grown from 6'11 to 7'1 James Wiseman doesn't compare anywhere close to a prospect as JJJ did.

That saying I do like James Wiseman, in high school he did show a mid range game and shot a couple of 3s , his defense equates to more just being an athletic shot blocker at the moment but he still has the most upside in this draft.

Its a tough sell for a GM though, if you take him first after a 3 game sample size and he busts, you probably loose your job

[Marcus]

Wiseman isn't being drafted solely for his 3 game sample size at Memphis. He's been on radars for a while which is why he hasn't really moved from the convo and it made perfect sense to not come back and just sit at home and get ready for June.

[Duke4life831]

would like to see him play in a more intense setting before i just take the flyer on him. skill wise i think he's a top 5. would definitely take him over any other forward in the class RN (haven't really seen enough Avdija).

Ya I would love to see how his athleticism looks again higher quality competition. That is his big knock is the questionable athleticism. Is it bad enough where he struggles to get any kind of separation, or with his size and skill it doesn't really matter.

yeah that's the part for me and his tendency to not play up to his talent. once that gets answered then i'm good. off measurerables and skillset kid could get paid today though.

any idea where he's looking to play overseas?

No clue at all, that is just an assumption by me. He had his meniscus worked on in September and was supposed to be out 3 months max. Started posting vids of him playing pickup ball in December and saying he was healthy. But he wasn't showing up to IMG. Some crazy rumors around that started, then after a week or so of denying he left IMG, he officially announced he left IMG. And the last I have heard, he has no plans on returning to school this year.

Ive heard some chatter for awhile now that him at Duke was up in the air. I know some people aren't too confident he will ever play a game at Duke. Now to me I assumed that meant over seas. But he is barely age eligible for the 2020 draft and with him not attending high school this past year, Im sure if they challenge the NBA on it, he could pass the "1 year removed from high school" rule as well.

Then add in Duke basically almost stopped recruiting Kuminga for a little bit, then once all this happened, the entire Duke coaching staff and team show up to his game and it looks like Duke is all the way back on the Kuminga train. I honestly would be shocked if he ends up on Duke's campus.

[Marcus]

Ya I would love to see how his athleticism looks again higher quality competition. That is his big knock is the questionable athleticism. Is it bad enough where he struggles to get any kind of separation, or with his size and skill it doesn't really matter.

yeah that's the part for me and his tendency to not play up to his talent. once that gets answered then i'm good. off measurerables and skillset kid could get paid today though.

any idea where he's looking to play overseas?

No clue at all, that is just an assumption by me. He had his meniscus worked on in September and was supposed to be out 3 months max. Started posting vids of him playing pickup ball in December and saying he was healthy. But he wasn't showing up to IMG. Some crazy rumors around that started, then after a week or so of denying he left IMG, he officially announced he left IMG. And the last I have heard, he has no plans on returning to school this year.

Ive heard some chatter for awhile now that him at Duke was up in the air. I know some people aren't too confident he will ever play a game at Duke. Now to me I assumed that meant over seas. But he is barely age eligible for the 2020 draft and with him not attending high school this past year, Im sure if they challenge the NBA on it, he could pass the "1 year removed from high school" rule as well.

Then add in Duke basically almost stopped recruiting Kuminga for a little bit, then once all this happened, the entire Duke coaching staff and team show up to his game and it looks like Duke is all the way back on the Kuminga train. I honestly would be shocked if he ends up on Duke's campus.

that's pretty interesting. i was wondering why i hadn't seen much from him this year which the other kids in the class were indeed losing their collective minds on the court. If he did declare this year i would wonder how high he is being viewed by the league. Would teams be more leery and or less leery since most of the kids in this class haven't shown enough to standout. would he just fall into that category as well and the risk doesn't matter or do you pump the breaks at some point as a franchise? I'd like to see him at Duke next year as i think it helps shine light on him and with those collegiate ballers on the roster he could/should shine as the piece that brings it all together. Hopefully if he does go overseas he goes somewhere that his full game can be showcased. definitely keep us posted though if you'd be so kind good sir.