2022 NBA Draft

[Duke4life831]

Im having a harder and harder time making an argument from having Mathurin being the first guard taken in this draft. All year long he has been just climbing up my rankings and I think I have him #1 when it comes to the guards. Im waiting to see Sharpe do some measurements to get a better feeling on how big he actually is.

But at the moment Bennedict kind of checks off all the boxes for me. Now granted I have him as my #1 guard because I think this is a pretty weak guard class up at the top.

But the dude is 6'6-6'7
Seems to have pretty long arms
Is a good athlete
Good form on his jumper
Solid FT shooter and solid production with his jumper
Not the tightest and most dynamic handle though

I just like the idea of taking him and early on he can focus on being a 3&D guard with plenty of upside of hopefully his on ball ability growing and his offensive role growing as well.

His listed height seems like a massive stretch to me, he’s closer to 6’4 than 6’7 imo. I mean he looks shorter than a lot of the 6’5/6’6 guys on his own team.
To me he’s KCP 2.0, which is honestly not bad value in the 6-10 range

I think 6'7 might be generous, but I dont think he is any shorter than 6'6. But even getting out of the exact measurement of his height, the point Im making is he is the biggest out of main guards being talked about to go early (Ivey and Davis) and he has good size for the guard position and will have some positional versatility with his size.

I actually dont think KCP is all that bad of a comp. And is one of the reasons I kind of like Mathurin more than the other guards. I think KCP is the floor for Mathurin. I think you take Mathurin with the hope that he can add some dynamic ability to his game. If not you still know you got yourself a solid 3&D guy that can guard multiple positions.

I like the potential with him because he is a good athlete and has a good shot to go with his size. And ya I think he has a solid floor where you can easily see him as a good 3&D guard.

I also want to be crystal clear. This is not me saying I think he should be in the discussion for #1 pick or anything like that. I just think its a pretty weak class for guards at the top and neither Davis or Ivey have done anything in my opinion that has separated themselves from the rest of the guard pack.

[MotownMadness]

I really like Mathurin as well. Just watching him tonight he was getting his shot from anywhere on the court and his playmaking is pretty good too.

[The Moose]

Im having a harder and harder time making an argument from having Mathurin being the first guard taken in this draft. All year long he has been just climbing up my rankings and I think I have him #1 when it comes to the guards. Im waiting to see Sharpe do some measurements to get a better feeling on how big he actually is.

But at the moment Bennedict kind of checks off all the boxes for me. Now granted I have him as my #1 guard because I think this is a pretty weak guard class up at the top.

But the dude is 6'6-6'7
Seems to have pretty long arms
Is a good athlete
Good form on his jumper
Solid FT shooter and solid production with his jumper
Not the tightest and most dynamic handle though

I just like the idea of taking him and early on he can focus on being a 3&D guard with plenty of upside of hopefully his on ball ability growing and his offensive role growing as well.

His listed height seems like a massive stretch to me, he’s closer to 6’4 than 6’7 imo. I mean he looks shorter than a lot of the 6’5/6’6 guys on his own team.
To me he’s KCP 2.0, which is honestly not bad value in the 6-10 range

I think 6'7 might be generous, but I dont think he is any shorter than 6'6. But even getting out of the exact measurement of his height, the point Im making is he is the biggest out of main guards being talked about to go early (Ivey and Davis) and he has good size for the guard position and will have some positional versatility with his size.

I actually dont think KCP is all that bad of a comp. And is one of the reasons I kind of like Mathurin more than the other guards. I think KCP is the floor for Mathurin. I think you take Mathurin with the hope that he can add some dynamic ability to his game. If not you still know you got yourself a solid 3&D guy that can guard multiple positions.

I like the potential with him because he is a good athlete and has a good shot to go with his size. And ya I think he has a solid floor where you can easily see him as a good 3&D guard.

I also want to be crystal clear. This is not me saying I think he should be in the discussion for #1 pick or anything like that. I just think its a pretty weak class for guards at the top and neither Davis or Ivey have done anything in my opinion that has separated themselves from the rest of the guard pack.

Agreed, KCP's career is probably his floor, but just in terms of prospects coming into the draft they remind me so much of each other. I liked drafting KCP at the time, and I would be ok drafting Mathurin if the Pistons fell to say 6.
I feel like Mathurin is a redemption shot for my belief in KCP. I always felt KCP should've been slightly better than he's ended up being throughout his career.
I definitely have him over Davis too, and in the same range as Ivey depending on roster fit

[Nuntius]

Sorta like a Ja Morant then?

what? Morant averaged 10 assists a game in college. Ivey's barely at 3.

Ya the Ivey being a PG thing needs to die already haha.

I actually think Ivey has one of the clearer archetypes in this draft. You take him with the Mitchell/LaVine view point. He will be your primary ball handler but not your primary floor general.

You just need a PG to pair with him that fits that. A Conley/Ball fit with that kind of player perfectly. If I draft Ivey, I'm probably looking to sign Tyus Jones this summer to pair with him. Because he is the kind of PG you'd like next to him. Super smart PG that doesn't need to dominate the ball but can settle the offense down and run sets when needed.

If you're drafting Ivey to be a PG, that's going to go very poorly.

I agree that Ivey has a clear archetype and that's why I want my Pacers to draft him. We already have a very good young guard in Tyrese Haliburton that excels in playmaking but isn't much of a volume scorer (he can definitely score, though). Ivey is kind of the opposite of that. He excels in scoring but isn't much of a playmaker. So, we'd have Ivey to score in bunches and Haliburton to be a floor general. Both are dynamic on the open court as well and both want to play at a high-tempo.

As far as guard tandems are concerned, this is one that seems to fit, imo.

[NYPiston]

I get the Ja comparisons from an aesthetic perspective, but while Ivey is a great athlete I don't think he's Ja, and they are going to occupy different roles. I see Ivey as a secondary playmaker who can moonlight as a primary playmaker a la SGA + Mitchell, etc.

Yep, that's exactly what his role will be. He'll never be a primary ballhandler/point guard. He'll be an explosive combo guard with elite rim attacking ability and a guy who demands the ball in the clutch. If he can be more consistent with the 3, look out.

On another note, is it just me or is Mathurin not being talked about enough? I know that he's a little short for a 2 (I see that Duke4Life has him at 6'6 or 6'7, he's more like 6'3-6'4 to my eye) but a guy with his athleticism that flashes defensive potential, is learning how to score in multiple ways and hits the 3 with consistency should be getting more pub as a potential top 5 pick. I see a lot of projections with him in the 7-10 range, even a few outside the top 10, and I think he should be right there in that 2nd tier with Ivey, Davis, Murray, Sharpe (assuming that he declares) etc., if not higher than a few of those guys.

Edit: I should have read the last few pages before mentioning that Mathurin hasn't been talked about enough haha

[BlazersBroncos]

Mathurin has alot of Klay to him as well. I dont think he ever becomes the same shooter but there are a lot of similarities.

I would say top development curve - Klay Thompson w/o quite as much shooting, middle curve - KCP

[Duke4life831]

what? Morant averaged 10 assists a game in college. Ivey's barely at 3.

Ya the Ivey being a PG thing needs to die already haha.

I actually think Ivey has one of the clearer archetypes in this draft. You take him with the Mitchell/LaVine view point. He will be your primary ball handler but not your primary floor general.

You just need a PG to pair with him that fits that. A Conley/Ball fit with that kind of player perfectly. If I draft Ivey, I'm probably looking to sign Tyus Jones this summer to pair with him. Because he is the kind of PG you'd like next to him. Super smart PG that doesn't need to dominate the ball but can settle the offense down and run sets when needed.

If you're drafting Ivey to be a PG, that's going to go very poorly.

I agree that Ivey has a clear archetype and that's why I want my Pacers to draft him. We already have a very good young guard in Tyrese Haliburton that excels in playmaking but isn't much of a volume scorer (he can definitely score, though). Ivey is kind of the opposite of that. He excels in scoring but isn't much of a playmaker. So, we'd have Ivey to score in bunches and Haliburton to be a floor general. Both are dynamic on the open court as well and both want to play at a high-tempo.

As far as guard tandems are concerned, this is one that seems to fit, imo.

I think it could work for sure and if the Pacers have a chance to take Ivey, I would be all for it.

My only push back from that would be I like the idea of giving Haliburton the ball even more and asking him to expand his role. Just for a quick comparison for Time per possession

Conley: 5.4
Lonzo: 4.2
Haliburton: 7.6

Both Conley and Ball arent 1st on their team's when it comes to Time Per Possession. And if I was trying to maximize Ivey, ideally he would be in that same situation where he is 1st in time per possession on his team, with a smart efficient PG to pair up with him.

I like the fact that Haliburton handles the ball a lot. I think he's more than capable of being a high volume on ball guy that scores and runs the offense, I think that will lead to good things with him.

But again that is with the idea of maximizing Ivey. If I were a Pacer fan and asked if I wanted a Haliburton/Ivey duo, Im all for it. Because ya there is still enough time for both guys to be high volume on ball guys and with Haliburton's skill set, he can still be super effective playing off the ball when you have Ivey with the ball. Definitely a duo I would like to see.

[SeattleJazzFan]

i'm bullish on mathurin. thicker/stronger than kcp, otherwise i guess it's not a bad comparison, though i think he has a chance to be a better all around SG than KCP.

[clyde21]

what? Morant averaged 10 assists a game in college. Ivey's barely at 3.

Ya the Ivey being a PG thing needs to die already haha.

I actually think Ivey has one of the clearer archetypes in this draft. You take him with the Mitchell/LaVine view point. He will be your primary ball handler but not your primary floor general.

You just need a PG to pair with him that fits that. A Conley/Ball fit with that kind of player perfectly. If I draft Ivey, I'm probably looking to sign Tyus Jones this summer to pair with him. Because he is the kind of PG you'd like next to him. Super smart PG that doesn't need to dominate the ball but can settle the offense down and run sets when needed.

If you're drafting Ivey to be a PG, that's going to go very poorly.

I agree that Ivey has a clear archetype and that's why I want my Pacers to draft him. We already have a very good young guard in Tyrese Haliburton that excels in playmaking but isn't much of a volume scorer (he can definitely score, though). Ivey is kind of the opposite of that. He excels in scoring but isn't much of a playmaker. So, we'd have Ivey to score in bunches and Haliburton to be a floor general. Both are dynamic on the open court as well and both want to play at a high-tempo.

As far as guard tandems are concerned, this is one that seems to fit, imo.

good plan

Indy was one of the places I thought Ivey fits best, even more so now that Hali's on board

only issue is Duarte/Ivey essentially are both 2s, maybe Duarte can play the 3 in some capacities but one of them essentially will have to come off the bench.

but yea, love Hali/Ivey on paper.

[Duke4life831]

i'm bullish on mathurin. thicker/stronger than kcp, otherwise i guess it's not a bad comparison, though i think he has a chance to be a better all around SG than KCP.

Its more of a comparison of KCP coming out of Georgia than what KCP has turned into. KCP at Georgia was pretty much their only offensive weapon and he looked pretty good in that role and ended up SEC POY and 2nd in scoring. Its just that KCP's offensive game never took that next step in the NBA and fell into more of a 3&D role.

You essentially take Mathurin with the same hope of what people had for KCP and that he will have a good progression and his offensive game will expand. But also knowing his floor is a solid 3&D guy.

[CptCrunch]

Wendell Moore is my sleeper of the draft.

He is a SG sized 6'5" in-shoes, 6'10.5" span, 213 lb player who can play point guard. Despite his junior tag, he is the exact same age as Cade (and basically the same size, weight, length, mediocre-ish athleticism).

I would rate him as a superior playmaker and inferior shooter to Cade. If he could create his own shot like Cade, he would actually be better than Cade. Mocking him at late first to early second is criminal.

Fun fact, Ty Ty Washington the freshman is only 2 months younger than Moore but is being mocked a #7-12 pick these days with worse size, shooting, and play making. I can't see a compelling case to rate Ty Ty that much higher than Moore. You can discount Moore's college experience, but these two kids are the same age both right now in college, one with better measurable and stats, the other has that 'freshman' tag.

[DirtyDez]

Watch on YouTube

[Coeur]

As much as NIL deals might bust college football it may actually help deepen NCAA basketball and lessen the amount of not future NBA players leaving early?

Seems like there’s always 50+ guys going pro early that have no business doing so. Sure many aren’t good enough as a student but I just have to wonder if a ton of borderline type prospects will start spending 3 and 4 years at school with the ability to pay these kids now.


Shouldn’t a group of boosters be able to pay for some pretty legit ncaa squads until these rules change a bit??

[clyde21]

Seems like there’s always 50+ guys going pro early that have no business doing so.

irrelevant - the players that have 'no business going pro' (whatever that means) are also likely not benefiting from the NIL program.

[Kobblehead]

Mathurin ain't special IMO.

Bad steal percentage, bad block percentage, subpar assist percentage. Is assisted on 61.2% of his field goals at the rim. He's just an athletic shooter, IMO.

[DCasey91]

Wendell Moore is my sleeper of the draft.

He is a SG sized 6'5" in-shoes, 6'10.5" span, 213 lb player who can play point guard. Despite his junior tag, he is the exact same age as Cade (and basically the same size, weight, length, mediocre-ish athleticism).

I would rate him as a superior playmaker and inferior shooter to Cade. If he could create his own shot like Cade, he would actually be better than Cade. Mocking him at late first to early second is criminal.

Fun fact, Ty Ty Washington the freshman is only 2 months younger than Moore but is being mocked a #7-12 pick these days with worse size, shooting, and play making. I can't see a compelling case to rate Ty Ty that much higher than Moore. You can discount Moore's college experience, but these two kids are the same age both right now in college, one with better measurable and stats, the other has that 'freshman' tag.

Age and experience does play a factor here. Tyty has been excellent and should be drafted high. Nothing wrong with Moore but there’s an essential development curve with Tyty.

[DCasey91]

You can’t discount College experience at all yes for an elite world sport College is on low low tier of a developmental system but it’s still a system all the same.

NBA needs the exact model of the Majors (A, AA, AAA) sooner rather than later then the argument for Moore would be a lot more sound.

NBA still has a very real problem of youngsters going in who don’t deserve to be just on age they are not ready. Until that problem is remedied the product isn’t the best it’s going to be.

Also NBA teams having a strict secondary squad for juniors/zone prospects only will bring outstanding results. It’s tried and tested and works wonderfully

[Saints14]

You can’t discount College experience at all yes for an elite world sport College is on low low tier of a developmental system but it’s still a system all the same.

NBA needs the exact model of the Majors (A, AA, AAA) sooner rather than later then the argument for Moore would be a lot more sound.

NBA still has a very real problem of youngsters going in who don’t deserve to be just on age they are not ready. Until that problem is remedied the product isn’t the best it’s going to be.

Also NBA teams having a strict secondary squad for juniors/zone prospects only will bring outstanding results. It’s tried and tested and works wonderfully

I think the G league is making strides towards being a legit minor league for guys who aren't ready for the NBA, but it's not quite there yet. The Ignite is a decent alternative to college ball for top prospects but I think it would be cool to implement a more formal "domestic draft and stash" for guys who need more development. Maybe you can draft a kid, and agree to a 1 year G-league stint before their rookie contract kicks in? The player would have to wait a year before getting their NBA salary (they'd get a G-league salary) but their draft position would be locked in, and teams wouldn't have to eat years of a rookie deal to develop them

[azcatz11]

Mathurin ain't special IMO.

Bad steal percentage, bad block percentage, subpar assist percentage. Is assisted on 61.2% of his field goals at the rim. He's just an athletic shooter, IMO.

I think that's fair. He's small also. He's been great for us but I'm not sure he's ever more than a role player in the league (which I guess you're drafting him in the 6-14 range)

I think his best attribute is competitiveness which may sound crazy. His stamina is off the charts also.

His ceiling is 7th guy a championship team IMO.

[DCasey91]

You can’t discount College experience at all yes for an elite world sport College is on low low tier of a developmental system but it’s still a system all the same.

NBA needs the exact model of the Majors (A, AA, AAA) sooner rather than later then the argument for Moore would be a lot more sound.

NBA still has a very real problem of youngsters going in who don’t deserve to be just on age they are not ready. Until that problem is remedied the product isn’t the best it’s going to be.

Also NBA teams having a strict secondary squad for juniors/zone prospects only will bring outstanding results. It’s tried and tested and works wonderfully

I think the G league is making strides towards being a legit minor league for guys who aren't ready for the NBA, but it's not quite there yet. The Ignite is a decent alternative to college ball for top prospects but I think it would be cool to implement a more formal "domestic draft and stash" for guys who need more development. Maybe you can draft a kid, and agree to a 1 year G-league stint before their rookie contract kicks in? The player would have to wait a year before getting their NBA salary (they'd get a G-league salary) but their draft position would be locked in, and teams wouldn't have to eat years of a rookie deal to develop them

Exactly I’m thinking more 3 years (18-21 and onwards) access to zone prospects first dibs essentially. Kind of like a European style approach but in the USA. All NBA teams have a junior squad that trains with the starters and bench players etc so it’s all one thing. Say 3 youngsters on each list brings it to a legit 15. Then you can get rid of two ways and 10 day contracts which is silly imo the draft slot is where it’s locked in. Also you can’t cheat if another club bids on it using their pick as circumventing the draft can’t happen. So you won’t see a top ten prospect go in the 40’s so to speak.

Happens in our national sport and they have it bang on for a draft laden one. Keeps local talent and allows them to develop properly. Also extension signings happen during their first year sometimes if they are that talented. Now that high school kids are coming in I believe there will be a lot more developmental system problems that will occur this is just one of many ways to rectify it long term.