Zach Edey, 7-4

[HadAnEffectHere]

It's hard to have very strong feelings about Edey when this draft class has been so horrible and he's like... fine and was picked 9th.

Salaun, Sheppard, and Cody Williams are going to be out of the NBA in a couple of years and he's going to stick around, it's whatever.

[JMAC3]

It's hard to have very strong feelings about Edey when this draft class has been so horrible and he's like... fine and was picked 9th.

Salaun, Sheppard, and Cody Williams are going to be out of the NBA in a couple of years and he's going to stick around, it's whatever.

Guess it just depends on how much you value age when it comes to prospects.
Someone like Devin Carter struggling as a rookie at age 23 is a lot different to me than guys like Tidjane Salaun and Ron Holland struggling as 19 yr olds.

The fact that Missi, Ware and Flip are basically just as good as Edey is right now probably means that in 18 months chances are all 3 are better players.

[HadAnEffectHere]

It's hard to have very strong feelings about Edey when this draft class has been so horrible and he's like... fine and was picked 9th.

Salaun, Sheppard, and Cody Williams are going to be out of the NBA in a couple of years and he's going to stick around, it's whatever.

Guess it just depends on how much you value age when it comes to prospects.
Someone like Devin Carter struggling as a rookie at age 23 is a lot different to me than guys like Tidjane Salaun and Ron Holland struggling as 19 yr olds.

The fact that Missi, Ware and Flip are basically just as good as Edey is right now probably means that in 18 months chances are all 3 are better players.

I had Missi and Filipowski ranked ahead of Edey before the draft, but Edey probably goes 13th or so in my redraft which is perfectly fine for the 9th pick.

[FarBeyondDriven]

It's hard to have very strong feelings about Edey when this draft class has been so horrible and he's like... fine and was picked 9th.

Salaun, Sheppard, and Cody Williams are going to be out of the NBA in a couple of years and he's going to stick around, it's whatever.

Guess it just depends on how much you value age when it comes to prospects.
Someone like Devin Carter struggling as a rookie at age 23 is a lot different to me than guys like Tidjane Salaun and Ron Holland struggling as 19 yr olds.

The fact that Missi, Ware and Flip are basically just as good as Edey is right now probably means that in 18 months chances are all 3 are better players.

Devin Carter is coming off shoulder surgery ffs. He's had two games where he's played 20+ minutes. In those games:

13/7/2 with a steal

16/5/3 with 3 steals

he's also still 22 y/o until next week. Saying he's struggling is a bit unfair considering his injury and being drafted to a team trying to make the playoffs

[The-Power]

Here is the last 15 games for rookies. Edey ranks 19th in ppg.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=GP*GE*6&LastNGames=15&PlayerExperience=Rookie&dir=A&sort=PTS

Guys 2-3 years younger than him already outperforming him is not a good sign for Edey future.

So? PPG is now the (sole) measure you want to use to determine performance? You listed a bunch of guys who play on tanking teams and thus get more leeway now, scoring at terrible efficiency. Edey is still starting on a team making the playoffs. Quite the difference.

You can believe that Edey is going to drop compared to others. You can make the argument that some Rookies have caught up to him this season. That's all fine. But just looking at PPG to make any claim is silly because it doesn't mean anything in and of itself this context.

Some of the players you listed as supposedly better as of late would not even play a single minute on this Memphis outside of garbage time. They are just on teams that stopped caring about the results.

edit: But I can already see this turning into the next Scoot Henderson thread. Who are you going to pick out from the upcoming draft class?

[GoBobs]

Edey is one of the top rookies. All the people taking victory laps said he should be a 2nd rounder.

That is why people think you are a bunch of disingenious trolls,

or more likely, one disingenious troll with multiple alt accounts.

[JMAC3]

It's hard to have very strong feelings about Edey when this draft class has been so horrible and he's like... fine and was picked 9th.

Salaun, Sheppard, and Cody Williams are going to be out of the NBA in a couple of years and he's going to stick around, it's whatever.

Guess it just depends on how much you value age when it comes to prospects.
Someone like Devin Carter struggling as a rookie at age 23 is a lot different to me than guys like Tidjane Salaun and Ron Holland struggling as 19 yr olds.

The fact that Missi, Ware and Flip are basically just as good as Edey is right now probably means that in 18 months chances are all 3 are better players.

I had Missi and Filipowski ranked ahead of Edey before the draft, but Edey probably goes 13th or so in my redraft which is perfectly fine for the 9th pick.

Yes right now that might be the case, but again a lot of these other younger players are going to keep improving and Edey is likely not going to improve at the same rate. He could, but the chances are lower if you look what is most likely to happen based on history. I just wouldn't be shocked if most have him as the 20th best player from this draft class at next yrs all star break. Which is a pretty big fall from December when people were clamoring he was the best player from this draft class and should win ROY.

[JMAC3]

Here is the last 15 games for rookies. Edey ranks 19th in ppg.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=GP*GE*6&LastNGames=15&PlayerExperience=Rookie&dir=A&sort=PTS

Guys 2-3 years younger than him already outperforming him is not a good sign for Edey future.

So? PPG is now the (sole) measure you want to use to determine performance? You listed a bunch of guys who play on tanking teams and thus get more leeway now, scoring at terrible efficiency. Edey is still starting on a team making the playoffs. Quite the difference.

You can believe that Edey is going to drop compared to others. You can make the argument that some Rookies have caught up to him this season. That's all fine. But just looking at PPG to make any claim is silly because it doesn't mean anything in and of itself this context.

Some of the players you listed as supposedly better as of late would not even play a single minute on this Memphis outside of garbage time. They are just on teams that stopped caring about the results.

edit: But I can already see this turning into the next Scoot Henderson thread. Who are you going to pick out from the upcoming draft class?

I am talking about trends, at no point am I saying because player x is scoring more than Edey that he is better right now. It is very very obvious players are surpassing Edey, which is why nobody is talking about him anymore. He was considered to be the favorite for ROY for a few months and he has completely fallen off. Meanwhile other guys are taking off as the season goes, this will be the trend for the next 2-3 years. I mean we can just not say anything for 2 years and wait for this to 100% confirmed if that makes it better for you.

If you look at how much guys like Risacher, Castle, Sarr, Ware etc... etc... have improved it is night and day vs what Edey looks like now vs in December.

[JMAC3]

Edey is one of the top rookies. All the people taking victory laps said he should be a 2nd rounder.

That is why people think you are a bunch of disingenious trolls,

or more likely, one disingenious troll with multiple alt accounts.

You said he was going to be Shaq lololololololololololol... but yes we were all the idiots who weren't high on him.

[JMAC3]

Here is the last 15 games for rookies. Edey ranks 19th in ppg.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=GP*GE*6&LastNGames=15&PlayerExperience=Rookie&dir=A&sort=PTS

Guys 2-3 years younger than him already outperforming him is not a good sign for Edey future.

So? PPG is now the (sole) measure you want to use to determine performance? You listed a bunch of guys who play on tanking teams and thus get more leeway now, scoring at terrible efficiency. Edey is still starting on a team making the playoffs. Quite the difference.

You can believe that Edey is going to drop compared to others. You can make the argument that some Rookies have caught up to him this season. That's all fine. But just looking at PPG to make any claim is silly because it doesn't mean anything in and of itself this context.

Some of the players you listed as supposedly better as of late would not even play a single minute on this Memphis outside of garbage time. They are just on teams that stopped caring about the results.

edit: But I can already see this turning into the next Scoot Henderson thread. Who are you going to pick out from the upcoming draft class?

Edey has 1 double double in his last 20 games. Do you think he has been playing well during that stretch?

[clyde21]

Here is the last 15 games for rookies. Edey ranks 19th in ppg.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=GP*GE*6&LastNGames=15&PlayerExperience=Rookie&dir=A&sort=PTS

Guys 2-3 years younger than him already outperforming him is not a good sign for Edey future.

So? PPG is now the (sole) measure you want to use to determine performance? You listed a bunch of guys who play on tanking teams and thus get more leeway now, scoring at terrible efficiency. Edey is still starting on a team making the playoffs. Quite the difference.

You can believe that Edey is going to drop compared to others. You can make the argument that some Rookies have caught up to him this season. That's all fine. But just looking at PPG to make any claim is silly because it doesn't mean anything in and of itself this context.

Some of the players you listed as supposedly better as of late would not even play a single minute on this Memphis outside of garbage time. They are just on teams that stopped caring about the results.

edit: But I can already see this turning into the next Scoot Henderson thread. Who are you going to pick out from the upcoming draft class?

I am talking about trends

Ron Holland, dude you had ranked #1 overall, is 32nd in this list. Why didn't you bump his thread talking about "trends"?

[JMAC3]

So? PPG is now the (sole) measure you want to use to determine performance? You listed a bunch of guys who play on tanking teams and thus get more leeway now, scoring at terrible efficiency. Edey is still starting on a team making the playoffs. Quite the difference.

You can believe that Edey is going to drop compared to others. You can make the argument that some Rookies have caught up to him this season. That's all fine. But just looking at PPG to make any claim is silly because it doesn't mean anything in and of itself this context.

Some of the players you listed as supposedly better as of late would not even play a single minute on this Memphis outside of garbage time. They are just on teams that stopped caring about the results.

edit: But I can already see this turning into the next Scoot Henderson thread. Who are you going to pick out from the upcoming draft class?

I am talking about trends

Ron Holland, dude you had ranked #1 overall, is 32nd in this list. Why didn't you bump his thread talking about "trends"?

Go for it lol. Have I been clamoring for Holland all year? Been trying to tell everyone they were wrong about him? Or was that 15 Edey Posters in December?

My point is Edey hasn't improved at all this year, played 11 mins last night and picked up 5 fouls in a game they lost. Has had 1 double double in last 20 appearances, does his month over month performance to you say we should projecting him to improve a lot in the next year? That is the conversation I was trying to have, not try to call out people or say I am right. Just expressing my logic to why I was lower on him, point to statistical evidence that backs my initial reasoning. You know have a real conversation about the player, the draft class etc.

I have more faith that Holland will improve as a 19 year old than Edey at 22 years old if I am being honest but yeah if someone wants to have the argument with me that I was dead wrong on Holland then call me out in the appropriate thread lol

[HadAnEffectHere]

Guess it just depends on how much you value age when it comes to prospects.
Someone like Devin Carter struggling as a rookie at age 23 is a lot different to me than guys like Tidjane Salaun and Ron Holland struggling as 19 yr olds.

The fact that Missi, Ware and Flip are basically just as good as Edey is right now probably means that in 18 months chances are all 3 are better players.

I had Missi and Filipowski ranked ahead of Edey before the draft, but Edey probably goes 13th or so in my redraft which is perfectly fine for the 9th pick.

Yes right now that might be the case, but again a lot of these other younger players are going to keep improving and Edey is likely not going to improve at the same rate. He could, but the chances are lower if you look what is most likely to happen based on history. I just wouldn't be shocked if most have him as the 20th best player from this draft class at next yrs all star break. Which is a pretty big fall from December when people were clamoring he was the best player from this draft class and should win ROY.

Bruh, there are like 15 actual NBA players per draft class, you can't be this dumb.

Edey can play in the NBA at least a little.

[JMAC3]

I had Missi and Filipowski ranked ahead of Edey before the draft, but Edey probably goes 13th or so in my redraft which is perfectly fine for the 9th pick.

Yes right now that might be the case, but again a lot of these other younger players are going to keep improving and Edey is likely not going to improve at the same rate. He could, but the chances are lower if you look what is most likely to happen based on history. I just wouldn't be shocked if most have him as the 20th best player from this draft class at next yrs all star break. Which is a pretty big fall from December when people were clamoring he was the best player from this draft class and should win ROY.

Bruh, there are like 15 actual NBA players per draft class, you can't be this dumb.

Edey can play in the NBA at least a little.

Calling me dumb as you just pull some random number out of your ass lol.
I would say 25-30 is very doable for most classes in terms of guys who stick around the league for 5+ quality years minimum.

Anyways Edey is already 14th in this draft class for mins played this year, so according to your logic he is already about to fall out of the 15 actual players argument you tried to make.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Yes right now that might be the case, but again a lot of these other younger players are going to keep improving and Edey is likely not going to improve at the same rate. He could, but the chances are lower if you look what is most likely to happen based on history. I just wouldn't be shocked if most have him as the 20th best player from this draft class at next yrs all star break. Which is a pretty big fall from December when people were clamoring he was the best player from this draft class and should win ROY.

Bruh, there are like 15 actual NBA players per draft class, you can't be this dumb.

Edey can play in the NBA at least a little.

Calling me dumb as you just pull some random number out of your ass lol.
I would say 25-30 is very doable for most classes in terms of guys who stick around the league for 5+ quality years minimum.

Anyways Edey is already 14th in this draft class for mins played this year, so according to your logic he is already about to fall out of the 15 actual players argument you tried to make.

25-30 is a bit high.

Looking at the 2010-2018 draft classes, all of them have between 20-30 guys who played at least 300 games (That's 4-5 seasons of playing 80%+ of the games). That includes guys who barely got to 300 games and haven't been in the NBA in 5+ years.

Id say around 15 is when you start having the players play 500+ games, which is essentially getting a 2nd contract of decent value and playing a real role and consistently earning playing time past being a developmental piece.

[GoBobs]

Here is the last 15 games for rookies. Edey ranks 19th in ppg.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=GP*GE*6&LastNGames=15&PlayerExperience=Rookie&dir=A&sort=PTS

Guys 2-3 years younger than him already outperforming him is not a good sign for Edey future.

So? PPG is now the (sole) measure you want to use to determine performance? You listed a bunch of guys who play on tanking teams and thus get more leeway now, scoring at terrible efficiency. Edey is still starting on a team making the playoffs. Quite the difference.

You can believe that Edey is going to drop compared to others. You can make the argument that some Rookies have caught up to him this season. That's all fine. But just looking at PPG to make any claim is silly because it doesn't mean anything in and of itself this context.

Some of the players you listed as supposedly better as of late would not even play a single minute on this Memphis outside of garbage time. They are just on teams that stopped caring about the results.

edit: But I can already see this turning into the next Scoot Henderson thread. Who are you going to pick out from the upcoming draft class?

Edey has 1 double double in his last 20 games. Do you think he has been playing well during that stretch?

hmmm... I am counting 2 double doubles

there is the raptors game on 2/5 where he had 13 pts, 15 reb, and 2 blocks and then also the knicks on 2/28 where he had 10 pts, 11 reb, 2 blks

I don't think he really has to have a double double to have a great game anyway though. The game where he had 17 pts, 9 reb, and 3 blk vs the spurs on 3/1 was a great game even though he didn't get the double double because he also went 7-7 from the field.

He also had games where he had:

12 pts, 8 reb, 4 blk
12 pts, 8 reb, 2 blk
6 pts, 12 reb, 1 blk
8 pts, 12 reb, 3 blk
6 pts, 9 reb
15 pts, 5 reb, 1 blk
8 pts, 8 reb, 1 blk
6 pts, 9 reb, 1 blk
5 pts, 11 reb, 1 blk
4 pts, 9 reb, 2 blk

I would call all of those games good games for a rookie. So that is 13 good games out of the last 20. Out of the other 7 games, he had 5 games where he played 13 min or less. He was still productive in the minutes he did play. Then he had 2 sort of average games. So, yes he is playing well in the last 20 games.

[jasonxxx102]

Edey is one of the top rookies. All the people taking victory laps said he should be a 2nd rounder.

That is why people think you are a bunch of disingenious trolls,

or more likely, one disingenious troll with multiple alt accounts.

congrats on admitting you either haven't watched or don't understand what you watched.

Edey has been awful

[blog_pistons]

Beyond the numbers and without being a Holland fanboy, I have to admit several things.

1-He has improved his pace on the court, now he seems to control his body.
2-He is a good defender and has the tools to be even better.
3-He is a good offensive rebounder.
4-As incredible as it may seem, he is a good finisher near the rim. Sometimes it feels like a lack of control but the ball ends up going in.
5-He is capable of making plays (still limited by the coaching staff).

Things to improve:
-His three-point shot. It doesn't look bad, from the beginning of the season until January I seem to remember that it was at 30% but since then it has dropped sharply.
-Understanding the game, you need to be more patient (despite having improved).

In general terms I think he is going to be a good player, if he can improve with Fred Vinson his shot in a couple of years he will be one of the best in his draft. As I say, they are not a big fan of his but I have to admit that the boy goes out, works hard and gives his all in every play, producing and sometimes helping to change the direction of the games.

[JMAC3]

this year, so according to your logic he is already about to fall out of the 15 actual players argument you tried to make.
25-30 is a bit high.

Looking at the 2010-2018 draft classes, all of them have between 20-30 guys who played at least 300 games (That's 4-5 seasons of playing 80%+ of the games). That includes guys who barely got to 300 games and haven't been in the NBA in 5+ years.

Id say around 15 is when you start having the players play 500+ games, which is essentially getting a 2nd contract of decent value and playing a real role and consistently earning playing time past being a developmental piece.

The 2018 draft - 21-31 most minutes include JVando, Jevon Carter, Mitchell Robinson, Okogie, Mo Wagner, Bagley, Aaron Holiday
The 2019 draft - the 25th-29th most minute players are Goga, Cody Martin, Ty Jerome, Jalen McDaniels
The 2020 draft- 24-28th most minute players are Tillman, Isiah Joe, Nick Richards, and Jalen Smith

I would say all 15 guys here are worthy of calling actual NBA players and all range in the 25th~ mins rank for their class 5-7 years later. That is the first 3 drafts I looked at, so yeah going to have to disagree that only 15 guys are going to last more than 5 yrs argument. I wouldn't say Edey has shown me anything that he is guaranteed to have a better career than any of these guys on the list thus far.

As mentioned he already ranks 14th in minutes played, really should be 15th in McCain didn't miss most of the year.

[QingJames]

It's hard to have very strong feelings about Edey when this draft class has been so horrible and he's like... fine and was picked 9th.

Salaun, Sheppard, and Cody Williams are going to be out of the NBA in a couple of years and he's going to stick around, it's whatever.

Guess it just depends on how much you value age when it comes to prospects.
Someone like Devin Carter struggling as a rookie at age 23 is a lot different to me than guys like Tidjane Salaun and Ron Holland struggling as 19 yr olds.

The fact that Missi, Ware and Flip are basically just as good as Edey is right now probably means that in 18 months chances are all 3 are better players.

Missi is quite bad. Ware and Filipowski are going to be better than Edey in the longterm though, yeah.