Buddy Hield

[NuggetsWY]

Wow - is it hate or ignorance? You guys jump on one phrase and ignore the context. The first paragraph talks about how often even the NBA gurus miss things. The last paragraph finishes with an example of how the gurus are wrong sometimes (although the jury is still out on that one, but they are starting to believe). And the mis-used quote in it's entirety is "It seems almost certain he will go in the top 5 but then again ..." and continues to show that last year, similar statements were wrong. That's called a qualifier --- "It seems" but "last year it seemed but wasn't".

It's easy to criticize a college player and say "he won't fit in the NBA". The two games are very different and it isn't just the college team a player is on, but it is also dependent upon the team that he is playing against. There's a reason that top picks are sometimes a bust and late picks become stars. There is a reason why multiple teams pass over a player that later becomes an all-star.

What is known about Buddy Hield is at least three things:
1. He is a high quality character individual.
2. He is a total gym rat. He may still improve.
3. He can flat out shoot.

Last I checked, there were quite a few proven NBA players that had defensive limits or ball-handling limits but they CAN SHOOT!!! It seems almost certain he will go in the top 5 but then again, last year the Nuggets picked up Mudiay at #7 when "everyone" knew he would go in the Top 3 or at least in the Top 5.

[No-Man]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

[NuggetsWY]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Facts??? What "facts"??? The only "fact" was my opinion. My opinion was based on what some of the NBA analysts have said. I just glanced at 4 mock drafts that have no "facts" but just their opinion and they have Hield listed as #6 #7 #7 #9 and commentators are raving about his performance during the tournament saying his going to go higher than predicted. But those aren't facts - not the mock drafts - not the commentators - and certainly not my opinion. Again, I suggested he'd go top 5 but the whole posting was one massive "no one can predict". So the only "fact" involved in this is that you think I am wrong". I actually agree with you that there are no facts "pointing towards him been a top5 pick" but you said "there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick" and there you are wrong. There are indicators that he MIGHT be a top 5 pick.

[doordoor123]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Facts??? What "facts"??? The only "fact" was my opinion. My opinion was based on what some of the NBA analysts have said. I just glanced at 4 mock drafts that have no "facts" but just their opinion and they have Hield listed as #6 #7 #7 #9 and commentators are raving about his performance during the tournament saying his going to go higher than predicted. But those aren't facts - not the mock drafts - not the commentators - and certainly not my opinion. Again, I suggested he'd go top 5 but the whole posting was one massive "no one can predict". So the only "fact" involved in this is that you think I am wrong". I actually agree with you that there are no facts "pointing towards him been a top5 pick" but you said "there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick" and there you are wrong. There are indicators that he MIGHT be a top 5 pick.

This is true, but commentators don't draft. Each team has their own big board of players they would like. Hield, while seemingly really good, it's only college and he doesn't have some of the bigger attributes that make him an NBA-type prospect. Having said that, I like him a lot and think he's going to be very good. Willie Cauley-Stein was 22 when he was drafted and went 8 overall, Sam Dekker went 12. Someone who wants a guy that can contribute right away will take Hield early. It could be the Kings (who did that last year) or it could be the Pelicans who want to contend with Anthony Davis while he's young. I think it's possible he goes 6-12 based on who is drafting. And who knows, maybe the Celtics take him with the 4th pick because beyond the top 3, its a mixed bag and the Celtics could really use a player like Hield, but does that mean their experiment with either Marcus Smart or Avery Bradley is over?

[NuggetsWY]

Thank you - you've said almost exactly what I said and even said Hield might go 6th - might. That's close to what I said - MIGHT or WOULD SEEM to be a top 5. Then you suggest he might even go 4th (reasonable based on your reasoning). As I had said before the haters started - nobody knows and last year, "everyone" (whoever that is) was wrong about Mudiay. The way some of these guys responded, you'd have thought I was the world's foremost authority and I was threatening their team and their first born. LOL

[Karmaloop]

Hield is going to be a mostly a 'pure' shooter in the NBA that'll best be utilized in an offense with tons of ball-movement. He clearly doesn't have the handle, pg skills or athleticism to be a full-time creator on offense against NBA defenses.

Calling him a "pure shooter" is an insult to how far his game has come. Sure, he doesn't have great handles nor is he an elite floor leader but he's capable of handling those roles.

[Karmaloop]

People thinking that Hield has either the athleticism or the ballhandling to be an on-the-ball player at the next level really need to watch again or get new eyes, because their current ones are failing them.

Since when did you have to have elite athleticism or ball handing to run an offense? For as much usage as he has, he hasn't been a guy who has a ton of turnovers despite not being a great ball handler. I mean, the guard that most people are fondling over (Kris Dunn) is averaging 3.5 TOPG, but NOBODY is mentioning that. Sure, ideally you'd like him to be part of an offense where someone else is initiating the offense, but let's not pretend like that there isn't a fair chance that he could play really well as a 2 guard at the next level.

[Karmaloop]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Based on? Right now, it's largely considered a two-player draft. Beyond that, it's a matter of what you need and how you view a player. Buddy Hield as legitimate of an argument as anyone in this year's class not named Ben Simmons or Brandon Ingram.

[doordoor123]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Based on? Right now, it's largely considered a two-player draft. Beyond that, it's a matter of what you need and how you view a player. Buddy Hield as legitimate of an argument as anyone in this year's class not named Ben Simmons or Brandon Ingram.

At the same time, there are a lot of other valuable guys. Rim protectors are very rare, stretch fours that can defend are rare (and stretch fours in general), defenders at the 3 are rare, speedy point guards are rare, guys taller than their position are rare and reliable 3&D guys are rare, etc. In terms of rarity, Hield isn't that special, but he can do what he does very well and that is again, rare... but the question is if it is sustainable.

[yitur]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Based on? Right now, it's largely considered a two-player draft. Beyond that, it's a matter of what you need and how you view a player. Buddy Hield as legitimate of an argument as anyone in this year's class not named Ben Simmons or Brandon Ingram.

As a Laker fan I hope we get the 3rd pick so Hield would be in conversation. I'm turning into a homer of Hield but I think he has a great NBA ready game and physique so his age is not a problem for me. Butler came into the league around his age and improved in his 4th year there are many players like that. Age thing is sometimes overblown because old bigs dominate the game easily with their better physique and experience against young bigs in college. But usually guards don't develop their shooting this drastically in college.

[doordoor123]

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Based on? Right now, it's largely considered a two-player draft. Beyond that, it's a matter of what you need and how you view a player. Buddy Hield as legitimate of an argument as anyone in this year's class not named Ben Simmons or Brandon Ingram.

As a Laker fan I hope we get the 3rd pick so Hield would be in conversation. I'm turning into a homer of Hield but I think he has a great NBA ready game and physique so his age is not a problem for me. Butler came into the league around his age and improved in his 4th year there are many players like that. Age thing is sometimes overblown because old bigs dominate the game easily with their better physique and experience against young bigs in college. But usually guards don't develop their shooting this drastically in college.

EH.. If you're a Laker fan you should be cheering desperately for Simmons or Ingram. And if you get 3 you should take Bender. Clarkson and Russell have so much going for them and they could fit really well with any of these three players. If you got Simmons, LOOK OUT. He would speed up your rebuilding process so much and he would attract free agents with your core already. Ingram probably wouldn't get as much attention, but he's still a great fit and great long-term option. At the same time Ingram won't make the Lakers a team right away. Simmons just fits that Laker team like a glove.

[NuggetsWY]

Lakers fans might want Hield - I understand that - My problem is that as much as I love Hield - I've got my eye on several guys depending on what pick the Nuggets get and who is available. I wish Hield would slide way down and let us grab him with a mid first round pick - but that seems unlikely.

[[[To clarify for Fischella: I did not say Hield would slide to mid first round. I said I wish he would but it seemed unlikely. That would indicate I would prefer this but don't expect it. It in no way should be taken as a declaration that Hield will be taken in the top 20 draft picks. Nor should it be taken in any way as an indicator that Hield will not be taken in the top 20 draft picks. I was merely expressing a personal opinion and speculation regarding my personal desires. "Facts" were not included.]]]

[yitur]

Based on? Right now, it's largely considered a two-player draft. Beyond that, it's a matter of what you need and how you view a player. Buddy Hield as legitimate of an argument as anyone in this year's class not named Ben Simmons or Brandon Ingram.

As a Laker fan I hope we get the 3rd pick so Hield would be in conversation. I'm turning into a homer of Hield but I think he has a great NBA ready game and physique so his age is not a problem for me. Butler came into the league around his age and improved in his 4th year there are many players like that. Age thing is sometimes overblown because old bigs dominate the game easily with their better physique and experience against young bigs in college. But usually guards don't develop their shooting this drastically in college.

EH.. If you're a Laker fan you should be cheering desperately for Simmons or Ingram. And if you get 3 you should take Bender. Clarkson and Russell have so much going for them and they could fit really well with any of these three players. If you got Simmons, LOOK OUT. He would speed up your rebuilding process so much and he would attract free agents with your core already. Ingram probably wouldn't get as much attention, but he's still a great fit and great long-term option. At the same time Ingram won't make the Lakers a team right away. Simmons just fits that Laker team like a glove.

Ben simmons yeah, even though he doesnt fit we dont have the luxury, but i dont know why but something is off with ingram for me.

[NuggetsWY]

If the Lakers get Ben Simmons, there will be plenty of market for him or another young player that many are drooling over. Ingram's short-comings have been documented - but HE SURE CAN SCORE. But this thread is about Hield not Simmons or Ingram, we better be careful or haters will come out.

[Karmaloop]

At the same time, there are a lot of other valuable guys. Rim protectors are very rare, stretch fours that can defend are rare (and stretch fours in general), defenders at the 3 are rare, speedy point guards are rare, guys taller than their position are rare and reliable 3&D guys are rare, etc. In terms of rarity, Hield isn't that special, but he can do what he does very well and that is again, rare... but the question is if it is sustainable.

And I don't disagree about that first part. Which means at the end of the day, it's going to largely come down to feel and scheme fit. I don't think there's anyone at three whose going to come in here and say that they're clearly better than Hield. Obviously, we've still got a LOT of time until the draft and much will change, but I'm having a hard time seeing any player outside of Simmons/Ingram that's undeniably better than someone else. To me, guys like Dragan Bender (assuming the buyout concerns are somewhat founded), Jaylen Brown, Kris Dunn, Buddy Hield, and Jakob Poeltl are in that next tier of prospects for me. As far as sustainable, good scorers aren't something that's unsustainable. Sure, he might not be doing it at that clip that he's doing it right now, but even if he's doing it at half of what he's doing right now that's still a LOT better than most.

[Karmaloop]

EH.. If you're a Laker fan you should be cheering desperately for Simmons or Ingram. And if you get 3 you should take Bender. Clarkson and Russell have so much going for them and they could fit really well with any of these three players. If you got Simmons, LOOK OUT. He would speed up your rebuilding process so much and he would attract free agents with your core already. Ingram probably wouldn't get as much attention, but he's still a great fit and great long-term option. At the same time Ingram won't make the Lakers a team right away. Simmons just fits that Laker team like a glove.

I think that goes without saying. But you need to be prepared for all possibilities. Right now, there is a 17% chance that the Lakers fall to three. What do they do then? For the Lakers, right now Simmons and Ingram are atop the board. But whose 3rd?

[NuggetsWY]

In terms of rarity, Hield isn't that special, but he can do what he does very well and that is again, rare... but the question is if it is sustainable.

You are correct - but then again, John Stockton wasn't rare in terms of height or reach or strength. Frankly neither was Karl Malone or Hakeem Olajuwon or Michael Jordon or so many other greats - not compared to the average guy at their position. Charles Barkley was extremely short for his position. But as you say, "Hield ... can do what he does very well and that is again, rare ... but the question is if it is sustainable." Those others and many more have sustained, so I don't discount the player that is arguably the best shooter among the top 10 NBA prospects.

[Barnsey]

I think it's very possible Hield could go top 5.*

He's more than just a pure shooter. The guy has been prolific with his scoring. He can create his own offense. He regularly shoots ballsy pull-up threes off the dribble and in transition. He gets low on his drives, has a quick first step with the ball in his possession, and gets to the rim at a decent rate which keeps the defense honest. He can score from all over the court and this is reflected in his TS% relative to his usage (0.67 TS% on 27.4% usage, which is absolutely crazy. For perspective: Damian Lillard had 0.62 TS% and 30.9 usage as a senior in a less tough conference). He will have a large gravitational pull for an NBA offense, and that is very valuable. His game is instantly translatable in modern NBA and that's very appealing. And the fact that he's 22 doesn't bother me, it has been reported that his practice habits are off the charts, so I trust that he will continue to develop his game in his own time.

Look at Draymond Green. He was drafted as a senior and became a key cog for a championship team. He had the same knocks: not a standout athlete, too old, too short, etc. But at the end of the day all that matters is if they can contribute in the NBA. All these draft rankings don't mean **** once the NBA season starts. Players that were drafted 20th start looking like they should have been drafted 3rd. Players that were drafted 6th can fade away and become forgotten. It's a crapshoot. Anybody who thinks their opinion is flawlessly above everybody else's is kidding themselves. It's a shame certain people here think they are so right about everything that they aren't willing to even consider the perspective of others. What's the point in having a discussion with a brick wall?

Unexpected things happen in the draft all the time. It is massively frustrating to see such entitled and stubborn opinions on this board. But that's the internet for you i guess. NBA teams run a tight ship. Nobody really knows what's going to happen. Not you, not me. Remember when Anthony Bennett went #1? Nobody here predicted that. Cody Zeller at #4? Surprising. Len falling to #5? Nerlens falling to #6? Nobody was privvy to any of it. Hell, even Aaron Gordon at #4 shocked most people. Most NBA teams aren't influenced by the consensus of rankings from draft websites, they do it their own way and make their own decisions. They don't give a ****, and it's impossible to predict. So it shouldn't be that hard to swallow that a team could legitimately roll with Hield between #3 and #5. Especially since this is a pretty weak draft at the top.

* - disclaimer: i am not claiming this as fact

Again there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick, on the other hand Mudiay was a top5 in almost everybodys mock/board last year, I dont really see where are you coming from, but you are quite the case by calling it a case of ignorance when you cant even get your facts straight.

Facts??? What "facts"??? The only "fact" was my opinion. My opinion was based on what some of the NBA analysts have said. I just glanced at 4 mock drafts that have no "facts" but just their opinion and they have Hield listed as #6 #7 #7 #9 and commentators are raving about his performance during the tournament saying his going to go higher than predicted. But those aren't facts - not the mock drafts - not the commentators - and certainly not my opinion. Again, I suggested he'd go top 5 but the whole posting was one massive "no one can predict". So the only "fact" involved in this is that you think I am wrong". I actually agree with you that there are no facts "pointing towards him been a top5 pick" but you said "there is absolutely nothing pointing towards him been a top5 pick" and there you are wrong. There are indicators that he MIGHT be a top 5 pick.

This is true, but commentators don't draft. Each team has their own big board of players they would like. Hield, while seemingly really good, it's only college and he doesn't have some of the bigger attributes that make him an NBA-type prospect. Having said that, I like him a lot and think he's going to be very good. Willie Cauley-Stein was 22 when he was drafted and went 8 overall, Sam Dekker went 12. Someone who wants a guy that can contribute right away will take Hield early. It could be the Kings (who did that last year) or it could be the Pelicans who want to contend with Anthony Davis while he's young. I think it's possible he goes 6-12 based on who is drafting. And who knows, maybe the Celtics take him with the 4th pick because beyond the top 3, its a mixed bag and the Celtics could really use a player like Hield, but does that mean their experiment with either Marcus Smart or Avery Bradley is over?

Sam Dekker was drafted 18th.

[toussaud]

If I'm the bucks I'm not leaving the draft without Hield under no circumstances

[doordoor123]

I meant Kaminsky