2020 NBA Draft II

[MotownMadness]

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[King Ken]

I think it's clear, Edwards is starting to separate as the #1 pick

[Roddy B for 3]

I feelell like LaMelo can maybe be a more uptemp Lonzo, with more ability to attack one-on-one. But will probably be quite a bit worse defensively.

I also feel like he'll take almost his entire rookie contract before he becomes a positive impact player.

Like with Ja last year on this sub, there is a massive effort to underrate offensive skill. Melo has exceptional offensive skill. Exceptional! Let's not misconstrue that

His shot isn't falling though.
I think growing into his "man" body will increase his efficiency numbers. But I think it will take two + years before he does that and then you will probably have to resign him to a big money contract, still betting on potential, to a degree.

Mathematically speaking:
I think Lamelo will cost a high pick, come in and be negative player, then show signs of living up to his draft placement followed shortly thereafter of demanding a big money extension, followed by inconsistent play or he will be a frindge star.

I was lower on Morant than I shouldve been (I had him 3rd), but I was worried about Morants "flashy" moves not translating from weak college opponents to strong NBA opponents (I was wrong). With LaMelo, to me, it's more a worry about his poor effinceny. And youthful (read weak) body.

[clyde21]

Antman shot versatility is pretty bonkers, if he can harness his powers for good hes gonna be a stupid good offensive player in the nba

[King Ken]

I feelell like LaMelo can maybe be a more uptemp Lonzo, with more ability to attack one-on-one. But will probably be quite a bit worse defensively.

I also feel like he'll take almost his entire rookie contract before he becomes a positive impact player.

Like with Ja last year on this sub, there is a massive effort to underrate offensive skill. Melo has exceptional offensive skill. Exceptional! Let's not misconstrue that

His shot isn't falling though.
I think growing into his "man" body will increase his efficiency numbers. But I think it will take two + years before he does that and then you will probably have to resign him to a big money contract, still betting on potential, to a degree.

Mathematically speaking:
I think Lamelo will cost a high pick, come in and be negative player, then show signs of living up to his draft placement followed shortly thereafter of demanding a big money extension, followed by inconsistent play or he will be a frindge star.

I was lower on Morant than I shouldve been (I had him 3rd), but I was worried about Morants "flashy" moves not translating from weak college opponents to strong NBA opponents (I was wrong). With LaMelo, to me, it's more a worry about his poor effinceny. And youthful (read weak) body.

I strongly believe you underestimate his skill. He's not Haliburton. Ball can get to the lane with his handles and his drive and skill is crazy good for anyone. His shot is underrated at this point. It's not good but it's much better than this sub has tried to turn it into. Too much this is reminding me of Ja Morant where there is a need to underrate players for no real reason other than to be outside of the box.

I think he's going to be an impact as a rookie. I can't say he will have a smooth transition like Morant but I can see him having a lot of success for most of his rookie year like Trae Young did. I think he is massively underrated on this sub. No question about it. You can't overanalyze. It's the biggest fault of this sub. It's not like you guys aren't smart because at times, you guys too smart. I just think you guys should tone it down a bit.

You gotta realize that some things are obvious. His skill is obvious. It's special. It's the skill we see from Trae Young, Luka Doncic, etc. The rare of the rare of skills. That's not a disrespect to Zo who was always the more natural PG of the two but Melo always had the superstar potential and it's clear he has superstar skill. I think a team like New York, Chicago, or Detriot would be a fool to pass up on Ball. Even if they could land Edwards. Guys like Melo Ball are extremely hard to find and they fit what the NBA is going today. It's can you get us the most for PPP, can create for you and your teammates out of the PnR, can you put constant pressure on the defense where they have to scheme for you. Melo has all of the skills for these things. I don't see how he's not #1 for a team that needs a PG. BAD!

[Roddy B for 3]

Like with Ja last year on this sub, there is a massive effort to underrate offensive skill. Melo has exceptional offensive skill. Exceptional! Let's not misconstrue that

His shot isn't falling though.
I think growing into his "man" body will increase his efficiency numbers. But I think it will take two + years before he does that and then you will probably have to resign him to a big money contract, still betting on potential, to a degree.

Mathematically speaking:
I think Lamelo will cost a high pick, come in and be negative player, then show signs of living up to his draft placement followed shortly thereafter of demanding a big money extension, followed by inconsistent play or he will be a frindge star.

I was lower on Morant than I shouldve been (I had him 3rd), but I was worried about Morants "flashy" moves not translating from weak college opponents to strong NBA opponents (I was wrong). With LaMelo, to me, it's more a worry about his poor effinceny. And youthful (read weak) body.

I strongly believe you underestimate his skill. He's not Haliburton. Ball can get to the lane with his handles and his drive and skill is crazy good for anyone. His shot is underrated at this point. It's not good but it's much better than this sub has tried to turn it into. Too much this is reminding me of Ja Morant where there is a need to underrate players for no real reason other than to be outside of the box.

I think he's going to be an impact as a rookie. I can't say he will have a smooth transition like Morant but I can see him having a lot of success for most of his rookie year like Trae Young did. I think he is massively underrated on this sub. No question about it. You can't overanalyze. It's the biggest fault of this sub. It's not like you guys aren't smart because at times, you guys too smart. I just think you guys should tone it down a bit.

You gotta realize that some things are obvious. His skill is obvious. It's special. It's the skill we see from Trae Young, Luka Doncic, etc. The rare of the rare of skills. That's not a disrespect to Zo who was always the more natural PG of the two but Melo always had the superstar potential and it's clear he has superstar skill. I think a team like New York, Chicago, or Detriot would be a fool to pass up on Ball. Even if they could land Edwards. Guys like Melo Ball are extremely hard to find and they fit what the NBA is going today. It's can you get us the most for PPP, can create for you and your teammates out of the PnR, can you put constant pressure on the defense where they have to scheme for you. Melo has all of the skills for these things. I don't see how he's not #1 for a team that needs a PG. BAD!

Ok. I've shown you alot of respect, multiple times.
It's a strawman argument to compare LaMelo's perception to Balls because I told you 100% why I was lower on Morant than nessesary(competition level & I still had him #3) and I've told you why I'm low on Ball (lack of effcienty and physical weakness as a result of youth). I'm only mentioning this because I'm honestly trying to access Ball's ability. And, I respect your opinion on draftees.

I'm not making any strawman arguments, I'm being clear.

Now, I'm asking objective questions about Balls lack of effcienty.

Why do you think his three point percentage is so low? I've seen him take awful shots, does he have a good shooting % from catch and shoot threes?

[MemphisX]

Antman shot versatility is pretty bonkers, if he can harness his powers for good hes gonna be a stupid good offensive player in the nba

Just don't trust his brain but everyone in this draft has issues. Just gotta adjust your sliders on expectations on the top 5-7 picks. Especially top 3.

[King Ken]

His shot isn't falling though.
I think growing into his "man" body will increase his efficiency numbers. But I think it will take two + years before he does that and then you will probably have to resign him to a big money contract, still betting on potential, to a degree.

Mathematically speaking:
I think Lamelo will cost a high pick, come in and be negative player, then show signs of living up to his draft placement followed shortly thereafter of demanding a big money extension, followed by inconsistent play or he will be a frindge star.

I was lower on Morant than I shouldve been (I had him 3rd), but I was worried about Morants "flashy" moves not translating from weak college opponents to strong NBA opponents (I was wrong). With LaMelo, to me, it's more a worry about his poor effinceny. And youthful (read weak) body.

I strongly believe you underestimate his skill. He's not Haliburton. Ball can get to the lane with his handles and his drive and skill is crazy good for anyone. His shot is underrated at this point. It's not good but it's much better than this sub has tried to turn it into. Too much this is reminding me of Ja Morant where there is a need to underrate players for no real reason other than to be outside of the box.

I think he's going to be an impact as a rookie. I can't say he will have a smooth transition like Morant but I can see him having a lot of success for most of his rookie year like Trae Young did. I think he is massively underrated on this sub. No question about it. You can't overanalyze. It's the biggest fault of this sub. It's not like you guys aren't smart because at times, you guys too smart. I just think you guys should tone it down a bit.

You gotta realize that some things are obvious. His skill is obvious. It's special. It's the skill we see from Trae Young, Luka Doncic, etc. The rare of the rare of skills. That's not a disrespect to Zo who was always the more natural PG of the two but Melo always had the superstar potential and it's clear he has superstar skill. I think a team like New York, Chicago, or Detriot would be a fool to pass up on Ball. Even if they could land Edwards. Guys like Melo Ball are extremely hard to find and they fit what the NBA is going today. It's can you get us the most for PPP, can create for you and your teammates out of the PnR, can you put constant pressure on the defense where they have to scheme for you. Melo has all of the skills for these things. I don't see how he's not #1 for a team that needs a PG. BAD!

Ok. I've shown you alot of respect, multiple times.
It's a strawman argument to compare LaMelo's perception to Balls because I told you 100% why I was lower on Morant than nessesary(competition level & I still had him #3) and I've told you why I'm low on Ball (lack of effcienty and physical weakness as a result of youth). I'm only mentioning this because I'm honestly trying to access Ball's ability. And, I respect your opinion on draftees.

I'm not making any strawman arguments, I'm being clear.

Now, I'm asking objective questions about Balls lack of effcienty.

Why do you think his three point percentage is so low? I've seen him take awful shots, does he have a good shooting % from catch and shoot threes?

You have and I am showing you respect 100% back. You are one of my absolute favorites here. 100%

I hope I didn't give off a different energy saying otherwise. I just notice not just from you but on this sub in general that we like to take a massive approach to handling prospects is a definite take. I think we should think twice about it. Even I had to drop back from it. If guys go to terrific situations, they will likely grow faster from it.

I just think we shouldn't be so definite in what these guys can't or can be.

As far as your take, efficiency is not as important as effectiveness in a possession by possession league so while your take on his efficiency could be accurate regardless for several months to as long as the end of his rookie year, it's not that important.

He doesn't really play that weak to me. Can you explain this one in more depth?

He shoots a lot of difficult threes. He doesn't quite have the size of Luka or Harden to really do that as often as he doesn't from that standpoint and he isn't a dead eye like Trae Young to do it to his degree and even Trae struggled early on as young kids simply don't have their adult legs yet. If that's what you mean by physical maturity, I can see that.

[Roddy B for 3]

I strongly believe you underestimate his skill. He's not Haliburton. Ball can get to the lane with his handles and his drive and skill is crazy good for anyone. His shot is underrated at this point. It's not good but it's much better than this sub has tried to turn it into. Too much this is reminding me of Ja Morant where there is a need to underrate players for no real reason other than to be outside of the box.

I think he's going to be an impact as a rookie. I can't say he will have a smooth transition like Morant but I can see him having a lot of success for most of his rookie year like Trae Young did. I think he is massively underrated on this sub. No question about it. You can't overanalyze. It's the biggest fault of this sub. It's not like you guys aren't smart because at times, you guys too smart. I just think you guys should tone it down a bit.

You gotta realize that some things are obvious. His skill is obvious. It's special. It's the skill we see from Trae Young, Luka Doncic, etc. The rare of the rare of skills. That's not a disrespect to Zo who was always the more natural PG of the two but Melo always had the superstar potential and it's clear he has superstar skill. I think a team like New York, Chicago, or Detriot would be a fool to pass up on Ball. Even if they could land Edwards. Guys like Melo Ball are extremely hard to find and they fit what the NBA is going today. It's can you get us the most for PPP, can create for you and your teammates out of the PnR, can you put constant pressure on the defense where they have to scheme for you. Melo has all of the skills for these things. I don't see how he's not #1 for a team that needs a PG. BAD!

Ok. I've shown you alot of respect, multiple times.
It's a strawman argument to compare LaMelo's perception to Balls because I told you 100% why I was lower on Morant than nessesary(competition level & I still had him #3) and I've told you why I'm low on Ball (lack of effcienty and physical weakness as a result of youth). I'm only mentioning this because I'm honestly trying to access Ball's ability. And, I respect your opinion on draftees.

I'm not making any strawman arguments, I'm being clear.

Now, I'm asking objective questions about Balls lack of effcienty.

Why do you think his three point percentage is so low? I've seen him take awful shots, does he have a good shooting % from catch and shoot threes?

You have and I am showing you respect 100% back. You are one of my absolute favorites here. 100%

I hope I didn't give off a different energy saying otherwise. I just notice not just from you but on this sub in general that we like to take a massive approach to handling prospects is a definite take. I think we should think twice about it. Even I had to drop back from it. If guys go to terrific situations, they will likely grow faster from it.

I just think we shouldn't be so definite in what these guys can't or can be.

As far as your take, efficiency is not as important as effectiveness in a possession by possession league so while your take on his efficiency could be accurate regardless for several months to as long as the end of his rookie year, it's not that important.

He doesn't really play that weak to me. Can you explain this one in more depth?

He shoots a lot of difficult threes. He doesn't quite have the size of Luka or Harden to really do that as often as he doesn't from that standpoint and he isn't a dead eye like Trae Young to do it to his degree and even Trae struggled early on as young kids simply don't have their adult legs yet. If that's what you mean by physical maturity, I can see that.

The physical strength is mostly in regards to his defense.

[clyde21]

Antman shot versatility is pretty bonkers, if he can harness his powers for good hes gonna be a stupid good offensive player in the nba

Just don't trust his brain but everyone in this draft has issues. Just gotta adjust your sliders on expectations on the top 5-7 picks. Especially top 3.

yea, his decision making should improve hes super young but that natural bbiq isnt really there tbh, even in these games where he goes off you'll see a lot of dumb mistakes and decisions

still clearly a t1 guy tho

[getrichordie]

Are we seriously still not talking about Immanuel Quickley? He deserves some attention on this board.

Before last night’s game, he was shooting 50% from 3 over his last 7 games. And he’s averaging 20. Decisive guard who knows how to set up his own shot. He’s wiry but long (6-8 wingspan). He’s 6’3 so he has good size for a point but he plays more like a 2. But we’ve seen undersized 2s succeed in the league.

Let’s get some discussion going on about this kid. He’s the leader of a solid Kentucky team.

[EvanZ]

Are we seriously still not talking about Immanuel Quickley? He deserves some attention on this board.

Before last night’s game, he was shooting 50% from 3 over his last 7 games. And he’s averaging 20. Decisive guard who knows how to set up his own shot. He’s wiry but long (6-8 wingspan). He’s 6’3 so he has good size for a point but he plays more like a 2. But we’ve seen undersized 2s succeed in the league.

Let’s get some discussion going on about this kid. He’s the leader of a solid Kentucky team.

I mean I think you said it that combo guard archetype is pretty tough to succeed. How high do you want to draft a guy who is most likely a 6th man in his best outcome? He is kinda like Seth Curry (not Steph) with less defense in his best outcome.

[getrichordie]

Are we seriously still not talking about Immanuel Quickley? He deserves some attention on this board.

Before last night’s game, he was shooting 50% from 3 over his last 7 games. And he’s averaging 20. Decisive guard who knows how to set up his own shot. He’s wiry but long (6-8 wingspan). He’s 6’3 so he has good size for a point but he plays more like a 2. But we’ve seen undersized 2s succeed in the league.

Let’s get some discussion going on about this kid. He’s the leader of a solid Kentucky team.

I mean I think you said it that combo guard archetype is pretty tough to succeed. How high do you want to draft a guy who is most likely a 6th man in his best outcome? He is kinda like Seth Curry (not Steph) with less defense in his best outcome.

True, but he can get bigger in the NBA and be a better defender. 6-8 wingspan is nothing to sneeze at. And he can hit the open 3. I mean, it’s just crazy to me that he’s not on Tankathon or a lot of big boards. I’d draft him over Hagans or Maxey.

[clyde21]

a lot of people are expecting Quickly to return and be full time PG for Kentucky next year, that's why you're not seeing him on tankathon etc...Hagans/Maxey in, Quickley returning

[No-Man]

I'd draft Quickley over Hagans, no way close to Maxey

Quickley is a spot up shooter who can move the ball, he has length but not real strength, he is fine on defense but he is basically a 6-3 wing at the moment, hasn't proven **** as a lead Guard

[King Ken]

Quickley is a fast raiser for sure. He looks like another Kentucky gem

[NO-KG-AI]

I don’t remember the forum being that down on Morant. Ja had high level athleticism, a full skill set including good shooting mechanics, and he was insanely productive. You can’t say any of that about Lamelo.


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[King Ken]

I don’t remember the forum being that down on Morant. Ja had high level athleticism, a full skill set including good shooting mechanics, and he was insanely productive. You can’t say any of that about Lamelo.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Just pull up the Morant thread. It wasn't no bust talk but this sub was not high on him. I remember the guys high on him, which was me, clyde, and several others. Many had their doubts.

In all fairness, LeMelo was in a superior league by a mile. Are you really comparing the competition in the OVC to the Australian Professional Basketball League? Honestly, really?

I will be honest. I didn't like Trae, Luka, Ja, or LaMelo shooting mechanics. Truth be told, I am still not a fan of their shooting mechanics.

[getrichordie]

In this weak and uncertain draft, I can see teams reaching for a sure thing in Markus Howard. Sure, he's not going to give you much, if any at all on the defensive side of the ball, but dude can definitely space the floor and when he gets run off his spot, he has an elite floater game as well as a nice mid-range jumper. He's not super tall, but he's strong and isn't afraid to play defense. I think he can benefit from his speed and paint penetration at the next level when it comes to playmaking because of the spacing difference from NCAA to NBA.

[NO-KG-AI]

I don’t remember the forum being that down on Morant. Ja had high level athleticism, a full skill set including good shooting mechanics, and he was insanely productive. You can’t say any of that about Lamelo.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Just pull up the Morant thread. It wasn't no bust talk but this sub was not high on him. I remember the guys high on him, which was me, clyde, and several others. Many had their doubts.

In all fairness, LeMelo was in a superior league by a mile. Are you really comparing the competition in the OVC to the Australian Professional Basketball League? Honestly, really?

I will be honest. I didn't like Trae, Luka, Ja, or LaMelo shooting mechanics. Truth be told, I am still not a fan of their shooting mechanics.

He wasn't good pretty much anywhere. His claim to fame is putting up a bunch of points in high school where he got to shoot 60+ times on a high school team. His father has done a great ob putting him overseas to hide him from getting exposed here. Somehow playing like absolute trash and bouncing around teams has boosted his stock.

The difference with the mechanics for all of those guys is that they were productive shooters and scorers. Lamelo isn't.