Luka Doncic

[Bob8]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

He is not playing U18 games for almost 2 years. He will play Eurobasket in pair with Goran Dragic for Slovenia this summer.

[reanimator]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

He is not playing U18 games for almost 2 years. He will play Eurobasket in pair with Goran Dragic for Slovenia this summer.

Thats a bit dissapointing. Thanks.

[Mirotic12]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

I was thinking about it...and as I said, Jaric was the closest similar type player I could think of from recent EuroLeague. Since Jaric also played in NBA, at least NBA fans should have some idea also then.

I don't think Doncic is stronger than Jaric though. Jaric was a really huge guard, 6-7 to 6-8, and he had a really built and strong body. He was very strong, and I would think definitely stronger than Doncic.

I would say Jaric is the closest player type, with Doncic being more athletic and a better outside shooter, and with Jaric being a better defensive player.

[Bob8]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

He is not playing U18 games for almost 2 years. He will play Eurobasket in pair with Goran Dragic for Slovenia this summer.

Thats a bit dissapointing. Thanks.

He played the strongest U18 tournament in Europe, Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament, 2 years ago. He was 2 years younger than most players, he won the tournament and was MVP.

http://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=005929&seasoncode=JT14#!JT14_QRC

It would be strange to play something like this, instead of Euroleague or Eurobasket for National team, don't you think?

[reanimator]

He is not playing U18 games for almost 2 years. He will play Eurobasket in pair with Goran Dragic for Slovenia this summer.

Thats a bit dissapointing. Thanks.

He played the strongest U18 tournament in Europe, Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament, 2 years ago. He was 2 years younger than most players, he won the tournament and was MVP.

http://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=005929&seasoncode=JT14#!JT14_QRC

It would be strange to play something like this, instead of Euroleague or Eurobasket for National team, don't you think?

I get why he isn't doing it but I wanted to see hm against teams like USA, Canada, France and Australia.

[Bob8]

Thats a bit dissapointing. Thanks.

He played the strongest U18 tournament in Europe, Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament, 2 years ago. He was 2 years younger than most players, he won the tournament and was MVP.

http://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=005929&seasoncode=JT14#!JT14_QRC

It would be strange to play something like this, instead of Euroleague or Eurobasket for National team, don't you think?

I get why he isn't doing it but I wanted to see hm against teams like USA, Canada, France and Australia.

It's very possible you will see him against France, but there won't be Ntilikina, but some Nba guys.
Serbia was second in WC and Olimpics, Spain should be very good too, than you have Croatia with some interesting Nba players and some others. All in all Eurobasket is high quality competition with almost none bad teams.

[Derento]

In Slovenia's group is France and Greece.
Two teams with talented long wings and guards.
So I think it will be a very good opportunity for scouting Doncic.

[SportsGuy8]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

I was thinking about it...and as I said, Jaric was the closest similar type player I could think of from recent EuroLeague. Since Jaric also played in NBA, at least NBA fans should have some idea also then.

I don't think Doncic is stronger than Jaric though. Jaric was a really huge guard, 6-7 to 6-8, and he had a really built and strong body. He was very strong, and I would think definitely stronger than Doncic.

I would say Jaric is the closest player type, with Doncic being more athletic and a better outside shooter, and with Jaric being a better defensive player.

Jaric might have been stronger than Doncic is right now, but it's unlikely that's going to be the case in a couple of years. Anyone who is into serious strength-training learned the hard way just how slow and grueling the process is, it's impossible to be anywhere near your peak as a teenager, no matter how advanced for his age one is.

Doncic is also substantially ahead of Jaric in actual court-vision and overall feel for the game. Jaric really wasn't that special, he just had a good, NBA-like body. He is a similar player TYPE, but in actual abilities, they really aren't that close.

Doncic is basically Papaloukas trapped in Jaric's body. (I truly think that's quite accurate, even though I'm going to get killed for it )

In Slovenia's group is France and Greece.
Two teams with talented long wings and guards.
So I think it will be a very good opportunity for scouting Doncic.

But, but, but, he's going to be up against actual NBA players, so it won't matter. It only matters how he does against top prospects from his own draft class, KIDS who don't even know basic defensive concepts.

[Bob8]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

I was thinking about it...and as I said, Jaric was the closest similar type player I could think of from recent EuroLeague. Since Jaric also played in NBA, at least NBA fans should have some idea also then.

I don't think Doncic is stronger than Jaric though. Jaric was a really huge guard, 6-7 to 6-8, and he had a really built and strong body. He was very strong, and I would think definitely stronger than Doncic.

I would say Jaric is the closest player type, with Doncic being more athletic and a better outside shooter, and with Jaric being a better defensive player.

Jaric might have been stronger than Doncic is right now, but it's unlikely that's going to be the case in a couple of years. Anyone who is into serious strength-training learned the hard way just how slow and grueling the process is, it's impossible to be anywhere near your peak as a teenager, no matter how advanced for his age one is.

Doncic is also substantially ahead of Jaric in actual court-vision and overall feel for the game. Jaric really wasn't that special, he just had a good, NBA-like body. He is a similar player TYPE, but in actual abilities, they really aren't that close.

Doncic is basically Papaloukas trapped in Jaric's body. (I truly think that's quite accurate, even though I'm going to get killed for it )

The problem with Papaloukas is, he was awful shooter, something like Nick "the brick" Calathes nowadays. So you need the third player, not elite but good shooter. Maybe Jasikevicius?

I really don't like this comparisons. It's obvious that Luka will be very good at almost everything. The only problem I see is, will he be master in one? All the best had at least one area where they dominated. Luka is too young to have such area, his BBIQ and feeling for the game look wery good even now, the time will tell if he is capable to develop something special.

[Derento]

I really like his skill-set but I want to see more improvement in his slashing,inside skills and using his pullup jumpshot to playoff the drive.
If he can do that by next years draft he's the number one prospect for me.

[SportsGuy8]

I was thinking about it...and as I said, Jaric was the closest similar type player I could think of from recent EuroLeague. Since Jaric also played in NBA, at least NBA fans should have some idea also then.

I don't think Doncic is stronger than Jaric though. Jaric was a really huge guard, 6-7 to 6-8, and he had a really built and strong body. He was very strong, and I would think definitely stronger than Doncic.

I would say Jaric is the closest player type, with Doncic being more athletic and a better outside shooter, and with Jaric being a better defensive player.

Jaric might have been stronger than Doncic is right now, but it's unlikely that's going to be the case in a couple of years. Anyone who is into serious strength-training learned the hard way just how slow and grueling the process is, it's impossible to be anywhere near your peak as a teenager, no matter how advanced for his age one is.

Doncic is also substantially ahead of Jaric in actual court-vision and overall feel for the game. Jaric really wasn't that special, he just had a good, NBA-like body. He is a similar player TYPE, but in actual abilities, they really aren't that close.

Doncic is basically Papaloukas trapped in Jaric's body. (I truly think that's quite accurate, even though I'm going to get killed for it )

The problem with Papaloukas is, he was awful shooter, something like Nick "the brick" Calathes nowadays. So you need the third player, not elite but good shooter. Maybe Jasikevicius?

I really don't like this comparisons. It's obvious that Luka will be very good at almost everything. The only problem I see is, will he be master in one? All the best had at least one area where they dominated. Luka is too young to have such area, his BBIQ and feeling for the game look wery good even now, the time will tell if he is capable to develop something special.

I was targeting Papaloukas' bball-IQ, feel for the game and his playmaking abilities. There are several possessions basically every single game where he's highly reminiscent of Papaloukas and I think that eventually, Luka is going to thrive the most as a playmaker/point. He already reads situations extremely well, we can only imagine what it's going to be like in a few years. No matter how advanced his bball-IQ is for his age, he's still going to improve a lot with every season, just by experience alone.

His P'n'R passing is already great and now that he's starting to add passing out of post-ups to his game, a whole new level is opening up.

And unlike Rubio (I know, I also hate that I'm always bringing him up ), he's always going to be a scoring threat also, opening his passing abilities even further, not to mention being much taller, enabling him to see over defenses.

Even if his vision isn't as good as Rubio's and Papaloukas' (although even that remains to be seen), he's probably going to end up being a more efficient and better passer because his other abilities will open everything up for him ... He just needs to end up on a team that's going to need and see that in him.

[reanimator]

But, but, but, he's going to be up against actual NBA players, so it won't matter. It only matters how he does against top prospects from his own draft class, KIDS who don't even know basic defensive concepts.

Who said any of this? I'm sorry for wanting to see a Doncic vs Michael Porter Jr/Troy Brown or Doncic vs Ntilikina or Doncic vs Justin Jackson/Rowan Barrett Jr matchup :shrugs:

[SportsGuy8]

But, but, but, he's going to be up against actual NBA players, so it won't matter. It only matters how he does against top prospects from his own draft class, KIDS who don't even know basic defensive concepts.

Who said any of this? I'm sorry for wanting to see a Doncic vs Michael Porter Jr/Troy Brown or Doncic vs Ntilikina or Doncic vs Justin Jackson/Rowan Barrett Jr matchup :shrugs:

There were multiple posts about how what Doncic is doing isn't reliable because he's not doing it against NBA talent ... While at the same time, every other top prospect in both 2017 and 2018 is mostly up against KIDS who're going to end up in China or some other similar league, and then sometimes up against kids who MIGHT ONE DAY be good defensive players in the NBA.

For that one game every blue moon that you're going to see a top NCAA prospect vs. some other top prospect, you get Doncic vs. either Westbrook, or on a weekly basis you get to see him go against players that actually played in the NBA in the past and play defensive concepts that are even far ahead of the NBA (because of the rules)!

I actually agree with many of your valid concerns about Doncic, but if you're skeptical about how Doncic's game is going to translate to NBA and it's defenders, you should have even bigger concerns and skepticism when it comes to NCAA prospects who go against KIDS (even if they're sometimes kids with massive potential). If it's questionable how Doncic's game with translate to the NBA, then it should be super-duper questionable how Fultz's, Ball's, Jackson's games will translate ...

P.s.: What would even be the point of seeing Doncic vs. Ntilikina? Maybe in like 5 years Ntilikina is going to be close to Doncic, maybe even ahead (although I highly doubt that), but right now it would be an unwatchable bloodbath/massacre. Athleticism wouldn't matter, Doncic isn't some dummy like Hezonja or Musa who force things without thinking ...

[pohani komarac]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.

He is not playing U18 games for almost 2 years. He will play Eurobasket in pair with Goran Dragic for Slovenia this summer.

Thats a bit dissapointing. Thanks.

You can evaluate him better in circus game than against NBA and Euroleague players? OK

[reanimator]

I will not be baited...I will not be baited...I will not be baited

[a3r0d]

I really like his skill-set but I want to see more improvement in his slashing,inside skills and using his pullup jumpshot to playoff the drive.
If he can do that by next years draft he's the number one prospect for me.

Same. I have noticed already a couple of times that he managed to beat his own defender on the drive to the basket but then he didn't finish the layup and instead he goes for the kickout for the 3. Sometimes it seems like he ends up being surprised that he managed to get so easily under the basket.. I think that it has something to do with the "seniority" on the team as he obviously still doesn't have the green light to just shoot every time and it has also something to do that he is still adjusting to his body.
In the future i would really like him to try start finishing contested layups and goin for and ones, as he his body looks big enough to absorb contact.

[Mirotic12]

Jaric might have been stronger than Doncic is right now, but it's unlikely that's going to be the case in a couple of years. Anyone who is into serious strength-training learned the hard way just how slow and grueling the process is, it's impossible to be anywhere near your peak as a teenager, no matter how advanced for his age one is.

Doncic is also substantially ahead of Jaric in actual court-vision and overall feel for the game. Jaric really wasn't that special, he just had a good, NBA-like body. He is a similar player TYPE, but in actual abilities, they really aren't that close.

Doncic is basically Papaloukas trapped in Jaric's body. (I truly think that's quite accurate, even though I'm going to get killed for it ):

Sorry, but Papaloukas was light years a better passer and light years and then some better in court vision. Papaloukas was also way more athletic. People always talk about Papaloukas' athleticism, basing it on how he was from like age 30-35. They forget, or simply don't know, he was an absolute FREAK athlete when he was younger. When he was like age 20-25 he would regularly drive into the lane against a set defense and just throw down massive poster dunks on big men. His first step and leaping were really explosive.

Papaloukas was also better as a ball handler by miles.

Doncic is bigger than Papaloukas easily, and he's also a much better shooter than Papaloukas. I mean, at age 17-18, Doncic is a vastly superior shooter to what Papaloukas was at any time in his career. Even at age like age 35, when he finally had a decent set shot, Papaloukas still couldn't shoot in general, and was still being left open all the time, with the defense daring him to shoot the 3.

Doncic definitely has some similar traits and characteristics to Papaloulas, yes, that is true, and I mentioned it before. But no way is Doncic most like Papaloukas, or basically another different size Papaloukas. Not even in the same remote discussion in terms of passing and court vision. I'm sorry, but Papaloukas was light years ahead of Doncic in those ways, and Doncic, again - a much, much better shooter than Papaloukas.

They have some similar traits - big guards that can handle the ball, and run screen roll, and that can play multiple positions on offense and defense...but that's about the end of the similarity.

I also mentioned Zoran Planinic - he was a better passer, play maker, better in screen roll, and better court vision than Jaric. So there is also him as a comparison. But Planinic was like Papaloukas, in that he couldn't shoot at all. Jaric could shoot, so he is a closer comparison. You can't really compare guys in their skill sets, when one can shoot, and one can't shoot.

Same. I have noticed already a couple of times that he managed to beat his own defender on the drive to the basket but then he didn't finish the layup and instead he goes for the kickout for the 3. Sometimes it seems like he ends up being surprised that he managed to get so easily under the basket.. I think that it has something to do with the "seniority" on the team as he obviously still doesn't have the green light to just shoot every time and it has also something to do that he is still adjusting to his body.
In the future i would really like him to try start finishing contested layups and goin for and ones, as he his body looks big enough to absorb contact.

Real Madrid's coach is Pablo Laso. There is most definitely 100% no such thing ever uttered out of his mouth. That guy is like Mike D'Antoni on steroids. If anything, he would bench a guy for not shooting enough. He's the most offensively aggressive coach you would ever find anywhere. I can assure you, he never put an orange or red light on anyone that can shoot.

[Bob8]

Sorry, but Papaloukas was light years a better passer and light years and then some better in court vision. Papaloukas was also way more athletic. People always talk about Papaloukas' athleticism, basing it on how he was from like age 30-35. They forget, or simply don't know, he was an absolute FREAK athlete when he was younger. When he was like age 20-25 he would regularly drive into the lane against a set defense and just throw down massive poster dunks on big men. His first step and leaping were really explosive.

Papaloukas was also better as a ball handler by miles.

Doncic is bigger than Papaloukas easily, and he's also a much better shooter than Papaloukas. I mean, at age 17-18, Doncic is a vastly superior shooter to what Papaloukas was at any time in his career. Even at age like age 35, when he finally had a decent set shot, Papaloukas still couldn't shoot in general, and was still being left open all the time, with the defense daring him to shoot the 3.

Doncic definitely has some similar traits and characteristics to Papaloulas, yes, that is true, and I mentioned it before. But no way is Doncic most like Papaloukas, or basically another different size Papaloukas. Not even in the same remote discussion in terms of passing and court vision. I'm sorry, but Papaloukas was light years ahead of Doncic in those ways, and Doncic, again - a much, much better shooter than Papaloukas.

They have some similar traits - big guards that can handle the ball, and run screen roll, and that can play multiple positions on offense and defense...but that's about the end of the similarity.

I also mentioned Zoran Planinic - he was a better passer, play maker, better in screen roll, and better court vision than Jaric. So there is also him as a comparison. But Planinic was like Papaloukas, in that he couldn't shoot at all. Jaric could shoot, so he is a closer comparison. You can't really compare guys in their skill sets, when one can shoot, and one can't shoot.

I think we're at least 5 years to early for this comparisons. It' not fair to Doncic, because we're comparing a 17 years old boy with Legends in their prime time. He will for sure be much better in 5 years time. And it's not fair to Legends to compare them with a boy who has potential but in reality still didn't do anything to deserve this comparisons.

[Mirotic12]

I think we're at least 5 years to early for this comparisons. It' not fair to Doncic, because we're comparing a 17 years old boy with Legends in their prime time. He will for sure be much better in 5 years time. And it's not fair to Legends to compare them with a boy who has potential but in reality still didn't do anything to deserve this comparisons.

Papaloukas might be a legend for European basketball - fair to say that, but he's a lower tier one - he's certainly not any Jasikevicius or Spanoulis for example. And guys like Jaric and Planinic were no legends for European basketball standards. Planinic was very talented, extremely talented actually, but he never learned to shoot. So he was much like Rubio or Calathes as you said, a negative for the offense because the other team could just leave him open.

Jaric was a really damn good overall player in his best times. He could easily single handed take over games with his offense or his defense, or both. However, he was one of the most inconsistent and laziest players around. He had all the physical tools and all the skills to be an all time great player, and to be a all star for years in NBA. But his work ethic was obviously nothing, and his effort and consistency were not there usually. He had all the tools to be great, and instead he was just a good player (decent NBA starter for 6 years / very good, but inconsistent EuroLeague player for a few years).

So it's not like Doncic is being compared to some truly great players or anything here. Papaloukas was the only one that you could ever say was the best player in EuroLeague for example. Guys like Planinic and Jaric sure the hell were never the best player in EuroLeague. And even in the case of Papaloukas, he was the best player in EuroLeague at his his peak, but he was never that kind of Bodiroga, Navarro, Spanoulis, Jasekivicius, Diamantidis - he was never THAT kind of EuroLeague level player.

At least with Planinic and Jaric, we are not talking about legends...not at all. Planinic even had a fatal flaw as a player, with having no jump shot at all.

Doncic isn't that far off from being peak Planinic with a jumper right now. Not as good in screen roll, or in ball handing, as Planinic was, but he's not that far off either.

[Bob8]

I think we're at least 5 years to early for this comparisons. It' not fair to Doncic, because we're comparing a 17 years old boy with Legends in their prime time. He will for sure be much better in 5 years time. And it's not fair to Legends to compare them with a boy who has potential but in reality still didn't do anything to deserve this comparisons.

Papaloukas might be a legend for European basketball - fair to say that, but he's a lower tier one - he's certainly not any Jasikevicius or Spanoulis for example. And guys like Jaric and Planinic were no legends for European basketball standards. Planinic was very talented, extremely talented actually, but he never learned to shoot. So he was much like Rubio or Calathes as you said, a negative for the offense because the other team could just leave him open.

Jaric was a really damn good overall player in his best times. He could easily single handed take over games with his offense or his defense, or both. However, he was one of the most inconsistent and laziest players around. He had all the physical tools and all the skills to be an all time great player, and to be a all star for years in NBA. But his work ethic was obviously nothing, and his effort and consistency were not there usually. He had all the tools to be great, and instead he was just a good player (decent NBA starter for 6 years / very good, but inconsistent EuroLeague player for a few years).

So it's not like Doncic is being compared to some truly great players or anything here. Papaloukas was the only one that you could ever say was the best player in EuroLeague for example. Guys like Planinic and Jaric sure the hell were never the best player in EuroLeague. And even in the case of Papaloukas, he was the best player in EuroLeague at his his peak, but he was never that kind of Bodiroga, Navarro, Spanoulis, Jasekivicius, Diamantidis - he was never THAT kind of EuroLeague level player.

At least with Planinic and Jaric, we are not talking about legends...not at all. Planinic even had a fatal flaw as a player, with having no jump shot at all.

Doncic isn't that far off from being peak Planinic with a jumper right now. Not as good in screen roll, or in ball handing, as Planinic was, but he's not that far off either.

my point is, we're comparing very good/great players in their prime time to a kid who is not formatted as a player yet. for example, you said Bodiroga was much better rebounder, but I think Doncic can be easy better than Bodiroga, because he already is more than decent(4,2 rbt in 19 minutes, Bodiroga 4.8 in 31 minutes) and it's very safe to say Doncic will be around 6.8, stronger than now and with much more experience than now. and we can say that for shooting, passing, playmaking... I tried to find some stats for this players when they were 17, but I didn't find anything. But I doubt they looked that good than Doncic. But saying that, Doncic is still long way away from Bodiroga, Papaloukas, Kukoc... We just can't compare players in such different time of their careers. There is one thing that makes Doncic really special, he was couple of times near triple double, that means he is very good at alomost everything and that's really rare in european basketball, and he's 17.

P.s. Stats comparison between different decades can be a bit tricky, because the game is much faster, that means more possessions and inflated stats.