Frank Kaminsky

[BringtheD]

Some guys stay all four years in school because they want to, not because they needed the extra time to get the attention of the NBA. Kaminsky put up equally impressive numbers last year and would have been a 1st round pick last year had he declared.

Kris Dunn is going to be a great case of this next year. His athleticism, steal rate, and A/TO ration would have had scouts drooling about him. He is a better prospect than Cam Payne and would have made the lottery had he declared. He is likely going to dominate college basketball next year and will still be in the lottery conversation if he doesn't get hurt. The same could be said of Duncan, he would have been the number one pick had he declared as a Junior. He stayed another year and was still the #1 pick. Not all four year college guys should be labeled as fully developed, low ceiling players.

i totally agree with what you said, it never hurts to stay in school and develop it's just most guys are after the money and overall i think it hurts the quality and often times stunts the growth of guys who could use the extra time to develop and even learn something not money. i was just wondering if kaminsky had a ceiling as high as dirk but now I know why he doesn't.

[Johnlac1]

in the athletic tools department i put kaminsky in between nowitzki and okur. less athletic than nowitzki but more athletic than okur. does the difference in athleticism between dirk and frank prevent kaminsky from becoming like dirk? I like to think kaminsky has the tools to be like dirk but idk, I don't see a big difference in athleticisim, and they are both better shooters than okur. I think frank has a step okur didn't, and i'd be surprised if kaminsky isn't better than okur was.

A pretty good analysis. Nowitzki was a pretty rare kind of big man....a big man who could put the ball on the floor and make jump shots from 20+ ft with a hand in his face.
Kaminsky can't do that, but he can hit long jumpers off a curl and take the ball to the basket. I watched almost every badger game for the last two years.
He only took one or two per game, but looking at where he shot from, many were right around the the NBA three point line. He has excellent form, and the NBA three ball shouldn't be a problem for him.

[BringtheD]

in the athletic tools department i put kaminsky in between nowitzki and okur. less athletic than nowitzki but more athletic than okur. does the difference in athleticism between dirk and frank prevent kaminsky from becoming like dirk? I like to think kaminsky has the tools to be like dirk but idk, I don't see a big difference in athleticisim, and they are both better shooters than okur. I think frank has a step okur didn't, and i'd be surprised if kaminsky isn't better than okur was.

A pretty good analysis. Nowitzki was a pretty rare kind of big man....a big man who could put the ball on the floor and make jump shots from 20+ ft with a hand in his face.
Kaminsky can't do that, but he can hit long jumpers off a curl and take the ball to the basket. I watched almost every badger game for the last two years.
He only took one or two per game, but looking at where he shot from, many were right around the the NBA three point line. He has excellent form, and the NBA three ball shouldn't be a problem for him.

I think a slower player trying to guard kaminsky on the perimeter and kaminsky will look like he's dirk, he'll be able to put the ball on the floor and get a shot off...that guy would be dead meat. but i don't see him putting the ball on the floor and shooting over smfwds with a hand in his face, no.

[greg4012]

Looking for feedback -- what makes Kaminsky a better NBA prospect than Kelly Olynyk? I see very similar NBA ceilings for them


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forumjbogmmm

[BringtheD]

Looking for feedback -- what makes Kaminsky a better NBA prospect than Kelly Olynyk? I see very similar NBA ceilings for them


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forumjbogmmm

kaminsky is a better shooter, can put the ball on the floor a little, and has a back to the basket game, all around offensive tool set. olynyk is a poor man's okur, rebounds and shoots, but doesn't even have the back to the basket game that okur had. .kaminsky is at least a richmans okur, if not a poormans nowitzki.

[BringtheD]

kaminsky has a really good back to the basket game, his footwork is on level with al jefferson, he's going to be faking people out all day, kaminsky will be better than okur whom relied on strength down low. olynyk has zero back to the basket game, and only puts the ball on the floor to dribble out of traffic, he's a poor mans okur at best. okur was better at everything than olynyk is and kaminsky will better at everything than okur. that's why i was wondering where his ceiling was, it ain't dirk, but damn between okur and nowitzki is a damn fine offensive player. the footwork of al jeff with the shooting touch of nowitzki, how much will he be able to put the ball on the floor and create and do the heavy damage was the questio but he'll be a dangerous player who will get stopped by faster players on the perimeter, and shut down by the double teams, but he'll be more than just a shooter or someone whom you throw the ball to and sit back and watch.

[Johnlac1]

in the athletic tools department i put kaminsky in between nowitzki and okur. less athletic than nowitzki but more athletic than okur. does the difference in athleticism between dirk and frank prevent kaminsky from becoming like dirk? I like to think kaminsky has the tools to be like dirk but idk, I don't see a big difference in athleticisim, and they are both better shooters than okur. I think frank has a step okur didn't, and i'd be surprised if kaminsky isn't better than okur was.

A pretty good analysis. Nowitzki was a pretty rare kind of big man....a big man who could put the ball on the floor and make jump shots from 20+ ft with a hand in his face.
Kaminsky can't do that, but he can hit long jumpers off a curl and take the ball to the basket. I watched almost every badger game for the last two years.
He only took one or two per game, but looking at where he shot from, many were right around the the NBA three point line. He has excellent form, and the NBA three ball shouldn't be a problem for him.

I think a slower player trying to guard kaminsky on the perimeter and kaminsky will look like he's dirk, he'll be able to put the ball on the floor and get a shot off...that guy would be dead meat. but i don't see him putting the ball on the floor and shooting over smfwds with a hand in his face, no.

No, but he will post up sfs. That's what makes Kaminsky a prospective valuable off. performer. He can hit the three, take it to the basket, and post up. Basically, few big men can make shots consistently with a hand in their face away from the basket.

[Johnlac1]

Looking for feedback -- what makes Kaminsky a better NBA prospect than Kelly Olynyk? I see very similar NBA ceilings for them


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forumjbogmmm

They are very similar players. Frank might have better post up moves.

[doordoor123]

Looking for feedback -- what makes Kaminsky a better NBA prospect than Kelly Olynyk? I see very similar NBA ceilings for them


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forumjbogmmm

They are very similar players. Frank might have better post up moves.

Better post up moves, better handle, better passer and better shooter.

[BringtheD]

A pretty good analysis. Nowitzki was a pretty rare kind of big man....a big man who could put the ball on the floor and make jump shots from 20+ ft with a hand in his face.
Kaminsky can't do that, but he can hit long jumpers off a curl and take the ball to the basket. I watched almost every badger game for the last two years.
He only took one or two per game, but looking at where he shot from, many were right around the the NBA three point line. He has excellent form, and the NBA three ball shouldn't be a problem for him.

I think a slower player trying to guard kaminsky on the perimeter and kaminsky will look like he's dirk, he'll be able to put the ball on the floor and get a shot off...that guy would be dead meat. but i don't see him putting the ball on the floor and shooting over smfwds with a hand in his face, no.

No, but he will post up sfs. That's what makes Kaminsky a prospective valuable off. performer. He can hit the three, take it to the basket, and post up. Basically, few big men can make shots consistently with a hand in their face away from the basket.

ya, but I think Kaminsky will be able to take anyone on in the post and sfwds will be no exception. one on one i like his chances down there even against the howards and jordans.

[greg4012]

Looking for feedback -- what makes Kaminsky a better NBA prospect than Kelly Olynyk? I see very similar NBA ceilings for them


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forumjbogmmm

kaminsky is a better shooter, can put the ball on the floor a little, and has a back to the basket game, all around offensive tool set. olynyk is a poor man's okur, rebounds and shoots, but doesn't even have the back to the basket game that okur had. .kaminsky is at least a richmans okur, if not a poormans nowitzki.

Is he a better shooter though? Olynyk wasn't asked to shoot 3s at Gonzaga, but proved off the bat in the NBA that he was an adept 3 point shooter. Further, his shot %'s from everywhere else on the court (in college) were as good or better than Frank's. 53% for Olynyk on 2 point jumpshots as a Junior vs. 38% on 2 point jumpshots for Frank.

As such, since Olynyk spent less time on the perimeter, he actually scored A LOT from his back to the basket game in college. 64% of Olynyk's FGA in college were around the rim (largely from his back to the basket game) whereas 41% of Frank's FGA were around the rim. Both converted around 70%.

I really just don't see a big difference in skillset and I'm look for more than no because not. It has me concerned that Olynyk is a good indicator for what Frank's NBA projection could be. Not that Olynyk is a poor player at all. He is a solid rotation player, and I'm confident Frank will be similar. I just think this talk of Dirk comparisons and Okur as his floor is madness.

[BringtheD]

Looking for feedback -- what makes Kaminsky a better NBA prospect than Kelly Olynyk? I see very similar NBA ceilings for them


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forumjbogmmm

kaminsky is a better shooter, can put the ball on the floor a little, and has a back to the basket game, all around offensive tool set. olynyk is a poor man's okur, rebounds and shoots, but doesn't even have the back to the basket game that okur had. .kaminsky is at least a richmans okur, if not a poormans nowitzki.

Is he a better shooter though? Olynyk wasn't asked to shoot 3s at Gonzaga, but proved off the bat in the NBA that he was an adept 3 point shooter. Further, his shot %'s from everywhere else on the court (in college) were as good or better than Frank's. 53% for Olynyk on 2 point jumpshots as a Junior vs. 38% on 2 point jumpshots for Frank.

As such, since Olynyk spent less time on the perimeter, he actually scored A LOT from his back to the basket game in college. 64% of Olynyk's FGA in college were around the rim (largely from his back to the basket game) whereas 41% of Frank's FGA were around the rim. Both converted around 70%.

I really just don't see a big difference in skillset and I'm look for more than no because not. It has me concerned that Olynyk is a good indicator for what Frank's NBA projection could be. Not that Olynyk is a poor player at all. He is a solid rotation player, and I'm confident Frank will be similar. I just think this talk of Dirk comparisons and Okur as his floor is madness.

unfortunately olynyks stats in college don't represent the player he is in the nba, and i watched him in college and he didn't have any footwork then and he doesn't now, and no one is asking him to live in the paint in the nba which is why he is just there to stretch the floor because he can't handle the ball and you can't ask him to get you points in the paint. kaminsky is the better shooter as of this moment and will be going forward especially in transistion where it matters the most. olynyk might have an edge in the midrange game as a shooter but that's where seven footers get most of their open looks in the nba, while in the college game it is more crowded, and you know kaminsky didn't get the open looks in college that olynyk got anywhere on the court, in the nba those midrange shots will either be uncontested or they will be passing situations. if i've ever seen olynyk hit a three in transistion i must've overlooked it, but that is a skill that okur had and kaminsky has shown he has.
then there is dirk who is so fast to the line and will just kill you if you leave him open, i don't remember olynyk ever hitting a three in transistion and i think that is something that translates to the nba, unlike how olynyk got his buckets doesn't translate to the nba, how kaminsky gets his buckets will translate, because of footwork, ballhandling, and shooting skills that olynyk doesn't have because he's too clumsy. in the face up game, olynyk will never, ever be a threat to dribble past anyone, that's something out of the realm of possibility for olynyk. okur could do it every once in awhle, dirk has a great first step, and this is the part of the game where i wonder how effective kaminsky will be, i'm not too worried about whether olynyk shoots the open midrange shot better than kaminsky right now. so i think my comparisons are pretty valid. if olynyk was any kind of threat to dribble and create a shot he wouldn't be such a good midrange shooter because he wouldn't be getting those open looks so much. kaminsky is faster and more athletic than okur but really there aren't many 7fters who are good shooters and were good. olynyk is better than hawes, but not by a whole lot. thats the best i can say about him but i don't think its saying much because i don't think he's as athletic or as skilled, he's just better because he plays like he wants to win.
olynyk plays with a chip on his shoulder and i like that, but at the end of the day he's too clumsy and slow to be compared to kaminsky, kaminsky can do alot of things that olynyk simply can't, so i'd rather compare kaminsky to good players because it's a better comparison, while i think hawes is more comparable to olynyk in terms of overall effectiveness.

[SelfishPlayer]

He's like as poor man's Keith Van Horn. College basketball doesn't have such great competition like in decades past, so be very careful how you value prospects that were garbage their first two or even first three college seasons. There is a huge strength and experience gap these "late bloomers" are able to capitalize upon that doesn't translate to professional basketball.

[J_Fan]

My biggest problem with Kaminsky is the fact that he needs the offense to be centered around him to be effective. He's a 7'0 big man who's not the most athletic, nor is he the most quick. He's not going to be out there like WCS hustling all over the place. In Wisconsin, I've noticed that in several games, if he's not involved in the offense or has the ball in his hands, Wisconsin sucks and Kaminsky is invisible. I think that will be a problem in the NBA.

Kaminsky will start off as a role player on all NBA teams. He won't have an offense that is built around him anymore. I just can't see him being as effective as he was in college in the NBA. He's just not that effective off the ball. To make things worse, he's not going to be anything more than an average defender in the NBA.


Am I the only one who shares this concern about his effectiveness when you take him off the ball? I just can't see teams making him their GUY unless he improves tremendously. He'll obviously have plays ran for him.

[BringtheD]

He's like as poor man's Keith Van Horn. College basketball doesn't have such great competition like in decades past, so be very careful how you value prospects that were garbage their first two or even first three college seasons. There is a huge strength and experience gap these "late bloomers" are able to capitalize upon that doesn't translate to professional basketball.

ya, but kaminsky is 7ft tall and shoots lights out and that translates, van horn was not seven feet tall and therefore couldn't just shoot over people. kaminsky's footwork in the post will translate, he'll have to work at being more creative getting his shot off, but the footwork and ballhandling he has in the post will translate, if he relied on strength then i'd say the work he does down there wouldn't translate, but he's more of an al jefferson down there. if you can run him off of curls, which i've heard he can do, he becomes effective off the ball. he may even be able to put the ball on the floor in the perimeter and create against equally athletic players. i don't think anyone is going to be trying to run wcs off of screens or expecting him to knock down threes in transition. kaminsky stayed in school and got the experience he needed to be good in the pros.

[SelfishPlayer]

He's like as poor man's Keith Van Horn. College basketball doesn't have such great competition like in decades past, so be very careful how you value prospects that were garbage their first two or even first three college seasons. There is a huge strength and experience gap these "late bloomers" are able to capitalize upon that doesn't translate to professional basketball.

ya, but kaminsky is 7ft tall and shoots lights out and that translates, van horn was not seven feet tall and therefore couldn't just shoot over people. kaminsky's footwork in the post will translate, he'll have to work at being more creative getting his shot off, but the footwork and ballhandling he has in the post will translate, if he relied on strength then i'd say the work he does down there wouldn't translate, but he's more of an al jefferson down there. if you can run him off of curls, which i've heard he can do, he becomes effective off the ball. he may even be able to put the ball on the floor in the perimeter and create against equally athletic players. i don't think anyone is going to be trying to run wcs off of screens or expecting him to knock down threes in transition. kaminsky stayed in school and got the experience he needed to be good in the pros.

Kaminsky is a 7 footer but his standing reach is pretty ordinary, relatively speaking. Being that you play basketball with your arms and hands, I believe that those measurements are more important than the measurement of the distance from the top of your head to the ground. Frank has a 9'1.5" standing reach. Kevin Durant has 9'2", Spencer Hawes 9'2", LaMarcus Aldridge 9'2", Charlie villanueva 9'1"' Chris bosh 9'1", Michael Beasley 9'1", Patrick Patterson 9'2", Channing Frye 9'2.5", Austin Daye 9'2". Those are all shooters and none of them just show up to games and simply shoot over everyone.

[BringtheD]

He's like as poor man's Keith Van Horn. College basketball doesn't have such great competition like in decades past, so be very careful how you value prospects that were garbage their first two or even first three college seasons. There is a huge strength and experience gap these "late bloomers" are able to capitalize upon that doesn't translate to professional basketball.

ya, but kaminsky is 7ft tall and shoots lights out and that translates, van horn was not seven feet tall and therefore couldn't just shoot over people. kaminsky's footwork in the post will translate, he'll have to work at being more creative getting his shot off, but the footwork and ballhandling he has in the post will translate, if he relied on strength then i'd say the work he does down there wouldn't translate, but he's more of an al jefferson down there. if you can run him off of curls, which i've heard he can do, he becomes effective off the ball. he may even be able to put the ball on the floor in the perimeter and create against equally athletic players. i don't think anyone is going to be trying to run wcs off of screens or expecting him to knock down threes in transition. kaminsky stayed in school and got the experience he needed to be good in the pros.

Kaminsky is a 7 footer but his standing reach is pretty ordinary, relatively speaking. Being that you play basketball with your arms and hands, I believe that those measurements are more important than the measurement of the distance from the top of your head to the ground. Frank has a 9'1.5" standing reach. Kevin Durant has 9'2", Spencer Hawes 9'2", LaMarcus Aldridge 9'2", Charlie villanueva 9'1"' Chris bosh 9'1", Michael Beasley 9'1", Patrick Patterson 9'2", Channing Frye 9'2.5", Austin Daye 9'2". Those are all shooters and none of them just show up to games and simply shoot over everyone.

They will if they are open and the guy is late, they'll just shoot right over them. At that point the shot usually just goes uncontested. It happens alot to 7fters that can shoot. And durant can shoot the three over a doubleteam, he simply shoots over people all the time like dirk does. If you're not the focal point of an offense, and I don't see frank as a focal point, he'll get lots of open looks and he'll be shooting over people all the time, whether they're late on a rotation, or just too slow to lock him down, or too short to really bother his shot. i haven't thought about it in depth, but it seems the taller you are the easier it is to shoot over people, and standing reach is more of defensive tool assessment, and for most players, the longer their arms the more difficult it is for them to shoot and control the ball in the post. the exceptional athletes like durant though, if you give him an inch of space he'll shoot right over you, but his ball handling is so good he usually puts the ball on the floor.

[JMac1]

I just hope he falls to us and we keep Bledsoe. Kaminsky is a better, YOUNGER Channing Frye. Not a superstar, but a guy who you have to respect and he'll put up 25 on you if you sleep on him. Perfect starting role player.

[skones]

My biggest problem with Kaminsky is the fact that he needs the offense to be centered around him to be effective. He's a 7'0 big man who's not the most athletic, nor is he the most quick. He's not going to be out there like WCS hustling all over the place. In Wisconsin, I've noticed that in several games, if he's not involved in the offense or has the ball in his hands, Wisconsin sucks and Kaminsky is invisible. I think that will be a problem in the NBA.

Kaminsky will start off as a role player on all NBA teams. He won't have an offense that is built around him anymore. I just can't see him being as effective as he was in college in the NBA. He's just not that effective off the ball. To make things worse, he's not going to be anything more than an average defender in the NBA.


Am I the only one who shares this concern about his effectiveness when you take him off the ball? I just can't see teams making him their GUY unless he improves tremendously. He'll obviously have plays ran for him.

This just isn't accurate. The swing offense is not centered around any one player. Acting as if Wisconsin's offense was built around him couldn't be further from the truth. The fact that Kaminsky was incredibly productive in a system like Wisconsin's should alleviate the concerns you have in that regard, not escalate them.

[bobsquad]

I'm having premonitions that Sacramento will take Kaminsky at #6 if Porzingis is off the board (as he will be). Could anyone else see this happening?