Dragan Bender - 97 born Croatian prospect

[Avihs7]

I doubt Thibs drafts him. After reading some threads in the bulls forum. Sounds like Thibs doesn't like playing rookies. Bender being so raw and only 18, I highly doubt he'll be a Timberwolf

[Von Bismarck]

Mind the title, it's a good read about Bender's life -> http://thelab.bleacherreport.com/the-next-porzingis/?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=programming-national

I also didn't know this;

That summer (2013), the Bender brothers traveled to Barcelona, Spain, to play in a Euroleague youth tournament. In one game, Dragan, who was two years younger than virtually every other player in the tournament, matched up against Kristaps Porzingis. Dragan scored 11 points against the future NBA lottery pick and, according to several observers who witnessed the matchup, held his own against the older Porzingis.

[SeattleJazzFan]

bender is a bust. he's not very athletic, he's not long for his height, his production either at the adult level or the high school level is poor, everything about him screams bust. lol @ whoever takes him top 5.

[PizzaLord305]

bender is a bust. he's not very athletic, he's not long for his height, his production either at the adult level or the high school level is poor, everything about him screams bust. lol @ whoever takes him top 5.

lol um he runs this floor and can handle the ball and make plays on the fast break at 7'1 lol. He has offensive and defensive versatility he gives his best effort when he plays. looks more impressive on youtube than kristaps did and kp is a good nba player atm. You cant judge him based on production at the adult level when he plays in bfe under most likely a lackluster coach who plays the older dudes he knows in a backwards ass league bro. He does really well against his age group at camps and stuff. Hes as legit as these euro players get man. Nothing about him screams bust.

[Johnny Firpo]

he's not long for his height

What are you talking about, he has a standing reach of 9'3, that would be like the 22nd highest ever recorded data. Also at around 7'3, by the draft possibly 7'4 wingspan, that's elite length.

[Cactus Jack]

bender is a bust. he's not very athletic, he's not long for his height, his production either at the adult level or the high school level is poor, everything about him screams bust. lol @ whoever takes him top 5.

Agreed. Not top 5 worthy. Decent player. Not a difference maker.

[EMG518]

I doubt Thibs drafts him. After reading some threads in the bulls forum. Sounds like Thibs doesn't like playing rookies. Bender being so raw and only 18, I highly doubt he'll be a Timberwolf

Playing a rookie on the Bulls and playing a rookie on the Timberwolves are two completely different scenarios.

[Patsfan1081]

bender is a bust. he's not very athletic, he's not long for his height, his production either at the adult level or the high school level is poor, everything about him screams bust. lol @ whoever takes him top 5.

You have to love it when people make conclusions after looking up stats online and do not have a clue what they are talking about. Bender at 16 wasn't putting up big numbers in juniors?

[Patsfan1081]

bender is a bust. he's not very athletic, he's not long for his height, his production either at the adult level or the high school level is poor, everything about him screams bust. lol @ whoever takes him top 5.

Agreed. Not top 5 worthy. Decent player. Not a difference maker.

And you came to this conclusion how? Weird that you know something that the tons of scouts getting paid to watch every second of this Kidd doent see. Anyone who thinks they have a clue on how some 18 year old kid is going to develope and end up is really difficult to take seriously. I guess it's easier to predict somone becoming a bust though.

[Patsfan1081]

I think there's a big difference between college basketball and u18 games... College is ugly but it's organized and has real schedules and coaches with long term interest in the quality of play... U18 is more like an exhibition or all star game.

Nah, you're wrong on all accounts -maybe you're confusing the FIBA competitions with those exhibition games and tournaments like the Europcamp and such- but that's beyond the point: someone has already posted the game there and people can watch for themselves if it was competitive or not and how the 18 year old Sabonics stacked up against the 16 years old Bender. Of course, some people will insist on having opinions without watching, but we agree we can safely discard those as silly.

I'd say two things in response to this.

1. If you think no one who hasn't watched years of U(whatever age) games in depth has a valid opinion... Okay, that's fine, but I would strongly recommend you never come on RealGM - Draft, because 90% of poster will admit to not having watched many of those games careful and of the remaining 10% that do claim to have watched those games, 90% are lying.

2. Here's my view. Proformance in U(whatever age) games isn't meaningless, but it's REALLY hard to interpret. I think what's MUCH more meaningful is that he cannot get on the floor for his ACTUAL basketball team.

So how would you explain every other Euro star that came over who saw even less playing time then Bender their rookie season? The six and a half minutes a game Porzingis saw when he was Bender's age?

[Golabki]

Nah, you're wrong on all accounts -maybe you're confusing the FIBA competitions with those exhibition games and tournaments like the Europcamp and such- but that's beyond the point: someone has already posted the game there and people can watch for themselves if it was competitive or not and how the 18 year old Sabonics stacked up against the 16 years old Bender. Of course, some people will insist on having opinions without watching, but we agree we can safely discard those as silly.

I'd say two things in response to this.

1. If you think no one who hasn't watched years of U(whatever age) games in depth has a valid opinion... Okay, that's fine, but I would strongly recommend you never come on RealGM - Draft, because 90% of poster will admit to not having watched many of those games careful and of the remaining 10% that do claim to have watched those games, 90% are lying.

2. Here's my view. Proformance in U(whatever age) games isn't meaningless, but it's REALLY hard to interpret. I think what's MUCH more meaningful is that he cannot get on the floor for his ACTUAL basketball team.

So how would you explain every other Euro star that came over who saw even less playing time then Bender their rookie season? The six and a half minutes a game Porzingis saw when he was Bender's age?

Zinger played WAY more at about the same age. Bender was DNP coaches decision most nights this past season and Zinger was a core rotation guy. And Zinger put up better per minute stats. AND Zinger had another year of improvement under his belt when drafted.

It's true that Bender was a few months younger relative to the league and playing for a higher profile team... so maybe you can forgive him that. But then your valuing him like a high schooler.

[Von Bismarck]

Zinger played WAY more at about the same age. Bender was DNP coaches decision most nights this past season and Zinger was a core rotation guy. And Zinger put up better per minute stats. AND Zinger had another year of improvement under his belt when drafted.

Why do people have that need to lie when trying to prove something?

When Kristaps Porzingis was 17-18 (2012/2013 season), like Bender was this season, he played exactly 10 games with Sevilla senior team through the whole season, averaging 6.7 minutes.

Bender played around 35 games this season for Maccabi, averaging about 15 minutes per game.

Besides that, competition in Sevilla is incomparable to Maccabi. Sevilla is just below average Euro team while Maccabi is European powerhouse, one of the best Euro teams ever.

[Golabki]

Zinger played WAY more at about the same age. Bender was DNP coaches decision most nights this past season and Zinger was a core rotation guy. And Zinger put up better per minute stats. AND Zinger had another year of improvement under his belt when drafted.

Why do people have that need to lie when trying to prove something?

When Kristaps Porzingis was 17-18 (2012/2013 season), like Bender was this season, he played exactly 10 games with Sevilla senior team through the whole season, averaging 6.7 minutes.

Bender played around 35 games this season for Maccabi, averaging about 15 minutes per game.

Zinger was closer to Bender's age now in the 2013/2014 season. Math, use it.

[Von Bismarck]

Zinger was closer to Bender's age now in the 2013/2014 season. Math, use it.

Let's play by your rules then


Porzingis in 2013/2014 season (ACB league, 35 games)

15.2 MPG - 6.9p 2,8r 0,3a 0,9blk - 53% 2PT 30% 3PT 63% FT


Bender this season (Israeli superleague, 26 games)

13.5 MPG - 5,4p 2,7r 0,8a 0,9blk - 57% 2PT 40% 3PT 73% FT


So, could you please tell me, how the following stats made you say ''Zinger played WAY more at about the same age. Bender was DNP coaches decision most nights this past season and Zinger was a core rotation guy. And Zinger put up better per minute stats.''

[Golabki]

Zinger was closer to Bender's age now in the 2013/2014 season. Math, use it.

Let's play by your rules then


Porzingis in 2013/2014 season (ACB league, 35 games)

15.2 MPG - 6.9p 2,8r 0,3a 0,9blk - 53% 2PT 30% 3PT 63% FT


Bender this season (Israeli superleague, 26 games)

13.5 MPG - 5,4p 2,7r 0,8a 0,9blk - 57% 2PT 40% 3PT 73% FT


So, could you please tell me, how the following stats made you say ''Zinger played WAY more at about the same age. Bender was DNP coaches decision most nights this past season and Zinger was a core rotation guy. And Zinger put up better per minute stats.''

Well... it's not my rule... it's how age works.

But you're right, I was looking more at euroleague where is role was reduced. I would still say he had a smaller role and was less effective in a weaker league than the ACB.

[Von Bismarck]

But you're right, I was looking more at euroleague where is role was reduced. I would still say he had a smaller role and was less effective in a weaker league than the ACB.

Yeah, the league is weaker but the club and the team is much stronger so he logically had less usage (he did, I checked).

I would not say he was less effective. If you take PER-40 statistics, you can see Zinger only had advantage in PTS and that advantage is small, Bender was actually more effective in everything else basically.

Their shooting numbers are also incomparable.

Anyhow, I do agree Bender won't be ready to immediately contribute like Zinger, but that's less important if a rebuilding team like Suns draft him.

[Cactus Jack]

bender is a bust. he's not very athletic, he's not long for his height, his production either at the adult level or the high school level is poor, everything about him screams bust. lol @ whoever takes him top 5.

Agreed. Not top 5 worthy. Decent player. Not a difference maker.

And you came to this conclusion how? Weird that you know something that the tons of scouts getting paid to watch every second of this Kidd doent see. Anyone who thinks they have a clue on how some 18 year old kid is going to develope and end up is really difficult to take seriously. I guess it's easier to predict somone becoming a bust though.

His upside is Motiejunas imo. Not the same athlete as Porzingis. Players like Dunn, Murray, Hield are superior prospects.

[saintEscaton]

Agreed. Not top 5 worthy. Decent player. Not a difference maker.

And you came to this conclusion how? Weird that you know something that the tons of scouts getting paid to watch every second of this Kidd doent see. Anyone who thinks they have a clue on how some 18 year old kid is going to develope and end up is really difficult to take seriously. I guess it's easier to predict somone becoming a bust though.

His upside is Motiejunas imo. Not the same athlete as Porzingis. Players like Dunn, Murray, Hield are superior prospects.

I see a poor man's Kukoc/ tougher Mirotic. Or he ends up becoming another Nikoloz Tskitishvili

[UcanUwill]

go watch Nikoloz highlights on Youtube, that guy is just terrible, so stiff and slow, nothing like Bender. I recently watched Nikoloz just for curiosity sake, and I don't want to come out as hindsight genius, but I have no idea how the hell that guy was a top 5 pick, guy is obvious bust. Sometimes you can call a bust just from his movement, running and such, Nikoloz is one of those guys.

I am not the biggest Bender fan, and I am not saying he can't bust, but when you see him move, so light on his feet, guy is oozing with potential. Guy just need to learn learnable things, he has everything else.

[Novocaine]

Agreed. Not top 5 worthy. Decent player. Not a difference maker.

And you came to this conclusion how? Weird that you know something that the tons of scouts getting paid to watch every second of this Kidd doent see. Anyone who thinks they have a clue on how some 18 year old kid is going to develope and end up is really difficult to take seriously. I guess it's easier to predict somone becoming a bust though.

His upside is Motiejunas imo. Not the same athlete as Porzingis. Players like Dunn, Murray, Hield are superior prospects.

Yeah, but he asked how did you arrive to that conclusion.