DeAndre Ayton

[GimmeDat]

Semantics, but I'm not sure I'd say he lacks heart - he seems to care out there and shows emotion out on the court at times. I would suggest it's more that he seems to be a bit too soft natured.

[ItsThatEasy]

Semantics, but I'm not sure I'd say he lacks heart - he seems to care out there and shows emotion out on the court at times. I would suggest it's more that he seems to be a bit too soft natured.

He definitely doesn't lack heart or show disinterest. I just think it's a maturity thing, plus he's still relatively new to the game. As he continues to play against high level comp I have faith that he'll adapt and grow, especially if he gets a great vet his rookie year. A guy like Tyson Chandler for instance would do wonders for Ayton.

[King Ken]

I feel the same about Bamba. Both need a decent center vet around them. They play the game wrong still. I don't want them to be like Towns. Uber talented flawed player. Where you got to play them but they do a lot wrong

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[The Master]

Very similar production level of Ayton and Bagley on offense make me think that the better as a prospect is the one with bigger potential to develop on D - and in this case it seems to be DAA. I like what I saw from Ayton recently on defensive end of a floor - he's still far away from being a good one on D but the development and better instincts on defense are visible. This is some issue with high school basketball when even elite prospects go to college as raw on D as Ayton is right now. DeAndre Jordan or Porzingod recently developed into great shotblockers while they were not as good before a draft, so it's not impossible for Ayton to make it.

[kg01]

I feel the same about Bamba. Both need a decent center vet around them. They play the game wrong still. I don't want them to be like Towns. Uber talented flawed player. Where you got to play them but they do a lot wrong

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If the Hawks were to pull the trigger on either, they may look to keep Dedmon for that role. Hard-worker, late-bloomer who won't short-change it effort-wise.

He has a player-option so it's not totally up to the team (obv).

[azcatz11]

Anyone see the Oregon game the other day? I was at the game. I've never seen a player get triple teamed the moment he touches the ball like Ayton did. He still put up 20 something

[Mulhollanddrive]

I haven't seen Ayton do much pick and roll finishing that might be what he's asked to do most in NBA.

[reignfire]

My final prediction on Ayton is that he's gonna be soft and lack motor. Basically he will be the opposite of what he looks.

He's also gonna insist that he's a 4.

[ItsThatEasy]

My final prediction on Ayton is that he's gonna be soft and lack motor. Basically he will be the opposite of what he looks.

He's also gonna insist that he's a 4.

I don't get the soft or motor questions.

He's shown he has heart and he plays with intensity he just lacks basketball awareness/IQ. I've yet to see him actually give up or quit on a play this season. I have however seen him be completely lost which can come across as nonchalant I guess.

And I have no idea why you think he'd insist on being a 4, I've seen no evidence of that preference.

[Ruzious]

My final prediction on Ayton is that he's gonna be soft and lack motor. Basically he will be the opposite of what he looks.

He's also gonna insist that he's a 4.

Why?

Why predict the worst for a freshman with a 33.4 PER and 68.5 ST% and 65% eFG and who can score inside or out? He's got into bad habits defensively, but he's 19 years old. We're not about a stiff like Okafor who showed no face-up game and lacked the mobility Ayton has.

[doordoor123]

My final prediction on Ayton is that he's gonna be soft and lack motor. Basically he will be the opposite of what he looks.

He's also gonna insist that he's a 4.

Why?

Why predict the worst for a freshman with a 33.4 PER and 68.5 ST% and 65% eFG and who can score inside or out? He's got into bad habits defensively, but he's 19 years old. We're not about a stiff like Okafor who showed no face-up game and lacked the mobility Ayton has.

Any coach that has him (other than the Lakers) are going to make him play center. Even if he wants to be a 4, no one is going to give him what he wants and he’s not going to complain? Why? Because he’s in the NBA and it’s his dream to be in the NBA. At that point he will just want to have success. Maybe one day he’ll pull a Kyrie Irving because he’ll want to be played differently or he’ll find his moments. And I only mention the Lakers because for some reason they have Brook Lopez shooting 8 threes a game.

Ayton is going to be a fine player. I personally don’t see him a defender much even when he does develop, but he does enough offensively to make him dangerous enough to start. I see him as kind of a DeMarcus Cousins-type player when all is said and done. Probably closer to Nene, but Nene was probably a better defender than Ayton will ever be. Two types of players become good defenders, players with the physical ability to defend and players that read the game really well and are able to defend because they read the game (example Andrew Bogut, Shane Battier, Matthew Dellavedova). The reason why someone like Roy Hibbert is no longer in the NBA is because he physically can’t keep up with guys and can’t jump, but he’s also not able to read the game enough to play defense.

I don’t think Ayton has the lateral movement to keep up with wing players and I don’t think he can turn around quick enough to recover all the time. I think he can develop into a solid piece of a defensive team, but if he defends well it’s because the rest of his team is defending well. He has enough fluidity and athleticism to be solid, but I have no faith so far in his ability to read the game. He might develop that as he gets older, but right now it doesn’t really look like he has it. It doesn’t look like he’s someone that thinks the game. I would be surprised if he didn’t have an extrovert personality because the way he plays is very outgoing and is very much about acting rather than reacting. It’s an offensive personality.

[azcatz11]

My final prediction on Ayton is that he's gonna be soft and lack motor. Basically he will be the opposite of what he looks.

He's also gonna insist that he's a 4.

I don't get the soft or motor questions.

He's shown he has heart and he plays with intensity he just lacks basketball awareness/IQ. I've yet to see him actually give up or quit on a play this season. I have however seen him be completely lost which can come across as nonchalant I guess.

And I have no idea why you think he'd insist on being a 4, I've seen no evidence of that preference.

That may have been a valid knock at the beginning of the year but not anymore. He's literally getting triple and something quadrupled teamed every possession. Defenders are being very physical with him and he's giving it right back. Expect that trend to continue as Pac 12 teams try to get him off his game.

I don't where the 4 comment is coming from...maybe b/c he's playing with a fellow 7 footer?

[Ruzious]

My final prediction on Ayton is that he's gonna be soft and lack motor. Basically he will be the opposite of what he looks.

He's also gonna insist that he's a 4.

Why?

Why predict the worst for a freshman with a 33.4 PER and 68.5 ST% and 65% eFG and who can score inside or out? He's got into bad habits defensively, but he's 19 years old. We're not about a stiff like Okafor who showed no face-up game and lacked the mobility Ayton has.

Any coach that has him (other than the Lakers) are going to make him play center. Even if he wants to be a 4, no one is going to give him what he wants and he’s not going to complain? Why? Because he’s in the NBA and it’s his dream to be in the NBA. At that point he will just want to have success. Maybe one day he’ll pull a Kyrie Irving because he’ll want to be played differently or he’ll find his moments. And I only mention the Lakers because for some reason they have Brook Lopez shooting 8 threes a game.

Ayton is going to be a fine player. I personally don’t see him a defender much even when he does develop, but he does enough offensively to make him dangerous enough to start. I see him as kind of a DeMarcus Cousins-type player when all is said and done. Probably closer to Nene, but Nene was probably a better defender than Ayton will ever be. Two types of players become good defenders, players with the physical ability to defend and players that read the game really well and are able to defend because they read the game (example Andrew Bogut, Shane Battier, Matthew Dellavedova). The reason why someone like Roy Hibbert is no longer in the NBA is because he physically can’t keep up with guys and can’t jump, but he’s also not able to read the game enough to play defense.

I don’t think Ayton has the lateral movement to keep up with wing players and I don’t think he can turn around quick enough to recover all the time. I think he can develop into a solid piece of a defensive team, but if he defends well it’s because the rest of his team is defending well. He has enough fluidity and athleticism to be solid, but I have no faith so far in his ability to read the game. He might develop that as he gets older, but right now it doesn’t really look like he has it. It doesn’t look like he’s someone that thinks the game. I would be surprised if he didn’t have an extrovert personality because the way he plays is very outgoing and is very much about acting rather than reacting. It’s an offensive personality.

Cousins without the turnovers would be pretty good.

[The-Power]

Cousins without the turnovers would be pretty good.

If you take the turnovers out, you also have to take the playmaking out. No way he's going to be the playmaker Cousins it when you also expect him to not have the turnover issues. But I do see why some would compare him to Cousins, there are certainly some similarities worth pointing out despite some notable differences.

[Ruzious]

Cousins without the turnovers would be pretty good.

If you take the turnovers out, you also have to take the playmaking out. No way he's going to be the playmaker Cousins it when you also expect him to not have the turnover issues. But I do see why some would compare him to Cousins, there are certainly some similarities worth pointing out despite some notable differences.

Cousins without both the playmaking and turnovers would be better than Cousins. His playmaking doesn't make up for his turnovers.

[The-Power]

Cousins without the turnovers would be pretty good.

If you take the turnovers out, you also have to take the playmaking out. No way he's going to be the playmaker Cousins it when you also expect him to not have the turnover issues. But I do see why some would compare him to Cousins, there are certainly some similarities worth pointing out despite some notable differences.

Cousins without both the playmaking and turnovers would be better than Cousins. His playmaking doesn't make up for his turnovers.

In certain situations, perhaps. Generally speaking, though, playmaking is a skill you always rather possess than not because it allows you to do more on offense. The question is not whether or not someone's playmaking skills are valuable but instead it's about how the player makes use of them. There's no denying that Cousins does way too much relative to his skill level and that's actually hurting his teams a lot of times. But there's still no question that having the skills Cousins indubitably has can be extremely valuable if used in a more healthy dose, by a more self-aware player. It's the situation he's in coupled with his attitude that causes the problems for Cousins – not his playmaking skills per se.

[RipCity71252]

Great hands, crazy coordination and mobility for size, good inside outside touch.

Just not sure he has the fluidity+dynamism+skill level to be a high usage offensive center and struggle to see him becoming physical and instinctive enough defensively to make up for that.

Has the natural talent to be a productive big, but I question how much a team with him as the focal point can win.

[HeadtopChunes]

Great hands, crazy coordination and mobility for size, good inside outside touch.

Just not sure he has the fluidity+dynamism+skill level to be a high usage offensive center and struggle to see him becoming physical and instinctive enough defensively to make up for that.

Has the natural talent to be a productive big, but I question how much a team with him as the focal point can win.

https://cleaningtheglass.com/midseason-draft-review-deandre-ayton/

Ben Falk wrote an article about Ayton for his draft review series.

He talked about the physical tools, offensive touch

But his main concern was Aytons BBIQ. This is something that can be improved but is a concerning flag. Ayton does not have the greatest feel for the game.

Which really supports what you are saying. These are fixable problems of course but the question is how much?

Which really swings back to the debate of physical tools vs feel for the game. Whats more valuable?

[Ruzious]

Great hands, crazy coordination and mobility for size, good inside outside touch.

Just not sure he has the fluidity+dynamism+skill level to be a high usage offensive center and struggle to see him becoming physical and instinctive enough defensively to make up for that.

Has the natural talent to be a productive big, but I question how much a team with him as the focal point can win.

https://cleaningtheglass.com/midseason-draft-review-deandre-ayton/

Ben Falk wrote an article about Ayton for his draft review series.

He talked about the physical tools, offensive touch

But his main concern was Aytons BBIQ. This is something that can be improved but is a concerning flag. Ayton does not have the greatest feel for the game.

Which really supports what you are saying. These are fixable problems of course but the question is how much?

Which really swings back to the debate of physical tools vs feel for the game. Whats more valuable?

But you gotta factor in that - while the BBIQ hasn't shown up YET, he's still put tremendous production and done it efficiently. If the BBIQ does come around, you have a freak.

[thr3ep01nte4]

Not everyone can be all-time great level smart. BBIQ is not something you can build up in a short amount of time. Ayton can still be one of the top big men in the league for 10 years. He just can’t be Duncan or Dirk level smart, which is not a knock against him.