Shabazz is being under valued.

Post #41 » by **UGA Hayes** » Fri May 24, 2013 1:16 am

It just frustrating b/c you get the feeling he would get quicker with some lost weight. I just wonder if he has too much security, just too certain that his NBA position is secured, which it is. One would sort of hope all the stuff he went through this season would make him more serious about the lead up period. It isn't just losing weight either. I'm concerned that he is a risk to gain weight tbh.

crgreen · Post #42 » by **crgreen** » Fri May 24, 2013 6:41 am

UGA Hayes wrote:It just frustrating b/c you get the feeling he would get quicker with some lost weight. I just wonder if he has too much security, just too certain that his NBA position is secured, which it is. One would sort of hope all the stuff he went through this season would make him more serious about the lead up period. It isn't just losing weight either. I'm concerned that he is a risk to gain weight tbh.

Interestingly, at the combine, his speed, quickness and agility scores were across the board better than Otto Porter, Oladipo, and Brandon Paul. Go figure. Tho his verticle was only a James Harden-Mo Harkless like 37 inches. Again interstingly, 1/2 inch better than the 36.5 former Bruin Russell Westbrook recorded at the 2008 combine.

crgreen · Post #43 » by **crgreen** » Fri May 24, 2013 6:53 am

ManualRam wrote:
Golabki wrote:3. I think the defense of Bazz has to center around the UCLA coaching staff. The whole team underachieved, and you hate to blame a 20-year-old if he was just in a bad situation. Basically, the same argument you'd make for Tony Mitchell.

i don't think they underachieved at all. they won their conference and finished up as top 25 team. that's more than i expected of them given the make up of their roster. they had no depth, were very young and were also a team full of really bad defenders.

Of course the Bruins underachieved - IF you're comparing their accomplishments to the predictions made when Shabazz and the rest of that class were signed. 30+ wins and a deep tourney run was NOT too high an expectation. HOWEVER.....

That was before rising Junior SG Tyler Lamb, a double digit scorer, 3rd on the team in assists, a 30 minute starter as a Soph was slow to heal from offseason surgery, and missed the season (eventually transferring). Those expectations were based on the potential of rising Junior Center Josh Smith - an unstoppable force when in shape - who came in 100 lbs overweight, lost the starting job, and eventually transferred. That was before backup center rising Junior Anthony Stover, who'd been 5th in the conference in shot blocking while playing only 11 minutes a game as a Soph, flunked out of school (Stover then beat out Renardo Sidney for the backup center spot with the LA-Defenders of the D-League). And that was when it was assumed top 25 recruit, and McDonalds All American Tony Parker was going to be a signicant contributor - rather than an 8 minute a game mop-up man who couldn't master the defensive and offensive assignments.

But the team DID win the Pac 12 title outright, due mainly to Shabazz being the top scoring true frosh in the country, and one of he top offensve rebounders among frosh in the country. And for 2/3s of the season, he LED the Pac 12 in 3 pt shooting.

They underachieved based on what was expected before the season. But they overachieved (in no small part doe to 'Bazz) based on what they ACTUALLY had to work with as the season unfolded.

ManualRam · Post #44 » by **ManualRam** » Fri May 24, 2013 7:04 am

crgreen wrote:
ManualRam wrote:
Golabki wrote:3. I think the defense of Bazz has to center around the UCLA coaching staff. The whole team underachieved, and you hate to blame a 20-year-old if he was just in a bad situation. Basically, the same argument you'd make for Tony Mitchell.

i don't think they underachieved at all. they won their conference and finished up as top 25 team. that's more than i expected of them given the make up of their roster. they had no depth, were very young and were also a team full of really bad defenders.

Of course the Bruins underachieved - IF you're comparing their accomplishments to the predictions made when Shabazz and the rest of that class were signed. 30+ wins and a deep tourney run was NOT too high an expectation. HOWEVER.....

That was before rising Junior SG Tyler Lamb, a double digit scorer, 3rd on the team in assists, a 30 minute starter as a Soph was slow to heal from offseason surgery, and missed the season (eventually transferring). Those expectations were based on the potential of rising Junior Center Josh Smith - an unstoppable force when in shape - who came in 100 lbs overweight, lost the starting job, and eventually transferred. That was before backup center rising Junior Anthony Stover, who'd been 5th in the conference in shot blocking while playing only 11 minutes a game as a Soph, flunked out of school (Stover then beat out Renardo Sidney for the backup center spot with the LA-Defenders of the D-League). And that was when it was assumed top 25 recruit, and McDonalds All American Tony Parker was going to be a signicant contributor - rather than an 8 minute a game mop-up man who couldn't master the defensive and offensive assignments.

But the team DID win the Pac 12 title outright, due mainly to Shabazz being the top scoring true frosh in the country, and one of he top offensve rebounders among frosh in the country. And for 2/3s of the season, he LED the Pac 12 in 3 pt shooting.

They underachieved based on what was expected before the season. But they overachieved (in no small part doe to 'Bazz) based on what they ACTUALLY had to work with as the season unfolded.

uh... yeah. like i said, they didnt underachieve.

pmfg10 · Post #45 » by **pmfg10** » Fri May 24, 2013 7:38 pm

I'm not comparing Rivers or Shabazz, I just talked about Rivers because people said he also had a "NBA Game" and people were dismissing a little what they did bad in college

Saltine · Post #46 » by **Saltine** » Fri May 24, 2013 8:25 pm

He's got bust written on his forehead, and he's a liar. No way the Wolves take him.

need4detroit · Post #47 » by **need4detroit** » Fri May 24, 2013 8:35 pm

Saltine wrote:He's got bust written on his forehead, and he's a liar. No way the Wolves take him.

My Pistons might.

Joel Embust · Post #48 » by **Joel Embust** » Sun May 26, 2013 8:26 pm

"Shabazz is afflicted with Tourette's Syndrome, though has seemingly dealt with it quite well. Still there are side effects sometimes associated with Tourettes that must be considered (depression, OCD, ADD)"

I had no idea about this.

HeartBreakKid · Post #49 » by **HeartBreakKid** » Mon May 27, 2013 8:14 am

Eleqtrique wrote:"Shabazz is afflicted with Tourette's Syndrome, though has seemingly dealt with it quite well. Still there are side effects sometimes associated with Tourettes that must be considered (depression, OCD, ADD)"

I had no idea about this.

Source?

No-Man · Post #50 » by **No-Man** » Mon May 27, 2013 8:54 am

This was well known for a while

It's not news

black bart · Post #51 » by **black bart** » Mon May 27, 2013 9:10 am

Do you trust a jump shooter that shoots 70% from the free throw lane? He has no handles and will be mainly a jump-shooting guy. The problem is that he doesn't have good shooting percentage from the lane making him a risky prospect. He has good size and athleticim. It is clear since the guy is packing some weight (9% body fat) but still put great numbers at the combine

Joel Embust · Post #52 » by **Joel Embust** » Mon May 27, 2013 11:15 am

Fischella wrote:This was well known for a while

It's not news

It might not be news, I'm saying that I had no idea about that.

HeartBreakKid wrote:Source?

It's on his NBAdraft.net profile. I never paid attention to it before.

Chi town · Post #53 » by **Chi town** » Mon May 27, 2013 3:49 pm

Big time value. Bazz>Porter. People like Porter cuz hes safer. Bazz will be better.

PTPaQ · Post #54 » by **PTPaQ** » Mon May 27, 2013 9:08 pm

I want to like Shabazz...I really do. I just can't seem to get myself there, though.

I just can't seem to get over his negatives: His horribly forced shots that he throws up, including the floaters he attempts from 10 feet away with a defenders all over him and wide open teammates all around him. He plays like a fat kid, is clumsy and just doesn't seem naturally coordinated. It's almost like he's a stretch 4 in a shooting guard body.

I love his passion, his will, his movement skills and he does have a knack for rackin' up points in a bunch of ways, I just can't talk myself 100 % into him.

DSand · Post #55 » by **DSand** » Wed May 29, 2013 6:42 am

PTPaQ wrote:I want to like Shabazz...I really do. I just can't seem to get myself there, though.

Same here. The Caron Butler comparisons are laughable, more like CJ Miles. Caron Butler in his prime was an all-star and triple double threat. Bazz does have some redeeming qualities but doubtful he ever reaches that level.

rockmanslim · Post #56 » by **rockmanslim** » Wed May 29, 2013 12:37 pm

PTPaQ wrote:I want to like Shabazz...I really do. I just can't seem to get myself there, though.

I just can't seem to get over his negatives: His horribly forced shots that he throws up, including the floaters he attempts from 10 feet away with a defenders all over him and wide open teammates all around him. He plays like a fat kid, is clumsy and just doesn't seem naturally coordinated. It's almost like he's a stretch 4 in a shooting guard body.

I love his passion, his will, his movement skills and he does have a knack for rackin' up points in a bunch of ways, I just can't talk myself 100 % into him.

Agree with the fat kid part. His body type and the way he runs looks vaguely familiar but I can't quite place it. Maybe I'm thinking of Anthony Mason.

Post #57 » by **gswhoops** » Wed May 29, 2013 7:37 pm

Bazz's career arc thus far reminds me a bit of Harrison Barnes...super hyped out of HS, presumptive #1 pick before their freshman season started, underachieved playing for a big-time program and stock fell pretty hard. Their styles of play are very different though.

Given how weak this draft is, Bazz should definitely be a top-10 pick. Don't see him falling past Minnesota at 9. Could be in play as high as 5 or 6.

Joel Embust · Post #58 » by **Joel Embust** » Wed May 29, 2013 8:24 pm

gswhoops wrote:
Given how weak this draft is, Bazz should definitely be a top-10 pick. Don't see him falling past Minnesota at 9. Could be in play as high as 5 or 6.

Agreed. I have him going 7th to the Sacramento Kings.

I think the top 5 guys are slightly above the rest of the lottery. (Porter, Oladipo, Bennett, Noel and McLemore, those won't drop below 5)

01 Cleveland - Otto Porter
02 Orlando - Victor Oladipo
03 Washington - Anthony Bennett
04 Charlotte - Nerlens Noel
05 Phoenix - Ben McLemore
06 New Orleans - Trey Burke
07 Sacramento - Shabazz Muhammad
08 Detroit - CJ McCollum
09 Minnesota - Cody Zeller
10 Portland - Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
11 Philadelphia - Alex Len
12 Oklahoma City - Steven Adams
13 Dallas - Rudy Gobert
14 Utah - Dennis Schröder

Who-rod · Post #59 » by **Who-rod** » Wed May 29, 2013 8:34 pm

He has a "Paul Pierc-ish" body. His physique is better than Harden's at least.

Post #60 » by **gswhoops** » Wed May 29, 2013 9:14 pm

Eleqtrique wrote:
gswhoops wrote:
Given how weak this draft is, Bazz should definitely be a top-10 pick. Don't see him falling past Minnesota at 9. Could be in play as high as 5 or 6.

Agreed. I have him going 7th to the Sacramento Kings.

I think the top 5 guys are slightly above the rest of the lottery. (Porter, Oladipo, Bennett, Noel and McLemore, those won't drop below 5)

01 Cleveland - Otto Porter
02 Orlando - Victor Oladipo
03 Washington - Anthony Bennett
04 Charlotte - Nerlens Noel
05 Phoenix - Ben McLemore
06 New Orleans - Trey Burke
07 Sacramento - Shabazz Muhammad
08 Detroit - CJ McCollum
09 Minnesota - Cody Zeller
10 Portland - Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
11 Philadelphia - Alex Len
12 Oklahoma City - Steven Adams
13 Dallas - Rudy Gobert
14 Utah - Dennis Schröder

Interesting. I have it as a top-6, with the five you listed and Len. Right now I have him going #8 to Detroit.