Luka Doncic Part III

daoneandonly · Post #41 » by **daoneandonly** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:23 pm

You put Joe Ingles right foot/hand in, and you shake it all about
You put Hedo Turkaglu's left foot/hand in, and you shake it all about

You do the hooky pokey and you turn yourself around, that's what Luka Doncic is all about (and will be in the NBA)

Stop trolling.

eminence · Post #42 » by **eminence** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:49 pm

A Hedo/Ingles combo isn't really all that rough. That's still a lotto pick no doubt.

daoneandonly · Post #43 » by **daoneandonly** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:03 pm

eminence wrote:A Hedo/Ingles combo isn't really all that rough. That's still a lotto pick no doubt.

Oh it's not a bad player by any stretch, a guy almost every team would love to have. But it's not a guy you take a top 6 pick on or worthy of the hype he is receiving.

SportsGuy8 · Post #44 » by **SportsGuy8** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:32 pm

Yes, if that comparison was accurate ... But it's not. Doncic is arguably better than a combo of Hedo and Ingles RIGHT NOW.

Hedo really wasn't anything special. He had one really good season. He was a 6'10 player who averaged 4 RPG for his career and 11 PPG on average scoring efficiency. His only real skill was that he had decent vision for his size.

As for Ingles, Doncic's averages in Europe are close to 2x what Ingles averaged (both actual stats and per36), and Ingles was 23-27 years old. So, going by Ingles alone, Doncic should put up like 22-8-8 in his prime.

daoneandonly · Post #45 » by **daoneandonly** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:39 pm

SportsGuy8 wrote:Yes, if that comparison was accurate ... But it's not. Doncic is arguably better than a combo of Hedo and Ingles RIGHT NOW.

Hedo really wasn't anything special. He had one really good season. He was a 6'10 player who averaged 4 RPG for his career and 11 PPG on average scoring efficiency. His only real skill was that he had decent vision for his size.

As for Ingles, Doncic's averages in Europe are close to 2x what Ingles averaged (both actual stats and per36), and Ingles was 23-27 years old. So, going by Ingles alone, Doncic should put up like 22-8-8 in his prime.

I see some sites having him as high as 2, while others having him 6 behind the real Big 5 of Ayton-Bagley-JJJ-Porter-Bamba. If Dal is sitting at 6 and those five are gone, I'd hope they listen to offers for Doncic and get some more value with the pick.

burek3 · Post #46 » by **burek3** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:04 pm

If Porter really goes top5, god have mercy...

MrTwister · Post #47 » by **MrTwister** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:18 pm

Dallas drafting Dennis Smith last year shouldn't stop them from drafting Luka if they are in position to do so. Maybe I'm missing something but Smith's rookie season has been disappointing.

Bob8 · Post #48 » by **Bob8** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:27 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
SportsGuy8 wrote:Yes, if that comparison was accurate ... But it's not. Doncic is arguably better than a combo of Hedo and Ingles RIGHT NOW.

Hedo really wasn't anything special. He had one really good season. He was a 6'10 player who averaged 4 RPG for his career and 11 PPG on average scoring efficiency. His only real skill was that he had decent vision for his size.

As for Ingles, Doncic's averages in Europe are close to 2x what Ingles averaged (both actual stats and per36), and Ingles was 23-27 years old. So, going by Ingles alone, Doncic should put up like 22-8-8 in his prime.

I see some sites having him as high as 2, while others having him 6 behind the real Big 5 of Ayton-Bagley-JJJ-Porter-Bamba. If Dal is sitting at 6 and those five are gone, I'd hope they listen to offers for Doncic and get some more value with the pick.

yes Porter looks incredible impressive, strong, athletic, can play 2-4, great lateral movement, great handles, great basketball IQ, unbelievable passer, much better than Durant... and I guess others can be all superstars, in 1990.

daoneandonly · Post #49 » by **daoneandonly** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:31 pm

Bob8 wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:
SportsGuy8 wrote:Yes, if that comparison was accurate ... But it's not. Doncic is arguably better than a combo of Hedo and Ingles RIGHT NOW.

Hedo really wasn't anything special. He had one really good season. He was a 6'10 player who averaged 4 RPG for his career and 11 PPG on average scoring efficiency. His only real skill was that he had decent vision for his size.

As for Ingles, Doncic's averages in Europe are close to 2x what Ingles averaged (both actual stats and per36), and Ingles was 23-27 years old. So, going by Ingles alone, Doncic should put up like 22-8-8 in his prime.

I see some sites having him as high as 2, while others having him 6 behind the real Big 5 of Ayton-Bagley-JJJ-Porter-Bamba. If Dal is sitting at 6 and those five are gone, I'd hope they listen to offers for Doncic and get some more value with the pick.

yes Porter looks incredible impressive, strong, athletic, can play 2-4, great lateral movement, great handles, great basketball IQ, unbelievable passer, much better than Durant... and I guess others can be all superstars, in 1990.

Luka may too, just like all the other Euro guards before him, remind me, outside of guys Pop made, who were they again?

Bob8 · Post #50 » by **Bob8** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:40 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
Bob8 wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:
I see some sites having him as high as 2, while others having him 6 behind the real Big 5 of Ayton-Bagley-JJJ-Porter-Bamba. If Dal is sitting at 6 and those five are gone, I'd hope they listen to offers for Doncic and get some more value with the pick.

yes Porter looks incredible impressive, strong, athletic, can play 2-4, great lateral movement, great handles, great basketball IQ, unbelievable passer, much better than Durant... and I guess others can be all superstars, in 1990.

Luka may too, just like all the other Euro guards before him, remind me, outside of guys Pop made, who were they again?

Maybe you should remind me who was 6’8”, 230? Or maybe I should remind you that game has changed in last decades and 6’8” pg/Point forward is made for this position-less, pick&roll heavy basketball. On the other hand defensive C like Bamba is on the verge of extinction. Everyone is shooting 3s and you need defensive C too guard who exactly? Which title contender has great dominant C in the roster?

BoardCrusher · Post #51 » by **BoardCrusher** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 5:13 pm

Alatan wrote:

Why are you comparing him to Teodosic? Teodosic is currently a bench pg in the NBA while being a much better playmaker than Doncic. Doncic is not average compared to NBA starting perimeter players. He is not explosive at all, he is slow with the ball and has a hunched dribble that throws him off balance when changing directions. His vertical jump is bad and his hang time is short. In essence he is a slow below the rim player in the NBA. Getting stronger wont fix that.

He is definitely not slow with the ball, especially considering his size.

And what do you mean his vertical is bad, how much is it?

Alatan · Post #52 » by **Alatan** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:44 pm

BoardCrusher wrote:
Alatan wrote:

Why are you comparing him to Teodosic? Teodosic is currently a bench pg in the NBA while being a much better playmaker than Doncic. Doncic is not average compared to NBA starting perimeter players. He is not explosive at all, he is slow with the ball and has a hunched dribble that throws him off balance when changing directions. His vertical jump is bad and his hang time is short. In essence he is a slow below the rim player in the NBA. Getting stronger wont fix that.

He is definitely not slow with the ball, especially considering his size.

And what do you mean his vertical is bad, how much is it?

Considering his size? One would think he is a 7 footer how some people talk about him. Being a 6 7-8 guard is nothing new in the NBA, specially if said player is an average athlete at best. I dont know at how much is his max vertical measured but from what ive seen it is below 30 inches currently.

BoardCrusher · Post #53 » by **BoardCrusher** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:03 pm

Alatan wrote:
BoardCrusher wrote:
Alatan wrote:

Why are you comparing him to Teodosic? Teodosic is currently a bench pg in the NBA while being a much better playmaker than Doncic. Doncic is not average compared to NBA starting perimeter players. He is not explosive at all, he is slow with the ball and has a hunched dribble that throws him off balance when changing directions. His vertical jump is bad and his hang time is short. In essence he is a slow below the rim player in the NBA. Getting stronger wont fix that.

He is definitely not slow with the ball, especially considering his size.

And what do you mean his vertical is bad, how much is it?

Considering his size? One would think he is a 7 footer how some people talk about him. Being a 6 7-8 guard is nothing new in the NBA, specially if said player is an average athlete at best. I dont know at how much is his max vertical measured but from what ive seen it is below 30 inches currently.

He has a much stronger build then most guarts at 6 7-8, Lonzos legs are like toothpicks compared to Lukas, yet Luka isnt any slower with the ball. Do you need me to copy/paste a part of an interview with Goran Dragic where he speaks exactly how fast Doncic is with the ball in the open court?

And the last time, his vertical was measured at 32 or 33 inches by P3, do you need me to provide a link to prove worng your eye test observations?

realEAST · Post #54 » by **realEAST** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:07 pm

BoardCrusher wrote:
Alatan wrote:
BoardCrusher wrote:
He is definitely not slow with the ball, especially considering his size.

And what do you mean his vertical is bad, how much is it?

Considering his size? One would think he is a 7 footer how some people talk about him. Being a 6 7-8 guard is nothing new in the NBA, specially if said player is an average athlete at best. I dont know at how much is his max vertical measured but from what ive seen it is below 30 inches currently.

He has a much stronger build then most guarts at 6 7-8, Lonzos legs are like toothpicks compared to Lukas, yet Luka isnt any slower with the ball. Do you need me to copy/paste a part of an interview with Goran Dragic where he speaks exactly how fast Doncic is with the ball in the open court?

And the last time, his vertical was measured at 32 or 33 inches by P3, do you need me to provide a link to prove worng your eye test observations?

34.5 actually, but hey, since when facts started to matter when talking about Doncic

Alatan · Post #55 » by **Alatan** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:31 pm

realEAST wrote:
BoardCrusher wrote:
Alatan wrote:
Considering his size? One would think he is a 7 footer how some people talk about him. Being a 6 7-8 guard is nothing new in the NBA, specially if said player is an average athlete at best. I dont know at how much is his max vertical measured but from what ive seen it is below 30 inches currently.

He has a much stronger build then most guarts at 6 7-8, Lonzos legs are like toothpicks compared to Lukas, yet Luka isnt any slower with the ball. Do you need me to copy/paste a part of an interview with Goran Dragic where he speaks exactly how fast Doncic is with the ball in the open court?

And the last time, his vertical was measured at 32 or 33 inches by P3, do you need me to provide a link to prove worng your eye test observations?

34.5 actually, but hey, since when facts started to matter when talking about Doncic

Open court speed with the ball with todays ball handling rules is irrelevant, i was talking about his speed in half court settings witch is slow and more importantly his explosiveness witch is bad. Lonzo Ball is trash so i dont know why comparisons to him matter.

His max vertical might be 34 in an empty gym but on the court is nowhere near that average number.

Bob8 · Post #56 » by **Bob8** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:34 pm

Alatan wrote:
realEAST wrote:
BoardCrusher wrote:
He has a much stronger build then most guarts at 6 7-8, Lonzos legs are like toothpicks compared to Lukas, yet Luka isnt any slower with the ball. Do you need me to copy/paste a part of an interview with Goran Dragic where he speaks exactly how fast Doncic is with the ball in the open court?

And the last time, his vertical was measured at 32 or 33 inches by P3, do you need me to provide a link to prove worng your eye test observations?

34.5 actually, but hey, since when facts started to matter when talking about Doncic

Open court speed with the ball with todays ball handling rules is irrelevant, i was talking about his speed in half court settings witch is slow and more importantly his explosiveness witch is bad. Lonzo Ball is trash so i dont know why comparisons to him matter.

His max vertical might be 34 in an empty gym but on the court is nowhere near that average number.

May I ask you how many full games of Doncic did you actually see?

Alatan · Post #57 » by **Alatan** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:41 pm

Bob8 wrote:
Alatan wrote:
realEAST wrote:
34.5 actually, but hey, since when facts started to matter when talking about Doncic

Open court speed with the ball with todays ball handling rules is irrelevant, i was talking about his speed in half court settings witch is slow and more importantly his explosiveness witch is bad. Lonzo Ball is trash so i dont know why comparisons to him matter.

His max vertical might be 34 in an empty gym but on the court is nowhere near that average number.

May I ask you how many full games of Doncic did you actually see?

5-6 full games.

Bob8 · Post #58 » by **Bob8** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:46 pm

Alatan wrote:
Bob8 wrote:
Alatan wrote:
Open court speed with the ball with todays ball handling rules is irrelevant, i was talking about his speed in half court settings witch is slow and more importantly his explosiveness witch is bad. Lonzo Ball is trash so i dont know why comparisons to him matter.

His max vertical might be 34 in an empty gym but on the court is nowhere near that average number.

May I ask you how many full games of Doncic did you actually see?

5-6 full games.

and you know more than people, who watched 100+ his games, some live in arena? people who knows Fiba rules, competition..

Alatan · Post #59 » by **Alatan** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:01 pm

Bob8 wrote:
Alatan wrote:
Bob8 wrote:
May I ask you how many full games of Doncic did you actually see?

5-6 full games.

and you know more than people, who watched 100+ his games, some live in arena? people who knows Fiba rules, competition..

Its enough for me to base my opinion. Do you think that fanboys that watch 100+ of his games have an unbiased opinion? Much more likely that they will overvalue his abilities and ignore his flaws. I also live in the "area" and know FIBA rules since im from the Balkans and i can tell you that Doncic is nothing special even as our media wants to portray him as this once in a lifetime prospect. He is not the best European prospect ever, not by a long shot. Just a few drafts ago Europe had a 7'2'' guy with better athleticism and shooting ability than Doncic. Hyping up Doncic as an NBA superstar is just asking for disappointment. Doncic playing in Euroleague at an early age doesnt mean he is this incredible prospect but that he understands the game and developed quickly. And the last thing is that Doncic is NOT dominating Europe. He is a very good player in Europe but that so were Bjelica, Marjanovic, Bogdanovic, Teodosic, Rodriguez etc and they are not killing it in the NBA.

Bob8 · Post #60 » by **Bob8** » Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:11 pm

Alatan wrote:
Bob8 wrote:
Alatan wrote:
5-6 full games.

and you know more than people, who watched 100+ his games, some live in arena? people who knows Fiba rules, competition..

Its enough for me to base my opinion. Do you think that fanboys that watch 100+ of his games have an unbiased opinion? Much more likely that they will overvalue his abilities and ignore his flaws. I also live in the "area" and know FIBA rules since im from the Balkans and i can tell you that Doncic is nothing special even as our media wants to portray him as this once in a lifetime prospect. He is not the best European prospect ever, not by a long shot. Just a few drafts ago Europe had a 7'2'' guy with better athleticism and shooting ability than Doncic. Hyping up Doncic as an NBA superstar is just asking for disappointment. Doncic playing in Euroleague at an early age doesnt mean he is this incredible prospect but that he understands the game and developed quickly. And the last thing is that Doncic is NOT dominating Europe. He is a very good player in Europe but that so were Bjelica, Marjanovic, Bogdanovic, Teodosic, Rodriguez etc and they are not killing it in the NBA.

Nobody from mentioned players didn’t even play in Euroleague with 18 years, that means they for sure weren’t great players with 18 years.

Nobody won Eurobasket and was selected in first team with 18 years. Porzingis didn’t play in Euroleague and was shooting 30% for 3 and 60% Fts in Sevilla. I would say his 3s was mostly open shots and not of the dribble like Doncic is mostly shooting. I can easily say Doncic is the best prospect since Sabonis. Will that be enough to be a star in Nba? Nobody knows.