Would have been Rudy Fernandez TOP 5 pick this draft?

[Spykes]

It's not relevant and anyway it's just about Bargnani (well, Bargnani in his 2nd season) since Belinelli didn't play much despite doing pretty well in limited minutes... do you think a player like Fernandez would have played much more minutes than Marco in GS with Nelson as coach? I highly doubt...

That has nothing to do with the players skill though. GS is just a bad situation for any rookie/2nd year SG. Nelson isn't big on young players and they specifically traded away their starting SG to get more minutes for Ellis at that position. I mean, Nelson barely even played Wright, and he was a Top 10 pick.

Your arguments here fall flat. First off, with Bargnani, he never should have been the #1 pick in hindsight. It was a risky move that hasn't paid off for the Raptors.

As for Belinelli, a big reason he was picked over Rudy is their contract situations. Rudy had a bad buyout issue with his current team that basically made it impossible for him to come over this season. So whichever team took him would be forced to wait at least 1 year to get him. If the contract situations were equal last year, Rudy would have gone in the Top 20.

It's just obvious that you can't look at things with an objective eye when one player is from Italy and the other isn't. And for the record, I like this Gallinari kid. I kinda hope he drops to #13 so the Blazers can take a chance on him.

[Toxicity]

First off, with Bargnani, he never should have been the #1 pick in hindsight. It was a risky move that hasn't paid off for the Raptors.

You speak like the Andrea Bargnani career is over... the kid is still just 22 and has played his 2nd NBA season (after a promising rookie season)... a bad bad season, yeah, but i'd wait a couple of more years to see if he can live up his hype before calling him a complete bust. Roy, Aldridge and Gay played great seasons this year but i doubt someone would have picked them 1st overall (only Lamarcus probably)... so the pick of Andrea was a risky pick but there wasn't much more choices (apart trading down) in the 2006 draft.

As for Belinelli, a big reason he was picked over Rudy is their contract situations. Rudy had a bad buyout issue with his current team that basically made it impossible for him to come over this season. So whichever team took him would be forced to wait at least 1 year to get him. If the contract situations were equal last year, Rudy would have gone in the Top 20.

The contract is a reason. But Belinelli was selected before also because he's 1 year younger and has probably more upside than Rudy... he's more a natural talent while Fernandez is more mechanical although Rudy is clearly the better player right now and probably in the future (there are small chances Marco realizes his full potential).

It's just obvious that you can't look at things with an objective eye when one player is from Italy and the other isn't. And for the record, I like this Gallinari kid. I kinda hope he drops to #13 so the Blazers can take a chance on him.

It's obvious for you... i'd like to see some of my past posts where i don't look objective speaking of italian prospects. The fact things aren't working right now have a lot of reasons. The NBA is a world apart and it's not just about basketball skills...

[cdcastellon1]

Toxi sometimes writtes too much with his heart, i understand he likes "his italian prospects"but generally you overrate a bit your italians hehe" No offense, Toxi i like your analisis and your activity is always welcome. I told you some times that Bargs at #1 pick will be a cone, i just see his numbers, a 7-0 than never averaged in NBA or Europe more than 5 RPG... thats too sucks for a number 1 pick.

I like to inform about spanish players, cos im spanish, but i think i try to not overrate them, for example you won

[Toxicity]

Toxi sometimes writtes too much with his heart, i understand he likes "his italian prospects"but generally you overrate a bit your italians hehe" No offense, Toxi i like your analisis and your activity is always welcome. I told you some times that Bargs at #1 pick will be a cone, i just see his numbers, a 7-0 than never averaged in NBA or Europe more than 5 RPG... thats too sucks for a number 1 pick.

His rebounds numbers are awful, it's true. The fact he's 7-0 should be enough for him to grab enough rebs but unfortunately it isn't like that. We have to say he was a SF at junior level (until he was 19) so he played way far from the basket. Benetton Treviso put him closer to the basket but he's still a facing PF and the conversion process to a real big man is very hard (if not impossible) for him. He's a project for the PF/C position...

I like to inform about spanish players, cos im spanish, but i think i try to not overrate them, for example you won

[Sugarless]

-= original quote snipped =-



Danilo is the best player in Italy right now despite the age (he leads the competition in efficiency per game). The Italian league isn't at Spanish one level but it's tough for youngsters. He also played very good in Euroleague. So he's not just a prospect, he's a baller with great potential left.

Rudy is good but i don't see all that much potential left... and the better SG in Europe is still Langdon.

I really don't find any interest in discussing a Spanish vs. an Italian player, cause we all know how it usually ends up (not really on this board, but I'd rather not gamble on it), but last year you were saying exactly the same about Belinelli being a better player/prospect than Rudy, and we all know how it's ended up so far (not knocking on you or Marco at all, it just goes to show the idea behind my point, which comes next).

This doesn't mean that I don't think Gallinari is a great prospect and a very good player already, or that he has no chance of being better than Rudy in the future, it only means that we should avoid some kind of assesments until we actually get to watch them play on the NBA. To me, Rudy's skillset fits the NBA game to a T, and he's yet far from reaching his ceilling, since he's a player that's grown with every new challenge on his life.

Whether he will be better than Danilo or the other way 'round ten years from now is yet to be seen. It depends on a lot of factors, and we honestly shouldn't worry about it at all. I think both Italian and Spanish fans have a lot to cheer for and can expect them to have pretty succesful NBA careers if everything goes as expected for them. That's all we should care about regarding our countrymen.

As for where do I think he'd end up this year? Well, anywhere from 5 to 8, probably ahead of Gallinari if only because at this point in time he's more reknowned and he's got more accolades under his belt, what besides him being an explendid prospect, makes him more of a sure fire pick. But that's just my opinion.

[Toxicity]

-= original quote snipped =-


I really don't find any interest in discussing a Spanish vs. an Italian player, cause we all know how it usually ends up (not really on this board, but I'd rather not gamble on it), but last year you were saying exactly the same about Belinelli being a better player/prospect than Rudy, and we all know how it's ended up so far (not knocking on you or Marco at all, it just goes to show the idea behind my point, which comes next).

I still think Belinelli is a better prospect (talent wise) but i doubt he'll ever be better than Fernandez as player... so between the two i'd pick Rudy right now and, probably, in the future.

This doesn't mean that I don't think Gallinari is a great prospect and a very good player already, or that he has no chance of being better than Rudy in the future, it only means that we should avoid some kind of assesments until we actually get to watch them play on the NBA. To me, Rudy's skillset fits the NBA game to a T, and he's yet far from reaching his ceilling, since he's a player that's grown with every new challenge on his life.

It suits Danilo too...

2004/2005 Italian 3rd League -> debut in pro basket
2005/2006 Italian 2nd League -> Italian MVP
2006/2007 Italian 1st League -> Best Young
2007/2008 Italian 1st League -> MVP
2007/2008 Euroleague -> Best U22
2008/2009 NBA?

Whether he will be better than Danilo or the other way 'round ten years from now is yet to be seen. It depends on a lot of factors, and we honestly shouldn't worry about it at all. I think both Italian and Spanish fans have a lot to cheer for and can expect them to have pretty succesful NBA careers if everything goes as expected for them. That's all we should care about regarding our countrymen.

Agree.

As for where do I think he'd end up this year? Well, anywhere from 5 to 8, probably ahead of Gallinari if only because at this point in time he's more reknowned and he's got more accolades under his belt, what besides him being an explendid prospect, makes him more of a sure fire pick. But that's just my opinion.

Don't forget it's all hypothetical since Rudy would be out of this draft (age wise, being 23)... but i can see Rudy in the Top 10 given his great season with Badalona.

What if Gallinari was 23 y-o too with 3 more Euro seasons of experience? Do you think he'd be the same player he is today? I think probably not. As 3 years ago Rudy wasn't the player he is now...

[Fran Vasquez]

dont mention victor C!!! ... the best thing can happen to him is being undrafted, that way he can pick up a team that suits him later with no buyout issues. If you all people mention him he will end up in portland or something fighting for the 4 minutes a game rudy will get next season

[Genjuro]

Danilo is the best player in Italy right now despite the age (he leads the competition in efficiency per game). The Italian league isn't at Spanish one level but it's tough for youngsters. He also played very good in Euroleague. So he's not just a prospect, he's a baller with great potential left.

Rudy is good but i don't see all that much potential left... and the better SG in Europe is still Langdon.

I agree Danilo has probably more potential than Rudy, but I don't think Langdon is any better than him.

Langdon is a role guy, superb role player indeed, excellent defender and shooter, who understands the game and works hard on the court. But Rudy is almost all that (probably just a notch below on defense) and also a go-to player, with a much better ability to create his own shot.

I think Rudy doesn't get enough credit in Europe out of Spain because he has not played the Euroleague and many people haven't been able to watch his games.