Cameron Boozer

[vincecarter4pres]

Here are some clips showing often Boozer travels. Is this the technique expected of a prospect that is supposed to be an "offensive genius" by some people?

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This is actually pretty wild, and why I’m always scratching my head when I hear people call his footwork “sublime”, and the such.

Didn’t realize he was that bad a perpetrator though lol.

[FrodoBaggins]

Here are some clips showing often Boozer travels. Is this the technique expected of a prospect that is supposed to be an "offensive genius" by some people?

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I mean, he does it because the modern game allows it, which is a sign of high basketball IQ if you think about it. None of those are getting consistently called in the NBA.

The clips actually show the extent of his rotational flexibility, balance, strength, coordination, and agility. He displays good footwork and pivoting, even if egregiously pushing the boundaries of legality. Look at the spins at 0:11, 0:20, 0:36, 0:45, and 1:03 in the first video. His two-foot play is really impressive with how he can seek out and absorb contact while getting to his spots. Very strong and balanced, just needs to add a few counters at the next level. One foot finishes, a floater/push shot, a mid-range jump shot.

Now, if this were 1985, it would be a serious problem, but he wouldn't have been doing it back then. Hell, he'd be playing like Karl Malone most likely—minimal ball handling beyond one or two dribble face-up moves.

[eminence]

Bit weird from JE, does he have a thread on AJ carrying every possession? (everyone does, AJ is particularly egregious)

[Marvin Martian]

Bit weird from JE, does he have a thread on AJ carrying every possession? (everyone does, AJ is particularly egregious)

Boozer is supposed to be more "fundamentally sound" than AJ, and yet he has no counters, no mid range and displayed sloppy footwork offensively.

The criticism is justified.

[eminence]

Bit weird from JE, does he have a thread on AJ carrying every possession? (everyone does, AJ is particularly egregious)

Boozer is supposed to be more "fundamentally sound" than AJ, and yet he has no counters, no mid range and displayed sloppy footwork offensively.

The criticism is justified.

The first two can and should be broken down and considered, the last one is not the same - I am not going to seriously entertain that a prospect is going to be meaningfully held back because they are called for too many travels in the NBA that weren't called at other levels.

[ItsDanger]

Watching him in tournament, he's gotten away with not advancing his game because of size/athleticism advantage. I don't see variety in his offensive game in half court which is concerning.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Watching him in tournament, he's gotten away with not advancing his game because of size/athleticism advantage. I don't see variety in his offensive game in half court which is concerning.

What do you think about him actually being paired with a point guard?

Do you think him as a 3-level scorer (or just pick and pop and short roll) will be dangerous and effective when playing with a Point Guard?

That seems like it will add quite a bit of variety to his game.

Another question, how much variety do you expect a college freshman to be adding over the course of 5 months? He will have more time from now until the NBA season starts to "add" to his game then he did during the college basketball season.

[King Ken]

Boozer’s NCAA tournament hasn't been great, and my knee-jerk reaction is to drop him on my board. But history tells me to ignore that impulse. Tournament games should be heavily discounted compared to the regular season; March Madness isn't representative of real college basketball, let alone the NBA.

People love to debate 'clutchness' and composure, but the truth is very few players are truly clutch or epic chokers, as most fall somewhere in the middle. The NBA is a grueling 5-to-15-year marathon of 82-game seasons. A single moment in March doesn't define a player, and overvaluing these tournament games is a mistake. Naturally, no player should drastically raise their stock in one tournament.

This of course also applies to other players. I have had Wagler at #2; a lot of people are now knee jerking Wagler into their top 5. If he wins that ship this year. It will be non-stop top 2/3 spam until draft day.

My knee jerk is less drop him like this but also just increase my second tier.

Something like this:

Generational
- - - - - - - - - -
All-NBA/MVP
#1 AJ Dybansta

All-Star/All-NBA
#2 Cameron Boozer
#3 Darryn Peterson
#4 Keaton Wagler
#5 Caleb Wilson
#6 Darius Acuff
#7 Kingston Flemings

Basically, I could see some real arguments for a few other guys ahead of Boozer, which to me puts him down a tier.

I really think Wagler either going to be used incorrectly and be a tier 4 player top 75-175 player or used correctly and be a generational player like AJ. His outcome is the most wide of any prospect in this class outside of the tier 3.5 guys but none of those guys have generational potential and generally never have it. Outside of one side of the court.

[King Ken]

Here are some clips showing often Boozer travels. Is this the technique expected of a prospect that is supposed to be an "offensive genius" by some people?

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Read on Twitter

?s=20

This is actually pretty wild, and why I’m always scratching my head when I hear people call his footwork “sublime”, and the such.

Didn’t realize he was that bad a perpetrator though lol.

It is sublime for his size.

[FrodoBaggins]

Am I wrong for thinking Boozer is more impressive athletically than Tatum was at Duke?

I don't see a discernible difference in speed, quickness/acceleration, agility, and vertical jumping ability. The fact that Cameron is 250 pounds and Jayson was 205 is what makes Booz more athletic to me. He's producing a greater force to overcome his additional 45+ lbs. And he's just functionally stronger in general (strength is an underrated aspect of athleticism, an opinion shared by P3's Eric Leidersdorf).

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Boozer becomes more of a Combo Forward, PF/SF, SF/PF in the NBA as opposed to a pure PF or PF/undersized C. I think his athleticism/mobility is underrated, and he has the requisite skillset and cognition to play inside or outside.

He looked slower than he is at Duke because he chose to lean into his strength, play off two feet, and seek contact & physicality. He'll get more straight-line drive opportunities where he prioritizes the speed and momentum that a one-foot finish offers in the NBA's spaced-out open floor. And people will say, "Wow! I didn't know he was this athletic."

Many forget that Tatum's athleticism was questioned during the 2017 draft cycle. He was compared to Paul Pierce a lot.

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yes. You're dead wrong. Tatum has better vertical, quickness, speed and bend. Boozer is a very stiff PF. Similar to Sabonis really. Seriously, if you're looking for comps then between Love and Sabonis really does work for Boozer. All the positives and all the negatives. You can win with guys like this. They just aren't #1 types

I was going to say similar.

This is like some of the people saying Wagler is Brandon Roy-like, and no, not even close.

Boozer might be a better athlete then some of us are giving credit for, and he may certainly become a top tier stud in the NBA, but he’s never going to be SF athletic.

Luka is one of the premier players in the world and it doesn’t mean he suddenly became young Kobe athletic.

Wagler feels more LaMelo/Haliburton-coded with his greatest weapon: his pull-up three-point shot. He plays slow and shifty inside the arc. Don't know who to compare him to in that regard. Skinny Luka? Shai? Reaves? His rim scoring wasn't anything special, IIRC.

The most Brandon Roy guy in the NBA is probably Jamal Murray.

[BostoNZ]

Cam Boozer running the pick and pop down the stretch in the Sweet 16 with Evans as the screener was very "NBA offense" of him

[Duke4life831]

I know earlier I said I finally gave in and had Boozer #1. Ya Im back off that train.

I get the raw stats still look fine, but ya what he showed when he faced up with teams that have guys that have equal size to him. Nothing came easy for him. Everything just seemed like a struggle. Scoring wise he really has 2 options, pick and pop or head down china shop in the paint. And when he went up against a team like Virginia who has size and shot blocking, he had 0 presence in the paint in those games.

Ya Im back at the spot where I was earlier this season. I wouldnt take him top 5 in this draft. I still think he has very little room as a starter in the NBA. He either has to be a superstar or I think he ends up as a bench big like a Bobby Portis. And watching him really struggle and really have to work for every little thing against college teams that have just 1 guy that can match his strength and be a rim protecting presence. Im really doubting he becomes a star at the NBA level.

Again strictly speaking from an NBA standpoint (I love the dude at the college level), Im taking AJ, Peterson, Acuff, Wilson all ahead of him with no hesitation.

[FarBeyondDriven]

yes. You're dead wrong. Tatum has better vertical, quickness, speed and bend. Boozer is a very stiff PF. Similar to Sabonis really. Seriously, if you're looking for comps then between Love and Sabonis really does work for Boozer. All the positives and all the negatives. You can win with guys like this. They just aren't #1 types

I was going to say similar.

This is like some of the people saying Wagler is Brandon Roy-like, and no, not even close.

Boozer might be a better athlete then some of us are giving credit for, and he may certainly become a top tier stud in the NBA, but he’s never going to be SF athletic.

Luka is one of the premier players in the world and it doesn’t mean he suddenly became young Kobe athletic.

Wagler feels more LaMelo/Haliburton-coded with his greatest weapon: his pull-up three-point shot. He plays slow and shifty inside the arc. Don't know who to compare him to in that regard. Skinny Luka? Shai? Reaves? His rim scoring wasn't anything special, IIRC.

The most Brandon Roy guy in the NBA is probably Jamal Murray.

Haliburton is really a great comp for Wagler. I think it's very possible he or one of the other guard(s) go before Boozer. It's going to come down to team needs. And if Boozer goes outside of the top 4 any concerns about him not being a #1 should be moot.

[FarBeyondDriven]

I know earlier I said I finally gave in and had Boozer #1. Ya Im back off that train.

I get the raw stats still look fine, but ya what he showed when he faced up with teams that have guys that have equal size to him. Nothing came easy for him. Everything just seemed like a struggle. Scoring wise he really has 2 options, pick and pop or head down china shop in the paint. And when he went up against a team like Virginia who has size and shot blocking, he had 0 presence in the paint in those games.

Ya Im back at the spot where I was earlier this season. I wouldnt take him top 5 in this draft. I still think he has very little room as a starter in the NBA. He either has to be a superstar or I think he ends up as a bench big like a Bobby Portis. And watching him really struggle and really have to work for every little thing against college teams that have just 1 guy that can match his strength and be a rim protecting presence. Im really doubting he becomes a star at the NBA level.

Again strictly speaking from an NBA standpoint (I love the dude at the college level), Im taking AJ, Peterson, Acuff, Wilson all ahead of him with no hesitation.

The 4 is the weakest and shallowest position in the NBA. Most of the great ones could also play the 5 (AD, Mobley, JJJ, Sabonis, Chet, Porzingis) and the rest are true 4s and outside of Giannis are nothing special. Boozer fits well alongside those guys like Randle, Smith, Washington, Collins, Toppin, Siakam, Green, Zion, Camara, etc. So you lose me when you say he's either going to be a superstar or bench big.

[Duke4life831]

I know earlier I said I finally gave in and had Boozer #1. Ya Im back off that train.

I get the raw stats still look fine, but ya what he showed when he faced up with teams that have guys that have equal size to him. Nothing came easy for him. Everything just seemed like a struggle. Scoring wise he really has 2 options, pick and pop or head down china shop in the paint. And when he went up against a team like Virginia who has size and shot blocking, he had 0 presence in the paint in those games.

Ya Im back at the spot where I was earlier this season. I wouldnt take him top 5 in this draft. I still think he has very little room as a starter in the NBA. He either has to be a superstar or I think he ends up as a bench big like a Bobby Portis. And watching him really struggle and really have to work for every little thing against college teams that have just 1 guy that can match his strength and be a rim protecting presence. Im really doubting he becomes a star at the NBA level.

Again strictly speaking from an NBA standpoint (I love the dude at the college level), Im taking AJ, Peterson, Acuff, Wilson all ahead of him with no hesitation.

The 4 is the weakest and shallowest position in the NBA. Most of the great ones could also play the 5 (AD, Mobley, JJJ, Sabonis, Chet, Porzingis) and the rest are true 4s and outside of Giannis are nothing special. Boozer fits well alongside those guys like Randle, Smith, Washington, Collins, Toppin, Siakam, Green, Zion, Camara, etc. So you lose me when you say he's either going to be a superstar or bench big.

Im talking about a starter on a good team. Ill take Siakam and Green off the list, because Green's defense is a game changer and Siakam's on ball game is far more versatile, also a more versatile defender.

So if you leave me the remaining list of, Randle who is on his 4th team and it seems like every fan base is excited when he gets traded. PJ Washington who just flat out isnt a starting caliber 4 on a good team, unless that team is carried by a freak superstar (and again, PJ has far more defensive versatility than Cam). Collins the same thing as Randle, I dont think contending teams are knocking down the door to get Collins as their starter. I assume we're talking Obi Toppin, he's a bench big. And Camara is an elite defender.

Youre either talking versatile 3/4s, offensive bigs that get moved often, or high level defenders. That is exactly the case Im making. He has no positional versatility, so there goes those comps. He's not going to be an All Defense level defender in the NBA. Even guys like Randle and Collins are much better athletes, but even then that is my issue. Those arent guys you want on championship level teams starting at your 4.

[BostoNZ]

Boozer is #1 for me but I do see the downsides

He's just so much a better prospect than Randle, Portis or anyone else mentioned

The archetype concerns are justified but I wouldn't want to just pigeonhole his NBA future based on archetype

[CptCrunch]

Boozer has indeed lost a lot of luster with his poor finish to the season. 5 of his last 7 games have been barely 5 game-level BPM or worse, with 3 games below 0. Problem is that I don't see anyone being clearly better. (Yes, we can calculate game BPM as BPM is just box-score stat, hence the average of game BPM is just raw BPM).



AJ I don't see as a higher level processor. Wagler at #1 is too rich. Peterson could be a Ben Simmons (although Simmons is one of Boozer's closest closest college stat comp btw). Boozer to me is valued as a big PF sized point forward. I don't think anyone serious considers Wilson at #1.

Any of the small guard is too small and plays a low impact NBA position being small guard - how many true superstar small guard are there? Zero. Brunson and Mitchell aren't really true superstars, usually the top 3-5 players in the league. The last small guard superstar we had was prime Curry. That's it. NBA is a big boy sport; anyone 6'6" to 7'0" can be the best in the league, I highly doubt anyone smaller than a SG can dominate the game these days.

[The-Power]

I get the raw stats still look fine, but ya what he showed when he faced up with teams that have guys that have equal size to him. Nothing came easy for him. Everything just seemed like a struggle. Scoring wise he really has 2 options, pick and pop or head down china shop in the paint. And when he went up against a team like Virginia who has size and shot blocking, he had 0 presence in the paint in those games.

...

Again strictly speaking from an NBA standpoint (I love the dude at the college level), Im taking AJ, Peterson, Acuff, Wilson all ahead of him with no hesitation.

I understand some hesitation about Boozer, though I will note that he had plenty of good games against teams with NBA size. What I struggle with is the idea that Boozer's struggles in certain match-ups hurt his stock tremendously – but what about the players you'd take ahead of him? They all have match-ups that cause them problems or have games in which they impact the game very little.

I can't help but feel that Boozer tends to be overanalyzed compared to others because of his playing style. Whereas every bad game is emphasized for him, others are judged more based more on their good games or flashes. A focus on what a player is not rather than what a player could be. And to be clear, I'm not even a particularly big fan of Boozer and do see his limitations clearly. I see them clearly for the other players, too, though.

I'm all in favor for changing ones opinion when new information come in or we reflect on existing information and impressions and reach different conclusions. But those are two extreme swings for a person who has watched Boozer extensively all year. I'm not quite sure what to make of that. I personally don't think that these last weeks have revealed anything about Boozer that wasn't already known.

[King Ken]

Ya'll underestimating how productive Boozer will be in the NBA RS. That said, playoffs are going to be an issue. When teams lock in, he will have Karl Malone like drops but Malone did make two NBA Finals and two game 6s. That said, Boozer is going to need a team around him, I said this before when I made the Dirk type role comp. He's going to need the right personnel and role.

I completely understand why a team like Indiana could covet him the most.

[Benjammin]

Another comp for Boozer: a rich man's Juwan Howard. More fluid, better playmaking and shooting range but similar athleticism.

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