Luka Doncic

[pacersGM]

these expectations vs reality can often soar into the clouds and into dream land, so here is one recent example of a similar path (not similar player position wise) for a young european prospect: DARIO SARIC

let me present you the 16,17,18 year old phenom from croatia - dario saric! probable, possible top1 nba pick. once in a generation talent! great iq, feel for the game for a 18 year old, but athletic part a question mark, or average.

then a few years pass, he gets drafted 12th, and even if he is still only 20 years old, starting for a top 5 euroleague club, and posting great number at 10 ppg, 6 rpg, 2 assist ..., the gap gets smaller to the other prospects.

now saric is and will be a solid nba player. i dont mention him in the ROY discussion, because thats embiid anyway. but if he averages 16 and 7 and 4 for his career, he is not a bust at 12.

if doncic goes top 3, he will be a bust. as he wont average 19, 7, 6 never ever, no matter how smart he is.and people are talking.
if he goes top 5-15, and gets 15,4,4, he will be considered to have a fine career.

people are mentioning bird, mullin etc, as his ceiling. and if people put bodiroga as kind of euro god, let me tell you that he wouldnt average 22 points either. not for 82 games anyway. those guys show up only for a few fiba tournament games, get hyped up, get most out of their bodys against the US (bodiroga crosses anthony, teodosic hitting magical trees, magic passes). you think they would do it for 82 games? no way.

look at dragic. one of top 5 european or even white point guards in the nba ever (modern era- not cousy celtics times). averages 20, 6 and 4, shoots 50, 40, 80, and doesnt get mentioned as beeing more just a little above average. if doncic gets such nba numbers for a year, he would be a god here in europe, but still just above average to the american public, and shurely a top 3 pick bust

[juanc]

these expectations vs reality can often soar into the clouds and into dream land, so here is one recent example of a similar path (not similar player position wise) for a young european prospect: DARIO SARIC

let me present you the 16,17,18 year old phenom from croatia - dario saric! probable, possible top1 nba pick. once in a generation talent! great iq, feel for the game for a 18 year old, but athletic part a question mark, or average.

then a few years pass, he gets drafted 12th, and even if he is still only 20 years old, starting for a top 5 euroleague club, and posting great number at 10 ppg, 6 rpg, 2 assist ..., the gap gets smaller to the other prospects.

now saric is and will be a solid nba player. i dont mention him in the ROY discussion, because thats embiid anyway. but if he averages 16 and 7 and 4 for his career, he is not a bust at 12.

if doncic goes top 3, he will be a bust. as he wont average 19, 7, 6 never ever, no matter how smart he is.and people are talking.
if he goes top 5-15, and gets 15,4,4, he will be considered to have a fine career.

people are mentioning bird, mullin etc, as his ceiling. and if people put bodiroga as kind of euro god, let me tell you that he wouldnt average 22 points either. not for 82 games anyway. those guys show up only for a few fiba tournament games, get hyped up, get most out of their bodys against the US (bodiroga crosses anthony, teodosic hitting magical trees, magic passes). you think they would do it for 82 games? no way.

look at dragic. one of top 5 european or even white point guards in the nba ever (modern era- not cousy celtics times). averages 20, 6 and 4, shoots 50, 40, 80, and doesnt get mentioned as beeing more just a little above average. if doncic gets such nba numbers for a year, he would be a god here in europe, but still just above average to the american public, and shurely a top 3 pick bust

How can you even compare Šarić to Dončič? Yes Dario was realy hyped, but his games at the age of 18 weren't even close to what Dončič is Doing right now... Let's take a look at Dario's euroleage stats in 2011/2012(He is 5 years older than Dončič so it should be equal to this season)
In the 2011/12 season Dario was playing for KK Zagreb in the euroleage. He played 4 games in the euroleage averaging 2pts, 4 reb and 0,2 assist.
3 years later(2014/15) he moved to Efes where he averaged 10pts, 6reb and 2.5ast. Kind of similar stats to Luka's. And Efes was never a real contender for the championship..

And I also don't understand why all of you want Luka to play at SF? Put him on SG position and he is an automatic missmatch for every SG in the leage.

[soulzen]

these expectations vs reality can often soar into the clouds and into dream land, so here is one recent example of a similar path (not similar player position wise) for a young european prospect: DARIO SARIC

let me present you the 16,17,18 year old phenom from croatia - dario saric! probable, possible top1 nba pick. once in a generation talent! great iq, feel for the game for a 18 year old, but athletic part a question mark, or average.

then a few years pass, he gets drafted 12th, and even if he is still only 20 years old, starting for a top 5 euroleague club, and posting great number at 10 ppg, 6 rpg, 2 assist ..., the gap gets smaller to the other prospects.

now saric is and will be a solid nba player. i dont mention him in the ROY discussion, because thats embiid anyway. but if he averages 16 and 7 and 4 for his career, he is not a bust at 12.

if doncic goes top 3, he will be a bust. as he wont average 19, 7, 6 never ever, no matter how smart he is.and people are talking.
if he goes top 5-15, and gets 15,4,4, he will be considered to have a fine career.

people are mentioning bird, mullin etc, as his ceiling. and if people put bodiroga as kind of euro god, let me tell you that he wouldnt average 22 points either. not for 82 games anyway. those guys show up only for a few fiba tournament games, get hyped up, get most out of their bodys against the US (bodiroga crosses anthony, teodosic hitting magical trees, magic passes). you think they would do it for 82 games? no way.

look at dragic. one of top 5 european or even white point guards in the nba ever (modern era- not cousy celtics times). averages 20, 6 and 4, shoots 50, 40, 80, and doesnt get mentioned as beeing more just a little above average. if doncic gets such nba numbers for a year, he would be a god here in europe, but still just above average to the american public, and shurely a top 3 pick bust

So it's settled then, he's a bust, he might as well retire at the age of 18. He should be drafted in the 2nd round just to be sure.

[BoardCrusher]

if doncic goes top 3, he will be a bust. as he wont average 19, 7, 6 never ever, no matter how smart he is.and people are talking.
if he goes top 5-15, and gets 15,4,4, he will be considered to have a fine career.

look everyone, here we have a guy predicting the future

[pacersGM]

look everyone, here we have a guy predicting the future

considering i know something about basketball of the last 25 years, and considering i knew who luka doncic was more then 5 years ago when you first heard of him, considering i know what kind of player his father was before him, i suggest you save this line you quoted and we can reopen the discussion in 7 years, when you will say man you were right, sorry

i chip in from time to time, since this discussion is mostly high in the clouds or way below, and the truth is somewehere in between. meaning, he shure as hell wont ever be a scorer and hall of famer such as bird, mullun or petrovic, and he shurely wont be a role player like jaric

[Bob8]

these expectations vs reality can often soar into the clouds and into dream land, so here is one recent example of a similar path (not similar player position wise) for a young european prospect: DARIO SARIC

let me present you the 16,17,18 year old phenom from croatia - dario saric! probable, possible top1 nba pick. once in a generation talent! great iq, feel for the game for a 18 year old, but athletic part a question mark, or average.

then a few years pass, he gets drafted 12th, and even if he is still only 20 years old, starting for a top 5 euroleague club, and posting great number at 10 ppg, 6 rpg, 2 assist ..., the gap gets smaller to the other prospects.

now saric is and will be a solid nba player. i dont mention him in the ROY discussion, because thats embiid anyway. but if he averages 16 and 7 and 4 for his career, he is not a bust at 12.

if doncic goes top 3, he will be a bust. as he wont average 19, 7, 6 never ever, no matter how smart he is.and people are talking.
if he goes top 5-15, and gets 15,4,4, he will be considered to have a fine career.

people are mentioning bird, mullin etc, as his ceiling. and if people put bodiroga as kind of euro god, let me tell you that he wouldnt average 22 points either. not for 82 games anyway. those guys show up only for a few fiba tournament games, get hyped up, get most out of their bodys against the US (bodiroga crosses anthony, teodosic hitting magical trees, magic passes). you think they would do it for 82 games? no way.

look at dragic. one of top 5 european or even white point guards in the nba ever (modern era- not cousy celtics times). averages 20, 6 and 4, shoots 50, 40, 80, and doesnt get mentioned as beeing more just a little above average. if doncic gets such nba numbers for a year, he would be a god here in europe, but still just above average to the american public, and shurely a top 3 pick bust

Dragic was never anything special in Europe. When he was 18 years old, he played in Slovan, slovenian league and had, 6.4, 2, 1. His best year in Europe was when he was 22 years old, playing for Olimpija Ljubljana, 9.8, 3, 3, with only 27% 3 pt. And 70% Ft. Bad shooter and not the best passer. He's playing much better and has having much better stats in NBA. If you want to compare Dragic and Doncic, you can only say, that with high probability Doncic will be much better player than Dragic and that shouldn't be to bad.

[pacersGM]

How can you even compare Šarić to Dončič? Yes Dario was realy hyped, but his games at the age of 18 weren't even close to what Dončič is Doing right now... Let's take a look at Dario's euroleage stats in 2011/2012(He is 5 years older than Dončič so it should be equal to this season)
In the 2011/12 season Dario was playing for KK Zagreb in the euroleage. He played 4 games in the euroleage averaging 2pts, 4 reb and 0,2 assist.
3 years later(2014/15) he moved to Efes where he averaged 10pts, 6reb and 2.5ast. Kind of similar stats to Luka's. And Efes was never a real contender for the championship..

And I also don't understand why all of you want Luka to play at SF? Put him on SG position and he is an automatic missmatch for every SG in the leage.

i compared saric to doncic based on his similar transition from being a hyped very young top draft prospect from europe, not comparing him by his position, wich i also wrote, stated.

the comparision is on point. he was as well years above his peers since the age 16, 17.
and playing efes was a power house then and now, you can say what you want, but to play 24 minutes for a legendary coach, you have to be smart, good, and to do that as 20 years is not less impressive then to do it at 18.

and efes teams had always top talent. be it young turkish or international talent force for hire. and i dont think this years real is a much more tougher team to prove himself at.

i never put luka at SF, that beeing said, scouts put him there at SG/SF. he shurely isnt considered a SG alone. and by the way, saric is a 4 / PF.

[pacersGM]

Dragic was never anything special in Europe. When he was 18 years old, he played in Slovan, slovenian league and had, 6.4, 2, 1. His best year in Europe was when he was 22 years old, playing for Olimpija Ljubljana, 9.8, 3, 3, with only 27% 3 pt. And 70% Ft. Bad shooter and not the best passer. He's playing much better and has having much better stats in NBA. If you want to compare Dragic and Doncic, you can only say, that with high probability Doncic will be much better player than Dragic and that shouldn't be to bad.

you really, seriously claim, there is a very high probability doncic will be MUCH or even BETTER then goran dragic?
ok, good for you.

dragic and doncic are the total opposites. goran was scouted, drafted based on his potential (own shot creating, attack mode, good size for a pg, explosive, speed, above average athlete ) not a great shooter.

doncic is praised for his iq, passing, maybe shooting, but not for his athletic ability.

wich means, players like goran can fix the shot, can learn sets, pick and roll, but players like doncic rarely make a huge leap athletic wise.

we are in a nba draft forum, discussing players nba potential, if it were a great euroleague basketball players off all time, then luka is on his way to become one for shure, but if we are talking about the nba, thats a whole different level. wont say worlds better, but different.

[BoardCrusher]

look everyone, here we have a guy predicting the future

considering i know something about basketball of the last 25 years, and considering i knew who luka doncic was more then 5 years ago when you first heard of him, considering i know what kind of player his father was before him, i suggest you save this line you quoted and we can reopen the discussion in 7 years, when you will say man you were right, sorry

i chip in from time to time, since this discussion is mostly high in the clouds or way below, and the truth is somewehere in between. meaning, he shure as hell wont ever be a scorer and hall of famer such as bird, mullun or petrovic, and he shurely wont be a role player like jaric

Why do you think youre the only one that knows things about Slovenian bball players and basketball in general?

Sorry for breaking your bubble, ive played for Olimpija kadets before Doncic was even born, had to stop playing when I torn my knee ligaments on skiing.

your future predictments are just YOUR opinion and they make you look ignorant, but please go ahead and predict some more

[Bob8]

Dragic was never anything special in Europe. When he was 18 years old, he played in Slovan, slovenian league and had, 6.4, 2, 1. His best year in Europe was when he was 22 years old, playing for Olimpija Ljubljana, 9.8, 3, 3, with only 27% 3 pt. And 70% Ft. Bad shooter and not the best passer. He's playing much better and has having much better stats in NBA. If you want to compare Dragic and Doncic, you can only say, that with high probability Doncic will be much better player than Dragic and that shouldn't be to bad.

you really, seriously claim, there is a very high probability doncic will be MUCH or even BETTER then goran dragic?
ok, good for you.

dragic and doncic are the total opposites. goran was scouted, drafted based on his potential (own shot creating, attack mode, good size for a pg, explosive, speed, above average athlete ) not a great shooter.

doncic is praised for his iq, passing, maybe shooting, but not for his athletic ability.

wich means, players like goran can fix the shot, can learn sets, pick and roll, but players like doncic rarely make a huge leap athletic wise.

we are in a nba draft forum, discussing players nba potential, if it were a great euroleague basketball players off all time, then luka is on his way to become one for shure, but if we are talking about the nba, thats a whole different level. wont say worlds better, but different.

The question is how good was Dragic at things he's doing now best at age 18? I'm sure he was way away, or he would have dominate slovenian league. I'm sure Doncic is way away from his best too. If Dragic could have improved big time, why Doncic can't? His body is nowhere near how he will look in 5 years. And he can improve in skills too. There's no way anybody can say he will be below average physically and average in skills. Doncic is a victim of his own success. He's judged like he's already 25 years old, on the top physically and skills wise. But he's 18 and way away from his max. And no, not you or anybody else can say, how he will look in 5 years time. We just don't know. And don't forget something, his working ethics are way better than work ethics from 99,9% of American high school kids.

[UcanUwill]

Dragic was a beast prospect, one of the fastest Euros ever and amazing ability to finish at the rim. If Doncic and Dragic were both 18 and I had the pick, I would probably pick Doncic first, but its closer than some Doncic fans would like to believe.

[Bob8]

Dragic was a beast prospect, one of the fastest Euros ever and amazing ability to finish at the rim. If Doncic and Dragic were both 18 and I had the pick, I would probably pick Doncic first, but its closer than some Doncic fans would like to believe.

Please stop. Dragic was nobody at age 18. He played in small club from Ljubljana, Ilirija. Yes he could run, great fighter, but that was more or else it. And there's almost no one in Europe today who haven't heard about Doncic, who's playing in Real Madrid, being 4 times round Mvp in Euroleague. Dragic was drafted in second round, 46th, when he was 22 years old. Why someone haven't picked him 4 yeas earlier as lottery pick?;)

[UcanUwill]

Dragic was a beast prospect, one of the fastest Euros ever and amazing ability to finish at the rim. If Doncic and Dragic were both 18 and I had the pick, I would probably pick Doncic first, but its closer than some Doncic fans would like to believe.

Please stop. Dragic was nobody at age 18. He played in small club from Ljubljana. Yes he could run, great fighter, but that was more or else it. And there's almost no one in Europe today who haven't heard about Doncic, who's playing in Real Madrid, being 4 times round Mvp in Euroleague. Dragic was drafted in second round, 46th, when he was 22 years old. Why someone haven't picked him 4 yeas earlier as lottery pick?;)

Well, I am obviously using hindsight. But being early bloomer doesnt guarantee you jack.

[Bob8]

Dragic was a beast prospect, one of the fastest Euros ever and amazing ability to finish at the rim. If Doncic and Dragic were both 18 and I had the pick, I would probably pick Doncic first, but its closer than some Doncic fans would like to believe.

Please stop. Dragic was nobody at age 18. He played in small club from Ljubljana. Yes he could run, great fighter, but that was more or else it. And there's almost no one in Europe today who haven't heard about Doncic, who's playing in Real Madrid, being 4 times round Mvp in Euroleague. Dragic was drafted in second round, 46th, when he was 22 years old. Why someone haven't picked him 4 yeas earlier as lottery pick?;)

Well, I am obviously using hindsight. But being early bloomer doesnt guarantee you jack.

Who says he's early bloomer? And who guarantees Fultz, Ball&co. anything? I don't hear that kind of skepticism in their threads. If anything, Doncic is younger and has already proved he can play as professional in pretty difficult league. That difficult that he's only under 20 there. He will be at least very good player. I really doubted that we can say something like that for first 10 players in 2017 and 2018 draft. At least half of them can be a bust. Some are looking totally raw, didn't show anything yet, but almost nobody doubts about theirs potential. Why is that?

[Rasho Brezec]

Because skills are easier to develop than athleticism. I thought we already cleared that up.

[pacersGM]

look everyone, here we have a guy predicting the future

considering i know something about basketball of the last 25 years, and considering i knew who luka doncic was more then 5 years ago when you first heard of him, considering i know what kind of player his father was before him, i suggest you save this line you quoted and we can reopen the discussion in 7 years, when you will say man you were right, sorry

i chip in from time to time, since this discussion is mostly high in the clouds or way below, and the truth is somewehere in between. meaning, he shure as hell wont ever be a scorer and hall of famer such as bird, mullun or petrovic, and he shurely wont be a role player like jaric

Why do you think youre the only one that knows things about Slovenian bball players and basketball in general?

Sorry for breaking your bubble, ive played for Olimpija kadets before Doncic was even born, had to stop playing when I torn my knee ligaments on skiing.

your future predictments are just YOUR opinion and they make you look ignorant, but please go ahead and predict some more

i responed to your predicting the future claim, by explaining on what my opinions are based. Then nobody should post their opinion on doncics potential, as no one knows for shure?

so you played for the best club in slovenia in the slovenian league when you were 14 years old, and then you got hurt? are you shure the injury was the reason you didnt play adittional, higher ranked basketball, or were you limited maybe elsewhere? because many people use a injury as an excuse and the forever what would have been if? ... and then they tell stories who they played against when they were 13, but then an injury happened?

i think you didnt need to attack me personal, saying i am ignorant by predicting how far the tools that doncic has, will take him in the nba, so i went also a little personal with the injury there

about dragic beeing an unknown prospect. he wasnt hyped nearly as much as doncic, but that deesnt mean that people who need to know stuff like that, didnt know him. i watched him play as an 16 year old in his "bad" club Illirija, and there were 2 adriatic league team scouts there, and when an opponent hit him hard, he was attacked by his own team manager, saying you wont be injuring the best prospect slovenia has. and TAU ceramica doesnt sign you as an 19 year old if you are an unknown or player without future. so thats that.

and thats all im saying: if doncic with all the hype becomes anywhat near what dragic has become in the nba (all nba player, most improved player ...), he can thank god, as some of you think he will be easy better then him, but let me tell you, you probably will be dissapointed.

[reanimator]

Who says he's early bloomer? And who guarantees Fultz, Ball&co. anything? I don't hear that kind of skepticism in their threads. If anything, Doncic is younger and has already proved he can play as professional in pretty difficult league. That difficult that he's only under 20 there. He will be at least very good player. I really doubted that we can say something like that for first 10 players in 2017 and 2018 draft. At least half of them can be a bust. Some are looking totally raw, didn't show anything yet, but almost nobody doubts about theirs potential. Why is that?

This just isnt true. Ball alone has more skepticism in his thread than this Doncic thread.

[soulzen]

Who says he's early bloomer? And who guarantees Fultz, Ball&co. anything? I don't hear that kind of skepticism in their threads. If anything, Doncic is younger and has already proved he can play as professional in pretty difficult league. That difficult that he's only under 20 there. He will be at least very good player. I really doubted that we can say something like that for first 10 players in 2017 and 2018 draft. At least half of them can be a bust. Some are looking totally raw, didn't show anything yet, but almost nobody doubts about theirs potential. Why is that?

This just isnt true. Ball alone has more skepticism in his thread than this Doncic thread.

Skill wise he is without a doubt, but 50% of Doncic's criticism anywhere you look is he's a classic case of "unathletic, overhyped white Euro" and that gets tiring fast.

[Bob8]

considering i know something about basketball of the last 25 years, and considering i knew who luka doncic was more then 5 years ago when you first heard of him, considering i know what kind of player his father was before him, i suggest you save this line you quoted and we can reopen the discussion in 7 years, when you will say man you were right, sorry

i chip in from time to time, since this discussion is mostly high in the clouds or way below, and the truth is somewehere in between. meaning, he shure as hell wont ever be a scorer and hall of famer such as bird, mullun or petrovic, and he shurely wont be a role player like jaric

Why do you think youre the only one that knows things about Slovenian bball players and basketball in general?

Sorry for breaking your bubble, ive played for Olimpija kadets before Doncic was even born, had to stop playing when I torn my knee ligaments on skiing.

your future predictments are just YOUR opinion and they make you look ignorant, but please go ahead and predict some more

i responed to your predicting the future claim, by explaining on what my opinions are based. Then nobody should post their opinion on doncics potential, as no one knows for shure?

so you played for the best club in slovenia in the slovenian league when you were 14 years old, and then you got hurt? are you shure the injury was the reason you didnt play adittional, higher ranked basketball, or were you limited maybe elsewhere? because many people use a injury as an excuse and the forever what would have been if? ... and then they tell stories who they played against when they were 13, but then an injury happened?

i think you didnt need to attack me personal, saying i am ignorant by predicting how far the tools that doncic has, will take him in the nba, so i went also a little personal with the injury there

about dragic beeing an unknown prospect. he wasnt hyped nearly as much as doncic, but that deesnt mean that people who need to know stuff like that, didnt know him. i watched him play as an 16 year old in his "bad" club Illirija, and there were 2 adriatic league team scouts there, and when an opponent hit him hard, he was attacked by his own team manager, saying you wont be injuring the best prospect slovenia has. and TAU ceramica doesnt sign you as an 19 year old if you are an unknown or player without future. so thats that.

and thats all im saying: if doncic with all the hype becomes anywhat near what dragic has become in the nba (all nba player, most improved player ...), he can thank god, as some of you think he will be easy better then him, but let me tell you, you probably will be dissapointed.

One is playing in F4 in Istanbul, being one of the most important players for Real, second was playing in Siska in a hall with a balcony for 30 spectators. And you're saying the biggest difference is one being hyped and other not?;)
He went in Murcia 3 years later, not Tau, I guessed all the scouts wasn't that impressed, because he went in Slovan, another club from Ljubljana, after Ilirija.

And please let patronizing tone," you will be probably disappointed", out of the debate.

[Bob8]

Because skills are easier to develop than athleticism. I thought we already cleared that up.

If it's that simple, why we don't take random athlete from athletic field and teach him basketball, football... I guess Bolt could be great Pg in Nba or football star in Europe.