RealGM

This may be hard to read but its insider so here you guys go for now until DX gets this up:
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft201 ... art-100526

NBA DRAFT COMBINE MEASUREMENTS
Player - No step vert - Max vert - Bench press (185 lbs) - Lane agility - 3/4 court sprint
Solomon Alabi 22.5 26.0 10 13.2 3.68
Cole Aldrich 23.0 28.0 10 11.48 3.35
Aminu, Al-Farouq 27.0 33.5 13 11.29 3.3
James Anderson 30.0 35.5 14 11.86 3.19
Luke Babbitt 29.5 37.5 15 10.98 3.4
Eric Bledsoe -N-a -N-a 9 -N-a -N-a
Trevor Booker 31.0 36.0 22 11.15 3.1
Craig Brackins 26.0 35.0 6 11.65 3.39
Avery Bradley 31.5 37.5 2 11.47 3.14
Derrick Caracter 25.0 30.5 22 12.78 3.61
Sherron Collins 27.5 33.0 -N-a 12.31 3.24
DeMarcus Cousins 23.5 27.5 -N-a 11.4 3.55
Jordan Crawford 31.5 34.5 7 11.03 3.37
Ed Davis 31.0 36.0 -N-a 11.7 3.21
Devin Ebanks 23.5 32.0 6 11.69 3.44
Derrick Favors 31.5 35.5 14 11.74 3.25
Keith Gallon 23.5 28.5 14 13.44 3.7
Charles Garcia 24.5 30.5 2 11.65 3.23
Paul George -N-a -N-a 4 -N-a -N-a
Luke Harangody 24.0 28.5 23 11.83 3.41
Manny Harris -N-a -N-a 11 -N-a -N-a
Lazar Hayward 31.0 36.0 15 10.87 3.31
Gordon Hayward 30.5 34.5 10 11.73 3.22
Xavier Henry 28.5 36.5 8 11.1 3.18
Darington Hobson 29.0 34.0 -N-a 11.68 3.25
James, Damion 29.0 33.0 13 10.89 3.2
Armon Johnson 31.5 38.5 18 11.25 3.19
Wesley Johnson 32.0 37.0 16 11.43 3.14
Dominique Jones 26.0 32.5 19 10.88 3.31
Jerome Jordan -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a
Sylven Landesberg 28.0 32.0 8 11.59 3.36
Gani Lawal 27.0 31.5 20 11.61 3.24
Greg Monroe 25.0 29.0 15 12.1 3.35
Daniel Orton 24.0 30.5 13 12.32 3.39
Artsiom Parakhouski 25.5 26.5 16 12.07 3.33
Patrick Patterson 28.5 33.5 17 11.14 3.25
Dexter Pittman -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a
Andy Rautins 23.5 30.5 8 11.27 3.49
Ryan Richards 25.0 28.5 4 11.33 3.37
Stanley Robinson -N-a 37.5 6 11.65 3.23
Larry Sanders 25.5 28.0 7 12.49 3.27
Jon Scheyer -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a
Lance Stephenson 27.0 33.0 10 11.39 3.38
Mikhail Torrance 23.0 32.0 8 11.43 3.17
Evan Turner 27.5 34.5 9 11.06 3.27
Ekpe Udoh 31.0 33.5 10 11.15 3.29
Jarvis Varnado 29.5 32.5 3 11.61 3.37
Greivis Vasquez -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a -N-a
John Wall 30.0 39.0 -N-a 10.84 3.14
Willie Warren 23.0 31.5 10 11.21 3.5
Terrico White 31.0 40.0 10 11.38 3.15
Hassan Whiteside 27.0 31.5 12 11.83 3.54

Quick reactions:
- Cole Aldrich is glued to the floor. 28" max vert
- Aminu only 33.5" max vert
- Babbitt can get up 37.5" max vert
- Cousins can't jump 27.5" max vert
- Ebanks not as athletic as anticipated.
- Wesley Johnson tested well vs Evan Turner
- Only having Bench press on Paul George is upsetting
- Dominique Jones is quite strong with 19 times on the bench press
- John Wall tested quite well
- Willie Warren is sloooowww? 3.5 sec 3/4 court?
- Terrico White with the best max vert at 40"

How did Wesley Johnson do 16 reps? He looks extremely underweight. Cole Aldrich's 10 reps are pretty disappointing as are Whiteside's numbers (Though it's hard to perform well in athletic testing when you're not wearing shoes).

cousins cant bench 185?

dballislife wrote:cousins cant bench 185?

He may have declined to do it?

Cousins declined the bench press because "he doesn't lift weights."

Some of those measurements strike me as very odd. Damion James had something like 37.5 for his max vert last year, but only 33 this year? There's always variances in these things, so I never take much from them. Personally, I know that some days when I'm in the gym I can easily jump a few inches higher or bench more than others, so it's not really fair to take much away from the athletic measurements.

If a guy is explosive in-game, that's what really matters, not if he puts up a 40 inch vert. Remember that Roy and Mayo threw up huge verts, despite neither being very explosive in-game players. Similarly, Aldrich had no problem blocking shots and Cousins produced just fine regardless of their vert #'s. I don't see their effectiveness changing just because we have can put a number to their max vert.

For big men, I like to look at the no step vert over the max vert to be honest, it's much more indicative of the type of leaping they'll be doing to block shots and rebound.

Xavier Henry quietly looking very good after the combine numbers have come out. Measuring at near 6'7", he has the best wingspan and standing reach of all the SGs in the draft and now jumps a very solid 36.5" on his max vert. And his 11.1 in the lane agility and 3.18 in the 25 yard sprint are both among the best on that list.

Everybody knew he had a great body (4.7% body fat confirms) and could shoot, but there were questions about his athleticism - those questions have been answered. Also, I thought he might measure at around 6'5" in shoes so the near 6'7" is a pleasant surprise.

NO-KG-AI wrote:For big men, I like to look at the no step vert over the max vert to be honest, it's much more indicative of the type of leaping they'll be doing to block shots and rebound.

I think this is a good point. Udoh, for example, has a good, but unspectacular, 33.5" max vert, but his no step of 31" is outstanding in comparison with the other guys on the list - for a 6'10" player.

Xand1 wrote:Cousins declined the bench press because "he doesn't lift weights."

Some of those measurements strike me as very odd. Damion James had something like 37.5 for his max vert last year, but only 33 this year? There's always variances in these things, so I never take much from them. Personally, I know that some days when I'm in the gym I can easily jump a few inches higher or bench more than others, so it's not really fair to take much away from the athletic measurements.

If a guy is explosive in-game, that's what really matters, not if he puts up a 40 inch vert. Remember that Roy and Mayo threw up huge verts, despite neither being very explosive in-game players. Similarly, Aldrich had no problem blocking shots and Cousins produced just fine regardless of their vert #'s. I don't see their effectiveness changing just because we have can put a number to their max vert.

This actually matters because of the size difference between NCAA and NBA players. Cousins & Aldrich had a considerable size advantage in the NCAA that wont persist in the NBA which makes their measurements concerning IMO... Neither Cousins nor Aldrich performed better than Monroe who gets a bad rap for his athleticism...

princeofpalace wrote:

Xand1 wrote:Cousins declined the bench press because "he doesn't lift weights."

Some of those measurements strike me as very odd. Damion James had something like 37.5 for his max vert last year, but only 33 this year? There's always variances in these things, so I never take much from them. Personally, I know that some days when I'm in the gym I can easily jump a few inches higher or bench more than others, so it's not really fair to take much away from the athletic measurements.

If a guy is explosive in-game, that's what really matters, not if he puts up a 40 inch vert. Remember that Roy and Mayo threw up huge verts, despite neither being very explosive in-game players. Similarly, Aldrich had no problem blocking shots and Cousins produced just fine regardless of their vert #'s. I don't see their effectiveness changing just because we have can put a number to their max vert.

This actually matters because of the size difference between NCAA and NBA players. Cousins & Aldrich had a considerable size advantage in the NCAA that wont persist in the NBA which makes their measurements concerning IMO... Neither Cousins nor Aldrich performed better than Monroe who gets a bad rap for his athleticism...

To an extent, yes, but I contend you're still better served watching them play. Seeing the quickness with which they react and get off the floor will tell you a lot more about their prospects in the NBA than knowing that Aldrich has a 28 inch vert.

How come a pogo stick athlete like Sanders has nearly the same max vert as "fatass" Cousins?

Xand1 wrote:

princeofpalace wrote:

Xand1 wrote:Cousins declined the bench press because "he doesn't lift weights."

Some of those measurements strike me as very odd. Damion James had something like 37.5 for his max vert last year, but only 33 this year? There's always variances in these things, so I never take much from them. Personally, I know that some days when I'm in the gym I can easily jump a few inches higher or bench more than others, so it's not really fair to take much away from the athletic measurements.

If a guy is explosive in-game, that's what really matters, not if he puts up a 40 inch vert. Remember that Roy and Mayo threw up huge verts, despite neither being very explosive in-game players. Similarly, Aldrich had no problem blocking shots and Cousins produced just fine regardless of their vert #'s. I don't see their effectiveness changing just because we have can put a number to their max vert.

This actually matters because of the size difference between NCAA and NBA players. Cousins & Aldrich had a considerable size advantage in the NCAA that wont persist in the NBA which makes their measurements concerning IMO... Neither Cousins nor Aldrich performed better than Monroe who gets a bad rap for his athleticism...

To an extent, yes, but I contend you're still better served watching them play. Seeing the quickness with which they react and get off the floor will tell you a lot more about their prospects in the NBA than knowing that Aldrich has a 28 inch vert.

Ive never noticed much quickness in Aldrichs game. His blocked shots are more the product of his length than anything, same goes for Cousins...

princeofpalace wrote:

Xand1 wrote:

princeofpalace wrote:

This actually matters because of the size difference between NCAA and NBA players. Cousins & Aldrich had a considerable size advantage in the NCAA that wont persist in the NBA which makes their measurements concerning IMO... Neither Cousins nor Aldrich performed better than Monroe who gets a bad rap for his athleticism...

To an extent, yes, but I contend you're still better served watching them play. Seeing the quickness with which they react and get off the floor will tell you a lot more about their prospects in the NBA than knowing that Aldrich has a 28 inch vert.

Ive never noticed much quickness in Aldrichs game. His blocked shots are more the product of his length than anything, same goes for Cousins...

I think you're missing what I'm trying to say, which is that watching a guy play tells you a whole lot more than combine measurements. I think the wingspan/reach stuff is pretty useful and the atheltic stuff is interesting, but nothing beats actual game footage for evaluating how well a guy will translate to the NB (to me, at least).

Xand1 wrote:I think you're missing what I'm trying to say, which is that watching a guy play tells you a whole lot more than combine measurements. I think the wingspan/reach stuff is pretty useful and the atheltic stuff is interesting, but nothing beats actual game footage for evaluating how well a guy will translate to the NB (to me, at least).

No, Im not missing what you are trying to say at all.

But when in game prospects look like modest athletes at best and the measurements back that up then theres not much left to say.

These measurements arent the end all be all but when taken in conjuction with in game play, they are useful. I have watched more of Aldrich than Cousins given that I go to a BIG 12 school and these numbers back up what Ive thought of Aldrich all along..

Dwayne Wade had a 36 inch max vert
Troy Bell had a 38 inch no step vert

Troy Bell is no longer in the NBA, Wade is an elite player. This is basketball, not football.

#1 pick wrote:Dwayne Wade had a 36 inch max vert
Troy Bell had a 38 inch no step vert

Troy Bell is no longer in the NBA, Wade is an elite player. This is basketball, not football.

I dont think thats the right way to look at it at all, I dont even know who Troy Bell is but you have to take everything in conjuction. You cant just look at the measurements but they are part of the puzzle that includes a variety of things...

princeofpalace wrote:

Xand1 wrote:I think you're missing what I'm trying to say, which is that watching a guy play tells you a whole lot more than combine measurements. I think the wingspan/reach stuff is pretty useful and the atheltic stuff is interesting, but nothing beats actual game footage for evaluating how well a guy will translate to the NB (to me, at least).

No, Im not missing what you are trying to say at all.

But when in game prospects look like modest athletes at best and the measurements back that up then theres not much left to say.

I've never said otherwise. I'm commenting on how the athletic measurements aren't really ALL that useful. Aldrich isn't quick or a great athlete, which is easily observable when watching him. My point is that combine stats don't change anything. If he'd have busted out a 36 inch vert, would it change how you felt about him? For exammple, Kevin Love dropped a 35 inch vert and everyone got excited, yet he's still ground-bound and slow in-game despite his very solid combine stats.

I wrote this for a thread on the Wolves' board, but it's probably worth having here, too:

Yep, as fun as it is to look at these numbers and draw conclusions, you don't have to look further than Kevin Love (who's max vertical was just as good as Anthony Randolph and Dwyane Wade and 3/4 sprint was the same as Chris Paul and .01 second slower than Jonny Flynn) to know that these measurements really don't mean much of anything. If a guy looks athletic in college, he's going to be athletic in the NBA regardless of what the numbers say.

AQuintus wrote:I wrote this for a thread on the Wolves' board, but it's probably worth having here, too:

Yep, as fun as it is to look at these numbers and draw conclusions, you don't have to look further than Kevin Love (who's max vertical was just as good as Anthony Randolph and Dwyane Wade and 3/4 sprint was the same as Chris Paul and .01 second slower than Jonny Flynn) to know that these measurements really don't mean much of anything. If a guy looks athletic in college, he's going to be athletic in the NBA regardless of what the numbers say.

There are always some outliers but I think more often than not the numbers back up what you often see, they just allow you to back it up with some statistical evidence