Luka Doncic

Rasho Brezec · Post #1161 » by **Rasho Brezec** » Sun May 14, 2017 8:26 am

First step and explosiveness isn't really something you can improve. How many players did that?

Wildlinger · Post #1162 » by **Wildlinger** » Sun May 14, 2017 8:45 am

Rasho Brezec wrote:First step and explosiveness isn't really something you can improve. How many players did that?

You can’t improve it as much as you can improve your core strength or specific muscle groups, but every athlete knows you can work on your explosive strength with proper power drills and measurably improve with time. Especially if you’re young enough. It’s not an exact science so you can’t really tell what improvement will Doncic make, but I’d be shocked if he doesn’t improve at all in the next few years. He reportedly went through a bit of a growth spurt in the past couple of years. That alone can diminish some of his explosiveness until his muscles catch up to his growth.

UcanUwill · Post #1163 » by **UcanUwill** » Sun May 14, 2017 8:46 am

Rasho Brezec wrote:First step and explosiveness isn't really something you can improve. How many players did that?

I think his explosiveness is a bit underrated, but the lack of first step is very worrysome.

Bob8 · Post #1164 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 8:51 am

Wildlinger wrote:
Bob8 wrote:It's easy. If Dragic is really that good, he should show that in Eurobasket. He's playing the best basketball of his career now in the best league. He should dominate in Eurobasket or at least be far the best Pg in the tournament. We will see.

We already saw. Dragic was All-Tournament in his last Eurobasket and the only point guard better than him was Tony Parker (and not Spanoulis who also played at that tournament). Dragic was also 2nd in pts (behind Barea) in 2nd in FG% (behind Irving) among point guards in his last world cup tournament. He was also the best player in last year's FIBA qualifiers as well. I suggest you do some research before posting.

I know more or less everything about basketball in Europe.

Eurobasket in Slovenia was his far the best tournament. Fiba qualifiers? I guess you're not serious.

Look, if he's better than all legends from Europe. He should show that with results, what he can't or with individual performances and 1 good tournament is not enough. Don't you think it would be some kind strange if Teo or Llull would be better than the best Pg from Europe in last decade, who's playing the best basketball of his career in this years Eurobasket?

UcanUwill · Post #1165 » by **UcanUwill** » Sun May 14, 2017 9:42 am

Previous Doncic thread was locked for this same BS. You guys just do not learn.

pacersGM · Post #1166 » by **pacersGM** » Sun May 14, 2017 10:38 am

Bob8 wrote:
I know more or less everything about basketball in Europe. Eurobasket in Slovenia was his far the best tournament. Fiba qualifiers? I guess you're not serious.

Look, if he's better than all legends from Europe. He should show that with results, what he can't or with individual performances and 1 good tournament is not enough. Don't you think it would be some kind strange if Teo or Llull would be better than the best Pg from Europe in last decade, who's playing the best basketball of his career in this years Eurobasket?

Another dumb claim. I cant say it any nicer. What you mean dragic should dominate eurobasket? You do know that every team slovenia plays against focuses on stoping dragic, but he still kills 95% of his opposing pg? Dude slovenia is not france or serbia. The opponents have to worry about 2 dragic family members the others are role players. And still the dragic broa eun through most of those slow ass hacking game playing teams! There you go with your ignorant tunnel vision. If slovenua plays the us, they go hard at goran with two guys and dont worry that much. Consider stuff like that or you come over as ignorant as anybody. Im tired explaining things that are f... obvious to normal people who have a clue about basketball.

And what the f you mean with he should prove he is a champion like your other GODS in europe?? Should he get the heat to the finals with what they have? Wtf! Lebron wont be able to bring another title to cleveland, because **** is tough too do. And ni f... one won titles on his own??!

And bodiroga? The holy grail? Why didnt he try it in the nba? Ill tell you why. Because it was to hard to say bye to f... smoking cigarettes and ****. He didnt like to much practice time either. That **** was goid for europe, but he would have to work on himself or he would get his ass ran out of tge court without body conditionings. So all your gods had najor flaws why they didnt last in the nba!!

Spanoulis was supposedly f... homesick. Tharswhy he went home after 1 year the poor guy. So dont you discredit the work dragic has done to ckme from a longshot second round pick to earnning everything he got. And f... yes. He is one of the top 5 euro point guards to ever play in the best league in the nba. And none if your GODS will ever be on that list because they were held by their oen flaws!!!

Bob8 · Post #1167 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 11:11 am

I have written, dominate or at least be the best Pg. Why? Because he's playing the best basketball of his career and should demonstrate his class against his direct opposition from Europe. That shouldn't be that difficult because Diamantidis retired, Spanoulis is long away from his prime. There're only Teo and Llull left.

You're writing is more or less every time on the border of ad hominem fallacy.

This's my last comment on Dragic, not because it's not interesting, but because the thread is wrong.

XTraderXL · Post #1168 » by **XTraderXL** » Sun May 14, 2017 1:57 pm

Bob8 wrote:I have written, dominate or at least be the best Pg. Why? Because he's playing the best basketball of his career and should demonstrate his class against his direct opposition from Europe. That shouldn't be that difficult because Diamantidis retired, Spanoulis is long away from his prime. There're only Teo and Llull left.

You're writing is more or less every time on the border of ad hominem fallacy.

This's my last comment on Dragic, not because it's not interesting, but because the thread is wrong.

You seriously think he has to prove he is better than Llull?? HAHHAHAHAHAHAH :crazy:

Besides, Wildlinger and PacersGM explained the situation so I will not bother. If you dont see the obvious, its your problem.

Bob8 · Post #1169 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 2:20 pm

XTraderXL wrote:
Bob8 wrote:I have written, dominate or at least be the best Pg. Why? Because he's playing the best basketball of his career and should demonstrate his class against his direct opposition from Europe. That shouldn't be that difficult because Diamantidis retired, Spanoulis is long away from his prime. There're only Teo and Llull left.

You're writing is more or less every time on the border of ad hominem fallacy.

This's my last comment on Dragic, not because it's not interesting, but because the thread is wrong.

You seriously think he has to prove he is better than Llull?? HAHHAHAHAHAHAH
Besides, Wildlinger and PacersGM explained the situation so I will not bother. If you dont see the obvious, its your problem.

I said it should be easy.

Yes, they're all big basketball authorities.

I wonder why Obradovic, Messina and other coaches from Europe don't have the same view?

XTraderXL · Post #1170 » by **XTraderXL** » Sun May 14, 2017 2:25 pm

Man, its impossible to debate you. Whatever I or anyone else says you will not change your mind. One last time. A guy makes it in by far the best league in the world and is one of the top players at his position. The mentioned guys were not good enough to stay there or were afraid to go to prove themselves. So who is the better player?
And how do you know what coaches think? I bet Popovich and Kerr think that Goran is much better than Teodosic. So what is your point??? You really dont know what you are saying.

Bob8 · Post #1171 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 3:12 pm

Why should I changed my mind? What has he done in his career is for me not enough to put him ahead of the best players ever from Europe. He is very possible the best player at this moment, but that we will for sure see in Eurobasket.

Diamantidis biography, http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=jko#!biography

Spanoulis biography,
http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=JUO#!biography

I understand Nba is the best league, but not the only one. And if I agree that only Nba counts, which I can't, then I have to put Udrih and Rubio ahead of Diamantidis, Spanoulis and Teodosic, what is total nonsense.

I understand you have different opinion, and I respect that. But my question is,
Can I have different opinion than you about Dragic or not?

XTraderXL · Post #1172 » by **XTraderXL** » Sun May 14, 2017 3:46 pm

You clearly do not understand the argument. Why are you bringing Rubio and Udrih into this? Nobody is talking about them. These guys you mentioned couldnt be on Gorans NBA level, so they went back/stayed in Europe. Do you really think that they would be winning titles in the NBA as stars on their teams? Its just idiotic to say they are better because they won in Europe. Since Goran never really played in the Euroleague, we have to take the next level (NBA) and FIBA tournaments into account. NBA is not even debatable and Goran is by far the best player for Slovenian NT even though he is currently the teams only that can play on the highest level. Every other teams game plan is to stop him and he still outplays these guys all the time. The problem is the players around him are just not good enough so he cant win titles with NT by himself. This year I expect him to play the best NT ball of his career, paired with Doncic they will be a joy to watch.

XTraderXL · Post #1173 » by **XTraderXL** » Sun May 14, 2017 3:49 pm

And you can have a different opinion, the problem is that you dont have an argument to support it. What you argue has been disproved every single time and at some point you have to admit you were wrong. Its no point debating someone, who wont accept/admit they were wrong...

Bob8 · Post #1174 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 3:57 pm

Diamantidis wasn't ever in Nba, the same goes with Teo. Spanoulis was in Nba 1 year and then he returned home, because he expected to much to soon. Dragic needed 4 seasons to break 10 ppg line. I have brought Udrih and Rubio into debate only to show that you can't only look at what someone has done in NBA.

The question is, do you really think Dragic would win everything in Europe, like Spanoulis and Diamantidis did, if he stayed in Europe? Not many in history did what this two have done. And don't forget Olympiacos was big underdog when they won Euroleague title in Istanbul.

Bob8 · Post #1175 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 3:58 pm

XTraderXL wrote:And you can have a different opinion, the problem is that you dont have an argument to support it. What you argue has been disproved every single time and at some point you have to admit you were wrong. Its no point debating someone, who wont accept/admit they were wrong...

Who has disproved it? Only evidence you have is statement that the NBA is the best league and Dragic did well there others didn't. What's under conditions mentioned above is really not enough for me. Especially when we look what others has done in Europe.

You can't be wrong?

O.k. Let's wait what Mirotic12 has to say or if you want, I can ask Obradovic, Itoudis and Laso in Istanbul.

UcanUwill · Post #1176 » by **UcanUwill** » Sun May 14, 2017 4:24 pm

DIamantidis had stacked team. Also, he never showed up in FIBA tournaments, go look up his stats. If you think Diamantidis was better than Goran you are high. Spanoulis, I give him credit for carrying that underdog OLY team to glory.

XTraderXL · Post #1177 » by **XTraderXL** » Sun May 14, 2017 4:43 pm

No point in debating this with you if you keep bringing up Rubio and Udrih. Nobody mentioned them in this conversation, why keep bringing them up? Yes, they play in the NBA but nobody said that they are better players. That should show you that just being in the NBA doesnt make you a better player, we look at other factors as well.

My friend plays in a recreational league and he won 10 straight titles. He went to try out for a pro team, couldnt make it and went back to playing rec team and won another 5 titles. By your standards he must be the best player that ever played the game. That is basically your logic. :banghead:

Who knows what Goran would do if he stayed in Europe. We cant know that. But we know what Spanoulis did in the NBA. 0! That is the only way we can really compare the two. The rest are not even in conversation for me as they did not go to the best league and didnt prove themselves against the best competition. Goran did all those things.
To your point, Goran had nothing handed to him. He needed 4 years to break out and he fought every day for what he has now. Spanoulis gave up after a year and ran back to Europe because it NBA was to tough for his spoiled ass. If this is a knock on Goran in your opinion, you must be smoking something. It shows his character and I will take Goran over any of these guys any day.

Bob8 · Post #1178 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 4:47 pm

XTraderXL wrote:No point in debating this with you if you keep bringing up Rubio and Udrih. Nobody mentioned them in this conversation, why keep bringing them up?
And to your reasoning, my friend plays in a recreational league and he won 10 straight titles. He went to try out for a pro team, couldnt make it and went back to playing rec team and won another 5 titles. By your standards he must be the best player that ever played the game. That is basically your logic.

Do you know how you undervalue Euroleague with this post? But o.k. How can we rank players who never played in Nba in comparison with Nba players?
Anybody who plays there is a better player? :noway:

And because of that I have brought Rubio and Udrih. if I understand your logic they are better than Spanoulis, because Spanoulis didn't do anything in NBA, and they were/are much better. And Diamantidis and Teo are even worse, because they didn't even try there.

Post #1179 » by **Prez** » Sun May 14, 2017 4:55 pm

Shane friggin Larkin is a top 10 scorer in Euroleague. Yes, a point guard like Dragic killing it in the NBA absolutely does put him over bonafide NBA scrubs like Spanoulis.

Bob8 · Post #1180 » by **Bob8** » Sun May 14, 2017 4:58 pm

Prez wrote:Shane friggin Larkin is a top 10 scorer in Euroleague. Yes, a point guard like Dragic killing it in the NBA absolutely does put him over bonafide NBA scrubs like Spanoulis.

i understand, all players who don't play in NBA are scrubs. It can't be different if one of the best players in Euroleague in last 10 years is a scrub.

the funny thing is, that within this logic even Doncic is a scrub.

and then scrubs from Europe, or recreational league like someone named Euroleague, beat Oklahoma. 142:137. Friendly match, but still...