The Ayton vs. Bamba Thread

clyde21 · Post #1 » by **clyde21** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:34 am

Top two centers in the draft. Very closely ranked across the board.

Who do you got now? Do you see it changing throughout the season?

ItsThatEasy · Post #2 » by **ItsThatEasy** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:51 am

I think Ayton is the most talented player in this draft. I'm confident in Sean Millers ability to get the most out of him this year.

Post #3 » by **GimmeDat** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:16 am

I like both a heck of a lot, but Ayton is the more complete prospect and we're hearing good early things out of Arizona. May not take us long in to the college season to get a much better handle on this debate, though.

The-Power · Post #4 » by **The-Power** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:38 am

#TeamBamba

That said, I realize that Ayton has arguably the most upside if he can positively answer the questions we have regarding his attitude. I can see myself ranking him anywhere between #1 and #7 and it wouldn't feel wrong, although he'd have to do a lot to get serious consideration for the first spot (Doncic is just a special talent and hard to pass).

Bamba, for me, is second at the moment although Bagley could quickly overtake his spot in case his game and impact translates well into college and he answers some questions I have. Still, I believe Bamba's game-changing defensive potential paired with his attitude is hard to take a pass on. I recognize the appeal of potential offensive superstars but in terms of future impact I doubt there are going to be more than a couple players who help their team more than Bamba will and it's not like this year's class is loaded with a bunch of elite offensive prospects anyway.

No-Man · Post #5 » by **No-Man** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:39 am

What about none? I'd prefer to invest my $ on wings, if you need a big you are gonna be able to get similar production from much cheaper players.

brackdan70 · Post #6 » by **brackdan70** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:57 pm

I like Ayton at this point little more but its close. I could easily see Bamba being he better player when it is all said and done though. Both pretty damn solid NBA prospects IMO.

J_T · Post #7 » by **J_T** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:46 pm

I think that Bamba is extremely overrated and is going to be a flop. By flop I mean that in 5 years time this pick will be laughable and fans of a certain franchise are going to be regretting it. Few weeks ago I saw a video titled something like... can't remember, something along the lines of "look how well he handles the ball, he can create his own shots, put the ball on the floor etc". After I saw the video I was trying to figure out whether the video was sarcastic but apparently it was not.

Post #8 » by **Duke4life831** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:52 pm

Ayton is the better prospect. His size mixed with athleticism, skill and toughness is a scary combination. But there is no getting around his biggest question mark which is his motor and work ethic. I love that he went to Zona because Miller wont put up with that and if there is a coach that will be able to get him to work his 1 year in college its Miller.

With all that said I still gotta go with Bamba. To me he still has a really high ceiling and I think his floor is still really high and the dude just screams DPOY potential. So give me the rim protecting defensive center over the all around center with major work ethic questions.

I do reserve my right to change my mind once the season starts and if Ayton just plays like a bat out of hell and those motor and work ethic questions look to be in the past. A high motor Ayton has the potential as #1 pick even over guys like Bagley, Doncic and Porter.

UcanUwill · Post #9 » by **UcanUwill** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 3:13 pm

What makes Ayton much better than Perry Jones or Magic Randolph? Genuine question, not trying to diss.

NDave79 · Post #10 » by **NDave79** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 4:43 pm

UcanUwill wrote:What makes Ayton much better than Perry Jones or Magic Randolph? Genuine question, not trying to diss.

Well, I think the biggest difference is that Ayton has great size for the center spot. Randolph weighed in at 197 before his draft. Perry Jones only had an 8'11" standing reach. Not that either of them are centers, so the comparisons seem a little off. Here is a little breakdown of Ayton I posted on the Bulls board.

Well here is my personal take based on what we have seen so far and info I've heard

Pros

- Awesome, physical specimen (7 ft, 7'5" winspan, 9'4.5" standing reach, 260lbs, monster vertical, great agility and lateral quickness.)
- Nice jumper
- Good hands
- Has huge potential as a rebounder and defender, imo.
- Based on his interviews, seems like a nice, down-to-earth kid if not a bit immature.

Cons

- While he is an awesome athlete for his size he seems a little stiff to me
- While he is a great leaper, Imo, he doesn't look quite as explosive as big guys like Shaq, Dwight and Gred Oden did in their physical primes. I feel as if he has to wind up a little more for his jump.
- Limited post game, I don't think he will ever be an elite focal point of an offense. I see him getting most of his points off of jumpers, offensive rebounds, finishing off assists, running in transition and free throws
- Questionable IQ and motor

However, apparently their have been reports he's been working his tail off at Arizona so we should have a decent feel what sort of motor he has by the draft.

J_T · Post #11 » by **J_T** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:38 pm

UcanUwill wrote:What makes Ayton much better than Perry Jones or Magic Randolph? Genuine question, not trying to diss.

Are they really supposed to be similar players, Randolph and Ayton? I think that if they play at C, Ayton is better at everything. The way Randolph developed in recent years has also been in different direction completely, he hasn't been adding C skills there, more those of SF. Bit off topic but I think that most people don't realize that Randolph is actually a much better player now than he was in NBA. In my opinion. I didn't like his play in NBA at all, but today I think he'd be making more impact in the league.

UcanUwill · Post #12 » by **UcanUwill** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:41 pm

J_T wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:What makes Ayton much better than Perry Jones or Magic Randolph? Genuine question, not trying to diss.

Are they really supposed to be similar players, Randolph and Ayton? I think that if they play at C, Ayton is better at everything. The way Randolph developed in recent years has also been in different direction completely, he hasn't been adding C skills there, more those of SF. Bit off topic but I think that most people don't realize that Randolph is actually a much better player now than he was in NBA. In my opinion. I didn't like his play in NBA at all, but today I think he'd be making more impact in the league.

Well, I do see similarities. These type of players usually look amazing in highschool, butnothing special in pros. So I am just being cautious. Bamba I think is a sure thing however.

Randoph is good defender now, but his offense sucks.

No-Man · Post #13 » by **No-Man** » Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:10 pm

Ayton is bigger than Randolph, more athletic and has a more natural jumpshot.

My thing with Bamba is that if the jumpshot doesnt evolve they can play him off-the-floor on offense, he ain't that good at PnR at least yet, he can get there and he is superlong so who knows.

I like both enough, but I'd sink them if I had enough upside wings to draft, which well I don't in this class, other than the Bridgeses

tsmith · Post #14 » by **tsmith** » Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:20 am

Fischella wrote:What about none? I'd prefer to invest my $ on wings, if you need a big you are gonna be able to get similar production from much cheaper players.

I think this depends, if the big is superstar level like KAT, Davis or Embiid then they are worth the investment, but your right in being to find a similar production from cheaper players if the big is not game changing.

CptCrunch · Post #15 » by **CptCrunch** » Sun Oct 15, 2017 5:46 pm

t_smith979 wrote:
Fischella wrote:What about none? I'd prefer to invest my $ on wings, if you need a big you are gonna be able to get similar production from much cheaper players.

I think this depends, if the big is superstar level like KAT, Davis or Embiid then they are worth the investment, but your right in being to find a similar production from cheaper players if the big is not game changing.

KAT is not a superstar. He is the worst defensive C in the league.

Embiid cannot stay healthy. Unless he does, it would be better to invest in wings.

Davis is once in a generation player and still plays on a losing team.

tsmith · Post #16 » by **tsmith** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:25 am

paulbball wrote:
t_smith979 wrote:
Fischella wrote:What about none? I'd prefer to invest my $ on wings, if you need a big you are gonna be able to get similar production from much cheaper players.

I think this depends, if the big is superstar level like KAT, Davis or Embiid then they are worth the investment, but your right in being to find a similar production from cheaper players if the big is not game changing.

KAT is not a superstar. He is the worst defensive C in the league.

Embiid cannot stay healthy. Unless he does, it would be better to invest in wings.

Davis is once in a generation player and still plays on a losing team.

But for all three of those names you'd be hard to get similar production from much cheaper players. Which was my point.

CptCrunch · Post #17 » by **CptCrunch** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:26 am

t_smith979 wrote:
paulbball wrote:
t_smith979 wrote:I think this depends, if the big is superstar level like KAT, Davis or Embiid then they are worth the investment, but your right in being to find a similar production from cheaper players if the big is not game changing.

KAT is not a superstar. He is the worst defensive C in the league.

Embiid cannot stay healthy. Unless he does, it would be better to invest in wings.

Davis is once in a generation player and still plays on a losing team.

But for all three of those names you'd be hard to get similar production from much cheaper players. Which was my point.

Yes, better off getting role player bigs who can rebound and D a big. Get your scoring from wings.

tsmith · Post #18 » by **tsmith** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:33 am

paulbball wrote:
t_smith979 wrote:
paulbball wrote:
KAT is not a superstar. He is the worst defensive C in the league.

Embiid cannot stay healthy. Unless he does, it would be better to invest in wings.

Davis is once in a generation player and still plays on a losing team.

But for all three of those names you'd be hard to get similar production from much cheaper players. Which was my point.

Yes, better off getting role player bigs who can rebound and D a big. Get your scoring from wings.

Hmm I disagree, I just think the league hasn't really seen a top quality big man for a while and that's why people feel it is natural for scoring off the wings. With a big man at the level of the above three you can definitely get elite production and scoring from them, while they still rebound and defend.

CptCrunch · Post #19 » by **CptCrunch** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:45 am

t_smith979 wrote:
paulbball wrote:
t_smith979 wrote:But for all three of those names you'd be hard to get similar production from much cheaper players. Which was my point.

Yes, better off getting role player bigs who can rebound and D a big. Get your scoring from wings.

Hmm I disagree, I just think the league hasn't really seen a top quality big man for a while and that's why people feel it is natural for scoring off the wings. With a big man at the level of the above three you can definitely get elite production and scoring from them, while they still rebound and defend.

Except such mythical creatures don't exist.

Davis maybe. Giannis if you want to count him as a big. Embiid, Towns, Jokic aren't ready for crap. Look at championship teams from the past decade.

tsmith · Post #20 » by **tsmith** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:53 am

paulbball wrote:
t_smith979 wrote:
paulbball wrote:
Yes, better off getting role player bigs who can rebound and D a big. Get your scoring from wings.

Hmm I disagree, I just think the league hasn't really seen a top quality big man for a while and that's why people feel it is natural for scoring off the wings. With a big man at the level of the above three you can definitely get elite production and scoring from them, while they still rebound and defend.

Except such mythical creatures don't exist.

Davis maybe. Giannis if you want to count him as a big. Embiid, Towns, Jokic aren't ready for crap. Look at championship teams from the past decade.

I disagree.
The idea of there not being a quality big man on championship teams just reinforces my point that the league has not seen a quality big man for a while. The only real, high quality big man of the last ten years has been Tim Duncan, and his team experienced major success.

Who ya got?