The Ayton vs. Bamba Thread

[CptCrunch]

Hmm I disagree, I just think the league hasn't really seen a top quality big man for a while and that's why people feel it is natural for scoring off the wings. With a big man at the level of the above three you can definitely get elite production and scoring from them, while they still rebound and defend.

Except such mythical creatures don't exist.

Davis maybe. Giannis if you want to count him as a big. Embiid, Towns, Jokic aren't ready for crap. Look at championship teams from the past decade.

I disagree.
The idea of there not being a quality big man on championship teams just reinforces my point that the league has not seen a quality big man for a while. The only real, high quality big man of the last ten years has been Tim Duncan, and his team experienced major success.

Yes because quality bigs are rare, but teams have not stopped drafting bigs in hopes of finding a star. Your chances of taking a wing at the ton of the draft and having him becoming an impactful franchise player is much greater than chances for a big.

And even if your big prospect are good, there is a much higher chance of them being derailed by injuries. Humans bones and joints aren't designed to support 7'0" 250 lb players.

[Justwar]

Cough, Bynum. Bynum was great before injuries. Short career but was elite. Elite talent still need a supporting class

[ItsThatEasy]

What makes Ayton much better than Perry Jones or Magic Randolph? Genuine question, not trying to diss.

There's almost no similarities between any of these players.

Ayton is a pure center from his size to his skill set. His perimeter skills and athletic abilities are a bonus not a calling card, similar to KAT and Boogie. He could go an entire game without taking a jumper and still finish with 30+ points.

This would be like comparing DeAndre Jordan to Marvin Williams.

[nolang1]

Hmm I disagree, I just think the league hasn't really seen a top quality big man for a while and that's why people feel it is natural for scoring off the wings. With a big man at the level of the above three you can definitely get elite production and scoring from them, while they still rebound and defend.

Except such mythical creatures don't exist.

Davis maybe. Giannis if you want to count him as a big. Embiid, Towns, Jokic aren't ready for crap. Look at championship teams from the past decade.

I disagree.
The idea of there not being a quality big man on championship teams just reinforces my point that the league has not seen a quality big man for a while. The only real, high quality big man of the last ten years has been Tim Duncan, and his team experienced major success.

And pre-injury Dwight Howard, who carried a team to the Finals at age 23. KG was the best player on a championship team within the last decade as well. 10 years ago someone could dismiss Steph Curry with the "look at past championship teams" argument when unspectacular players like Derek Fisher, 20-year-old Tony Parker and Ron Harper started at point guard for championship teams; obviously in a league that's only been around for 70 years there isn't sufficient evidence to say "you can't win a championship with X."

[Justwar]

How many teams besides the warriors have won ship's without a 7'0 star the past fifteen years? I know the last 3 years we haven't seen one. But before that? Does 3 years rewrite history? Before you say oh this and that guy is a power forward, most of the new generation of bigs play pf and center.

[clyde21]

How many teams besides the warriors have won ship's without a 7'0 star the past fifteen years? I know the last 3 years we haven't seen one. But before that? Does 3 years rewrite history? Before you say oh this and that guy is a power forward, most of the new generation of bigs play pf and center.

The Heat? Mavs did with Chandler but I wouldn't call him a star necessarily.

[Justwar]

It's not just a center. Nowitzki, he is about 7'1 and almost any other time in history would of been a center.

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[The Master]

I'll go with what Sean Miller said about Ayton - if he's really doing whatever they ask him to do during camp, his motor issues are irrelevant and he's working as hard as he can, than he will end his college career on Davis-tier in terms of quality as a prospect. Nothing against Bamba, he's great Gobert-like talent, but there was time that was undeniable Ayton is the best player of this class. It's all in Ayton's hands.

[Marcus]

I'll go with what Sean Miller said about Ayton - if he's really doing whatever they ask him to do during camp, his motor issues are irrelevant and he's working as hard as he can, than he will end his college career on Davis-tier in terms of quality as a prospect. Nothing against Bamba, he's great Gobert-like talent, but there was time that was undeniable Ayton is the best player of this class. It's all in Ayton's hands.

Love me some Ayton, waiting for the season to kick off, and i'll chalk some of it up to not going hard against teammates during in a scrimmage but he looked super lost on defense in some of the highlight clips of that scrimmage. I'm still holding out high hopes on rim protection and even some perimeter switching so I'm hoping it was somewhat dialed down on that end of the floor do to the setting but he can't miss rotations and just stare at whoever is attacking the cup like he did.

[Kalela]

Bamba is my favorite player in this draft. Just the defense he will bring due to his size and length will be awesome. I really want the Celtics to select him if they get the Lakers pick this year.

[KobesScarf]

I will call my shot and say Brandon McCoy will be better than both. He's way stronger than they are and you can see it by the way he rebounds and finishes through traffic.

[The-Power]

I will call my shot and say Brandon McCoy will be better than both. He's way stronger than they are and you can see it by the way he rebounds and finishes through traffic.

If his only visible advantage is being stronger, at 19 years old, then I'm not very optimistic about the chances to surpass two players as intriguing and promising as Ayton and Bamba.

[KobesScarf]

I will call my shot and say Brandon McCoy will be better than both. He's way stronger than they are and you can see it by the way he rebounds and finishes through traffic.

If his only visible advantage is being stronger, at 19 years old, then I'm not very optimistic about the chances to surpass two players as intriguing and promising as Ayton and Bamba.

He's not stronger for the sake of being stronger. He's a better rebounder and finisher than they are

[The-Power]

I will call my shot and say Brandon McCoy will be better than both. He's way stronger than they are and you can see it by the way he rebounds and finishes through traffic.

If his only visible advantage is being stronger, at 19 years old, then I'm not very optimistic about the chances to surpass two players as intriguing and promising as Ayton and Bamba.

He's not stronger for the sake of being stronger. He's a better rebounder and finisher than they are

Areas in which the other two will most certainly improve further once they grow further into their bodies while McCoy has less upside in this regard. And even if Bamba will never be a strong finisher, his DPOY potential is what makes him this intriguing anyway and McCoy simply doesn't have that in him. edit: And Ayton is bound to be one of the best finishers with that frame, size and athleticism coupled with a relatively soft touch.

[KobesScarf]

If his only visible advantage is being stronger, at 19 years old, then I'm not very optimistic about the chances to surpass two players as intriguing and promising as Ayton and Bamba.

He's not stronger for the sake of being stronger. He's a better rebounder and finisher than they are

Areas in which the other two will most certainly improve further once they grow further into their bodies while McCoy has less upside in this regard. And even if Bamba will never be a strong finisher, his DPOY potential is what makes him this intriguing anyway and McCoy simply doesn't have that in him. edit: And Ayton is bound to be one of the best finishers with that frame, size and athleticism coupled with a relatively soft touch.

McCoy will improve too he's also a hustler which is something you can't teach especially not in a big man. I think know he will surprise a lot of people.

[The-Power]

McCoy will improve too he's also a hustler which is something you can't teach especially not in a big man. I think know he will surprise a lot of people.

A hustle player with solid defense who can run and finish inside can absolutely be a valuable player but he's still just a role player with that profile, one of those energy bigs off the bench. It's too early to tell, though, so let's wait and see how he develops this year first.

[KobesScarf]

McCoy will improve too he's also a hustler which is something you can't teach especially not in a big man. I think know he will surprise a lot of people.

A hustle player with solid defense who can run and finish inside can absolutely be a valuable player but he's still just a role player with that profile, one of those energy bigs off the bench. It's too early to tell, though, so let's wait and see how he develops this year first.

You forgot rebounding. I think he projects as a guy who could lead the NBA in rebounding a 18-12 type player

[leper-con]

With the new plethora of good bigs interring the NBA, maybe three will be a shift away from small ball.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Bamba's personality is interesting I'm not sure if that'll help or hinder him as sometimes it's better to just be a one track mind athlete.

[King Ken]

I like both a heck of a lot, but Ayton is the more complete prospect and we're hearing good early things out of Arizona. May not take us long in to the college season to get a much better handle on this debate, though.

Same, I love both of them. Bamba to me just feels like he's gonna be #1 by the end of the year. His upside is just insane plus his tool-kit is massive. It's not Doncic or Bagley but his measurables are way better than both of them put together. I seen this story in the past with Porzingis and Giannis. You just don't pass up on someone with those tools. Then again, Ayton has insane measurables as well. You really can't go wrong with either. Right now, scouts are higher than Doncic, Bagley and Porter Jr but when it's all said and done, Ayton and Bamba in some order will be 1 and 2.