Emoni Bates

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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#81 » by Saints14 » Thu Oct 7, 2021 3:55 pm

He's got a crazy handle for his size and decent passing chops. With the negative wingspan, he might end up being functionally more of a big guard than a wing (I think that is the plan at Memphis). Saw him once over the summer playing with Duren, and those 2 had good chemistry - but I'm not sure I saw high-level feel or team basketball IQ from Bates. My concern would be that he's one of those guys who is best with the ball in his hands but isn't good enough as a scorer or at running an offense to justify it
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#82 » by Duke4life831 » Thu Oct 7, 2021 4:19 pm

I will say this, Jimmy Butler pretty much has a 1:1 height to wingspan ratio, that has never been an issue for him.

But with that said, ya these numbers are horrific but not surprising really. Just watching him you could see his wingspan wasn’t good at all and he never was the most explosive guy either. But all these numbers together has to be pretty worrisome for sure.

Also the thing that has always worried me about Bates and you tend to mostly see this with high school bigs but you will see it from perimeter players as well. He physically matured so much earlier than everyone else and that us when all the hype started. Ya the dude is skilled, but those measurements is no doubt a huge red flag.
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Emoni Bates 

Post#83 » by NO-KG-AI » Fri Oct 8, 2021 2:27 pm

Length only hurts him in the sense that he gets compared to Durant or even Ingram.

Durant turned in a similarly bad physical performance( 26 inch standing vert, 33 max, and couldn’t bench 185 one time. He was on the lower end of the sprint and lane drills as well, finishing noticeably slower than Oden iirc.)

Like Durant though, he’s just super fluid and mobile with and without the ball. And his aggression helps him just be a much better athlete in a basketball setting than a workout room.

Durant had 10” of wingspan on him though. Even 2-3 inches can be a big difference…

Like someone else said though, he does look skilled enough that maybe we should be treating him more like a big scoring guard than a generational forward. He’ll be weirdly much taller, but similar in functional dimensions as a guard.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#84 » by lebron3-14-3 » Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:21 am

Yeah he's still a 6'8 perimeter player, really good shooter, can handle the ball, aggressive. Obviously he doesn't have have the height advantage kd has, and he won't score that much at the rim, but he's good.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#85 » by clyde21 » Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:13 am

people saying he's not the generational dude he was being hailed as doesn't mean they don't think he's a great prospect, clearly he is, he'll be a top5 guy no doubt about it but he's not KD and never was.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#86 » by MemphisX » Tue Oct 12, 2021 11:06 am

Duke4life831 wrote:I will say this, Jimmy Butler pretty much has a 1:1 height to wingspan ratio, that has never been an issue for him.

But with that said, ya these numbers are horrific but not surprising really. Just watching him you could see his wingspan wasn’t good at all and he never was the most explosive guy either. But all these numbers together has to be pretty worrisome for sure.

Also the thing that has always worried me about Bates and you tend to mostly see this with high school bigs but you will see it from perimeter players as well. He physically matured so much earlier than everyone else and that us when all the hype started. Ya the dude is skilled, but those measurements is no doubt a huge red flag.



What? He is the skinniest dude. He was more SKILLED than everyone else and played harder. The stuff he does has nothing to do with over powering younger guys or less developed guys. Most of what he does will be able to be done vs. NBA guys too.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#87 » by Duke4life831 » Tue Oct 12, 2021 8:44 pm

MemphisX wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:I will say this, Jimmy Butler pretty much has a 1:1 height to wingspan ratio, that has never been an issue for him.

But with that said, ya these numbers are horrific but not surprising really. Just watching him you could see his wingspan wasn’t good at all and he never was the most explosive guy either. But all these numbers together has to be pretty worrisome for sure.

Also the thing that has always worried me about Bates and you tend to mostly see this with high school bigs but you will see it from perimeter players as well. He physically matured so much earlier than everyone else and that us when all the hype started. Ya the dude is skilled, but those measurements is no doubt a huge red flag.



What? He is the skinniest dude. He was more SKILLED than everyone else and played harder. The stuff he does has nothing to do with over powering younger guys or less developed guys. Most of what he does will be able to be done vs. NBA guys too.


You're correct, physically matured was not the proper thing to say. He grew way before anyone else in his grade. They crazy hype started to build around him when he was 6'5 in the 6th and 7th grade.

And yes dont get me wrong, Im not saying Bates is a bad prospect. He is no doubt a very skilled wing player. Im not questioning Bates as a 5 star prospect, he most definitely is.

What Im talking about is the "Bates is the next LeBron, KD, and so on" level of high school prospect talk and hype with him. That mostly started because yes he was skilled, but he was also much taller than everyone else he was playing against.

Again good prospect? Yes. Elite once in a decade kind of prospect (like the hype around him has been saying for years now)? No.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#88 » by NRSV » Tue Oct 26, 2021 12:25 am

SeattleJazzFan wrote:So this happened

Image

Those numbers are beyond concerning.

I’m a 5’9 30+ y/o white guy and I have the same vertical and my hands are more than 1” bigger and I can’t exactly palm a basketball.

Bad news…
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#89 » by Upperclass » Sat Oct 30, 2021 4:06 am

Bates might be a worst on paper athlete than Duncan Robinson
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#90 » by clyde21 » Sun Oct 31, 2021 9:25 pm

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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#91 » by azcatz11 » Sun Oct 31, 2021 9:29 pm

clyde21 wrote:


What do you think about that highlight package? He plays weird. His shot is super slow and it looks like he's almost moving in slow motion. I don't know. He doesn't look fluid at all in anything he does
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#92 » by clyde21 » Sun Oct 31, 2021 9:33 pm

azcatz11 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:


What do you think about that highlight package? He plays weird. His shot is super slow and it looks like he's almost moving in slow motion. I don't know. He doesn't look fluid at all in anything he does


well, i'll just say this, I've been saying hes overrated for years now, and that game did nothing to alleviate any of my concerns about him.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#93 » by CptCrunch » Sun Oct 31, 2021 10:04 pm

azcatz11 wrote:
clyde21 wrote:


What do you think about that highlight package? He plays weird. His shot is super slow and it looks like he's almost moving in slow motion. I don't know. He doesn't look fluid at all in anything he does


1/ Drive to basket, gets pushed. Looks really slow with the dribble. Makes 2 FT's

2/ Shoots a long jumper off a screen.

3/ Dribbles across the court. Literally slow as molasses. This is against Lane College??!!??? Literally dribbling slower than that lumbering center chasing after him. Makes a nice read, then catches and hoots against a mismatched center.

4/ Nice acrobatic finish off a pass that Duren couldn't handle.

5/ Blocks some random guard from lane college with a chasedown block.

6/ Catch and shoot 3. His shot overall feels hitchy, not smooth and the form is not standard. With these shots you either have to make them at an elite clip or a NBA team will want to rebuilt your shot from scratch.

If you play against Lane College and I don't see a single drive or iso against outmatched D2 players, #5 team in the Western division of SIAC conference, it is not a good look.

I don't see how you even touch this dude with a lottery pick. Emoni is better off dropping out of college. Going into hiding in Canada like what Thon Maker did for a year (but Emoni needs to do for 2).

Edit: this is his box, I would like to see the turnovers and missed shots also. Hope someone makes a video with his entire game.

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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#94 » by clyde21 » Sun Oct 31, 2021 10:13 pm

problem with his shot is that it negates a lot of his height b/c of the low release point, he'd be more intriguing if that wasn't the case and he actually had a legitimately high apex on his shots.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#95 » by NRSV » Mon Nov 1, 2021 4:50 am

The lack of athleticism is gonna be a problem as a pro but he’s so skilled that he should feast in college.

No chance he’s a top five pick. Measurables are too awful.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#96 » by Duke4life831 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 5:53 pm

The best way I can describe it, he looks like a labored athlete. There is nothing about him athletically that looks smooth or natural.

I’ve been pretty vocal on here for awhile that I never saw him as a generational prospect. But man I mean him pushing the fastbreak in that game, Lane’s big man was on his hip the entire time. It looked like he was really pushing it and he couldn’t get any gap between him and Lane’s big man on a fast break. That doesn’t look great.

The lack of first step explosion as well, is he going to be able to drive by NBA perimeter players?

I won’t be shocked if he ends up being a Harrison Barnes 2.0. What I mean by that is, Barnes coming out of high school was viewed as this can’t miss generational prospect. He ended up in college for 2 years and went 7th in the draft. And I’m sure a big reason he didn’t drop further than 7th was his name recognition and hope he still might have untapped “blue chip” potential.

There are just a lot of things about his game that I really have big questions about on how well they will translate going against NBA athletes.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#97 » by azcatz11 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 6:25 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:The best way I can describe it, he looks like a labored athlete. There is nothing about him athletically that looks smooth or natural.

I’ve been pretty vocal on here for awhile that I never saw him as a generational prospect. But man I mean him pushing the fastbreak in that game, Lane’s big man was on his hip the entire time. It looked like he was really pushing it and he couldn’t get any gap between him and Lane’s big man on a fast break. That doesn’t look great.

The lack of first step explosion as well, is he going to be able to drive by NBA perimeter players?

I won’t be shocked if he ends up being a Harrison Barnes 2.0. What I mean by that is, Barnes coming out of high school was viewed as this can’t miss generational prospect. He ended up in college for 2 years and went 7th in the draft. And I’m sure a big reason he didn’t drop further than 7th was his name recognition and hope he still might have untapped “blue chip” potential.

There are just a lot of things about his game that I really have big questions about on how well they will translate going against NBA athletes.


There's no way man. Even on that reverse, he got like no elevation. It looked weird.

I feel like Harrison Barnes has a lot more intangibles also. Not saying Bates is a bad kid - but Barnes is super smart and plays within himself.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#98 » by Duke4life831 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 6:44 pm

azcatz11 wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:The best way I can describe it, he looks like a labored athlete. There is nothing about him athletically that looks smooth or natural.

I’ve been pretty vocal on here for awhile that I never saw him as a generational prospect. But man I mean him pushing the fastbreak in that game, Lane’s big man was on his hip the entire time. It looked like he was really pushing it and he couldn’t get any gap between him and Lane’s big man on a fast break. That doesn’t look great.

The lack of first step explosion as well, is he going to be able to drive by NBA perimeter players?

I won’t be shocked if he ends up being a Harrison Barnes 2.0. What I mean by that is, Barnes coming out of high school was viewed as this can’t miss generational prospect. He ended up in college for 2 years and went 7th in the draft. And I’m sure a big reason he didn’t drop further than 7th was his name recognition and hope he still might have untapped “blue chip” potential.

There are just a lot of things about his game that I really have big questions about on how well they will translate going against NBA athletes.


There's no way man. Even on that reverse, he got like no elevation. It looked weird.

I feel like Harrison Barnes has a lot more intangibles also. Not saying Bates is a bad kid - but Barnes is super smart and plays within himself.


Yup. The best way I can put it is everything he does athletically looks labored. Nothing smooth or natural in his movements.
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#99 » by Upperclass » Wed Nov 3, 2021 8:02 am

He's not an NBA player. Some team will kick the tires in the second round but he isn't going to get more athletic as he ages
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Re: Emoni Bates 

Post#100 » by CptCrunch » Wed Nov 3, 2021 4:23 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:The best way I can describe it, he looks like a labored athlete. There is nothing about him athletically that looks smooth or natural.

I’ve been pretty vocal on here for awhile that I never saw him as a generational prospect. But man I mean him pushing the fastbreak in that game, Lane’s big man was on his hip the entire time. It looked like he was really pushing it and he couldn’t get any gap between him and Lane’s big man on a fast break. That doesn’t look great.

The lack of first step explosion as well, is he going to be able to drive by NBA perimeter players?

I won’t be shocked if he ends up being a Harrison Barnes 2.0. What I mean by that is, Barnes coming out of high school was viewed as this can’t miss generational prospect. He ended up in college for 2 years and went 7th in the draft. And I’m sure a big reason he didn’t drop further than 7th was his name recognition and hope he still might have untapped “blue chip” potential.

There are just a lot of things about his game that I really have big questions about on how well they will translate going against NBA athletes.


The Black Falcon is leagues above Bates in athleticism. Barnes had the "I am not good at basketball for a #1 consensus high school prospect" syndrome. Barnes could be drafted based on his physical profile alone. Plus he has been a fine role player in this league.

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