RealGM

zimpy27 wrote:A number of different places are putting LaMelo at number 1.

Some suggest both the Warriors and Knicks will take him with their pick. Understand it for the Knicks but if the Warriors take him I'll be shocked.

Warriors should look to trade

I really like Devin Vasell

- very good off ball defender
- good jumpshot (kinda looks like Durants too)
- played almost exclusively off ball last year but has improved his handles and is running PnR now (and some flashes of shooting off PnR)

Looks like a first rounder to me

clyde21 wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:A number of different places are putting LaMelo at number 1.

Some suggest both the Warriors and Knicks will take him with their pick. Understand it for the Knicks but if the Warriors take him I'll be shocked.

/puke

Myers is a moron tho, he'd do it

I'm waiting until end of December before I decide if he's a moron. It's still possible he's waiting to the December 15th deadline before trading DLo.

I can't imagine him taking LaMelo, in any situation it's a horrible fit. I'm with you and Ken on trading the pick.

King Ken wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:A number of different places are putting LaMelo at number 1.

Some suggest both the Warriors and Knicks will take him with their pick. Understand it for the Knicks but if the Warriors take him I'll be shocked.

Warriors should look to trade

Yeah definitely. Maybe trade down to pick Josh Green and get an FRP for next season.

I won't believe that the Warriors seriously targeting LaMelo Ball until they actually draft him. I have enough faith in the FO to not take that unnecessary risk in the top 5 when there are similarly talented but less problematic options available. I could understand if some talent-deprived team is going to go all-in on Ball early in the draft; but the Warriors are in a position to not have to swing for the fences – especially not that early in the draft.

zimpy27 wrote:

King Ken wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:A number of different places are putting LaMelo at number 1.

Some suggest both the Warriors and Knicks will take him with their pick. Understand it for the Knicks but if the Warriors take him I'll be shocked.

Warriors should look to trade

Yeah definitely. Maybe trade down to pick Josh Green and get an FRP for next season.

Yeah, there are number of interesting ‘wings’ in this draft that you should be able to get your hands on a bit later in the draft. Josh Green, Isaiah Joe, Isaac Okoro, Landers Nolley, Deni Avdija, Scottie Lewis, Aaron Wiggins, Romeo Weems, Devin Vassell, Aaron Nesmith, Aaron Henry etc. who range from late lottery to early/mid 2nd round on my preliminary big board. Of course it depends on who eventually declares and who rises/falls, but there are definitely some options available if the only goal is to get out of the draft with a wing prospect plus sufficient value from trading down. I'd still prefer if the Warriors either draft a player they believe can be a core piece of the franchise moving forward or use the pick in a package to acquire a great player, though.

The-Power wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:

King Ken wrote:Warriors should look to trade

Yeah definitely. Maybe trade down to pick Josh Green and get an FRP for next season.

Yeah, there are number of interesting ‘wings’ in this draft that you should be able to get your hands on a bit later in the draft. Josh Green, Isaiah Joe, Isaac Okoro, Landers Nolley, Deni Avdija, Scottie Lewis, Aaron Wiggins, Romeo Weems, Devin Vassell, Aaron Nesmith, Aaron Henry etc. who range from late lottery to early/mid 2nd round on my preliminary big board. Of course it depends on who eventually declares and who rises/falls, but there are definitely some options available if the only goal is to get out of the draft with a wing prospect plus sufficient value from trading down. I'd still prefer if the Warriors either draft a player they believe can be a core piece of the franchise moving forward or use the pick in a package to acquire a great player, though.

Well I think Green would be a core piece, he's an SG/SF that can backup or start next to Klay. He seems like the most certain to add impact to a team like the Warriors straight away.

zimpy27 wrote:

The-Power wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:
Yeah definitely. Maybe trade down to pick Josh Green and get an FRP for next season.

Yeah, there are number of interesting ‘wings’ in this draft that you should be able to get your hands on a bit later in the draft. Josh Green, Isaiah Joe, Isaac Okoro, Landers Nolley, Deni Avdija, Scottie Lewis, Aaron Wiggins, Romeo Weems, Devin Vassell, Aaron Nesmith, Aaron Henry etc. who range from late lottery to early/mid 2nd round on my preliminary big board. Of course it depends on who eventually declares and who rises/falls, but there are definitely some options available if the only goal is to get out of the draft with a wing prospect plus sufficient value from trading down. I'd still prefer if the Warriors either draft a player they believe can be a core piece of the franchise moving forward or use the pick in a package to acquire a great player, though.

Well I think Green would be a core piece, he's an SG/SF that can backup or start next to Klay. He seems like the most certain to add impact to a team like the Warriors straight away.

Oh yeah, he's definitely a lottery prospect for me and of course much more valuable than a number of other guys I just mentioned (but of course you'll also not get as much value from trading down because you can't trade down too far). That said, I would expect him to be considered a core piece wherever he goes; but I doubt any team drafts him with the expectation, or reasonable hope, that he'll become their future star/franchise player. If the Warriors have a top 3 pick and decide to use it for themselves, I'd definitely expect them to look for such a player with the hope for a smooth transition into the next era.

The-Power wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:

The-Power wrote:Yeah, there are number of interesting ‘wings’ in this draft that you should be able to get your hands on a bit later in the draft. Josh Green, Isaiah Joe, Isaac Okoro, Landers Nolley, Deni Avdija, Scottie Lewis, Aaron Wiggins, Romeo Weems, Devin Vassell, Aaron Nesmith, Aaron Henry etc. who range from late lottery to early/mid 2nd round on my preliminary big board. Of course it depends on who eventually declares and who rises/falls, but there are definitely some options available if the only goal is to get out of the draft with a wing prospect plus sufficient value from trading down. I'd still prefer if the Warriors either draft a player they believe can be a core piece of the franchise moving forward or use the pick in a package to acquire a great player, though.

Well I think Green would be a core piece, he's an SG/SF that can backup or start next to Klay. He seems like the most certain to add impact to a team like the Warriors straight away.

Oh yeah, he's definitely a lottery prospect for me and of course much more valuable than a number of other guys I just mentioned (but of course you'll also not get as much value from trading down because you can't trade down too far). That said, I would expect him to be considered a core piece wherever he goes; but I doubt any team drafts him with the expectation, or reasonable hope, that he'll become their future star/franchise player. If the Warriors have a top 3 pick and decide to use it for themselves, I'd definitely expect them to look for such a player with the hope for a smooth transition into the next era.

GSW looking for a future star? So they are done with Curry, Klay and Draymond championship run? I thought they'd try to build around these guys.

zimpy27 wrote:

The-Power wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:
Well I think Green would be a core piece, he's an SG/SF that can backup or start next to Klay. He seems like the most certain to add impact to a team like the Warriors straight away.

Oh yeah, he's definitely a lottery prospect for me and of course much more valuable than a number of other guys I just mentioned (but of course you'll also not get as much value from trading down because you can't trade down too far). That said, I would expect him to be considered a core piece wherever he goes; but I doubt any team drafts him with the expectation, or reasonable hope, that he'll become their future star/franchise player. If the Warriors have a top 3 pick and decide to use it for themselves, I'd definitely expect them to look for such a player with the hope for a smooth transition into the next era.

GSW looking for a future star? So they are done with Curry, Klay and Draymond championship run? I thought they'd try to build around these guys.

I guess it's all about availability. If no star is available, what can GS really do?

zimpy27 wrote:GSW looking for a future star? So they are done with Curry, Klay and Draymond championship run? I thought they'd try to build around these guys.

All we outsiders can do is guess, naturally. But I would expect GSW to either trade the pick for a (still not too old) player who can truly help us or to draft a player they believe has a chance to become the guy once the trio you mentioned above has to take a step back. Just because they would target such a player would not mean they have given up on these guys and their championship window. Why would it? Also, the Warriors have tried to acquire young players already, and I expect the trend to continue. It was also for cap reasons, sure, but it seems like they would like to have a smooth transition in a couple years and not sink once Curry declines.

The-Power wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:GSW looking for a future star? So they are done with Curry, Klay and Draymond championship run? I thought they'd try to build around these guys.

All we outsiders can do is guess, naturally. But I would expect GSW to either trade the pick for a (still not too old) player who can truly help us or to draft a player they believe has a chance to become the guy once the trio you mentioned above has to take a step back. Just because they would target such a player would not mean they have given up on these guys and their championship window. Why would it? Also, the Warriors have tried to acquire young players already, and I expect the trend to continue. It was also for cap reasons, sure, but it seems like they would like to have a smooth transition in a couple years and not sink once Curry declines.

Well none of the players look like franchise stars in this draft, the ones that could would need of development. You have to play these young guys when they aren't impactful so that they can learn and one day be impactful. You'd be doing that the first 2-3 years which would be detrimental to the team unless one already had NBA level defense and offense as a base.

we don't need to hit a home run in this draft, that would be dumb, there are no Zions or ADs in this class, or even KATs or Simmons where you say you have to have this guy and figure out the rest later.

you trade down, grab a guy like Scottie or Green, who are perfect fits for this team and should be able to contribute relatively quickly, pick up an extra asset or two and call it a day.

zimpy27 wrote:Well none of the players look like franchise stars in this draft, the ones that could would need of development. You have to play these young guys when they aren't impactful so that they can learn and one day be impactful. You'd be doing that the first 2-3 years which would be detrimental to the team unless one already had NBA level defense and offense as a base.

I don't subscribe to the idea that you have to play young players in a bigger role than they are prepared for in order for them to become great players. In fact, I'd argue that it's often detrimental to the development of young players. I have yet to see evidence that talented players with initially big roles on crappy teams are more likely to develop into good players than talented players with initially lesser roles on good teams. I'd actually expect that the opposite is the case more often than not, but I know many people seem to disagree with me on this.

Of course you have to play them minutes. But that won't be a problem since the Warriors have to rely on minutes from the young players no matter what. But you don't have to play them starter minutes and you don't have to give them the usage of star players. Play them in a role they can handle and the players you draft at the top of the draft are going to be fine. If you are a truly good team, much less a veritable contender, then playing a talented young player extended minutes in a sensible role is neither going to sink your team nor impede the development of said player. Tatum played 30 MPG on a good Celtics team in 2018, with a usage below 20%, and he is hardly some generational prospect – and if your top pick is less ready and only plays 20 MPG, that's fine too.

All I'm saying is that IF the Warriors to decide to keep their pick, then they're going to be drafting for the future – and they are going to pick whoever they believe can develop into a veritable franchise cornerstone. At least I'd hope they do that. Whether or not there is a superstar in this draft remains to be seen. Sure, there is no ‘sure thing’ in this draft but plenty of players have a chance if things break right – we see that in many drafts. Franchise cornerstones as in players who are going to develop into All-Star-level players are, however, almost assuredly going to be picked at the top of the draft. If the Warriors can find one of those, that's a win.

The-Power wrote:

zimpy27 wrote:Well none of the players look like franchise stars in this draft, the ones that could would need of development. You have to play these young guys when they aren't impactful so that they can learn and one day be impactful. You'd be doing that the first 2-3 years which would be detrimental to the team unless one already had NBA level defense and offense as a base.

I don't subscribe to the idea that you have to play young players in a bigger role than they are prepared for in order for them to become great players. In fact, I'd argue that it's often detrimental to the development of young players. I have yet to see evidence that talented players with initially big roles on crappy teams are more likely to develop into good players than talented players with initially lesser roles on good teams. I'd actually expect that the opposite is the case more often than not, but I know many people seem to disagree with me on this.

This ignores the fact that the vast majority of draft picks end up not being great and any young player who isn't will have the most value to other teams earlier in their career (or likely even before their career starts if you're willing to trade a future unprotected pick that later becomes that particular player). Additionally, most high lottery teams (obviously the Warriors are going to be an extremely rare exception here) should be realistic in knowing that one rookie isn't immediately going to take them from 22 wins or whatever to the playoffs and that the value in learning more about how good that player can potentially become is more important than the difference between winning 25 and 33 games.

A good recent example of this would be the Kings, who were very much "durrr you gotta earn your playing time because we're trying to win" at first with Fox, and then when the next draft rolled around, they still sucked and the BPA was the same position as Fox, so they had to take the next-best guy rather than trade Fox because they'd tanked Fox's value by not playing him in a system that best suited his talents.

This also ignores very real free agency constraints; the Hawks certainly would've won more games last year starting Jeremy Lin rather than Trae Young early on, but it wouldn't have been so many more as to even make the playoffs (much less be anything more than a first-round doormat), and if you look a few years into the future I'm sure them putting their trust in him from the start will give Atlanta (especially if they aren't yet a contender) a much better chance of holding onto him than if they'd been bringing him off the bench. The truly great players are going to be great no matter where they end up, and the players who are involved from the start (Westbrook) have a much better chance of sticking around than the ones who are held back (Harden).

clyde21 wrote:we don't need to hit a home run in this draft, that would be dumb, there are no Zions or ADs in this class, or even KATs or Simmons where you say you have to have this guy and figure out the rest later.

you trade down, grab a guy like Scottie or Green, who are perfect fits for this team and should be able to contribute relatively quickly, pick up an extra asset or two and call it a day.

Anthony Edwards seems like a sure thing to me. I think with more games under his belt Wiseman might also look to be. But neither are at the level of those other players. Pretty weak draft all-around IMO.

So much more aggressive, including shooting pull-ups and getting some buckets in the midrange. Please, please let him continue to be this aggressive and show some consistency in those areas (preferably with an increase in FTs, but I'll settle for less, too). He's worth a top 5 pick to me if he can do that.

E.J. Liddell is very intriguing.

Skill+physical package has the look of a versatile 2-way modern PF. Smart too.

Height and wingspan are lacking but think his strength, fluidity, and quickness off the floor helps up for his lack of traditional measurements for the position.

Robinson-Earl is a solid safe 1st round pick imo