Jalen Green - next elite prospect

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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#221 » by Duke4life831 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:50 pm

K_chile22 wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
Zombiesonics wrote:He is the size of booker beal and lavine. it takes all of 5 minutes from watching him play to tell he isn't the size of kobe or vince. his size is already priced in my opinion of him, he can still be an electric offensive centerpiece like the first guys I mentioned. Two way upside is not there though.


According to this

https://www.thehoopsgeek.com/average-nba-height/

The average height for a 2 guard was 6'4. Just look at someone like Donte DiVincenzo, he is a damn good defender at the 2 spot and he is 6'4 with a 6'6 wingspan. No way Green is any smaller than he is.

Dont get me wrong Im not saying Green is going to be some super stud defensive player, but I dont think size will hold him back defensively.

Yeah, people are talking like he has a negative wingspan or something. Probably about 6'8 there, average to above average height for a two guard. Totally adequate. Size isn't what's keeping LaVine (between the ears/effort) and Booker (a bit of effort though that was much better this year, mostly lack of athleticism) from being good on D. Also beal is absolutely smaller than all three of these guys so idk why hes being lumped in here


Ya Jrue Holiday is 6'4 (that is with shoes) and a 6'7 wingspan, that guy successfully defends 4s in today's NBA. Now yes Jrue is much stronger than Green will ever be. But I dont think Green needs to be able to defend 4s at a high level to be a good defender. Green will be average or slightly above average when it comes to size for the 2 guard in the NBA, to go with his freakish explosiveness and agility.

His defense wont be held back by physical traits.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#222 » by Zombiesonics » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:56 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:
According to this

https://www.thehoopsgeek.com/average-nba-height/

The average height for a 2 guard was 6'4. Just look at someone like Donte DiVincenzo, he is a damn good defender at the 2 spot and he is 6'4 with a 6'6 wingspan. No way Green is any smaller than he is.

Dont get me wrong Im not saying Green is going to be some super stud defensive player, but I dont think size will hold him back defensively.


Yeah there are a lot of great defenders his size thats true, even historically. But just from all i've seen from him he doesn't really fit that 'bulldog' prototype like a divincenzo or marcus smart. Maybe i'm wrong and he can do matisse thybulle things @ the next level, but i see him more as a beal or booker level defender. Is he absolutely killing you being a mouse in the house every time down the floor or getting absorbed by every screen? no i dont think so but its hard to see him being elite there.

he's still an incandescent scorer with otherworldly athleticism. thats where his bread is buttered really so any team should be happy with him in the top 3. I dont see the ceiling of mj/kobe or a perennial mvp candidate though.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#223 » by Duke4life831 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:59 pm

Zombiesonics wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
According to this

https://www.thehoopsgeek.com/average-nba-height/

The average height for a 2 guard was 6'4. Just look at someone like Donte DiVincenzo, he is a damn good defender at the 2 spot and he is 6'4 with a 6'6 wingspan. No way Green is any smaller than he is.

Dont get me wrong Im not saying Green is going to be some super stud defensive player, but I dont think size will hold him back defensively.


Yeah there are a lot of great defenders his size thats true, even historically. But just from all i've seen from him he doesn't really fit that 'bulldog' prototype like a divincenzo or marcus smart. Maybe i'm wrong and he can do matisse thybulle things @ the next level, but i see him more as a beal or booker level defender. Is he absolutely killing you being a mouse in the house every time down the floor or getting absorbed by every screen? no i dont think so but its hard to see him being elite there.

he's still an incandescent scorer with otherworldly athleticism. thats where his bread is buttered really so any team should be happy with him in the top 3. I dont see the ceiling of mj/kobe or a perennial mvp candidate though.


Again to be crystal clear, Im not saying all this because I think Green is going to be some stud defender. If you tell me he becomes a defender along the lines of LaVine, wouldnt shock me. Because I have the same concerns, I dont really see natural defensive instincts you see from elite guys like a Jrue or Smart, and ya I dont see the high energy on that end either. I think no doubt if he wants to, he can become a good defender.

I was just saying physical traits wont hold him back from being a good defender is all.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#224 » by yoyoboy » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:06 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:
Zombiesonics wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
According to this

https://www.thehoopsgeek.com/average-nba-height/

The average height for a 2 guard was 6'4. Just look at someone like Donte DiVincenzo, he is a damn good defender at the 2 spot and he is 6'4 with a 6'6 wingspan. No way Green is any smaller than he is.

Dont get me wrong Im not saying Green is going to be some super stud defensive player, but I dont think size will hold him back defensively.


Yeah there are a lot of great defenders his size thats true, even historically. But just from all i've seen from him he doesn't really fit that 'bulldog' prototype like a divincenzo or marcus smart. Maybe i'm wrong and he can do matisse thybulle things @ the next level, but i see him more as a beal or booker level defender. Is he absolutely killing you being a mouse in the house every time down the floor or getting absorbed by every screen? no i dont think so but its hard to see him being elite there.

he's still an incandescent scorer with otherworldly athleticism. thats where his bread is buttered really so any team should be happy with him in the top 3. I dont see the ceiling of mj/kobe or a perennial mvp candidate though.


Again to be crystal clear, Im not saying all this because I think Green is going to be some stud defender. If you tell me he becomes a defender along the lines of LaVine, wouldnt shock me. Because I have the same concerns, I dont really see natural defensive instincts you see from elite guys like a Jrue or Smart, and ya I dont see the high energy on that end either. I think no doubt if he wants to, he can become a good defender.

I was just saying physical traits wont hold him back from being a good defender is all.

Length wise, he’s probably fine, but his frame might end up holding him back. Even if he gets put on a bulking routine, right now he’s at about a 25 pound disadvantage compared to the average SG, so it begs the question how much stronger he can realistically get without hurting his game.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#225 » by Duke4life831 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:23 pm

yoyoboy wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
Zombiesonics wrote:
Yeah there are a lot of great defenders his size thats true, even historically. But just from all i've seen from him he doesn't really fit that 'bulldog' prototype like a divincenzo or marcus smart. Maybe i'm wrong and he can do matisse thybulle things @ the next level, but i see him more as a beal or booker level defender. Is he absolutely killing you being a mouse in the house every time down the floor or getting absorbed by every screen? no i dont think so but its hard to see him being elite there.

he's still an incandescent scorer with otherworldly athleticism. thats where his bread is buttered really so any team should be happy with him in the top 3. I dont see the ceiling of mj/kobe or a perennial mvp candidate though.


Again to be crystal clear, Im not saying all this because I think Green is going to be some stud defender. If you tell me he becomes a defender along the lines of LaVine, wouldnt shock me. Because I have the same concerns, I dont really see natural defensive instincts you see from elite guys like a Jrue or Smart, and ya I dont see the high energy on that end either. I think no doubt if he wants to, he can become a good defender.

I was just saying physical traits wont hold him back from being a good defender is all.

Length wise, he’s probably fine, but his frame might end up holding him back. Even if he gets put on a bulking routine, right now he’s at about a 25 pound disadvantage compared to the average SG, so it begs the question how much stronger he can realistically get without hurting his game.


Sure but how many guards in today's game have a bruising style of play? Will the lack of strength lower his versatility on that end? Ya. But again he's going to be asked to guard the opposing team's guards, I dont think it will be that much of an issue.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#226 » by Big J » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:25 pm

Green's got some long legs on him. He takes some huge strides for a guy his size. He's kind of got a Durant type body in a smaller frame where his length is more functional than guys who have a long ass neck.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#227 » by yoyoboy » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:58 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:
yoyoboy wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
Again to be crystal clear, Im not saying all this because I think Green is going to be some stud defender. If you tell me he becomes a defender along the lines of LaVine, wouldnt shock me. Because I have the same concerns, I dont really see natural defensive instincts you see from elite guys like a Jrue or Smart, and ya I dont see the high energy on that end either. I think no doubt if he wants to, he can become a good defender.

I was just saying physical traits wont hold him back from being a good defender is all.

Length wise, he’s probably fine, but his frame might end up holding him back. Even if he gets put on a bulking routine, right now he’s at about a 25 pound disadvantage compared to the average SG, so it begs the question how much stronger he can realistically get without hurting his game.


Sure but how many guards in today's game have a bruising style of play? Will the lack of strength lower his versatility on that end? Ya. But again he's going to be asked to guard the opposing team's guards, I dont think it will be that much of an issue.

It doesn’t necessarily have to be defending a bruising style of play though. Just being able to navigate screens without getting stuck on them, not bounce off guys on drives, and box out effectively are all important. NBA players use their bodies so much when they drive, and right now Green is going to provide zero resistance.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#228 » by Duke4life831 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:13 pm

yoyoboy wrote:
Duke4life831 wrote:
yoyoboy wrote:Length wise, he’s probably fine, but his frame might end up holding him back. Even if he gets put on a bulking routine, right now he’s at about a 25 pound disadvantage compared to the average SG, so it begs the question how much stronger he can realistically get without hurting his game.


Sure but how many guards in today's game have a bruising style of play? Will the lack of strength lower his versatility on that end? Ya. But again he's going to be asked to guard the opposing team's guards, I dont think it will be that much of an issue.

It doesn’t necessarily have to be defending a bruising style of play though. Just being able to navigate screens without getting stuck on them, not bounce off guys on drives, and box out effectively are all important. NBA players use their bodies so much when they drive, and right now Green is going to provide zero resistance.


I dont know, when healthy Dejounte Murray is a hell of a defender at the guard spot and he and Green have pretty similar body types. Im pretty sure Murray even has made an All Defense team or two. Again Im not saying he is going to be a stud defender or anything, I just dont think his physical traits will hold him back on that end. Hell Wiggins defends 3s and 4s and he's skinny as hell and he was damn good on the defensive end this year. Mikal Bridges is skinny as hell and he holds his own against 3s and 4s. I just dont see it being that much of an issue to be asked to defend 1s and 2s.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#229 » by clyde21 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:14 pm

Green core strength stays underrated, he's wiry strong, always been, just look @ some of his finishes in traffic when a bigger body tries to shield him off the rim...whether he'll be able to fight off screens once he's physically more developed will have nothing to do with lack of strength only if he's willing to do it
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#230 » by DNice68 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:34 pm

I as a a Piston fan would not be mad if we took Green. I’m good with Cunningham, but he does lack the burst, and first step to play guard. I like his wingspan, but he lacks the lateral quickness to defend 1s and 2s. I see him as more of a 3!
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#231 » by CptCrunch » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:38 pm

Big J wrote:Green's got some long legs on him. He takes some huge strides for a guy his size. He's kind of got a Durant type body in a smaller frame where his length is more functional than guys who have a long ass neck.


I don't care about strides. He is 6'4" w/o shoes. That is a major flaw of his.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#232 » by K_chile22 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:41 pm

People care too much about the actual measurements and not how functional they are. This board overrating Joe Wieskamp is another example. That 6'11 Wingspan never shows up on film. He just looks like a 6'5 guy out there with how he plays, so why does it matter that it's actually 6'11 if he doesn't use it?
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#233 » by DCasey91 » Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:01 pm

Besides his wingspan as other have mentioned I don’t worry about his size or body type. He finishes with zero hassles against grown men. Top ten efficiency wise yes small sample size but it’ll be the same in NBA imo.

He’s further along then Lavine/Booker/Beal age for age and his athletic traits is far superior to me.

Lavine is taller (he kept growing same with Tatum and JJJ who I liken to a brontosaurus lol didn’t stop growing) they all got noticeably taller. Long legs that’s why.

Jalen Green has long legs and a beautiful running gait (long strides)
Earlier mention of Randy Moss. I’d say slightly lighter on the frame but A+++ speed and A++++ speed on direction and going from 0-100 quicker then almost anyone like the greats. He keeps his glitch speed and then some.

Going straight, diagonal, backwards, sideways it don’t matter to Jalen.

Sports isn’t played in a straight line. He has that ATG athletic trait in him.

Fantastic touch and skill contortion wise once he’s in the air.

Those types make wonderful sportsmen in basically any sport. Their balance and core like a spinning top always keep them afloat. Just that they are spinning way quicker then everyone else.

Imagine a buoy in an ocean except it moves around like a Ferrari.

He’s going to be handful no doubt about it.

It’s Morant inside Beal with less prodigious passing and a better shot form. That’s my comparison I guess lol

And everyone knows how easy Morant moves around when it’s anything but that.

When he had one of the dunks of the year in his rookie season Jalen has that exact explosion. One second it looks like they are just dribbling half pace into the lane then BOOM TAKEOFF!! you just got posterized my man :)
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#234 » by KIRAG » Wed Jul 28, 2021 9:33 am

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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#235 » by Big J » Wed Jul 28, 2021 12:03 pm

If he’s Filipino the speed makes a ton of sense. Look at Pacquiao’s quick twitch movements. He’s basically like a cat. No wonder Green is a top 1% level athlete.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#236 » by Yuri Vaultin » Wed Jul 28, 2021 3:53 pm

Big J wrote:If he’s Filipino the speed makes a ton of sense.

Do all Filipinos have a quickness gene I'm unfamilar with?
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#237 » by KIRAG » Wed Jul 28, 2021 4:02 pm

Big J wrote:If he’s Filipino the speed makes a ton of sense. Look at Pacquiao’s quick twitch movements. He’s basically like a cat. No wonder Green is a top 1% level athlete.


speaking of,

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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#238 » by KIRAG » Wed Jul 28, 2021 4:06 pm

Yuri Vaultin wrote:
Big J wrote:If he’s Filipino the speed makes a ton of sense.

Do all Filipinos have a quickness gene I'm unfamilar with?


Not sure but probably to make up for lack of height. Most Filipino boxers are
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#239 » by Big J » Wed Jul 28, 2021 4:20 pm

Yuri Vaultin wrote:
Big J wrote:If he’s Filipino the speed makes a ton of sense.

Do all Filipinos have a quickness gene I'm unfamilar with?


Yes.
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Re: Jalen Green - next elite prospect 

Post#240 » by ThatBoyNick » Wed Jul 28, 2021 4:32 pm

Him getting hype from the Filipino community when his great grandfather was only partially Filipino is pretty funny.

He’s like 6% Filipino lol

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