Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman

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Who will be the better pro?

Poll runs till Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:15 pm

Onyeka Okongwu
26
47%
James Wiseman
29
53%
 
Total votes: 55

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Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#1 » by OGLife » Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:15 pm

Onyeka Okongwu has risen to the top 5 in a lot of people's mocks and it now has become a debate as to which big will go off the board first.

So who do you believe will have the better career between the two?
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#2 » by Stillwater » Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:57 pm

Clear to me Big O has the much higher IQ given his ability to defend at a high level at 6'8" barefoot .He has the ambidextrous touch you want offensively with a decent amount of mobility with or without the ball along with a jumper despite the jumper never being seen at the college level and it needs work. Wiseman could prove to be better long term given the measureables but he lacks the bbiq to read plays before they happen and will strugle to defend until he is developed. He also thinks he is better than he actually is offensively based on some film from HS with him shooting an ugly J from deep early in the shot clock and missing the broad side of the ocean.
I would take Okongwu as a decent offensive upside high floor 3 or 4 position defender over Wiseman who projects as a high level rim runner early on that can impact the game with his length but will really have to improve as a shooter and raise his iq to be on O's level or better defensively. I also think WIseman lacks the same level of mobility to guard the perimiter although I still think he could to some degree.He isn't slow just not the same level of athlete.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#3 » by karkinos » Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:21 pm

onyeka

he's probably the most sure thing in the lottery
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#4 » by clyde21 » Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:23 pm

Onyeka, more scalable, better ball skills and BBIQ, better mobility
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#5 » by Upperclass » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:14 am

Emeka Okafor vs Whiteside imo .. pleading with Wiseman to show up and care will get old for players and teams
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#6 » by RiotPunch » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:50 am

Onyeka. Superior feel on both ends of the floor. Speedy reaction and load times paired with great footwork and mobility negate some of the size disadvantages. I buy him more as a face-up threat, just way more fluid. Agree on his scalability in relation to Wiseman, and I see him as a modern big that will play meaningful minutes in a playoff environment.

Wiseman I can understand taking pretty high, but right now you are getting a low-feel-rim-runner-rebounder with exceptional size and straight-line speed. I worry about him being a meaningful piece on a contending team, he is so clunky in the HC. I see him as an empty calorie stats big man, maybe even an eventual all-star, who gets played off the floor in the postseason.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#7 » by The-Power » Tue Jun 16, 2020 11:26 am

Upperclass wrote:Emeka Okafor vs Whiteside imo .. pleading with Wiseman to show up and care will get old for players and teams

Aha, and this is based on what exactly? I totally understand questions about Wiseman's feel for the game. But Wiseman has never been lazy or a headcase. Not in HS, not in college – and certainly not to the extent that we have to worry about teams desperately pleading that he shows up and cares. So I'm really curious how you justify and substantiate this claim of yours.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#8 » by Fischella » Tue Jun 16, 2020 11:29 am

Wiseman def is lazy at times on the court, his motor is so-so
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#9 » by King Ken » Tue Jun 16, 2020 1:48 pm

I signs point to Wiseman but I am more sure Big O will be a 8 over Wiseman becoming a 9. Tough question. Bigs take time to develop as well.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#10 » by Ruzious » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:10 pm

Upperclass wrote:Emeka Okafor vs Whiteside imo .. pleading with Wiseman to show up and care will get old for players and teams

I didn't see anything but a good attitude in Wiseman. He doesn't seem like Whiteside in that regard. I'd still take Okongwu over him.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#11 » by EMG518 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:40 pm

Unpopular opinion, I really like Okongwu, I think he will be very good and I would take both Wiseman and Achiuwa over him. I don't think you can pass on Wiseman, he has game changing potential on both ends of the floor.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#12 » by DayofMourning » Tue Jun 16, 2020 2:44 pm

Would take Wiseman. Onyeka is quality, no doubt. Would count on good player development to get the most out of Wiseman. At worst you're getting rebounds and rim protection.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#13 » by getrichordie » Tue Jun 16, 2020 3:55 pm

DayofMourning wrote:Would take Wiseman. Onyeka is quality, no doubt. Would count on good player development to get the most out of Wiseman. At worst you're getting rebounds and rim protection.


I'd add a lob threat and a rim-runner as well.

People are overthinking this. You take Wiseman 100/100 before Okongwu. Really not sure where the whole Okongwu being a face-up threat comes from. Some people desperately want him to be Adebayo.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#14 » by getrichordie » Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:04 pm

Ruzious wrote:
Upperclass wrote:Emeka Okafor vs Whiteside imo .. pleading with Wiseman to show up and care will get old for players and teams

I didn't see anything but a good attitude in Wiseman. He doesn't seem like Whiteside in that regard. I'd still take Okongwu over him.


I really want this guy to respond as to how he came up with this viewpoint on Wiseman. Seems like he won't be able to come up with a good answer.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#15 » by Stillwater » Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:47 pm

getrichordie wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:Would take Wiseman. Onyeka is quality, no doubt. Would count on good player development to get the most out of Wiseman. At worst you're getting rebounds and rim protection.


I'd add a lob threat and a rim-runner as well.

People are overthinking this. You take Wiseman 100/100 before Okongwu. Really not sure where the whole Okongwu being a face-up threat comes from. Some people desperately want him to be Adebayo.

Some might be overthinking but the way I see it it's simple math: Okongwu is the better player on both sides of the ball right now so it comes down to Wisemans work ethic and if there is any questions about it where he may never become the same level prospect as O already is then you are taking Big O. I mean it's not that tough of a decision to me as hard as it is to find a high IQ 6'9 modern mobile 4/5 that can defend multiple positions already vs a long term albeit higher upside project
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#16 » by clyde21 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:56 pm

no one is overthinking anything, it's simple actually, you take the multi-level big every time, i'm way more confident in Onyeka's mobility and switchability, on offense he also has better ball skills, and is just a more functional bball player at this point both physically and mentally
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#17 » by getrichordie » Tue Jun 16, 2020 6:00 pm

clyde21 wrote:no one is overthinking anything, it's simple actually, you take the multi-level big every time, i'm way more confident in Onyeka's mobility and switchability, on offense he also has better ball skills, and is just a more functional bball player at this point both physically and mentally


This is such an easy statement to make because Wiseman only played 3 games. In his first game, he put 28 points and 11 boards in 22 minutes. It took Okongwu 11 games to reach 28/10 and he did it in 30 minutes and he only put up 28 points or more twice.

The word functional gets thrown around a lot as if it has a lot of meaning. The only word you have to know when discussing these two is impact. Wiseman has already shown more ability to impact a game than Okongwu in his first game. That shouldn't get discounted just because of an eligibility issue.

Only 3 games, but Wiseman had a block rate of 14.2% which was tops for this year's relevant prospects in games played in November.

His defensive rebounding rate was 27.3% only bested by Oturu, Carey Jr., Bey, and Knight.

His offensive rebounding rate was a sky-high 21.8% which is best in class.

He made 17-19 shots at the rim and shot 27 free throws through 3 games. That's a ridiculous free throw rate.

His ORtg was 144. His DRtg was 79.

And he did all of this while still being somewhat relatively raw. Yes, there's absolutely aspects of his game he needs to clean up but he has shown the same mobility (no less) and perimeter defensive potential as Okongwu.

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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#18 » by clyde21 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 6:37 pm

i refuse to debate stats over a 3 game sample size, especially early in the season against **** teams
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#19 » by getrichordie » Tue Jun 16, 2020 6:40 pm

clyde21 wrote:i refuse to debate stats over a 3 game sample size, especially early in the season against **** teams


Okongwu played against **** teams too and didn't do what Wiseman did. Wiseman's debut was statistically historic. Only player who came close to doing what he did in last 12 years was Carey Jr. this year.

And I never said a 3 game sample size was the end all-be all but you have to take his performance in those games into consideration.
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Re: Onyeka Okongwu or James Wiseman 

Post#20 » by clyde21 » Tue Jun 16, 2020 6:46 pm

no you don't have to do anything, you look at his game, projectable traits, archetype, role, functionality

i don't give two **** what his block rate against the UIC Flames was lol

he's not as portable or scalable as Onyeka, doesn't have the 3 level mobility nor the ball skills on offense, that's why Onyeka is a better prospect.
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