consensus big board -- who is #28?

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who is #28?

Poll ended at Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:33 pm

isaiah joe
2
4%
isaiah stewart
6
12%
jahmi'us ramsey
15
29%
jay scrubb
3
6%
malachi flynn
2
4%
mason jones
2
4%
robert woodard II
3
6%
tre jones
5
10%
xavier tillman sr.
6
12%
*OTHER (write-in)
8
15%
 
Total votes: 52

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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#21 » by Stillwater » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:07 pm

RiotPunch wrote:
getrichordie wrote:
RiotPunch wrote:He is limited as a POA guy, but he is one of the best and smartest team defenders in this class. You're drafting him for his shooting/PnR passing though.

Isaiah Joe is absolutely an elite shooter. Recency bias.


Nailed it with Bane, though I just don't believe in his translation as much as some others. I have him mid-to-late 2nd.

My big concern with Joe is if he can add weight. He's listed at 180, but I've read he's 165. If he can get to 190-195, I really like him. Can definitely see him or Flynn going to play with LeBron.

Yep. Adding weight is literally the only knock on Joe for me. He supposedly has been adding weight during quarantine, and had put some on between freshman and sophomore years as well. Needs the right strength dev team.

one of the worst if not the worst off screen shooter that had that level of chucker usage in college basketball.
He regressed from his first year where he did look legit. What happened? he really didn't improve at anything and regressed in some areas suggesting he maybe just maybe is'nt the prospect you hope him to be.
I get the optimism, but the data this season suggests you should be pessimistic.
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#22 » by getrichordie » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:49 pm

Stillwater wrote:
RiotPunch wrote:
getrichordie wrote:
Nailed it with Bane, though I just don't believe in his translation as much as some others. I have him mid-to-late 2nd.

My big concern with Joe is if he can add weight. He's listed at 180, but I've read he's 165. If he can get to 190-195, I really like him. Can definitely see him or Flynn going to play with LeBron.

Yep. Adding weight is literally the only knock on Joe for me. He supposedly has been adding weight during quarantine, and had put some on between freshman and sophomore years as well. Needs the right strength dev team.

one of the worst if not the worst off screen shooter that had that level of chucker usage in college basketball.
He regressed from his first year where he did look legit. What happened? he really didn't improve at anything and regressed in some areas suggesting he maybe just maybe is'nt the prospect you hope him to be.
I get the optimism, but the data this season suggests you should be pessimistic.


At the very least, you could some research to answer your own question:

https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/arkansas-football/eric-musselman-announces-injury-surgery-for-arkansas-star-isaiah-joe/

Also, he received a bump in USG% this year.
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#23 » by Stillwater » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:51 pm

^ Lets say I am wrong and he is a legit off the dribble shot maker at the next level , doesn't fix the fact he can't play off ball ;not the way he cuts , he cannot drive and finish against any strength and can't pass good enough to run a offense...so he is a iso perimiter threat who wont get any better looks than he did in college.
What does he do for your rotation ? he cannot be inserted in any lineup besides one so poor it uses him as the first or 2nd option high usage iso only scorer .
He is Marshon Brooks at best even if he gains 25lbs over the next 3 yrs.
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where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#24 » by RiotPunch » Tue Jun 23, 2020 10:20 pm

Comparing Isaiah Joe to MarShon Brooks indicates to me that maybe that person has not watched many Arkansas games.

He is highly active and manipulative using off-ball screens and has a relatively small sample of off-screen shooting. I buy it. He sets his feet fast and has a quick trigger with beautiful form. He is a highly capable C&S threat, he is also a very underrated connecting player. Chuckers (Brooks) are selfish players, Joe is not--he routinely makes the extra pass. He is a very willing and effective screener, showing some real grit and toughness despite his slight frame. His % dip was due to a combination of shot difficulty, increased usage, and coming off an injury.

I can totally understand being turned off by his off-screen shooting numbers. Usually, that sort of thing is backed up by visual evidence of some sort of flaw, but in Joe's case everything looks good to me. Kind of a hop shooter, maybe it's a rhythm thing. Took Middleton awhile to figure that out. Again though, I think the main factor will be core strength--being able to go stop on a dime and get squared off a screen. I reckon he is around 185 right now, needs at least 20 more to withstand tangling with NBA wings.

He also plays defense. He is a clever off-ball thief and rotates well. Guys can ram through his chest though, so the strength must improve. He gained 13lbs from freshman to sophomore years, and he looks bigger to me in the recent practice vid I saw. As Jackson Frank says, "core strength is Joe's skeleton key" to success.
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#25 » by Stillwater » Tue Jun 23, 2020 10:39 pm

RiotPunch wrote:Comparing Isaiah Joe to MarShon Brooks indicates to me that maybe that person has not watched many Arkansas games.

He is highly active and manipulative using off-ball screens and has a relatively small sample of off-screen shooting. I buy it. He sets his feet fast and has a quick trigger with beautiful form. He is a highly capable C&S threat, but he is also a very underrated connecting player. Chuckers (Brooks) are selfish players, Joe is not--he routinely makes the extra pass. He is a very willing and effective screener, showing some real grit and toughness despite his slight frame. His % dip was due to a combination of shot difficulty, increased usage, and coming off an injury.

He also plays defense. He is a clever off-ball thief and rotates well. Guys can ram through his chest though, so the strength must improve. He gained 13lbs from freshman to sophomore years, and he looks bigger to me in the recent practice vid I saw. As Jackson Frank says, "core strength is Joe's skeleton key" to success.


Mason Jones is a lot better NBA ready prospect and he is extremely underrated because he is not a + athlete.
Joe is a scrawny kid who now has injury issues added to his resume.
He could be an ok catch and shoot option, but that is not his game. It's obvious he has separation ability
and that is appealing , but he lacks the ability at this point in time to attack the basket with much success and since he failed to shoot a decent % with defenses not afraid of the first step or ability to pass out of the drive it says to me he will not be looked at favorably compared to guards who can get to the rack with power pass out of dt's and force defenses to be honest.
The comparison to brooks was misunderstood...he's Brooks at best in the future and isnt close to it yet...meaning an iso dominant shooter who doesn't do anything else at a NBA level and won't be given that much freedom to shoot like he had in college so he is unlikely to be more than a g-league chucker without significant improvement as a passer and finisher. improving that shot % is paramount to being a useable asset, as it stands he choked hard this season and should go back to school
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where the painted dream of the wayward soul is false reality bliss-
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#26 » by RiotPunch » Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:00 pm

I think you are seriously underrating his passing and defensive abilities. He was used solely as a floor spacer for Arkansas, but he has shown flashes of great passing. He has also shown physicality as a screener and defender, despite his slenderness, which I view as an indicator that he will be a better finisher with added weight. He's not allergic to contact like some skinnier dudes, he welcomes it, he just can't withstand that style at his current weight.

You get him over 200 lbs and that alleviates most of the issues, IMO. With added strength he is far more than just an iso scorer as you claim.

Agree Jones is more NBA-ready, while Joe is a developmental pick. However, Joe with the right staff has a ceiling far higher than Jones or MarShon stinking Brooks. :D Just my humble opinion though.

Also agree he probably goes back for his junior year. He says his body is responding well to Arkansas weight program and he'll have the reins next season.
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#27 » by getrichordie » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:08 am

I think it is safe to say that Ramsey is running away with this one. Shall we move on?
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Re: consensus big board -- who is #28? 

Post#28 » by babyjax13 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:00 am

getrichordie wrote:I think it is safe to say that Ramsey is running away with this one. Shall we move on?


I think so!
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