Cade Cunningham

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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#81 » by mattao313 » Sun Dec 6, 2020 6:30 pm

I see more off guard than lead guard imo, also he looks closer to 6'5 than 6'8 maybe its the camera angle tho.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#82 » by Marcus » Sun Dec 6, 2020 6:33 pm

clyde21 wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:I'm definitely feeling better about him. He just makes things look so smooth and under control. Could see him being a great floor general especially with how vocal he is.

Wonder how a Cade and Hayes backcourt would look after we see how Kayes does this year off the ball but that's two great playmakers in the back court who find ways to create offense


love how u just combined both names here :lol:


Lol didn't even peep that at first
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#83 » by Marcus » Sun Dec 6, 2020 6:36 pm

KembaWalker wrote:
clyde21 wrote:lol @ comparing Deni to Cade


You'll figure it out eventually, people are in the blind honeymoon phase on this dude still and it's really funny. Not even a single post in here about his flaring elbow and inconsistent shot mechanics


Actually Clyde and I are the last to come around we've been critical of Cade and still are in those same regards but we're not going to just ignore all the positives either.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#84 » by MotownMadness » Sun Dec 6, 2020 6:44 pm

clyde21 wrote:
MotownMadness wrote:I'm definitely feeling better about him. He just makes things look so smooth and under control. Could see him being a great floor general especially with how vocal he is.

Wonder how a Cade and Hayes backcourt would look after we see how Kayes does this year off the ball but that's two great playmakers in the back court who find ways to create offense


love how u just combined both names here :lol:

Lol, good call
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#85 » by clyde21 » Sun Dec 6, 2020 6:46 pm

KembaWalker wrote:
clyde21 wrote:lol @ comparing Deni to Cade


You'll figure it out eventually, people are in the blind honeymoon phase on this dude still and it's really funny. Not even a single post in here about his flaring elbow and inconsistent shot mechanics


honeymoon stage? Cade is not even my guy I just know a dumb comparison when I see one.

just because Deni can grab a board and make a pass in transition doesn't make him a facilitator of offense like Cade and other true points are.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#86 » by The-Power » Sun Dec 6, 2020 7:07 pm

clyde21 wrote:just because Deni can grab a board and make a pass in transition doesn't make him a facilitator of offense like Cade and other true points are.

Also notice how that user's list could have applied to Doncic as well. I guess all Forward-sized players with some passing skills, non-elite shooting and non-elite athleticism (or rather explosiveness) are the same. Never mind differences in ball-handling, shot-making ability, court vision and anticipation, creativity, passing skills, athletic attributes and the list goes on.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#87 » by Marcus » Mon Dec 7, 2020 3:17 am

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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#88 » by Roger Murdock » Mon Dec 7, 2020 4:32 am

Marcus wrote:https://youtu.be/3X8jsA2sKt4

Pick it apart


Its pretty clear to me that his best skill, and I know this sounds stupid, is that he's realllllllly good at basketball. He consistently makes good reads, smart passes, good form on his shot, positions well on defense, plays within the flow of the game, doesn't force anything, and has a ton of moves. His athleticism doesnt blow me away at all, I'm not sure if its below average of he just plays a methodical game. But still I dont think it matters a ton cause he's got size and skill.

Also jeeeez that OK-St team is terrible. His teammates don't matchup at all.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#89 » by WargamesX » Mon Dec 7, 2020 4:46 am

Roger Murdock wrote:
Marcus wrote:https://youtu.be/3X8jsA2sKt4

Pick it apart


Its pretty clear to me that his best skill, and I know this sounds stupid, is that he's realllllllly good at basketball. He consistently makes good reads, smart passes, good form on his shot, positions well on defense, plays within the flow of the game, doesn't force anything, and has a ton of moves. His athleticism doesnt blow me away at all, I'm not sure if its below average of he just plays a methodical game. But still I dont think it matters a ton cause he's got size and skill.

Also jeeeez that OK-St team is terrible. His teammates don't matchup at all.


Out of the teams he was rumored to have been considering, I wish he went to Kansas. He and Jalen Wilson and the rest of that squad could have had a great season. I would have liked to see him play point forward next to a better traditional PG
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#90 » by Marcus » Mon Dec 7, 2020 4:53 am

Roger Murdock wrote:
Marcus wrote:https://youtu.be/3X8jsA2sKt4

Pick it apart


Its pretty clear to me that his best skill, and I know this sounds stupid, is that he's realllllllly good at basketball. He consistently makes good reads, smart passes, good form on his shot, positions well on defense, plays within the flow of the game, doesn't force anything, and has a ton of moves. His athleticism doesnt blow me away at all, I'm not sure if its below average of he just plays a methodical game. But still I dont think it matters a ton cause he's got size and skill.

Also jeeeez that OK-St team is terrible. His teammates don't matchup at all.


Doesn't sound stupid at all. It truly is that simple and it shines through when watching him play the game. The lack of athleticism isn't a farce but back again to the original point he's just good at the game itself so he's plays with and within all the nuances that comes with the balance of the game. The handle isn't wasted, he switches his mode of attack quickly, always reading the floor, uses the defenders balance against them, and because his pace is what it is he catches you sleeping when he does decide to go into the in between game.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#91 » by Slim Charlez » Mon Dec 7, 2020 7:24 am

KembaWalker wrote:We just had a 6'8" guy with all around game, point forward potential and mid tier athleticism in this past draft. His name is Deni Avidja, he played in a way tougher league than NCAA games against Oakland and he still slid to 9th


Isn't the Israeli league pretty terrible with his team pretty much dominating every year? He played way more there than in the euroleague where going by last seasons stats he was mediocre.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#92 » by Pistol King » Mon Dec 7, 2020 4:21 pm

Slim Charlez wrote:
Isn't the Israeli league pretty terrible with his team pretty much dominating every year? He played way more there than in the euroleague where going by last seasons stats he was mediocre.


I've never understand the claim of "his team is dominant so it's probably easier for him". If anything the exact opposite is the truth. Especially for a teenager. What situation will be easier for a young player to fulfill his stat sheet and highlights reel, playing in a weak team where he can be the focal point, can grow through mistakes and play consistent minutes, when his team is ok with losing games, or playing in a much stronger team (Maccabi Tel Aviv was a top 5 Euroleague team last year), against grown experienced men, where the coach can bench him for every little mistake and he doesn't have the freedom to do risky stuff as all of those NCAA prospects playing in weak teams does? it took time for Deni to progress, but in the second half of this season he was already one of the best players in such good team. And after the COVID he was already their second best player. Even Maccabi's best player Scottie Wilbekin confirmed it on a podcast from 1 month ago.

I said and and will say it again, I'd like to see how Edwards, Lamelo, Hayes, Obi, Pat Will or even Cade perform in such situation.

As about the Deni-Cade comparison, there are many similarities potentially actually but also 1 big difference in their game. Similarities: both big creators with an average athleticism. Both very good passers, both leaders and competitive, both have high BBIQ and feel for the game, the 1 difference I see is: Cade has a better body control and it's clear has grown in American playstyle environment when they encouraged him to play flashy and creative, where Deni has grown in a system where they kinda turn him to play more a robotic systematic playstyle and suppressed his creative side (due to a winning now pressure). I believe in the NBA we're going to see a lot more creativity and flashy stuff from Deni to the point people will think to themselves, man, hes a better player than I thought. It will happen once he shacks off his European style habits and start to show his American playstyle side. This adjustment might take some time, how much long depends on the Wiz staff.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#93 » by Slim Charlez » Mon Dec 7, 2020 5:45 pm

Pistol King wrote:
Slim Charlez wrote:
Isn't the Israeli league pretty terrible with his team pretty much dominating every year? He played way more there than in the euroleague where going by last seasons stats he was mediocre.


I've never understand the claim of "his team is dominant so it's probably easier for him". If anything the exact opposite is the truth. Especially for a teenager. What situation will be easier for a young player to fulfill his stat sheet and highlights reel, playing in a weak team where he can be the focal point, can grow through mistakes and play consistent minutes, when his team is ok with losing games, or playing in a much stronger team (Maccabi Tel Aviv was a top 5 Euroleague team last year), against grown experienced men, where the coach can bench him for every little mistake and he doesn't have the freedom to do risky stuff as all of those NCAA prospects playing in weak teams does? it took time for Deni to progress, but in the second half of this season he was already one of the best players in such good team. And after the COVID he was already their second best player. Even Maccabi's best player Scottie Wilbekin confirmed it on a podcast from 1 month ago.

I said and and will say it again, I'd like to see how Edwards, Lamelo, Hayes, Obi, Pat Will or even Cade perform in such situation.

As about the Deni-Cade comparison, there are many similarities potentially actually but also 1 big difference in their game. Similarities: both big creators with an average athleticism. Both very good passers, both leaders and competitive, both have high BBIQ and feel for the game, the 1 difference I see is: Cade has a better body control and it's clear has grown in American playstyle environment when they encouraged him to play flashy and creative, where Deni has grown in a system where they kinda turn him to play more a robotic systematic playstyle and suppressed his creative side (due to a winning now pressure). I believe in the NBA we're going to see a lot more creativity and flashy stuff from Deni to the point people will think to themselves, man, hes a better player than I thought. It will happen once he shacks off his European style habits and start to show his American playstyle side. This adjustment might take some time, how much long depends on the Wiz staff.


Don't mean to belittle the Israeli league I had heard on several podcasts that the quality of the league itself was pretty poor and it seems like he averaged almost double the minutes in the Israeli league compared to the Euroleague where you'd imagine he faced stronger competition.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#94 » by Pistol King » Mon Dec 7, 2020 6:14 pm

Slim Charlez wrote:Don't mean to belittle the Israeli league I had heard on several podcasts that the quality of the league itself was pretty poor and it seems like he averaged almost double the minutes in the Israeli league compared to the Euroleague where you'd imagine he faced stronger competition.

Yeah I heard some of those podcasts as well,John Hollinger, Sam Vecenie etc. Once they praised the German League they lost credibility. The German teams were very bad last year in European competition (where that's the best indication for their quality), yet they claimed Hayes is playing in a much better league to explain why he's higher on their boards.

I don't want to turn this topic into a Deni topic so I'll just answer shortly, Deni's stats in my opinion and according to what my eyes have seen (watched a lot of his games) have less to do with the level of competition. When his coach trusted him and gave him a big role (whether in Maccabi on at FIBA), he has shined, when his coach was hesitant to play him and was impatient with him, Deni didn't stand out. Also take into account that Deni of the first part of the year was a totally different player than Deni of the last part of it. In the Israeli league on his first games he got a bigger role than in the Euroleague, but still averaged only around 9-10ppg. In the latest part of the season in the Israeli League he already averaged around 18ppg. Same apply to the Euroleague. In the first part of the season he didn't get a lot of minutes (Maccabi didn't have a reason to develop a teenager that is going to the NBA next year, and since they already brought more experienced players with a lot of money ) and he averaged around 3ppg. On his last 7 Euroleague games when he started to get bigger minutes (20MPG) because the coach needed him, he already averaged 7.5ppg while having the best plus minus on the entire team, and despite not getting a lot of ball touches (the more he touch the ball the better for him). And that happens before the COVID break. He worked during the quarantine and came back as one of Maccabi's two best players and was projected tobe a starter in the Euroleague if it wouldn't have been cancelled.

TL;DR
When trying to evaluate him, the most important thing is to investigate his trajectory, his progress, and to deeply understand the challenge of playing in a top 5 Euroleague team with all the pressure and expectations involved, compared to playing in a weak teams, whether in college or overseas.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#95 » by clyde21 » Mon Dec 7, 2020 6:36 pm

Roger Murdock wrote:
Marcus wrote:https://youtu.be/3X8jsA2sKt4

Pick it apart


Its pretty clear to me that his best skill, and I know this sounds stupid, is that he's realllllllly good at basketball. He consistently makes good reads, smart passes, good form on his shot, positions well on defense, plays within the flow of the game, doesn't force anything, and has a ton of moves. His athleticism doesnt blow me away at all, I'm not sure if its below average of he just plays a methodical game. But still I dont think it matters a ton cause he's got size and skill.

Also jeeeez that OK-St team is terrible. His teammates don't matchup at all.


that's exactly whawt I said about Luka...I have no idea why he's so good he just is :lol:
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#96 » by WargamesX » Mon Dec 7, 2020 7:52 pm

Pistol King wrote:
Slim Charlez wrote:Don't mean to belittle the Israeli league I had heard on several podcasts that the quality of the league itself was pretty poor and it seems like he averaged almost double the minutes in the Israeli league compared to the Euroleague where you'd imagine he faced stronger competition.

Yeah I heard some of those podcasts as well,John Hollinger, Sam Vecenie etc. Once they praised the German League they lost credibility. The German teams were very bad last year in European competition (where that's the best indication for their quality), yet they claimed Hayes is playing in a much better league to explain why he's higher on their boards.

I don't want to turn this topic into a Deni topic so I'll just answer shortly, Deni's stats in my opinion and according to what my eyes have seen (watched a lot of his games) have less to do with the level of competition. When his coach trusted him and gave him a big role (whether in Maccabi on at FIBA), he has shined, when his coach was hesitant to play him and was impatient with him, Deni didn't stand out. Also take into account that Deni of the first part of the year was a totally different player than Deni of the last part of it. In the Israeli league on his first games he got a bigger role than in the Euroleague, but still averaged only around 9-10ppg. In the latest part of the season in the Israeli League he already averaged around 18ppg. Same apply to the Euroleague. In the first part of the season he didn't get a lot of minutes (Maccabi didn't have a reason to develop a teenager that is going to the NBA next year, and since they already brought more experienced players with a lot of money ) and he averaged around 3ppg. On his last 7 Euroleague games when he started to get bigger minutes (20MPG) because the coach needed him, he already averaged 7.5ppg while having the best plus minus on the entire team, and despite not getting a lot of ball touches (the more he touch the ball the better for him). And that happens before the COVID break. He worked during the quarantine and came back as one of Maccabi's two best players and was projected tobe a starter in the Euroleague if it wouldn't have been cancelled.

TL;DR
When trying to evaluate him, the most important thing is to investigate his trajectory, his progress, and to deeply understand the challenge of playing in a top 5 Euroleague team with all the pressure and expectations involved, compared to playing in a weak teams, whether in college or overseas.


I think Deni’s ceiling is a Hedo Turkgulu type player..... Cade’s ceiling is idk, he just looks like he can do anything.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#97 » by Alonzo_Morning » Mon Dec 7, 2020 9:59 pm

Is Cade anywhere near Luka?
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#98 » by Marcus » Mon Dec 7, 2020 10:10 pm

Alonzo_Morning wrote:Is Cade anywhere near Luka?


Huge separator is Luka's jumper and Luka's ability to manipulate the defense. Don't know if Cade ever catches up in that regard same as I don't think Luka will be the defender Cade will be so it's not really a one for one comp. the being effective without looking like you should be effective is how the correlation is made with the two I think.
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#99 » by clyde21 » Mon Dec 7, 2020 11:57 pm

Alonzo_Morning wrote:Is Cade anywhere near Luka?


impossible to say that when Luka is on like a GOAT pace
..its better to leave Luka out of these convos and look for a different comp
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Re: Cade Cunningham 

Post#100 » by shotsquatch » Tue Dec 8, 2020 6:13 am

Really impressive player. If he was an A- athlete instead of a B- athlete we'd be talking about him as a generational prospect. The explosiveness is just not there. Everything else is though.

What really stands out to me is the passing. He makes some difficult reads in that clip. Seems like one of those guys who makes his whole team better.

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