Scoot Henderson

[clyde21]

Yeah, he could be Gary Payton Jr or Patrick Beverly on defense....

or Jrue. Or Cp3. Or Smart. Or Caruso. Or Rubio. Or Gordon. Or Jevon Carter. Or Conley.

or so many other "small guards" that are/were good defenders.

or he can be a good off-ball and team defender, like Steph, which is infinitely more important than POA perimeter defense for a guard. i don't expect KOC to think beyond the 6-2 tho, so I'm not surprised you're using Ringer as a reference point here.

Caruso is 6-4/6-5 averages 6 ppg for his career
Smart is 6-3 or 6-4 depending on site. Averages 11 ppg
Jrue is 6-3 or 6-5 depending on site
Jevon Carter averages 5 ppg
Rubio averages 11 ppg for his career

A lot of people have mentioned it, but it is verrrrrryy rare for small guards to be good defenders, and even more rare for small guards that are offensive hubs to be good defenders. The vast majority of them are bad defenders as small guards.

The few that are good defenders are role players who don't put the ball in the hoop.

That is what makes Jrue so rare.

it's literally not rare at all - good guard defenders are all over the league, I just gave you half a dozen off top, the only reason it seems that way because it's more important for bigs/wings to be great on-ball but for guards it's way more important to be good team defenders than it is to be POA defenders.

and LOL at you pretending Caruso is in any way functionally bigger than Scoot. you still have no fkn clue how functional size works despite spending the last 12 pages being taught. Scoot's w/s and reach dwarfs Caruso even if Caruso has an inch or two on Scoot.

at this point I'm not sure why anyone bothers with anything you post in this thread tbh and that's me being nice about it.

[clyde21]

Or he could be a bad defender like Lillard who has similar, if not better tools than Scoot. Assuming he's going to be an awesome defender seems foolhardy just as assuming he's going to be a complete trash defender. Truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

no one is assuming anything except JMAC/Ringer who are assuming he's bad because he's 6-2. my entire point is that being 6'2 =/= bad defender. if you think he's a bad defender, bring the fkn tape.

[mattao313]

It's facts that teams hunt mismatches with small players tho. I'm sure Kevin durant would rather go against marcus smart than Kawhi. Size matters with defense, I'd assume most small guards are what? At best average while most are just bad.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

[clyde21]

It's facts that teams hunt mismatches with small players tho. I'm sure Kevin durant would rather go against marcus smart than Kawhi. Size matters with defense, I'd assume most small guards are what? At best average while most are just bad.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

it's also facts that teams hunt mismatches on bigger players too. you don't think teams try to get slow and unathletic bigs/wings in ISO?

[Big J]

Teams hunt short guys because they are easier to see over the top of because their heads are lower. If you can see your other teammates and/or the hoop easier it's easier to visualize your next move.

[JMAC3]

or Jrue. Or Cp3. Or Smart. Or Caruso. Or Rubio. Or Gordon. Or Jevon Carter. Or Conley.

or so many other "small guards" that are/were good defenders.

or he can be a good off-ball and team defender, like Steph, which is infinitely more important than POA perimeter defense for a guard. i don't expect KOC to think beyond the 6-2 tho, so I'm not surprised you're using Ringer as a reference point here.

Caruso is 6-4/6-5 averages 6 ppg for his career
Smart is 6-3 or 6-4 depending on site. Averages 11 ppg
Jrue is 6-3 or 6-5 depending on site
Jevon Carter averages 5 ppg
Rubio averages 11 ppg for his career

A lot of people have mentioned it, but it is verrrrrryy rare for small guards to be good defenders, and even more rare for small guards that are offensive hubs to be good defenders. The vast majority of them are bad defenders as small guards.

The few that are good defenders are role players who don't put the ball in the hoop.

That is what makes Jrue so rare.

it's literally not rare at all - good guard defenders are all over the league, I just gave you half a dozen off top, the only reason it seems that way because it's more important for bigs/wings to be great on-ball but for guards it's way more important to be good team defenders than it is to be POA defenders.

and LOL at you pretending Caruso is in any way functionally bigger than Scoot. you still have no fkn clue how functional size works despite spending the last 12 pages being taught. Scoot's w/s and reach dwarfs Caruso even if Caruso has an inch or two on Scoot.

at this point I'm not sure why anyone bothers with anything you post in this thread tbh and that's me being nice about it.

Yeah, seems like everyone around here hates me LOL... because I posted something from the ringer.com draft guide?

Anyways, others have made note about smaller players usually being poor defenders or specifically being defensive minded players with little offensive impact. This isn't some crazy unheard of thought process.

Just find it funny you would even bring Caruso and Jrue even into the conversation as they might be two of the best defenders in the league.... but yeah let's compare them to Scoot, because anything is possible apparently. Really any draft content mentions Scoot being a subpar defender, it is common knowledge. No reason for me to scour over footage for you to see it.

[Big J]

Even if Scoot was 7'5 I'd still take Wemby over him. Do you know why? Because Wemby can actually shoot and gives a **** on defense.

[clyde21]

Caruso is 6-4/6-5 averages 6 ppg for his career
Smart is 6-3 or 6-4 depending on site. Averages 11 ppg
Jrue is 6-3 or 6-5 depending on site
Jevon Carter averages 5 ppg
Rubio averages 11 ppg for his career

A lot of people have mentioned it, but it is verrrrrryy rare for small guards to be good defenders, and even more rare for small guards that are offensive hubs to be good defenders. The vast majority of them are bad defenders as small guards.

The few that are good defenders are role players who don't put the ball in the hoop.

That is what makes Jrue so rare.

it's literally not rare at all - good guard defenders are all over the league, I just gave you half a dozen off top, the only reason it seems that way because it's more important for bigs/wings to be great on-ball but for guards it's way more important to be good team defenders than it is to be POA defenders.

and LOL at you pretending Caruso is in any way functionally bigger than Scoot. you still have no fkn clue how functional size works despite spending the last 12 pages being taught. Scoot's w/s and reach dwarfs Caruso even if Caruso has an inch or two on Scoot.

at this point I'm not sure why anyone bothers with anything you post in this thread tbh and that's me being nice about it.

Yeah, seems like everyone around here hates me LOL... because I posted something from the ringer.com draft guide?

Anyways, others have made note about smaller players usually being poor defenders or specifically being defensive minded players with little offensive impact. This isn't some crazy unheard of thought process.

Just find it funny you would even bring Caruso and Jrue even into the conversation as they might be two of the best defenders in the league.... but yeah let's compare them to Scoot, because anything is possible apparently. Really any draft content mentions Scoot being a subpar defender, it is common knowledge. No reason for me to scour over footage for you to see it.

can't speak for anyone else but the performance in this thread has been very trollish and subpar.

and I'm giving you a list of defenders that are around Scoot's size - you/ringer (i'm assuming u agree because you quoted them) are making the argument that he's going to be targeted on defense b/c he's 6-2, without anything really backing it up. it's just bad surface level analysis. if you think he's a bad defender, prove it with game tape. do you have specific plays you want to highlight where he's being targeted or losing himself in team defense?

and again, there are just as many good guard defenders as there as wing/big defenders. it only seems different because the defensive threshold that wings/bigs have to reach is much higher to see the court than guards, because again POA defense isn't as important for guards as it is for bigs/wings.

guards don't HAVE to be great defenders to see the court. wings/bigs (unless your name is like Towns or Jokic) do.

[JMAC3]

It's facts that teams hunt mismatches with small players tho. I'm sure Kevin durant would rather go against marcus smart than Kawhi. Size matters with defense, I'd assume most small guards are what? At best average while most are just bad.

Yeah, some people really want to argue like size isn't important in basketball. I don't get why there is always so much pushback on it.

[Big J]

https://youtu.be/gsJOl96NLf4?t=122
https://youtu.be/vSNz269AMj0?t=353

Here you go big boy. The next Jrue right here.

[mattao313]

It's facts that teams hunt mismatches with small players tho. I'm sure Kevin durant would rather go against marcus smart than Kawhi. Size matters with defense, I'd assume most small guards are what? At best average while most are just bad.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

it's also facts that teams hunt mismatches on bigger players too. you don't think teams try to get slow and unathletic bigs/wings in ISO?

Of course that doesn't change anything I said.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

[JMAC3]

It's facts that teams hunt mismatches with small players tho. I'm sure Kevin durant would rather go against marcus smart than Kawhi. Size matters with defense, I'd assume most small guards are what? At best average while most are just bad.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

it's also facts that teams hunt mismatches on bigger players too. you don't think teams try to get slow and unathletic bigs/wings in ISO?

Of course that doesn't change anything I said.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

If you had to rank the top 7 prospects... Wemby, Scoot, Amen, Ausar, Miller, Jarace and Whitmore 1-7 in terms of the level of defender they are in the league how do you rank them?

[mattao313]

it's also facts that teams hunt mismatches on bigger players too. you don't think teams try to get slow and unathletic bigs/wings in ISO?

Of course that doesn't change anything I said.

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

If you had to rank the top 7 prospects... Wemby, Scoot, Amen, Ausar, Miller, Jarace and Whitmore 1-7 in terms of the level of defender they are in the league how do you rank them?

Wembanyama


Walker
Whitmore
Miller
Thompsons


Scoot

Sent from my SM-A528B using RealGM mobile app

[JMAC3]

Scoot Defense

How about you? How do you rank prospects these guys on defense only?

Scoot, Wemby, Walker, Thompson twins, Miller and Whitmore.

[clyde21]

Scoot Defense

How about you? How do you rank prospects these guys on defense only?

Scoot, Wemby, Walker, Thompson twins, Miller and Whitmore.

i don't think any of these guys differentiated themselves defensively other than Wemby.

[JMAC3]

Scoot Defense

How about you? How do you rank prospects these guys on defense only?

Scoot, Wemby, Walker, Thompson twins, Miller and Whitmore.

i don't think any of these guys differentiated themselves defensively other than Wemby.

So you just don't consider defense at all when ranking them?

[EvanZ]

Small guards who have high usage (30%+) are always bad defenders. I don't think it's a coincidence. There is only so much energy you can expend in a game on both ends.

Universally (I haven't found an exception yet), the guards we are talking about as good or great defenders always have usage rates roughly maxing out at 25% USG.

So the real question here you should be asking is whether Scoot is a 30% usage guy who will suck on D or a 25% usg guy who could excel on D. Coaches and GM's should ask the same thing.

[Big J]

Small guards who have high usage (30%+) are always bad defenders. I don't think it's a coincidence. There is only so much energy you can expend in a game on both ends.

Universally (I haven't found an exception yet), the guards we are talking about as good or great defenders always have usage rates roughly maxing out at 25% USG.

So the real question here you should be asking is whether Scoot is a 30% usage guy who will suck on D or a 25% usg guy who could excel on D. Coaches and GM's should ask the same thing.

Better question would be what are Scoot's agent and his entourage telling him.

[clyde21]

How about you? How do you rank prospects these guys on defense only?

Scoot, Wemby, Walker, Thompson twins, Miller and Whitmore.

i don't think any of these guys differentiated themselves defensively other than Wemby.

So you just don't consider defense at all when ranking them?

i said, other than Wemby, none of them have differentiated themselves defensively. what is it that you didn't understand about that?

[JMAC3]

i don't think any of these guys differentiated themselves defensively other than Wemby.

So you just don't consider defense at all when ranking them?

i said, other than Wemby, none of them have differentiated themselves defensively. what is it that you didn't understand about that?

righttttttt, so when you rank Jarace Walker on your big board and Scoot on your big board. Neither one gets bumped or negatively affected based on defense. In your mind they are equivalent on defense?