Can Rose's impressive tournament push him past Beasley?

[Malinhion]

In 35 minutes...

20.8 Points
.518 FG% (43/83)
.773 FT% (34/44)
.357 3P% (5/14)

6.5 Rebounds
24 Defensive
15 Offensive

6.0 Assists
High: 9 (vs. DJ Augustin)

1.8 Turnovers
2.0 Fouls

1.3 Steals
0.3 Blocks

While Memphis gets knocked for losing the championship on late free throw misses, Rose's late front-end rattled out. It was the only free throw he missed the entire night. He only missed more than one free throw in one of six tournament games.

A dismal first half of distance shooting really killed him in the championship game, going 1-6 from behind the arc. But he was doubled most of the fist half. It seemed that Kansas was able to have some success doubling him, but they got burned by Rose on 7 straight possessions late in the 4th when Self switched to the box-and-1 to keep a leash on CDR.

Rose showed the ability to play at the NBA pace. His slashing is dynamic and he has the upper-body strength to collect and-1s. When he would get the ball he ran down the court full sprint, slashing to the basket. NCAA fastbreaks tend to be one guy getting away from another, but Rose can sprint even in traffic. I recall him maintaining his speed in the midst of a behind-the-back dribble one time he went coast-to-coast.

Thoughts?

[tsherkin]

I thought he did a pretty nice job on Chalmers on that last possession, that's a tough shot to go in with his hand right in Mario's grill.

[Malinhion]

Calipari pinned the no-foul situation on Rose, after the media started spouting off with 20-20 hindsight. No matter what their plan, Memphis had timeouts to burn and it definitely wasn't a Freshman's fault for D-ing up like Rose did on that final shot.

[horaceworthy]

I thought Calipari pinned the no-foul situation on the refs much moreso than Rose. How often did he say "We fouled/shoved their guy to the ground, but I guess we didn't foul hard enough?"

[ponder276]

I think people have to agree that Rose's stock is substantially up overall throughout the tournament, and Beasley's stock is slightly down (not because his team lost - they were expected to, but because he disappeared for the entire second half against Xavier. Bill Walker looked better than Beasley through much of their two games). Pre-tournament Beasley was the clear-cut #1, right now I think Beasley has only a slight edge, and there are quite a few teams who would take Rose if they won the lottery (Seattle, for example).

[skones]

I think people have to agree that Rose's stock is substantially up overall throughout the tournament, and Beasley's stock is slightly down (not because his team lost - they were expected to, but because he disappeared for the entire second half against WISCONSIN. Bill Walker looked better than Beasley through much of their two games). Pre-tournament Beasley was the clear-cut #1, right now I think Beasley has only a slight edge, and there are quite a few teams who would take Rose if they won the lottery (Seattle, for example).

Fixed.

[deanx]

i dont think its a question of "can rose..." but rather it has already pushed rose past beasley

[DanTown8587]

I'm sorry, Beasley did nothing to lose the top spot and though Rose was great, how you gonna take six games over the course of the season that Beasley was the best.

[XTC]

Beasley to me is still the clear cut number one. He is something special, and Rose made his stock much higher and is now the clear cut #, but Beasley is too good to pass up on.

[deanx]

the 5 worst teams right now: heat, sonics, twolves, knicks, grizz

with the exception of grizz, the other 4 are likely to pick rose over beasley due to needs.

[5DOM]

green-durant-beasely trio would be something unique.

weird sizes

[Milkdud]

I don't think it will effect it that much, I look at Rose and Beasley as 1A and 1 B so whichever player suits the drafting teams need will be the one nabbed IMO. But as mentioned already much of the high lotto teams are weaker at PG then at F (not sure where Beasley will start his NBA career). So I think Rose is a more likely #1 pick.

[BMiller52]

-= original quote snipped =-



Fixed.

Eh they suck though so it doesn't matter. Atleast Xavier made it to the elite eight. Really you should be greatful that he mixed the 2 teams up

[Doctor MJ]

I'm sorry, Beasley did nothing to lose the top spot and though Rose was great, how you gonna take six games over the course of the season that Beasley was the best.

This isn't an MVP race my friend. It's not about who was better, it's about who will be better. By no means am I saying Rose is a lock for that top spot, but when someone who was already rated at #2 before the tournament surprises people with what he does on a big stage, I don't see why it's crazy to think he might move up that one spot.

[Malinhion]

Yes. Especially when we're talking about freshmen. Playing on a big stage isn't just about shining in the limelight. It's about putting your skills together over the course of a season, and exhibitng your ability to play well within a team framework against the best competition at your level.

Rose was my #1 prospect before the college basketball season, but Beasley's numbers blew me away all season. I can't discount him for K-State performing as I expected in the tourney, but with the love I already had for Rose's game I can't say I was anything but impressed with his all-around showing. I mean, the kid was shooting 78% from the PG spot heading into the final 4.

[Paydro70]

He didn't say it was crazy, he said you shouldn't do it, and I agree. Performing well in the tournament should mean far less than the regular season, simply because it's far fewer games. Beasley was consistently dominant for an entire season... he had literally two or three bad games, while Rose had at least 10, maybe 15, depending on how generous you are.

It's great that Rose played so well in the tourney, but even there it wasn't a uniform success. His defense was uniformly great, he boarded very well, and he kept his turnovers low, something he didn't do very well through the season. His offense, however, was inconsistent, which is strange considering how much people are creaming their jeans over his point totals. In my opinion the Kansas game wasn't very good, he shot poorly against Miss St., and UT Arlington is of course terrible. So I really don't think it's sensible to privilege his superlative performances in the other 3 games, declare he had a great tourney (though overall that is true), and assume he should move up a spot on the draft board.

As others have said, he improved his stock, and maybe a few more teams would pick him over Beasley, but I don't think they should, if they aren't forced by position to take him first.

[BubbaTee]

I think individual workouts will have more of an impact on who's #1 than the tourney. We've seen tournament risers pan out (Dwyane Wade) and not pan out (Marcus Williams - UConn), to the point where it's not anything I would rely on when making that judgement.

[mandurugo]

I think individual workouts will have more of an impact on who's #1 than the tourney. We've seen tournament risers pan out (Dwyane Wade) and not pan out (Marcus Williams - UConn), to the point where it's not anything I would rely on when making that judgement.

To me, individual workouts are the least valuable indicator. Too many players can excel in the artificial formats they have them performing in, I put much more stock in how they did in the college season.

[BubbaTee]

-= original quote snipped =-



To me, individual workouts are the least valuable indicator. Too many players can excel in the artificial formats they have them performing in, I put much more stock in how they did in the college season.

I agree that the entire 30-game body of work (not a 6 game stretch) should weigh more than a workout.

However, I'm pretty sure if Derrick Rose shows up and hits 75% of his 3s, some GMs aren't going to much care about how he shot only 1/6 from deep against Kansas. At that point, the workout becomes the more recent data.

[_BBIB_]

How many guys in the last two decades are NBA stars?

2008 Mario Chalmers Kansas 29 points, 7 rebounds, 7 steals
2007 Corey Brewer Florida 32 points, 7-13 3-pointers, 10 rebounds
2006 Joakim Noah Florida 17 rebounds, 10 blocks
2005 Sean May North Carolina 48 points, 17 rebounds
2004 Emeka Okafor UConn 42 points, 22 rebounds
2003 Carmelo Anthony Syracuse 53 points, 24 rebounds
2002 Juan Dixon Maryland 51 points, 7 steals
2001 Shane Battier Duke 43 points, 19 rebounds
2000 Mateen Cleaves Michigan State 29 points, 5 assists
1999 Richard Hamilton UConn 51 points, 12 rebounds
1998 Jeff Sheppard Kentucky 16-29, 43 points
1997 Miles Simon Arizona 54 points, 8 rebounds
1996 Tony Delk Kentucky 8-16 3-pointers
1995 Ed O'Bannon UCLA 45 points, 25 rebounds
1994 Corliss Williamson Arkansas 52 points, 21 rebounds
1993 Donald Williams North Carolina 10-14 3-pointers
1992 Bobby Hurley Duke 35 points, 11 assists
1991 Christian Laettner Duke 46 points, 17 rebounds
1990 Anderson Hunt UNLV 19-31, 49 points
1989 Glen Rice Michigan 59 points, 16 rebounds
1988 Danny Manning Kansas 56 points, 17 rebounds
1987 Keith Smart Indiana 14-22 fgs, 35 points
1986 Pervis Ellison Louisville 36 points, 24 rebounds
1985 Ed Pinckney Villanova 28 points, 15 rebounds
1984 Patrick Ewing Georgetown 18 rebounds, 15 blocks
1983 Akeem Olajuwon* Houston 41 points, 40 rebounds
1982 James Worthy North Carolina 20-27 fgs, 42 points
1981 Isiah Thomas Indiana 37 points, 9 assists
1980 Darrell Griffith Louisville 57 points, 15 assists
1979 Earvin Johnson Michigan State 53 points, 17 rebounds
1978 Jack Givens Kentucky 64 points, 17 rebounds
1977 Butch Lee Marquette 30 points, 6 rebounds
1976 Kent Benson Indiana 41 points, 18 rebounds
1975 Richard Washington UCLA 54 points, 20 rebounds
1974 David Thompson North Carolina St. 49 points, 17 rebounds
1973 Bill Walton UCLA 28-34 fgs, 58 points
1972 Bill Walton UCLA 57 points, 41 rebounds
1971 Howard Porter* Villanova 47 points, 24 rebounds
1970 Sidney Wicks UCLA 39 points, 34 rebounds
1969 Lew Alcindor UCLA 62 points, 41 rebounds
1968 Lew Alcindor UCLA 53 points, 34 rebounds
1967 Lew Alcindor UCLA 39 points, 38 rebounds
1966 Jerry Chambers* Utah 70 points, 35 rebounds
1965 Bill Bradley* Princeton 87 points, 24 rebounds
1964 Walt Hazzard UCLA 30 points, 10 rebounds
1963 Art Heyman* Duke 51 points, 19 rebounds
1962 Paul Hogue Cincinnati 59 points, 38 rebounds
1961 Jerry Lucas* Ohio State 20-28 fgs, 56 points
1960 Jerry Lucas Ohio State 35 points, 23 rebounds
1959 Jerry West West Virginia 66 points, 25 rebounds
1958 Elgin Baylor* Seattle 48 points, 41 rebounds
1957 Wilt Chamberlain* Kansas 55 points, 25 rebounds
1956 Hal Lear* Temple 80 points
1955 Bill Russell San Francisco 47 points



NCAA tourney success should not outweigh season production and individual skills and talent.