2019-2020 SPURS TRADE WHISPERS & IDEAS

[G R E Y]

So we have had some Spurs posters calling for trades, and as the February trade deadline approaches, this thread will be for reading the tea leaves of whatever whispers we get wind of from the notoriously private Spurs.

Feel free to post you trade ideas here as well.

First up:

Read on Twitter

DeMarre has gone from DNP-CD to being in street clothes for the past two games. Can't help but think it's a harbinger of his exit. This is one of the most strange cases of FA signings. Though healthy and without a word of complaint he has hardly played because when he has been given minutes, he has looked borderline unplayable (especially on O - 31%FG, 23% from 3, 60%FTs). But surely as a pro he would like to be playing even as he collects a paycheck to be in his position.

His contract is three years at $7M this season, $6.65M next season, and $7M in 2021-2022 which is not fully guaranteed. (So $15M for a guy we're not using. So weird. Wish in retrospect we could have brought Milutinov over as we're thin on bigs, but we thought we'd addressed that situation, and who knew DC would pan out the way he has).


Upcoming FAs are Bryn (and perhaps his slump is not only due to the pressure of too big a role but also of his upcoming FA status), and Beli. Bryn is in the final year of a $2.875M contract, Beli, $5,846,154.


DeMar has a $27,739,975 PO for next season, and we picked up LMA's full $24M contract for next season.

As to the latter two, RealGM Wiretap reported that Miami could be interested in either DeMar or LMA, info which was found in this source:
https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article239217073.html


RealGM Wiretap has also reported that Atlanta has expressed interest in Jakob according to this source:
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2871435-how-can-league-worst-atlanta-hawks-prove-to-trae-young-hes-not-alone

Jakob, who will be a RFA this summer, is earning $3,754,886 this season and is eligible for a $5,087,870 QO for 2020-2021.

[-Sammy-]

I don't understand the Carroll situation, either; I expected him to be a nice asset for us this year. If we can get some value for him, that'll be a boon.

I don't know how I feel about the prospect of moving Jakob, but I'm starting to get the sense that the hoped-for emergence is vapor.

[G R E Y]

I don't understand the Carroll situation, either; I expected him to be a nice asset for us this year. If we can get some value for him, that'll be a boon.

I don't know how I feel about the prospect of moving Jakob, but I'm starting to get the sense that the hoped-for emergence is vapor.

Fingers crossed we can get someone serviceable or an asset for DC.

As to Jakob, I think he's made good strides defensively, but his FT% is disappointing after he reportedly worked on it along with some O moves this summer. He averaged 17.2PPG, 68.9FT% in 30MPG in his final year in college, and these numbers were a big jump from his previous year - 9.1PPG, 44.4FT% in 23.3MPG.

Though that doesn't necessarily always translate into the NBA, and he's more of a traditional C in a changing game, I read in a recent article that LMA has talked with Jakob about extending his game farther than playing close to the basket, and Jakob is willing. He's really efficient down low, so that's a positive, and his getting so few chances to score are also a function of other guys being more ball dominant and being bigger features in our O.

He is a wonderful defensive presence, a great blocker, good screener and rebounder. He moves well without the ball, and has a nice touch around the rim. To whatever extent it takes longer for bigs to develop, I would not want to part with Jakob yet until we see what we have with him on the O end. Besides, we're so thin up front already.

I do wonder what the extent of emergence Spurs hoped for as they didn't extend him in the available window of time. That could be more business than interest, but it was a gamble we were willing to make despite our thin bigs situation, so it's interesting to consider what prospective options we have on the table.

[imagump1313]

I really don't care where DeRozan goes as long as he does, but I don't see the Miami thing with Butler there. Offensively they are almost the same player except for the three. Butler is actually distributing the ball well there. The last thing the Heat needs with all those young players blossoming is to have another ball dominant guy taking all the shots.

Looking at upcoming FAs, there isn't going to be much to replace DeRozan out there. Bogdanovich maybe if you can get him.
We will have plenty of money if DeRozan opts out.

The Carroll thing is a mystery. Didn't we sign him before we tried to sign Morris? Maybe the Spurs knew something then but why sign Carroll to begin with if that was the case? I think it might be more to do with Lyles being a little better than they thought.
I don't see how we can move him at this point and get anything back. Losing his salary would help though.

Poeltl is useful, we just need to figure out how to make him play more aggressively. Also once DeRozan is gone I think he will have more room to grow. Dallas could have really used him after Powell got hurt but we would never trade with them. They just got Cully-Stein which isn't much of an improvement but they were desperate. I wouldn't mind keeping him if we don't have to overpay.

I think its pretty much unanimous that we wont miss Belinelli.

Forbes I consider like George Hill, Kyle Anderson, Aaron Baynes, Boban...etc. Its time for him to move on and get overpayed by someone else. I don't see another team giving us any type of asset for him at this point.

[Phreak50]

I think we signed Carroll thinking he was the guy he once was.

On court he looked completely lost and completely outskilled.

I'd move Forbes as well. He has done as well as he possibly could and really, actually exceeded what anyone expected of him especially being a starter.

But he simply can't get a shot off against long athletic defenders.

Which leaves him in a Mills bench role situation and we don't need two of them.

I'd still listen to offers for Murray and White as well.

I like White as our starter for the future and don't see Murray being the saviour most had hoped.

I would love to see Derozan moved somewhere he will be happy and anything we get back is a bonus.

I won't bother listing names I'd like to see here because that never turns out.

Happy and proud of the fight this mismatch of a team has put up but we need to reassemble.

[G R E Y]

So most immediately we need to address our toughness and bigs situation. We identified these as needs in the off-season and thought we took care of both, alas, things turned out as they did.

Rudy has regressed. He looks less fluid and quick, and is missing open shots for lower percentages this season.

Bryn is a nice guy but his numbers in a starting role are worse than Lonnie's overall and Beli's in the last ten games, and for 3s in the season (Bryn's FG% is slightly higher as Beli's is a woeful 37%).

We can't / shouldn't give up both of our designated 3 shooters (always depends on what we get back), but a better balance in trading at least one of them along with other potentials to trade - Rudy, DeMarre - may hopefully net us some toughness and defensive presence.

Ironically, Rudy for Morris works, but I think there's a snowball's chance in hell we deal with the Knicks, and anyway, they'd surely want picks we surely wouldn't part with.

gump brought up Bogdanovic and I'm warming up to the idea, but a RFA with his numbers would be costly and without assurances we could retain him, not sure it's a risk we could take on.

Orlando is on a four-game losing streak and fighting to stay in the PO race, so I wonder if they'd be willing to bite. Fournier and Bamba address our immediate starting-level SG and bigs issue. Fournier is earning $17M/yr and is UFA in 2021. Bamba is a 3-shooting big (it's only actually at around 33% this season, but his willingness and range means there's potential to work with) but motor and toughness are a knock so far in his early career. But for an expiring DeMar? It's something to work with as it gives a bit more time to work in our young up and coming guards with more playing time as well as balances out our bigs better.

EDIT: I see now that Fournier, like DeMar, has a PO for next season so that doesn't seem as favourable now. Also, perusing the Magic board, their fans are not high on Bamba. Lack of development in his second year and criticism of laziness / lack of heart. Headdresses our bigs but not toughness issue.

[scottyg]

Bulls offer you
-Otto Porter
- Thad young
- Denzel Valentine
-lottery protected 1st rd draft pick

For

-DeroZan
- Carroll
-Mills

[G R E Y]

Hmm:

Read on Twitter

Also, perhaps related or not, didn't see DeMarre, still in street clothes, behind the bench in the second half.

[G R E Y]

Bulls offer you
-Otto Porter
- Thad young
- Denzel Valentine
-lottery protected 1st rd draft pick

For

-DeroZan
- Carroll
-Mills

Patty isn't going anywhere. I'd be shocked if he were moved.

Isn't Porter injured? Also regressed to the mean since his 17PPG run. But shoots 3s.

Thad Young with Trey and Rudy is redundant.

And we've got a glut of guards already coming up in our system, so Valentine isn't a lure.

Doesn't move the needle for us to give up one of our two main scorers and our central spirit energy guy off the bench.

[imagump1313]

Bulls offer you
-Otto Porter
- Thad young
- Denzel Valentine
-lottery protected 1st rd draft pick

For

-DeroZan
- Carroll
-Mills

Patty isn't going anywhere. I'd be shocked if he were moved.

Isn't Porter injured? Also regressed to the mean since his 17PPG run. But shoots 3s.

Thad Young with Trey and Rudy is redundant.

And we've got a glut of guards already coming up in our system, so Valentine isn't a lure.

Doesn't move the needle for us to give up one of our two main scorers and our central spirit energy guy off the bench.

Agree with Grey. This doesn't work for us.
I like Young but even you guys want nothing to do with Valentine or Porter so why would we?

[imagump1313]

This is a pipe dream (because I love Tobias Harris) but it worked in the Trade Machine.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=va6mrpl

Philly is desperate to win now. They miss Jimmy Butler big time.
What is the closest thing to Butler but with less balls? DeRozan!
Philly is dying for shooters. Forbes only shoots (just not well)
Gay could help them with toughness and could be his last chance for a title.(Plus his salary makes the trade work)

For us:
Harris is only 27. He makes more money and has 4 years left but if we keep DeRozan he will want more than what Harris makes.
Harris opens the floor for us big time with DeRozan gone.
We lose Gay's cap hit.
At this point, Brown can give us what Gay was doing.
Smith is the wild card. I know he's been hurt but Philly isn't even using him at all. He cant be any worse than Forbes and if he is we can bench him and play White/Murray with no regrets for now.

You could also swap out Forbes for Belinelli and it still works and Philly likes him.

I know its crazy and this is why I'm not a GM IRL....

[G R E Y]

This is a pipe dream (because I love Tobias Harris) but it worked in the Trade Machine.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=va6mrpl

Philly is desperate to win now. They miss Jimmy Butler big time.
What is the closest thing to Butler but with less balls? DeRozan!
Philly is dying for shooters. Forbes only shoots (just not well)
Gay could help them with toughness and could be his last chance for a title.(Plus his salary makes the trade work)

For us:
Harris is only 27. He makes more money and has 4 years left but if we keep DeRozan he will want more than what Harris makes.
Harris opens the floor for us big time with DeRozan gone.
We lose Gay's cap hit.
At this point, Brown can give us what Gay was doing.
Smith is the wild card. I know he's been hurt but Philly isn't even using him at all. He cant be any worse than Forbes and if he is we can bench him and play White/Murray with no regrets for now.

You could also swap out Forbes for Belinelli and it still works and Philly likes him.

I know its crazy and this is why I'm not a GM IRL....

Every time I see one of these newly signed contracts I get sticker shock, but that's the cost of retaining better players. Not everyone who gets a max contract really deserves it, but the reality of the marketplace is such that someone will pay it. If it's about getting a quality player back, then TH has value. Just not sure for Philly's line-up whether DD would find the space to operate - they need outside shooting badly as they already have a ball-dominant star who doesn't shoot 3s. Still, DD is a terrific shot getter and facilitator.

I think Beli sat because he is reportedly being shopped along with Carroll (and to a lesser extent, Rudy) so it would likely be Beli here as much as I want Bryn to be more in a Beli role rather than his current one which he's woeful in.

Rudy, I **** you not, is shooting 14.3% from 3 in his last 10 games, and 37.8FG%. Scott has a lower FG% for the season, but a higher 3%. I think he's a downgrade in terms of the overall versatility Rudy brings, but that is becoming more so on paper. Rudy at $14M for what he is producing (and declining physically, hence settling for outside shots) is steep, but I do wonder whether we can get more for a vet like him? Apparently our price for parting with him is on the higher end (no details available), but I get it in this scenario the central deal is TH for DD.

Not sure what Smith's development is like but he's only 20 and has better stats this season in the G-League. Texas kid, so maybe he'd like to be home.

Bryn's on a super-friendly contract right now and he's being given every opportunity to make the most of it. Re-signing him gives us a better chance to do more with the asset later, but again, in this scenario it's about TB for DD and if they need shooters, in theory at least either he or Beli fit the bill for them.

Maybe they'd like to get out from under TH's contract (and given that we've carefully managed to clear space for 2021, is this how we want to use it)? Feels like they're under a lot of pressure to perform this season before they make some roster changes.

I have a feeling we've edging closer to a S&T with DeMar, but apparently all options with him are still on the table. I would want to be paying him long-term years at $30M++/yr so at most a 1+1 (PO for the latter).

[G R E Y]

Grain of salt about the source, but this could be something:

Read on Twitter

[SD2042]

Grain of salt about the source, but this could be something:

Read on Twitter

If that's the case, then the Spurs could be looking at Ilyasova as they both make the same exact salary. Just that Ilyasova has two less years than Carroll.

[imagump1313]

This is a pipe dream (because I love Tobias Harris) but it worked in the Trade Machine.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=va6mrpl

Philly is desperate to win now. They miss Jimmy Butler big time.
What is the closest thing to Butler but with less balls? DeRozan!
Philly is dying for shooters. Forbes only shoots (just not well)
Gay could help them with toughness and could be his last chance for a title.(Plus his salary makes the trade work)

For us:
Harris is only 27. He makes more money and has 4 years left but if we keep DeRozan he will want more than what Harris makes.
Harris opens the floor for us big time with DeRozan gone.
We lose Gay's cap hit.
At this point, Brown can give us what Gay was doing.
Smith is the wild card. I know he's been hurt but Philly isn't even using him at all. He cant be any worse than Forbes and if he is we can bench him and play White/Murray with no regrets for now.

You could also swap out Forbes for Belinelli and it still works and Philly likes him.

I know its crazy and this is why I'm not a GM IRL....

Every time I see one of these newly signed contracts I get sticker shock, but that's the cost of retaining better players. Not everyone who gets a max contract really deserves it, but the reality of the marketplace is such that someone will pay it. If it's about getting a quality player back, then TH has value. Just not sure for Philly's line-up whether DD would find the space to operate - they need outside shooting badly as they already have a ball-dominant star who doesn't shoot 3s. Still, DD is a terrific shot getter and facilitator.

I think Beli sat because he is reportedly being shopped along with Carroll (and to a lesser extent, Rudy) so it would likely be Beli here as much as I want Bryn to be more in a Beli role rather than his current one which he's woeful in.

Rudy, I **** you not, is shooting 14.3% from 3 in his last 10 games, and 37.8FG%. Scott has a lower FG% for the season, but a higher 3%. I think he's a downgrade in terms of the overall versatility Rudy brings, but that is becoming more so on paper. Rudy at $14M for what he is producing (and declining physically, hence settling for outside shots) is steep, but I do wonder whether we can get more for a vet like him? Apparently our price for parting with him is on the higher end (no details available), but I get it in this scenario the central deal is TH for DD.

Not sure what Smith's development is like but he's only 20 and has better stats this season in the G-League. Texas kid, so maybe he'd like to be home.

Bryn's on a super-friendly contract right now and he's being given every opportunity to make the most of it. Re-signing him gives us a better chance to do more with the asset later, but again, in this scenario it's about TB for DD and if they need shooters, in theory at least either he or Beli fit the bill for them.

Maybe they'd like to get out from under TH's contract (and given that we've carefully managed to clear space for 2021, is this how we want to use it)? Feels like they're under a lot of pressure to perform this season before they make some roster changes.

I have a feeling we've edging closer to a S&T with DeMar, but apparently all options with him are still on the table. I would want to be paying him long-term years at $30M++/yr so at most a 1+1 (PO for the latter).

Yeah, I was trying to get us a little younger and build for the future with that trade. Harris being only 27 means we could build for a year or two and he would still be young enough to be part of the plan(DeRozan and Aldridge are too old to have around for a rebuild).
I think he would flourish even more in our system because he can score inside or out. He also moves well off the ball and can get shots through movement(something DeRozan cannot do). In 2 years his contract will be a bargain for what he does so we could have an opportunity to move him for a different asset if it doesnt work out.

I'm not against waiting for a sign and trade for DeRozan if we have to but PLEASE do not try to sign him long term! I have had enough of him.

Smith still has an unknown ceiling while Forbes has hit his ceiling and is what he is. Plus he is younger and cheaper.

Scott? Who cares really? He can be a filler for losing Gay who wasn't doing much for us anyway. Cut him or package him with someone else later.

I just hope we do something and not keep this roster the way it is. Its painful to watch.

[G R E Y]

Grain of salt about the source, but this could be something:

Read on Twitter

If that's the case, then the Spurs could be looking at Ilyasova as they both make the same exact salary. Just that Ilyasova has two less years than Carroll.

Sold! Not sure why Bucks would take on the extra salary, but that's what they pay the GMs to figure out.

*Jedi hand wave* "This is the player you're looking for."

[SD2042]

Grain of salt about the source, but this could be something:

Read on Twitter

If that's the case, then the Spurs could be looking at Ilyasova as they both make the same exact salary. Just that Ilyasova has two less years than Carroll.

Sold! Not sure why Bucks would take on the extra salary, but that's what they pay the GMs to figure out.

*Jedi hand wave* "This is the player you're looking for."

[G R E Y]

Read on Twitter

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[G R E Y]

Given this:

Read on Twitter

(I read we supposedly had some interest in Parker in FA or acquisition, so at least the latter is out of the equation. Plus he's forever pining for the Bucks, so...).

My pipe dream would be to trade Carroll (plus a 2nd round pick?) for Bjelica.

And also trade Rudy and Beli to Orlando for Fournier and Bamba.

Of course, it works better for us especially with the NB for DC swap, but maybe they want a 3&D great locker room vet?...?

I thought Mo would pan out better, but it seems Magic fans are disenchanted with both him and Evan for different reasons. A big knock on Bamba is his motor and willingness to work on his game (has a rep for being lazy), but a young prospect in a change of scenery could be good.

They get insta-scoring with Beli and to a lesser extent Rudy but they are essentially bucket getters. Beli's great for spacing and movement, though his D is what it is at this point.

So we give up 2,3,4 and get 2,4,5, get younger, but there's more incentive for us in these deals. Really the main impetus is to replace Bryn with Evan as the starting SG and never ever return to Bryn in that role again. I mean, if none of our current players are breaking through, surely Evan could and should.

[G R E Y]

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Well then...

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