SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT)

Moderators: Baphomet, GREY 1769

User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#21 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:33 am

WHAT A bull CALL HOLY ****. KEEP YOUR ARMS TO YOURSELF, DOUG!
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#22 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:36 am

THAT 3 WAS BECAUSE KELDON ONCE AGAIN DID NOT GO TO THE RIGHT PLACE ON THE SWITCH AND GOT CAUGHT DOWN LOW RATHER THAN ON THE 3 SHOOTER. Happened earlier but Derrick told him where to go.

AND NOW KELDON LOSES THE BALL ON THE DRIBBLE.

BBIQ needs some infusion.
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#23 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:38 am

BBIQ LIKE DEVIN. SO SMART.
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#24 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:43 am

Doug and Drew are the only starters with good efficiency and Keldon is the only starter in double digits with... 12 points. *sigh*
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
imagump1313
Veteran
Posts: 2,867
And1: 1,628
Joined: Apr 27, 2013
Location: Behind You
       

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#25 » by imagump1313 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:47 am

See what I mean? 3 guys pass on wide open shots and if it wasn't for Prince committing a dumb foul we would have had a shot clock violation.
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#26 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:53 am

3RD Q: SPURS 78

WOLVES 93

A better end of Q push there. I liked that Lonnie drive - fake, one big step to start the drive and focused finish. He missed because he got absolutely clobbered. Glad he's ok.

Consistency is still something we're chasing. Some bad switches for their open shots - the ones they take the most of, and the ones they're killing us with - and a single-digit lead ballooned.

Hard strong smart play here, please.
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#27 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:55 am

How did we allow a switch of Bryn onto Townes lmao
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#28 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:09 am

FINALLY Lonnie makes a quick decision to drive... but it's on THREE defenders down low and as he skies in the air he **** PASSES the ball to I think Drew and of course they steal. Like... I can't, I just can't...

Bryn steps out of bounds LMFAO

Good thing I have beer...
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
GREY 1769
Forum Mod - Spurs
Forum Mod - Spurs
Posts: 21,923
And1: 19,210
Joined: Mar 17, 2010
Location: Silver and Black; Blue and White
   

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#29 » by GREY 1769 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 4:20 am

4TH Q: SPURS 90

WOLVES 115

Well ****. Lacklustre effort after flimsy mindset coming in. We left this one like we came into it - shellshocked. Twelve points scored in the final Q after doing down 20 points in the first Q on blitz scoring from 3 by them. They scored it early, they scored it throughout the middle, they scored it late.

I keep wondering why we - it mostly stand out with Keldon - go under screens versus teams that shoot the 3 so much. Wolves shot 49(!) of their 86 FGAs from beyond the arc. It's what they're known for. What did we think would happen?

It didn't help that we made only 6-32 ourselves, this after we made 5 the previous game.

Once again I go back to shot distribution. Doug was off from the arc tonight making just 1-5, but **** Lonnie took the MOST on the team and hit 1-10. HOW IS HE **** ALLOWED TO JUST TAKE 3s when HE'S NOWHERE NEAR THE BEST SHOOTER FROM THERE?

His play is increasingly infuriating: he's a super nice guy, all full of wise quotes, but the results-to-talk ratio is diverging with each season. We saw these erratic drives and fancy finishes for misses at the rim his first year. And it was fine then as we expected the BBIQ and reading the court to catch up to the athleticism but there he is in his third playing year and he continues to confound with just bad skills and worse BBOQ. Sorry to say that as I had far higher hopes for him, but I've see enough to just feel so disappointed.

With the ball in his hands as O initiator, he continues to take 4-5 seconds off the clock dribbling dribbling dribbling probing a couple of step forward before backing out and... making the wonderfully creative move to PASS IT TO THE SIDE AROUND THE ARC to the teammate who has been OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME. Meanwhile, the D recovers, sets up, and closes any opportunities we may have otherwise had. It stalls the O because nobody moves nearly as well with the ball in Lonnie's hands, and we watch him dribble and pass before the O starts to move again. Either he does that pass across, or he drives into **** multiple defenders, or he uses a screen for a one-and-done shot where nobody else touches the ball. **** black hole. SO unintelligent in reading the court, Christ it pains me to say it because he's so nice but... there it is.

I do like his drives in transition and don't fault him when he's wide open and takes the shot off the pass. Either they go in or they don't. But again in terms of recognition, there is NO WAY it should ever happen that he not only takes the most shots but also the most 3s. There were A LOT of missed opportunities with these plays that sucked the energy out of the O.

I'm starting to wonder whether there is some sort of hierarchy that the guys set in place where the players who have been here more years take their own rather than passing it to the hot hand - again, Devin! - because, hey, they have to earn theirs. It's not what we want or what is good for us.

Lonnie was also inconsistent on D. Their last 3 was all on Lonnie for not only not switching well and going to the right man, but also in the hustle in contesting it. The game was at hand so I don't want to make too fine a point of it especially since he flew at 3 shooters way better earlier so the effort was there but the recognition was off. Bench low -15.

The switching was noticeably off all game. Keldon looked lost several times, going into no man's land and getting stuck going to where Derrick already was only to have his man make an open 3. Keldon not only got killed switches but also kept going under screens for their open 3s while only making 2-5, 2-3 from 3, but leading us in FTs, making 6-7.

The 3RD Q was better in terms of defensive pressure and it got us rolling to bring their lead down to 4 points, but mental mistakes crept in each time we cut the lead to single digits to allow 3s and putbacks.

Our back court combined for 11 points on 3-16 (DJ taking 12 of those...), 0-6 from 3 (DJ taking 4 of those), 10 rebounds (3 on O), 5-6FTs, and 8 assists. DJ was largely invisible but for some good D plays. Derrick stood out more there with great help D in the block, and that presence down low helped us get stops and make some runs. Loved his left side drive and reverse finish. Physicality, focus, and finesse. Great to see.

Jakob only played 15 minutes but I'm not sure how he could have helped with the outcome given our perimeter woes on both D and O. Maybe a few rebounds to limit second chances, but with the number of 3s they attempted, they rebounds were long anyway.

Tre was a positive tonight, looking like his rhythm is coming back. I like his assertiveness and court vision. Nice drives, crafty finishes, terrific passes to the weak side for some much needed open looks. Devin was flat out our best player out there tonight, and along with a more assertive Doug they did what they could. Devin stole the ball, played great help D, rebounded well, drove with intent and finished with touch or dunks, and made some 3s. SO VALUABLE. He's already surpassed Lonnie on both ends with smarts, defense, finishing at the rim, and shot making. He led us in scoring with 18 on 8-14 (2-7 from 3), several on great D to O transition baskets, 4 boards, 1 assist, 1 steal, and 1 block.

I did like the better D in spurts. Thad stood out with his physicality on man D which allowed us to sneak on help D more especially to seal up the baseline drives and force passes. The rotations and contests were not always as consistent there, but when we did rotate well we contested vigorously at the arc to force passes there as well. Just not nearly enough consistency there.

I really wanted us to show well tonight but it was a dud from the get go. I think we thought that this would be easier than it was and we looked and played like the team that was on a SEGABABA. We did not have the requisite energy to start the game, and DJ being a non-factor in that regard hurt us. No spark from him meant we had to look elsewhere and it was sparse. What's a bit concerning is some guys looking to get theirs throughout the games that take us out of the team concept that is successful for us. Keldon, DJ, and Lonnie tend to do this more or at least it stand out with them more. One and done shots, not looking for the open man nearly as much (though to his credit Keldon made some nice, patient passes today for 3 assists), and it's something we definitely need to curb.

Our poor shooting is putting so much pressure on our D that even when we're overall very good (and we weren't tonight) there's far less room for error which magnifies any little mistake because we can't seem to close the gap on the other end.

We have to go back to maximizing guys' strengths. Bryn and Lonnie - you are not good ball handlers and initiators of O. Stop it, move off ball, either shoot or drive. It's not that complicated. I don't want to see any more blind behind him passes by Bryn or drives by Lonnie into three defenders. Doug - keep doing what you're doing. Jakob has to get back into rhythm and we have to incorporate him in the O more. We know what we have with DJ and Derrick, just an off night from them. Keldon - passing more, driving with physicality but not into three defenders and some film for reading the switches better. Devin - LOVE. HIS. GAME. Get his the ball more. Tre is also coming along well. I hope he becomes more of a secret weapon alongside Devin.

We also have to go back to our core concepts: communicate, rotate, and close out on D, BOX OUT, and MOVE with and without the ball. Gump is right on with his observation that we made too many passes when guys had open shots. Nobody wants to be the guy to miss from the arc in particular. This versus teams that are anything but gun shy is the wrong mindset. There's good-to-great which creates the BEST shot and then there's passing up open shots for a late clock heave.

Finally, we have to adjust more to the 3s game. We're neither taking nor making enough of them and it's on everyone to not only take up the personal responsibility to get better in making those shots, but in creating them as well as getting the ball to the hot hand. We are good at the mid range, but it may also be a factor of teams giving us those shots in exchange for 3s. If we're not a high FT-generating team for traditional 3s (something to improve), then we have to make a more concerted effort to create 3s at the arc opportunities.

Mindset and resilience permeates it all. We have to be smarter with and without the ball on both ends and play harder. Easy to say, but nobody else is going to do it for us. We've played way better on both ends, and though the film will have some bitter pills, learning from them and implementing them are crucial. We are a developing team so consistency will not always be there but you always want the compete level and smarts to be there. Some rest practice before an important home stand coming up.
ImageImageImageImageImage
The Spurs Way
Thinking of you, Pop :hug:
User avatar
Phreak50
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,993
And1: 6,746
Joined: Feb 01, 2014

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#30 » by Phreak50 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:32 am

Got to watch this on my second screen at work, but without audio.

To be fair on our inconsistent guards, we honestly have the worst lineup up big men in the entire league, at least offensively.

Put a decent big in there and our guards automatically look a lot better.

So on that sense, to stay fairly competitive in most games, we are overachieving.

In saying that, White might need to move to the bench and run that team. He looks disinterested this season.

Give Lonnie a guarantee he'll have a 10-20 game stretch as a starter and see how that goes for his confidence.

There also has to be a point of no return during the season where Forbes gets DNP while younger guys like Jones and Primo get some experience.
Tomjas
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,130
And1: 2,884
Joined: Nov 04, 2017
 

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#31 » by Tomjas » Fri Nov 19, 2021 9:30 am

Sorry guys but it’s obvious what needs to happen

Stay the same & it’s a maximum of 30 wins & a lottery pick

Pump the value of some players by getting them stats on a bad team

Alternative is to trade for Simmons

Get a psych evaluation because nobody knows what is happening there

Put some protection on picks

Etc etc

“Normal” Simmons is levels above anyone on your roster
JeffReal
Ballboy
Posts: 19
And1: 16
Joined: Jun 26, 2021

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#32 » by JeffReal » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:49 pm

All this wild Simmons talk. Simmons is the last thing the Spurs need.

The Spurs already have good defense at the guard positions. Simmons could offer only marginal improvement at twice the price.

The Spurs already have plenty of players, on cheaper contracts, who can shoot poorly at long range. No need for any more of that.

The Spurs already have players, on cheaper contracts, who can miss free throws. No need for more.

Assists, playmaking? Simmons has always had good shooters and scorers available. Embiid of course, and Harris, Redick, Curry, etc. To whom, on the Spurs, would Simmons be feeding the ball? The Spurs have no Embiid, no Curry. Etc.

Basketball is a team sport.

Simmons, on the Spurs, would look like a tall pile of gold plated trash. He is the opposite of what the Spurs need.

The Spurs need more reliable scoring, especially from long range.
User avatar
imagump1313
Veteran
Posts: 2,867
And1: 1,628
Joined: Apr 27, 2013
Location: Behind You
       

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#33 » by imagump1313 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:44 pm

Tomjas wrote:Sorry guys but it’s obvious what needs to happen

Stay the same & it’s a maximum of 30 wins & a lottery pick

Pump the value of some players by getting them stats on a bad team

Alternative is to trade for Simmons

Get a psych evaluation because nobody knows what is happening there

Put some protection on picks

Etc etc

“Normal” Simmons is levels above anyone on your roster


At this point you would have to give him to us for next to nothing to take on that contract and headache. Your GM isn't doing that......

I still think its an interesting idea but I'm not giving Philly more than some 2nd round picks now and we have no salaries that come close to matching his for trading.
User avatar
imagump1313
Veteran
Posts: 2,867
And1: 1,628
Joined: Apr 27, 2013
Location: Behind You
       

Re: SPURS GAME DAY! GAME 15: SPURS AT WOLVES, 18-11-2021, 7PM (CT) 

Post#34 » by imagump1313 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:59 pm

Phreak50 wrote:Got to watch this on my second screen at work, but without audio.

To be fair on our inconsistent guards, we honestly have the worst lineup up big men in the entire league, at least offensively.

Put a decent big in there and our guards automatically look a lot better.

So on that sense, to stay fairly competitive in most games, we are overachieving.

In saying that, White might need to move to the bench and run that team. He looks disinterested this season.

Give Lonnie a guarantee he'll have a 10-20 game stretch as a starter and see how that goes for his confidence.

There also has to be a point of no return during the season where Forbes gets DNP while younger guys like Jones and Primo get some experience.


I'm willing to let the season play out. I'm guessing our bigs will look a little better when Collins is playing and we have less of Eubanks. Poeltl has been great. Now if we can harness some aggressiveness and consistency out of him as the season progresses, we might be more solid than you think there.

White has the rest of the year to figure it out as well as the other guys.
If I had to decide right at this moment, I would say let White go and don't resign Walker, then do what you can with your cap space and another higher draft pick this year.
I'm still of the opinion that McDermott was a waste of cap space signing.

But like I said, l'm willing to let them play through the ups and downs this year and see where we are in June. Just give Jones more of an opportunity to fail than Forbes please.

Return to San Antonio Spurs